Single mom & single dad - taking it slow

[Toodaloo]

psi. You are going to get hurt. I can see it coming. Its OK though. if you want to chat about it when it happens I will not hold it against you.

 

We all have hope. Even when its as clear as day we all have hope.

 

I am bowing out now because you will make excuses for everything I say despite it all being right there in your first post.

 

Good luck. I always hope I am wrong and I would be really happy if in 6 months you are able to come back and tell me that I was.

[angel.eyes]

Yes, and unfortunately insecurity results in self-sabotage. Figure out a way to get this under control.

 

This is about your fears, not the state of your relationship. But if you insist on continually pushing things with her daughter, it will destroy your relationship. And then what?

 

Bingo. That is exactly the demon that I'm fighting in my mind.

 

My "pushing" for her to open up to be more comfortable with me spending time with both her and her daughter is my insecurities talking. I crave for that reassurance. Potentially losing her a couple of weeks ago scared the crap out of me, but maybe I'm trying too hard now.

[angel.eyes]

One more thought... How about focusing on integrating her into your life? Introduce her to your family. Involve her in your social circle. That will give you something to do while continuing to build your relationship. Also, if you have a free weekend before your kids come back, and she's child-free, take a mini-vacation together.

[psiblast]

angel.eyes - To date, I've only met one of her friends. She's indicated to me that she's bashful, and that's one of the reasons why she has held off on introducing me. It would come off as a shock to her different circle of friends. The only friends that even know of my existence are her closest friends.

 

She is really a sweet and innocent girl, and doesn't have a whole lot of experience with relationships. She told me that she's even tried dating men who had everything on paper, but had no chemistry, thinking she'd be able to simply overcome the lack of attraction, for the security of having a man in her life who checks all her other boxes. I'm very different. She says she feels great chemistry with me, but I don't quite check all the "on paper" boxes. Some of those boxes were checked when we had that conversation and clarified some misunderstandings. She admitted that she was not a great communicator and made some assumptions about me.

 

I have introduced her to most of my friends, but not often -- maybe once or twice. I have not introduced her to my parents yet. And she has yet to meet my sister.

 

I agree, I need to start focusing on integrating her into my life -- but only as she feels comfortable. I have to be careful here and not make her feel like I'm pushing.

 

We actually just went on a mini vacation this past weekend.

[psiblast]

Here's some more info:

 

She is Korean. I am Japanese. English is her 2nd language, but it's my first. Culturally, I'm very American. There's a little bit of a language barrier, because she came to the US when she was 20. She grew up culturally Korean, but integrated somewhat over the past 20+ years. So she has very traditional values. Divorce is something that is very much looked down upon, and she went through that 6 years ago after a short two-year marriage with an abusive husband. She left the marriage. Her ex-husband remarried this year.

 

She's told me that she is envious of "complete" families. Most of her friends are married.

[angel.eyes]

This is helpful. As you probably know, for many traditional Asians and non-Westerners in general, introducing someone to your parents is a big deal. She sounds serious about you. I would try to relax and enjoy the relationship. As long as things are progressing, try not to be overly analytical. We've all worried about our relationships and whether they will work. You're not alone on that front. It's how we handle our worries that's important.

 

BTW, having the girls become friends is smart. Unhappy kids or jealous kids can really sabotage a relationship. So that's a savvy approach.

 

I know it's months away, but do you have any holiday traditions--Thanksgiving, Christmas,...Festivus? Who gets the kids when? Do you go away for vacation at the end of the year? Perhaps start thinking about that and how you'll want to broach the topic when the time comes.

 

Here's some more info:

 

She is Korean. I am Japanese. English is her 2nd language, but it's my first. Culturally, I'm very American. There's a little bit of a language barrier, because she came to the US when she was 20. She grew up culturally Korean, but integrated somewhat over the past 20+ years. So she has very traditional values. Divorce is something that is very much looked down upon, and she went through that 6 years ago after a short two-year marriage with an abusive husband. She left the marriage. Her ex-husband remarried this year.

 

She's told me that she is envious of "complete" families. Most of her friends are married.

[psiblast]

This is helpful. As you probably know, for many traditional Asians and non-Westerners in general, introducing someone to your parents is a big deal. She sounds serious about you. I would try to relax and enjoy the relationship. As long as things are progressing, try not to be overly analytical. We've all worried about our relationships and whether they will work. You're not alone on that front. It's how we handle our worries that's important.

 

BTW, having the girls become friends is smart. Unhappy kids or jealous kids can really sabotage a relationship. So that's a savvy approach.

 

I know it's months away, but do you have any holiday traditions--Thanksgiving, Christmas,...Festivus? Who gets the kids when? Do you go away for vacation at the end of the year? Perhaps start thinking about that and how you'll want to broach the topic when the time comes.

 

Yeah, we celebrate Thanksgiving, Christmas. I have the kids pretty much full time, except holidays and a couple of weekends here and there when their mom (who travels a lot for work) is around.

 

I want the two girls to be friends. My girlfriend is open to the idea of all the kids meeting when they're back. She wants to keep it casual and relaxing -- and not a "forced" meeting.

 

Thanks for all your feedback. Greatly appreciated.

[angel.eyes]

You're welcome!

 

I'm sure things will continue to progress. I know it's hard when you're invested in a relationship. No one wants to get hurt. But unfortunately, we can't pull out a contract to guarantee that our BF/GF won't hurt us. It's a risk we have to take in trying to find our life partner.

[JoeSmith357-1]

9 months in and your kids have not met? This has zero future.

 

You are a diversion, a FWB, and nothing else.

 

Which is cool, but it sounds like you (the OP) want more, so you have decisions you need to make.

[psiblast]

9 months in and your kids have not met? This has zero future.

 

You are a diversion, a FWB, and nothing else.

 

Which is cool, but it sounds like you (the OP) want more, so you have decisions you need to make.

 

Joe, you're way off base here. First, it seems you misread some parts. My kids did meet. It was arranged. We went out and had a good time.

 

Btw, this girl doesn't know the concept of FWB. And she's had more sex with me in the first three months, than she's had in her entire lifetime, including her marriage.

[ThorntonMelon]

Hoping we are all wrong, OP. Best of luck.

 

But remember you posted for a reason...don't ignore those instincts...

[k2girl]

Thanks. Your story gives me hope.

 

May I ask, during that first year or so, were there any talks about the future, and did you feel that perhaps one of you felt ready to commit before the other? How did you deal with that? Did you have discussions about it?

 

Not a lot of talk about the future - we were both just seeing where it went. His separation was quite recent and I think he was still going through a lot of emotions about it. I think I definitely fell harder for him earlier in our relationship. About 1 1/2 years into the relationship we considered breaking up as I felt and wanted more. We both ended up in tears that night and got back together a few hours later. I think that was the turning point for him. Now I know he feels as much as I do and we are pretty committed.

[JoeSmith357-1]

Joe, you're way off base here. First, it seems you misread some parts. My kids did meet. It was arranged. We went out and had a good time.

 

Btw, this girl doesn't know the concept of FWB. And she's had more sex with me in the first three months, than she's had in her entire lifetime, including her marriage.

 

Ok, I missed the part about the kids meeting somehow I guess.

 

But it's obvious she is sending you signals that you are not in the cards as a long term partner...

 

And you are basically in a FWB scenario right now. Even if she doesn't know it or you acknowledge it.

[psiblast]

Today, we had a text exchange that is very worrisome to me.

 

On Wednesday, we were tentatively planning to see each other on Saturday. I asked her this morning if I'm seeing her tomorrow.

 

She says that she realizes that she's been really overwhelmed and stressed out this summer with work, her parents visiting (they live in Korea and visited for the summer), vacation planning, and with me.

 

I asked her to call me.

 

She says "No, that feels like more stress."

 

I asked "Do I give you stress"?

 

She said "yes", and continued and told me she feels pressured to have sex with me whenever we're together. She also said that talking feels stressful, and went on to say that it's part of her frustration at work as well.

 

Previously, she admitted she's not a good communicator. To reiterate, English is her 2nd language.

 

I replied to her saying that I also feel pressure... the pressure to please her.

 

To which she responded, "You try too hard, which is pressure to me too."

 

She closed by saying, "it's not a good time to talk, I'm in a really stressed out mood and it's not fair for you to take it".

 

Ugh... I'm feeling really down right now. I don't know what to do. We clearly need to talk, but she says talking about it gives her stress, and if I push for that level of communication, then that only drives her away from me.

[ThorntonMelon]

OK, I'm back. Damn, you're living my life from three years ago. Weird.

 

If someone you're dating for a year tells you they don't want to talk to you, please, she's screaming at you that this thing is dying. You originally posted because you knew something was wrong, then told all of us that we were wrong when we told you that there was...

 

You're a father. It sounds like you're a great one. This woman WILL (not might, WILL) affect your ability to parent, to work, to focus on your priorities. She is telling you that the fantasy relationship you have in your mind (sex is amazing for her, she's building for a future with you, etc) is complete fiction. You're smothering her with need for more, because you're so uncertain about where things stand that you're fighting for a place in your life.

 

I would wait until Sunday, until you don't see each other this weekend. And then I'd text her and tell her that you know she's overwhelmed, and that you understand that right now you need more from a partner that she can give, and so you're going to respect her needs and let her figure out her life.

 

Of course when my friends gave me that advice, I ignored it and wasted a lot of time and energy. So I'll understand when you do the same.

 

But I promise you, you'll be a worse father for it - your kids will sense the stress and pain no matter how hard you fight it. My kids were 10 and 7 at the time and completely emotionally unaware of most things and they knew something was wrong (with a woman they never met).

 

Protect your kids from this dysfunction. Get out of it. She can call you in a month if she feels more into you. But you've got to cut and run. ASAP. Yesterday if possible.

[psiblast]

Thanks Thornton.

 

I texted her afterwards and said that I feel bad that she feels overwhelmed and that I may have contributed to it. I told her that I feel like we need to talk about this, and that I don't want this relationship to fail.

 

She just texted me that she wants to come over tomorrow and we can talk for a couple hours. She needed to come by and get something anyways (she's going away on a trip next week).

[psiblast]

OK, I'm back. Damn, you're living my life from three years ago. Weird.

 

Thornton, if you wouldn't mind, could you share your story from 3 years ago?

[ThorntonMelon]

Its been a while, so the play by play isn't fresh -

 

but basically, single mother - we spent the weekends we had off from our kids together - felt magical, but no progress. Any time it was discussed (together a year) I was told it was too much pressure. There were other issues with it, but she dropped the "maybe we need to break up before more heartbreak" line on me as well - you learn over time that they loved the companionship and didnt want to give it up, especially the attention, but I wasn't her "real" life - just a fantasy distraction. Over time the need to fill that fantasy decreased, and my desires for something real increased, and it just blew up. But the push and pull routine along the way took an awful lot out of me.

[loveiswar101]

My friend, I have just gone through the same thing or so. Please do your self a favor and accept this may not turn out the way you want.

 

I currently have been pushed to one side, at the beginning I was flavor of the month but as soon as I wanted more I was let go over time, each time a little more and more until basically I not a priority at all to her after her kids.

 

Read the signs, the red flags, FWB maybe but that's not something I wanted and its not really anyone should pursue in my eyes wants when kids are involved.

 

Remove yourself from the situation, be honest with her, tell her you want more and if she changes her mind to let you know. Walk away and find someone who does want you and your kids full time over time.

[LadyLike30]

She's not using you. She's protecting her kids.

 

Most 2nd marriages with kids end up in divorce. Just enjoy each other and stop pushing her. Keep pushing her and yes, ahe'll dump you.

 

How many stories heard of married people fighting over how to raise each other's kids from their previous marriages? What about exes and drama. Yeah, marrying - instead of leaving it as is is gonna add this blanket of security between you and her and elevate you into her number one. Okay, yea

Edited August 20, 2016 by LadyLike30

[ThorntonMelon]

She's not using you. She's protecting her kids.

 

Agreed on the first (she's being honest, he's ignoring it). Disagree on the second - I don't think her kids are being protected.

 

She wants what she wants when she wants it and she doesn't want what he does. No one's fault. We're just looking out for OP and he can extend the pain or kill it now.

 

Either way, this one isn't going to last.

[psiblast]

We broke up yesterday.

 

We sat in a cafe and talked. I pleaded my case. I said how I was so good to her and how we were so good together and that I didn't want to throw away this relationship. I stated all the things I've done for her - the sacrifices I made.

 

She reiterated that she sees no future because she can't get over the fact that I have two kids and she also doesn't believe that I can take care of her. She sees that I'm trying hard but she feels it's not my natural for me. She thinks I need someone more nurturing that can take care of me. I disagreed.

 

She also said that what we felt for each other was more like "puppy love". I think it is she who wanted more, but didn't want to come to the realization that I couldn't give that to her.

 

To be honest with myself, I'm not sure if I wanted more, and think that maybe I positioned myself that way because I felt that it is what she wanted and I wanted to provide that need for her, while ignoring my own needs, and simply being blinded by the incredible intimacy with her. I don't know. I'm still trying to sort that out in my head.

 

She said she wants space. She's leaving for a trip tomorrow and was contemplating waiting a week (until she gets back from her trip) to have this talk with me so that she can make the decision with a clear mind (her words). She's been under a lot of stress lately and I added to it.

 

She has always told me that she is not good at expressing emotion and shes never cried in front of anyone before. Surprisingly, she cried as we were talking. On the flip side, I'm a very emotional person and I was very composed throughout. I did not cry.

 

I told her I love her and I will miss her. I thanked her for bringing me so much happiness over the last 9 months. I told her it is very hard to let her go, but I must. I gave her one last hug and kiss and said goodbye.

 

Interestingly, she texted me later last night asking how I'm doing, and saying "I hope you don't mind me texting you from time to time. And then she goes on to tell me that she talked with her best friend and now realizes how much I have done for her. She said she's heard me say it, but now she feels it.

 

I didn't respond and I'm not sure if I should.

 

This breakup freed me of the day to day anxiety over her... constantly wondering where her heart is, constantly waiting for her text messages, etc.

 

I wish she didn't text me last night. It now has me analyzing the meaning of what was said. Obviously she was thinking of me. But it could simply be out of pity. She knows she hurt me.

 

It also gave me (for a second) a glimmer of false hope that she has (or will have) a change of heart. I will try my best not to allow myself to believe that.

[ThorntonMelon]

I'm very sorry for your loss.

 

You're in pain right now so I won't analyze anything above other than the text message was not a change of heart. She'll keep texting. The more you ignore it, the quicker you'll move on.

 

I will give her this - if the conversation you described above is remotely what actually happened (not saying you'd lie, just in high emotion we all struggle to process everything) - she's got a set of brass balls to position this as she did.

 

Bump this in a couple weeks and let us know how you're doing, and at that point, once you're a little detached we can hit the individual points above.

 

That said, in the meantime, TRUST YOUR GUT!!!! - you knew something was very wrong and it was what happened, within days. That instinct will be very valuable to you in your relationships going forward. You're a great guy - we have to heal you because this one weakened you terribly, but the good news is you won't recognize the guy doing all that pleading in about 3-6 months.

 

I'm sorry. We're here.

[psiblast]

This morning she sent me a long text. Here are the main points:

 

- She feels she was perhaps premature in her conclusion that we should break up, and excused it by saying she was in a highly stressed mood.

 

- Talking with her friend yesterday reminded her of how good I made her feel.

 

- Getting everything off her chest (concerns of our future, etc) gave her emotional relief and space. She no longer feels overwhelmed.

 

- She agreed that we just need to take a break (without officially breaking up). I presented this option to her yesterday which she declined. She just wanted to end it.

 

Wished me well and says she hopes I find happiness because I deserve it.

 

I did not respond to her and don't intend to. I'm going to start working on myself asap. Going back to the gym. Going to get back on track with my job. Getting my house back in order. Putting more focus on hobbies I've neglected.

[sc0316]

What does "can't get over the fact you have two kids" even mean? Is she a hyprocrite or something—does she not have a daughter herself? And she said she felt pressured to have sex?!

 

If she were a little kinder, she wouldn't send you these follow-up texts to play with your emotions. She probably just misses your attention. She is too much drama and too much work. I'd just block her.