Cloudcuckoo Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 Yes I did. I read texts and listened to VAR that were both incriminating. It was awful and traumatic. Words you can never erase from your brain. It helped me tremendously because my WH lied until the proof was staring him in the face and then came the blameshifting. Here are a few of the outrageous things said that I cannot erase: "I want to f*ck you 2 times tonight and again in the morning" (my WH) "I am going to ride you like a stallion" (MOW) This from the VAR: "Remember when we even f*cked in (my son's name) bed." He was 6 at the time btw so they f*cked on Cars themed blankets too. I hope it was a turn on for the both of them sick f*cks Ugh, that's revolting LD, truly sick, ad you say. That made my stomach turn. What a pair of disrespectful see you next Tuesday's....
Cloudcuckoo Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 After finally answering my own alarm bells and finding a message on his phone, I called the number on it. I got a woman's answer machine, but didn't leave a message. It later transpired she knew my number and everything else about me, my life and our children. She'd hacked his computer and had been clandestinely watching everything. Still makes me shudder sometimes. I didn't scream, shout or cry initially, I was too shocked. I just woke him up (he'd been a bit off colour that day and went to bed), asked him who ****** was. He gave me a load of horse manure but when he realised the game was up he told me. I told him he could no longer have his cake and eat it, and that he had as long as it would take me to pack the car to decide what he wanted to do... I never called her again, but he did, to tell her it was over, and oh my goodness did the 'fun' start then.... She didn't leave any stone unturned in her persecution of me and my family, that included endless phone calls to all of us at sometimes ridiculous hours, and in spite of many inconvenient number changes, so that eventually we had no choice but to legally put a stop to her demented behaviour. The distance that had enabled my husband's long term affair wasn't enough to protect me and our children from her lunacy, so I certainly had no intention of actually speaking to her, and there was definately going to be no apology from her for her role in the triangle! 1
UpwardForward Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 Intended state of marriage: Neither the husband or wife have power over their own bodies. Husband has power over wife's body; Wife has power over husband's body. Even for non-believers - still you have the marital contract to honor. Or bill of divorcement under certain circumstances. OW's have responsibility for their part, or entering another's marriage. Should OW and MM (or OM and MW) marry, their marriage is built on adultery. Not sanctified.
cocorico Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 Intended state of marriage: Neither the husband or wife have power over their own bodies. Husband has power over wife's body; Wife has power over husband's body. Intended by whom? Certainly not by any educated person! I own my own body, and my husband owns his. My children own their own bodies. Nobody owns another person's body. Slavery has long been outlawed. I think you'll find that in all civilised societies the legal framework recognises that the archaic assumption of a husband owning a wife's body belongs in the dustbin, hence the criminalisation of marital rape. Every person has ownership of their own body. 1
wmacbride Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 (edited) Intended by whom? Certainly not by any educated person! I own my own body, and my husband owns his. My children own their own bodies. Nobody owns another person's body. Slavery has long been outlawed. I think you'll find that in all civilised societies the legal framework recognises that the archaic assumption of a husband owning a wife's body belongs in the dustbin, hence the criminalisation of marital rape. Every person has ownership of their own body. Upwardforward, please correct me f I am wrong I don't think what was meant was literal control ( e.g.- a husband can force his wife to have sex). I think what was meant was more that both a wife and a husband have promised to be faithful and not get involved with anyone else. Interestingly enough, the idea of control over another human being, albeit on an emotional level, is often used as a "reason' for an affair. How many times has it been said "I didn't want to get involved with a married person, but he/she pursued me relentlessly until i had to give in", as if the ow/om had no choice in the matter. Sorry, but that is bull. Edited September 16, 2016 by wmacbride 3
cocorico Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 Upwardforward, please correct me f I am wrong I don't think what was meant was literal control ( e.g.- a husband can force his wife to have sex). I think what was meant was more that both a wife and a husband have promised to be faithful and not get involved with anyone else. Interestingly enough, the idea of control over another human being, albeit on an emotional level, is often used as a "reason' for an affair. How many times has it been said "I didn't want to get involved with a married person, but he/she pursued me relentlessly until i had to give in", as if the ow/om had no choice in the matter. Sorry, but that is bull. Control over another - unless in a mutually consensual S&M relationship - is wrong, and against the law (children being under their parents "control" being moot). And saying "neither husband nor wife have power over their own bodies" is saying that the husband can decide what does or doesn't go down with the wife's body (and vice versa). Back-pedalling doesn't change that. If what was meant was "married people should be sexually exclusive with one another" then that is what ought to have been said, rather than claiming hat a man - if he wanted - could sell his wife for sex (or offer his daughters to be raped by visitors, as one reads in the bible). Wrong, wrong, wrong - and illegal (luckily). Whether or not spouses should be sexually exclusive is up to them, IMO - if they want to open their M, whose business is it but theirs? Hence many forms of marriage vows not stating sexual exclusivity. And FTR I agree about the "I had to give in" story. Unless coercion is involved - and then it becomes rape, or similar - there is choice. Hormones can be powerful, but choice remains. Sometimes people make daft choices but everyone should always own their choices and take responsibility for them.
wmacbride Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 Control over another - unless in a mutually consensual S&M relationship - is wrong, and against the law (children being under their parents "control" being moot). And saying "neither husband nor wife have power over their own bodies" is saying that the husband can decide what does or doesn't go down with the wife's body (and vice versa). Back-pedalling doesn't change that. If what was meant was "married people should be sexually exclusive with one another" then that is what ought to have been said, rather than claiming hat a man - if he wanted - could sell his wife for sex (or offer his daughters to be raped by visitors, as one reads in the bible). Wrong, wrong, wrong - and illegal (luckily). Whether or not spouses should be sexually exclusive is up to them, IMO - if they want to open their M, whose business is it but theirs? Hence many forms of marriage vows not stating sexual exclusivity. And FTR I agree about the "I had to give in" story. Unless coercion is involved - and then it becomes rape, or similar - there is choice. Hormones can be powerful, but choice remains. Sometimes people make daft choices but everyone should always own their choices and take responsibility for them. please find anywhere in upwardand forwards post where anything was said about a husband being allowed to sell his wife for sex, to allow his daughters to be raped etc. you are really engaging in hyperbole 1
cocorico Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 please find anywhere in upwardand forwards post where anything was said about a husband being allowed to sell his wife for sex, to allow his daughters to be raped etc. It's the logical conclusion from "the husband owns the wife's body".
Author aileD Posted September 16, 2016 Author Posted September 16, 2016 In our vows were the words "and forsaking all others". I don't control anyone but I expected that promise to be kept. In a way you are giving m yourselves to each other. Also... "I am going to ride you like a stallion" (MOW) hahahahah!!!!!!!! WHO SAYS STUFF LIKE THAT!? It hurt to read OWs emails to H but in a way it was also really funny because it read like some sappy romance novel, very poetic and filled with stuff out of a Hallmark card. Complained to therapist about it, she's like "that's the fantasy part..." My favorite from OW "I want to lick your sweat". *barf* 2
eye of the storm Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 In our vows were the words "and forsaking all others". I don't control anyone but I expected that promise to be kept. In a way you are giving m yourselves to each other. Also... "I am going to ride you like a stallion" (MOW) hahahahah!!!!!!!! WHO SAYS STUFF LIKE THAT!? It hurt to read OWs emails to H but in a way it was also really funny because it read like some sappy romance novel, very poetic and filled with stuff out of a Hallmark card. Complained to therapist about it, she's like "that's the fantasy part..." My favorite from OW "I want to lick your sweat". *barf* You have every right to expect fidelity from your H. You are focused on the OW. He promised you fidelity, she didn't. You are spending valuable time complaining to your therapist about the writing style of the OW instead of the WS's actions. She didn't damage your M. He did. 1
ladydesigner Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 Of course the WS is the ringleader of the whole circus show, but an OW who knowingly engages in it is an accomplice, that's how I see it anyway! 3
Midwestmissy Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 I think we scratch our heads at the ows because we can't believe the mutual idiocy that went on - plus, what we read in the texts and emails is the only voice of hers we've ever heard. If there's remorse, we are hearing more explanation from the wh, but trust me it's hard to un see a lot of that caca lol. The most telling email I read was on the day of break up (I found out later after it was over) where she wrote, "so I guess you win." It's not much of a relationship if there is a winner and in our case, sore, loser. Not sure what he won, but maybe it's that he walked first. All very manipulative. 3
ladydesigner Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 I think we scratch our heads at the ows because we can't believe the mutual idiocy that went on - plus, what we read in the texts and emails is the only voice of hers we've ever heard. If there's remorse, we are hearing more explanation from the wh, but trust me it's hard to un see a lot of that caca lol. The most telling email I read was on the day of break up (I found out later after it was over) where she wrote, "so I guess you win." It's not much of a relationship if there is a winner and in our case, sore, loser. Not sure what he won, but maybe it's that he walked first. All very manipulative. Right?! There are no winners in an A. I don't even think the OW who go on to marry the WS are even winners! The deed, the infidelity, has already been done IMHO. 4
Cloudcuckoo Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 It's the logical conclusion from "the husband owns the wife's body". Presumptive is what that is...
MuddyFootprints Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 Again, here we are with another thinly veiled question. If you already know the answer, why ask?
ladydesigner Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 Again, here we are with another thinly veiled question. If you already know the answer, why ask? Do you mean why ask the OW the question? For me my WH is a complete and utter liar so I went straight to MOW for answers only to get more gaslighting from her. She didn't spill the whole truth until my WH cut her off and she spilled the beans to me.
MuddyFootprints Posted September 16, 2016 Posted September 16, 2016 No, why ask a forum where OW participate and then challenge or negate their personal insight. 2
ladydesigner Posted September 17, 2016 Posted September 17, 2016 No, why ask a forum where OW participate and then challenge or negate their personal insight. This thread originally had a different title and moved here.
MuddyFootprints Posted September 17, 2016 Posted September 17, 2016 This thread originally had a different title and moved here. It would be a shame if the thread title was renamed to something that didn't accurately reflect the initial two or three lines of the opening of the original post. If the title was moderated, the integrity of the OP's initial question remained in tact.
ladydesigner Posted September 17, 2016 Posted September 17, 2016 It would be a shame if the thread title was renamed to something that didn't accurately reflect the initial two or three lines of the opening of the original post. If the title was moderated, the integrity of the OP's initial question remained in tact. I had to read the first post to see what was being asked originally because I couldn't understand the response. I answered on a thread that was what was the worst thing OW did to you. So I may have responded to the wrong thread
cocorico Posted September 18, 2016 Posted September 18, 2016 I had to read the first post to see what was being asked originally because I couldn't understand the response. I answered on a thread that was what was the worst thing OW did to you. So I may have responded to the wrong thread this is the thread about whether spouses own each other, and can be stolen by intruders
Got it Posted September 18, 2016 Posted September 18, 2016 Right?! There are no winners in an A. I don't even think the OW who go on to marry the WS are even winners! The deed, the infidelity, has already been done IMHO. Umm, I thought there were no winners?? Sorry but as a OW who married my MM, while I may not be a winner I still think I have a pretty amazing marriage. We learned a lot, definitely, but I think it has actually made us stronger for what we have gone through, learned, and been able to discuss. We are actually more transparent with each other because of everything than I thought we (I) would be having never gone down this path. Definitely learned how infidelity can happen, learned as a wayward myself my slippery slopes and coping mechanisms that allowed it to happen and so how to own my thinking/behavior and actions far more than I ever knew before. 2
cocorico Posted September 20, 2016 Posted September 20, 2016 Umm, I thought there were no winners?? Sorry but as a OW who married my MM, while I may not be a winner I still think I have a pretty amazing marriage. I must admit, I do wake up every morning, look across at my H and feel like I won the jackpot. 3
HadMeOverABarrel Posted October 12, 2016 Posted October 12, 2016 In our vows were the words "and forsaking all others". I don't control anyone but I expected that promise to be kept. In a way you are giving m yourselves to each other. Also... "I am going to ride you like a stallion" (MOW) hahahahah!!!!!!!! WHO SAYS STUFF LIKE THAT!? It hurt to read OWs emails to H but in a way it was also really funny because it read like some sappy romance novel, very poetic and filled with stuff out of a Hallmark card. Complained to therapist about it, she's like "that's the fantasy part..." My favorite from OW "I want to lick your sweat". *barf* OP, I'm really sorry for your pain. Hope you get your answers and healing as quickly as possible. This post made me want to ask... Does your husband's sweat really repulse you that much? What man wouldn't feel like a (or THE) stud with a woman saying something like that? While I don't believe BS are responsible for WS poor choices, and seems like WS should better communicate their desires to BS BEFORE starting an affair and setting their own boundaries (unless WS is serial cheater in which case nothing anyone says or does would stop WS), why not cater to H ego and sexually as long as it doesn't violate your own boundaries? Maybe it's difficult to keep that up in a long marriage, but I enjoy keeping things interesting with my long-term, committed partner. Would WS be less inclined to look for that from OW/OM if they had it at home? Can't say for sure but something worth considering?
Author aileD Posted October 12, 2016 Author Posted October 12, 2016 My H affair wasn't about sex. In fact he recently told me that their sex life wasn't even that great, he couldn't keep it up a lot (he says because of the extreme guilt he felt it who knows). He's more needy in the emotional area...needs to feel liked and wanted and out first and like he's special and be "one" and connect emotionally ALL THE TIME. He got anything he wanted in bed from me. My "failure" was that I put out children and my job before his needs. We were one and connected but not every second of the day when I'm doing dishes and wiping butts and paying bills and vacuuming and all that stuff. That's the best thing about an affair and what appealed to my H so much. OWs don't have free access to WS so when they do--it's all about the A. Best behavior all around. Nothing but focusing on each other and looking into each others eyes and flirting. He was always #1 when she'd leave work early to see him. When the few times a week she did she's him, was "amazing" because THATS ALL THEY HAD. When **** got real and they're living in a car with no money, he's like "why did you leave work early???? You need the $$". He sees now how real life would have never worked. When you're alone in a car behind a building gazing into each other's souls ..you don't have to deal with our kids hating you, the huge age difference, her family wanting to kill you, the fact that none of her friends speak English and you have nothing in common with anyone because they are 20 years younger and of a different culture, that you actually have no hobbies or world views that are the same. You're just in a car...gazing . That's what it was like for my H anyway. I get some of you ended up with your AP and if that works for you, I'm happy for you.
Recommended Posts