nicetomeetu Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 I was just reading the forum about if women find Asian men attractive, and it made me think of a question that is not really related, but I just didn't know where to post. PLEASE don't be angered by my ignorance, as that is why I am writing. My boyfriend is a "Hispanic" that grew up in America. I grew up in Canada. This may or may not influence what we both think about this. One day, he made reference to me being a "white" girl. I was very confused, and I noticed after that he may refer to himself as being brown, not white, etc. Which I guess he is of darker skin colour than I am. I don't really know how to explain what I am saying, but basically, he thinks we are an interracial couple, but I have never thought of us as one. I have always thougt of us as being the same "race". I don't know if it is my Canadian background, or if I am totally ignorant. But I don't think it is really proper to stick people in a category of "race". If so, how would people even begin to divide them. I mean, there are way too many types of people. I think Ethnicity is a more proper term. I don't see how people can be categorized into "races". ALSO, my grandfather was Spanish. He was white. How can Hispanic be a "race" if people are so different. To me, Hispanic always basiaclly meant that someone may follow certain cultures, or speak Spanish, or have Spanish descent. Also, my bf says his friend who is Italian is white. BUT he is physically darker than he is. I just don't think that this seems like a proper term, and if it is, I don't really like him to refer to me that way. Am I an idiot for wondering this??
moimeme Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 Nope. You're just Canadian We don't grow up thinking in 'races'. Thank God!
Zaira Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 No. Tell him exactly what you've told us, and that you would prefer not to be classified as a "white girl".
RecordProducer Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 There are only three races: white, black, and yellow. He comes from a different ethnicity, that's true. As much as I know there are white people who live in South America too, and Hispanics are the native Mexicans, Brazilians, Cubans, etc. who - as much as I know - have mixed origins from black, yellow, and white people. So basically he is right about his roots, but whether Hispanics are considered white or mixed race, you should ask an expert.
Author nicetomeetu Posted July 5, 2005 Author Posted July 5, 2005 well, I am just curious (or maybe ridiculous). Like is it an American thing? I actually saw it described as a seperate "race" on an American form. It was like an immagration form or something. And I have never thought of it in this way. I think American culture is just very different. His friend actually said that Italians are white and Hispanics are not. I thougt it sounded really wierd, and kinda ignorant to be honest.
sarah12 Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 Am I an idiot for wondering this?? Nope. We generally care much less about skin colour up here, but there are still some that would distinguish themselves by colour from another person. It's not like interracial dating isn't recognized here, it's just that we don't make it a big deal really. We don't grow up thinking in 'races'. Thank God! A teacher I had in elementary school asked our class who was black, yellow, white, brown, etc. When we raised our hands to show what 'colour' we were, she pulled out a few pieces of coloured cardboard and said we weren't black, yellow, white or brown unless our skin was the colour of the cardboard. It was one of the best lessons I ever learned in a classroom.
moimeme Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 but whether Hispanics are considered white or mixed race, you should ask an expert. Why? Why care? I think American culture is just very different. His friend actually said that Italians are white and Hispanics are not. Americans have long defined people by their colours. Canada has been multicultural for years and years. We just don't think of folks in terms of 'race', particularly, or at least not the same way the US does. There are only three races Sorry but you are wrong. It's a wierd concept; basically whatever you think constitutes a group is a 'race'. race1 ( P ) Pronunciation Key (rs) n. A local geographic or global human population distinguished as a more or less distinct group by genetically transmitted physical characteristics. A group of people united or classified together on the basis of common history, nationality, or geographic distribution: the German race. A genealogical line; a lineage. Humans considered as a group. Biology. An interbreeding, usually geographically isolated population of organisms differing from other populations of the same species in the frequency of hereditary traits. A race that has been given formal taxonomic recognition is known as a subspecies. A breed or strain, as of domestic animals. A distinguishing or characteristic quality, such as the flavor of a wine from dictionary.com We use 'ethnic origin' for our censuses and we include lots of categories; the US still uses 'race' and includes fewer categories.
Author nicetomeetu Posted July 5, 2005 Author Posted July 5, 2005 yeah, thats what the form was, a census form. It classified races as Black, White, Native, Hispanic and it even had a "Some Other Race" category. Like you MUST be one of the ones they had listed and if not you were "SOME OTHER RACE". And it had clumped all kinds of people together under each race. I thought it was absurd!!
shamen Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 Originally posted by moimeme We use 'ethnic origin' for our censuses and we include lots of categories; the US still uses 'race' and includes fewer categories. The last American census form that I received had TONS of categories. Latino was one (actually they use the word Hispanic) and there were tons of sub-categories for that group as it's the fastest growing population here. However, they are not classified as a race on the census forms (they use American Indian or Alaska Native, Asian or Pacific Islander, Black and White). They do include one ethnicity category: Hispanic origin, yes or no. It's amazing to me how much they've (the census forms) changed since I first started filling them out. Nice to meet u, We as a society in the US do tend to think of people in different categories. White/Caucasian, Black/African American, Latino, Asian, Native American, etc. I personally wouldn't necessarily use the word race for all of these groups though. Regardless, in the US in general, your relationship with the Latino man would be considered an inter-racial one here for all intents and purposes.
moimeme Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 The last American census form that I received had TONS of categories. Hm. I checked out the site and the section that discussed census terms listed very few but said options could be used.
shamen Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 Originally posted by moimeme Hm. I checked out the site and the section that discussed census terms listed very few but said options could be used. Yes, only 4 "races" are officially listed on the form (see my above post)... But, the ethnicity section is where it got interesting and where all of the extra categories were listed.
Author nicetomeetu Posted July 5, 2005 Author Posted July 5, 2005 But what purposes would those even be?? What would be a reason for labelling this way? I am sorry, this is sooo strange to me. I still think race is such a broad term, and ethnicity seems more correct to me. Personally, I didnt think that the census forms did have alot of categories. Unless that is you think five is alot, with all kinds of people lumped together?? How is it that people of different "colour" or from different places fall under the same category?? Im still confused. Please enlighten me here.
shamen Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 Why do they label us like this? Put us in different racial categories? I don't know. It does seem a little weird, but I grew up with the demarcations of white/black/Asian/American Indian. Now, depending on who you talk to, it could be Caucasian/African American/Asian/Native American. Very confusing. Then there are Americans who are African, not African American. Some African Americans who prefer to be called Black. Then there is the whole weird ethnicity question about whether or not Hispanics are Hispanic or Latino (Spanish vs. Latin American). I wish that I had a good answer. Personally, I believe that we're all from Africa and then depending on where our ancestors are from, then our skin color changed to reflect the warmth and amount of sun that we had. So we're all really one race. Do most people in the US believe that? Probably not. I also think that ethnicity does make a lot more sense. The reason that I said that there were a lot of categories was because they now have this new ethnicity section where you can specify where you are from in certain categories, which I thought was fascinating because the old Census forms would not let you do that. There was not a space for a "white" person however to do this. Yes, this is disconcerting. No, I do not think that five is a lot for a number of racial categories, but the whole thing should probably be changed to ethnicity anyway. Although I doubt that this will happen for a long time here...
alphamale Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 I will write this again for the 15th time: There are basically only three different genetic variations of humans: 1) caucasoid = europeans, mexicans, asian indians, arabs, etc.... 2) negroid = africans mostly 3) mongoloids = chinese, japanes, korean, etc... everyone on the earth is in one of these three classes or is a mix of two or more classes. people who have darker skin but do not have afros or oriental eyes are caucasoid. it is just that their ancestors grew up in countries close to the equator or where the was a lot of sun so they have brown skin vs. white skin. peoples who have very fair skin had ancestors who grew up in very northern latitudes where there was not a lot so sun. period. so you latino dude in really a caucasoid technically although some "white" people will disagreee.
guest Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 Why the label? to know how many people speak certain languages. How many are US citizens and how many require federal assistance and how many go to college, etc. If a largley hispanic population lives on welfare and do not complete school then a larger portion of federal tax dollars will be spent in their neighborhood to meet their needs. They may redistrict in order to do this. There are also health matters that are prevalent to one race over another. The us is the only place where you have African Americans and Italian Americans and German Americans. Why these groups chose to differentiat themselves from simply being Americans could be a whole new post. Most countries don't recognize the mixing of the two. One thing interesting about African Americans in my area is that most of the people who came here from Africa are white/caucasion and they are NOT recognized as African Americans because of the color of their skin. It doesn't matter that they are citizens of African countries. I think that is racist. African Americans who are negroid/black are recognized and also have holidays or special treatment just for them -- the same as any other [nation]-American, but not if they have white skin. Weird huh?
phidelt127 Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 I think race as a definition goes further than dictionary.com or census forms. I am an adopted asian. Therefore I was raised in the US and speak perfect english (with a boston accent), blah blah blah. I suppose technically I'd be considered yellow, but I grew up around all white people, so I'm basically white (they call us twinkies; yellow on the outside, white on the inside). I've never dated an asian woman, so I suppose all of my relationships have been interracial, but I don't feel that way. I'm not saying that I'm opposed to dating an asian but it just never worked out that way. Likewise I've known people from other "races" that are in the same boat as I am that also feel the same way. Now don't get me wrong, I'm proud to be an asian, but sometimes you have to look at the bigger picture. When I check the "asian" box on a census form, I wonder what kind of asian they think I am. Not to mention that box is usually "asian/pacific islander." Pacific Islander? Where does asian and pacific islander fit together? Anyway, getting back to the original post, I don't think that you should worry about what your bf says with the "white" comments. I doubt it was meant to be a derogatory remark. There are other words to describe white people that are worse, just the same as there are bad words for black, asian, hispanic, indian, etc people. The color of someone's skin shouldn't hinder the feelings that you have for another person. Remember, it's what's on the inside that really matters. Good luck.
phidelt127 Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 There are only three races: white, black, and yellow. He comes from a different ethnicity, that's true. As much as I know there are white people who live in South America too, and Hispanics are the native Mexicans, Brazilians, Cubans, etc. who - as much as I know - have mixed origins from black, yellow, and white people. So basically he is right about his roots, but whether Hispanics are considered white or mixed race, you should ask an expert. By the way, this is COMPLETE crap! Get out from under the freakin rock that you're evidently living under.
Prim&proper Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 I don't think he was talking about race in the sense of what census forms say, but more about race as it is perceived. I think Hispanics are not considered white because the category of Hispanics is very broad (i.e. you have Latin Americans, Mexicans, Spaniards, etc.) I think Hispanics have always considered themselves to not be "white", as that term is used in mainstream media in this country.
alphamale Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 Originally posted by Prim&proper I think Hispanics have always considered themselves to not be "white", as that term is used in mainstream media in this country. Well yes...they don't consider themselves to be "white" but they are caucasians.
DacaInaru Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 ok.. as a very white blue eye latina.. I can give you my stance on it.. first.. hispanic is a hispanic.. however, if I date a white guy.. and by white I mean a straight forward non hispanic dude.. then it would be technically considered interracial.. i'm currently dating a black guy again considered interracial.. however, when I have dated latino men.. i have been considered a white girl.. due to my color.. most people don't seem to get that the latino/hispanic community come in such arrangement of colors that your right there should be no distinction between it.. I would say for me.. like I said.. dating a non hispanic man is interracial.. dating a hispanic man regardless of color is not interracial.. if that makes sense..
A Fly onThe Wall Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 Originally posted by alphamale There are basically only three different genetic variations of humans: 1) caucasoid = europeans, mexicans, asian indians, arabs, etc.... 2) negroid = africans mostly 3) mongoloids = chinese, japanes, korean, etc... everyone on the earth is in one of these three classes or is a mix of two or more classes. Alpha you forgot about the Australoids (the Australian Aborigines) There are 4 classifications not 3
moimeme Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 Where do you fit Polynesians who are combinations of a whole bunch of groups? Where do you fit the product of a Haitian mother and a Navajo father who has a Greek grandmother?
A Fly onThe Wall Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 Originally posted by DacaInaru So is a black latino/a considered caucasiod? No. They would be a mix of negroid/caucasoid But on another note: As a general rule, it is good to remember that you should only refer to a person by category when it is relevant or necessary to the discussion at hand. That is, you should ordinarily view people as individuals and not mention their racial, ethnic, or other status, unless it is important to your larger purpose in communicating.
Craig Posted July 5, 2005 Posted July 5, 2005 Originally posted by DacaInaru ok.. as a very white blue eye latina.. I can give you my stance on it.. I would say for me.. like I said.. dating a non hispanic man is interracial.. dating a hispanic man regardless of color is not interracial.. if that makes sense.. So what you are saying is that, if you were dating a negroid hispanic, that you would not be in an interracial relationship?
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