After 4 dates, my lady friend told me she wants to take it slow

[sc0316]

Your lady friend sounds serious and uptight. Is it even appropriate to ask about your salary? Honestly, that would be a turn off to me.

[CollegeKid101]

Quite frankly, I think you dodged a bullet. Keep on keeping on! You'll find Ms. Right sooner rather than later.

[Teknoe]

Your lady friend sounds serious and uptight. Is it even appropriate to ask about your salary? Honestly, that would be a turn off to me.

 

I guess it was but eh. I think last night we were both finally ready to face the issues head on rather than brush them under the rug. I wish I could redo the home dinner date but I just have to use what I learned moving forward. Should definitely have done dinner after the home date rather than the meet up.

[Teknoe]

Quite frankly, I think you dodged a bullet. Keep on keeping on! You'll find Ms. Right sooner rather than later.

 

My brother said the same thing!

 

I replied "not a great fit = bullet dodged" and he said yep!

 

Doesn't mean she's bad. Just means we weren't extremely compatible.

[SwordofFlame]

Your lady friend sounds serious and uptight. Is it even appropriate to ask about your salary? Honestly, that would be a turn off to me.

 

This seems to be a cultural thing, I have a friend who's dated several Asian women and has been asked the same.

[MidwestUSA]

Your lady friend sounds serious and uptight. Is it even appropriate to ask about your salary? Honestly, that would be a turn off to me.

 

Given that they were set up by two sets of parents, hoping for a marriage, it's not that far off base.

[deep_night]

hey teknoe, it's not your fault, and its definitely not unattractive being a gentleman and being interested in someone. it's nice to have something to look forward to: plans, holding hands, a hug, a kiss.... just like back in high school! why people rush when one can enjoy things as they are?

 

i would friendzone only someone who would treat me as his buddy, but i think you showed interest very clearly (i dont know anyone who goes on romantic night pic nics with their friends tbh @_@)

 

good luck and stay as you are, i sincerely like guys like you and a respectful honest guy is definitely husband material.

[Teknoe]

hey teknoe, it's not your fault, and its definitely not unattractive being a gentleman and being interested in someone. it's nice to have something to look forward to: plans, holding hands, a hug, a kiss.... just like back in high school! why people rush when one can enjoy things as they are?

 

i would friendzone only someone who would treat me as his buddy, but i think you showed interest very clearly (i dont know anyone who goes on romantic night pic nics with their friends tbh @_@)

 

good luck and stay as you are, i sincerely like guys like you and a respectful honest guy is definitely husband material.

 

Thanks hun!

 

Yeah, I believe had I done things differently (i.e. better) maybe there's a chance we would be an actual couple right now. But as far as it working out long term, I now have my doubts. If we couldn't even work through the early stages, then what are the chances of it working out long term? Both parties have to buy in and commit. And it just didn't happen here.

 

And it's OK.

 

You live and you learn.

 

You move on and you do better next time with the next person.

 

And hopefully it will be a better match and fit. Right place right time right person for one another.

[I Just Wanna b Happy]

Sorry but a woman who I have not slept with better not dare ask me about my salary. Lord. This is a prime example of why so many of these women are single. You most definitely dodged a bullet. Word of advice, do not keep any kind of contact as its a complete waste of time. Let her fade with the wind.

[JuneJulySeptember]

Wow, that was a read.

 

You're a good writer though man. It didn't drag all that much.

 

One thing I will say is that you overanalyzing these dates and your failures is a waste. Women are unpredictable, fickle, and picky. I have had fairly bad first dates turn into women who love me and a great first couple of dates just vanish into thin air.

 

Also, I didn't know you're Asian. You might want to consider dating outside Asian-American women. They're rough.

[Teknoe]

Wow, that was a read.

 

You're a good writer though man. It didn't drag all that much.

 

One thing I will say is that you overanalyzing these dates and your failures is a waste. Women are unpredictable, fickle, and picky. I have had fairly bad first dates turn into women who love me and a great first couple of dates just vanish into thin air.

 

Also, I didn't know you're Asian. You might want to consider dating outside Asian-American women. They're rough.

 

Thanks for the compliment on my writing. I've been told that a time or two before, and I always appreciate it when someone notices my talent for writing and acknowledges it. I definitely overanalyzed these dates. It's almost like the post-date dissection is more fun and thrilling for me in some ways than the actual date itself. I resolve to change this going forward. More thought you put into something, the more you're obsessed about it. Obsession when it comes to relationships are rarely ever any good.

 

I do consider dating outside my race but I do strongly prefer to date Asian Americans, just because I'm used to it my entire life. It's also what I find to be most attractive and "compatible" in terms of overall package.

[Teknoe]

Heh, thanks. But trust me, I'm still learning (the second you think you got it all figured out is the second you fixin' to eat humble pie). It took me many years to be able to read female cues even halfway adequately. I've gone through so many crushes that I was deep in the friend zone with, before ultimately confessing which led to the awkward "Oh Tek I just see you as a good friend" speech. Ugh. But all those years were not for naught. Every experience has led me to this moment. Maybe because of those years I toiled and slowly learned through trial and error that I'm now better equipped to understand and communicate effectively with a woman who actually shows interest.

 

Lots of bumps in the road, and I'm sure many more to come. It's all about how you handle things (both good and bad) that makes the difference.

 

Haha. Believe it or not her dad wanted me to marry her EVEN BEFORE he ever met me or saw a photo! My dad and her dad are good friends. It's not an arranged marriage, but it was a set up of the parents. We just happened to actually like each other (at least, enough to be dating so far). It's way too soon to even think marriage, but so far I'm seeing certain qualities that I would like in a future wife.

 

Thanks, and yeah, isn't it awesome when communication is simple, clear and efficient? One thing I've learned over the years is to stop over texting. Oh man, was I ever the king of over texting even as short as 3-4 months ago. When I like a girl, I start texting them like crazy. "Hey what you up to?" or I'll see a picture, snapshot it and send it to her. Or hear a lyric and text it to her. Goodness gracious. Looking back, I cringe at my former texting behavior. Talk about killing attraction level. Currently, I'm only texting her as necessary, and saving the conversations for face to face dates/outings. That way you have stuff to talk about!

 

Hmm, I'm glad I learned because had we met a year earlier, I might have blown it with my neediness! Live and learn -- ain't it great?

 

 

Heh, I wanted to highlight this post, especially the part in bold. How ironic that I thought I was ready, but old habits kicked in and did me in voluntarily. I guess I wasn't quite ready to apply the lessons I had learned.

 

Perhaps next time.

 

Life is a series of the same test in a different pair of pants thrown our way. We don't move on until we finally pass the test in front of us.

[winny]

Reading all this I have only one thing to say to you Teknoe.

Be yourself.

Please do.

Feeling like texting a lot??? Text!!!

Feeling like not texting??? Dont!!!

Your every action or inaction should be to make yourself happy....

A girl has to like you for who you are....! Crazy texting habits included!!

You are blaming yourself totally here... What about the girl? Was she so faultless?

She didnt like you from day 1... Thats it...

A bad kiss is no big deal... Happens to everyone!!! She is also equally responsible and may I know what did she do to impress you??? Nothing.

Next time pick a gal who can deal with who you actually are!!

[sc0316]

I guess it was but eh. I think last night we were both finally ready to face the issues head on rather than brush them under the rug. I wish I could redo the home dinner date but I just have to use what I learned moving forward. Should definitely have done dinner after the home date rather than the meet up.

 

Sorry, but this is getting ridiculous. If she wanted to have a date in which the two of you could sit down and chat, why would she ask you to do the group event?

[katiegrl]

Teknoe.... I have read this entire thread, and your other threads, and please don't take offense, but what I think is happening here is you possess too much feminine energy which is preventing you from effectively connecting with the women you meet and go with.

 

Relationships are a balance of masculine energy (the man) and feminine energy (the woman). Ying and yang.

 

Just reading all your posts, which tbh at times were difficult to make it through all the way.... it is clear that you have a lot of work to do on yourself, IMO anyway, if you are ever to draw women to you and maintain their attraction.

 

Try and find and cultivate the masculine energy lurking within you. I know it's in there, you just need to find it and bring it to surface.

 

The below is from a very popular men's dating advice guru, Corey Wayne, who men swear by. I used to not like him, but I have listened to many of his videos and I have to say, the man knows his stuff!

 

---------------------

 

Beginning of article.

 

Masculine energy is all about purpose and drive and mission in life.

 

Feminine energy is about experiencing life, being joyful, being playful, and opening up to receive the strong masculine presence and love of her man. Feminine energy wants to be penetrated by a strong masculine alpha male presence.

 

Masculine energy takes the big problems or big emotional dramas and shrinks them down and resolves them.

 

Feminine energy takes the little problems and makes them into a big deal (Teknoe this is what you are doing).

 

A confident man has no doubt that he can listen to her, understand her, get her to effectively communicate her needs and wants and feelings and take whatever action is necessary to resolve the situation and make it all better. Similar to the way her father fixes everything when she’s a little girl.

 

So if you want your woman to feel safe, comfortable, become attracted to and like you so she can trust your masculine core, you must take care of business. Say what you mean and mean what you say. Directly and succinctly. Otherwise, you’re going to struggle unnecessarily.

End of Article.

 

Teknoe, listen to Corey Wayne, again his videos are all over the net, they're free. He has hundreds of them about every topic you could ever imagine dealing with women.

 

Spend a day just watching and listening to them. I guarantee you will gain an incredible amount of wealth and knowledge.... which you can take with you into your future dating experiences.

 

Again I hope you didn't take offense to any of this and if you did I apologize, that wasn't my intention. Just trying to help.

 

Best of luck and I am sorry things didn't work out with this chick.

Edited July 28, 2016 by katiegrl

[Els]

Your lady friend sounds serious and uptight. Is it even appropriate to ask about your salary? Honestly, that would be a turn off to me.

 

They are both fairly traditional Asians and it's a semi-arranged-marriage thing, so it's perfectly appropriate. If they had been even more traditional, the father would've asked Teknoe about his salary before the girl could even go out with him...

 

Anyway, I don't see the point in dissecting this girl. She's over now. Teknoe is looking forward to making changes in his life and using this as a lesson for how to date in the future, which is good.

Edited July 28, 2016 by Elswyth

[Teknoe]

Katie,

No offense taken. I admit I let my "feminine" energy take over too much when I'm really digging a girl. It's something I'm working on and think I've learned a good deal from this experience.

 

I do know Corey Wayne and I do watch his videos from time to time.

 

My friend gave me a good piece of advice tonight during our gym session. He said "Yeah maybe you could have kissed her in a more ideal romantic situation but I don't think that would change the course of the relationship. If she really liked you, an awkward first kiss or even all the little things you did wouldn't have mattered much. Think about it, when YOU like a girl, don't you give her the benefit of the doubt and look past her flaws particularly early on when you're trying to get to know her better?"

 

So it kinda tells me she never REALLY liked me to begin with, but that she liked me reasonably enough to try, and was probably very lonely, and you add in the parental pressure.

 

Anyway, Els is right. There is no point further dissecting this.

 

The last thing I will add (for now at least) is that she gave me her email address last night. We talked about maybe reading this spiritual book separately, but emailing each other thoughts at the end of each chapter. This is something we may do via email in the Fall if time permits. She said it's not a bad idea (this was right before the friend zone speech).

 

So last night I messaged her just to thank her for dinner and etc. She replied today saying she is glad to have met me as well. She said I have a "charming personality" and a "kind soul."

 

I'm open to communicating with her going forward as friends.

I'm not one of those people who believe once a dating relationship doesn't pan out that you should automatically cut that person out of your life. As long as you can emotionally handle it, a good friend isn't a bad thing to have or come out of such circumstances.

 

Time will tell if this is a legitimate "Let's remain friends" or the token, classic quiet fade away for good routine. I'm OK with either because I can't control her. I would hope she stays in touch here and there, but if not, no biggie.

Edited July 28, 2016 by Teknoe

[Eternal Sunshine]

I do beleive that when there is mutual chemistry, small details like who/when/where/how don't matter. Things flow, because you both want it so much that you kind of fall all over yourself to get a chance to spend time together. There is such a world of difference between that and what you described here. So in a sense, there is no use in dissecting it. I also know plenty of dudes with feminine energy that do well with the ladies and are in happy LTRs. I don't think you should work too hard in pretzeling yourself in something you are not.

 

I also tend to live inside my head and over-analyze. What I found helpful is not to talk about the early dating stages too much. Not to post about it, not to seek advice from others, the less it said the better. Of course you will still think about it but each time you post or discuss it it increases the amount of thinking and obsessivness.

[Moves Like Jagger]

Teknoe.... I have read this entire thread, and your other threads, and please don't take offense, but what I think is happening here is you possess too much feminine energy which is preventing you from effectively connecting with the women you meet and go with.

 

Relationships are a balance of masculine energy (the man) and feminine energy (the woman). Ying and yang.

 

Just reading all your posts, which tbh at times were difficult to make it through all the way.... it is clear that you have a lot of work to do on yourself, IMO anyway, if you are ever to draw women to you and maintain their attraction.

 

Try and find and cultivate the masculine energy lurking within you. I know it's in there, you just need to find it and bring it to surface.

 

The below is from a very popular men's dating advice guru, Corey Wayne, who men swear by. I used to not like him, but I have listened to many of his videos and I have to say, the man knows his stuff!

 

---------------------

 

I agree with katiegrl. Teknoe, I read the entire thread and I notice that you hold traditional views about sex. There's nothing wrong with being a relationship type of guy. However, I think that you took too long with the touching and flirting. Everything seemed so linear. Introduction to the girl. First date. Second date. Near the end of the second date, you go for the kiss. I think things were awkward when you tried to move things forward because you'd tried to transition from platonic friend to dating partner. Instead, you should have tried the flirting and touching much earlier. That way, you could can screen out the girls who will never be interested in you no matter how smooth you are.

 

I have to say congrats at looking for a studio. However, you don't seem to belong to a social circle that has any single women in it. You described yourself as a homebody in an older thread. I think that it would be beneficial to have a larger social circle so that you can practice being playful and flirting with women in a low-pressure environment so that you will be ready when you're on a date.

 

I remember a guy on the Internet who had the same problems with getting stuck in the friendzone. The big difference between him and you is that he wanted sex and relationship with women while you want a relationship. When one of the girls in his social circle started hitting on him, he capitalized in the situation and the girl became his girlfriend. The 1950s mentality about sex isn't going to help you unless you're dealing with a girl who is really religious or comes from a traditional background like the girl in this thread. If you don't become more assertive about your interest and desires, you will either waste time dating lukewarm women like the woman in this thread or worse, you run the risk of women losing interest in you after a few dates.

[Teknoe]

So, it's day two of post-friend zone speech. I felt OK day one, I was already in the acceptance stage of my "grieving" process. However, day two was surprisingly harder. I found myself thinking about her a lot today. Thinking of things to do, even. Her birthday is coming up in mid-August and I was at the store today and was thinking of buying her a card that I'd snail mail to her. I get these crazy "romantic" thoughts and I know these are things I should do if I am her boyfriend, but alas I am not. Sending a card on her bday will probably be frowned upon by her 99 out of 100 times. Sure, she's a sweet girl, but I bet receiving a card in the mail from someone she friend zoned could only scare her into thinking I haven't given up.

 

I know I shouldn't analyze it any further, but I get a little peeved at the notion that she and I would never have worked in a million years. Sure, we have our differences, but I don't doubt we could have been a couple for at least a couple months (and who knows, go from there).

 

I realize though where I truly went wrong.

 

It wasn't so much the awkward first kiss.

 

It was simply the fact that I THOUGHT I HAD THE RELATIONSHIP IN THE BAG.

 

In my mind that first kiss, as awkward as it was, signified to her that I was interested, and signified to me that she was interested. She set up the next date (a meet up event) 15 minutes after the first kiss, to take place 6 days later.

 

What did I do the next day?

 

Instead of asking her out (i.e. wanting to spend more time with her, wanting to get to know her better), we simply texted back and forth a few texts... nothing particularly interesting or flirty. I didn't call her. I just thought "Great, Monday. The day after we kissed. Surely we're on the road to becoming a couple. I'll just play it cool and wait until Saturday night."

 

I did send her another text Wednesday of that week. When she sent me a flirty text reply, I replied back in a very safe, boring "friend like" text. I should have flirted back.

 

So I played it TOO casual the five days following the first kiss.

When we finally met on the 6th day following the first kiss, I was hesitant on being physical with her because obviously her parents live with her and they were in the background when she opened the door. Otherwise I might have given her a big hug and at least a kiss on the cheek. Instead she opened the door, I saw her parents hanging in the background and I do the customary hello routine.

 

After driving her to the event, it was a meet up. So there goes the potential for any 1 on 1 bonding time. It felt like we were total friends on that evening. When we got back to my car I got desperate to establish something physical so I ill timed a hand holding play call. It backfired when she asked "what are you doing?"

 

But honestly, what made her say "what are you doing?"

 

A. The awkward first kiss

B. The casual indifference Monday-Saturday of that week

C. Lack of PDA on that very date

 

I truly believe it was option B. Had I been more forward with her the day after our first kiss, I might be singing a different tune now. All you may be saying "OK so what? What good is analyzing all this?" Well I think it teaches me a valuable lesson for next time. A first kiss doesn't guarantee a budding relationship. It must continue to be nurtured and pursued... especially the few days right after. That's such a critical time period, and I do believe I turned her off when I acted so casual and platonic. She probably felt a little rejected and confused when I didn't escalate on her flirty-ish text that she sent me mid-week of that week.

 

By the time I saw her for the meet up Saturday, she had probably already moved me halfway to the friend zone.

 

Now we don't know her thinking for sure, but I definitely believe this to be most likely accurate.

 

So next time I kiss a girl and we hit it off, I won't be content setting a date a week from now and then "playing it cool/casual" until the next date.

 

No more games and no more trying to play all these "cool casual" rules/tricks. I simply got too into my head rather than trusting my gut. The real me would have messaged her more the day after. Instead I thought I had it in the bag and didn't need to do anything to further cultivate the budding relationship.

 

Hopefully I will get another chance soon with another single lady that I'm attracted to.

Edited July 29, 2016 by Teknoe

[BaileyB]

I think you are still way too much in your head.

 

If she really liked you and wanted to date you, the awkward first kiss and the wait between dates wouldn't really have mattered... I just don't think that this relationship was the one for you.

 

I would encourage you to meet more women and get more experience with dating. Have fun with it and get out of your head. Sadly, it may take you many, many dates before you find someone who wants a relationship.

[sc0316]

I think this post is the best demonstration of Katie's point about displaying excessive feminine energy. I know many of us girls like to dissect every minute detail like the OP has done in this post.

 

As for her birthday, why not just send her a light text?

 

So, it's day two of post-friend zone speech. I felt OK day one, I was already in the acceptance stage of my "grieving" process. However, day two was surprisingly harder. I found myself thinking about her a lot today. Thinking of things to do, even. Her birthday is coming up in mid-August and I was at the store today and was thinking of buying her a card that I'd snail mail to her. I get these crazy "romantic" thoughts and I know these are things I should do if I am her boyfriend, but alas I am not. Sending a card on her bday will probably be frowned upon by her 99 out of 100 times. Sure, she's a sweet girl, but I bet receiving a card in the mail from someone she friend zoned could only scare her into thinking I haven't given up.

 

I know I shouldn't analyze it any further, but I get a little peeved at the notion that she and I would never have worked in a million years. Sure, we have our differences, but I don't doubt we could have been a couple for at least a couple months (and who knows, go from there).

 

I realize though where I truly went wrong.

 

It wasn't so much the awkward first kiss.

 

It was simply the fact that I THOUGHT I HAD THE RELATIONSHIP IN THE BAG.

 

In my mind that first kiss, as awkward as it was, signified to her that I was interested, and signified to me that she was interested. She set up the next date (a meet up event) 15 minutes after the first kiss, to take place 6 days later.

 

What did I do the next day?

 

Instead of asking her out (i.e. wanting to spend more time with her, wanting to get to know her better), we simply texted back and forth a few texts... nothing particularly interesting or flirty. I didn't call her. I just thought "Great, Monday. The day after we kissed. Surely we're on the road to becoming a couple. I'll just play it cool and wait until Saturday night."

 

I did send her another text Wednesday of that week. When she sent me a flirty text reply, I replied back in a very safe, boring "friend like" text. I should have flirted back.

 

So I played it TOO casual the five days following the first kiss.

When we finally met on the 6th day following the first kiss, I was hesitant on being physical with her because obviously her parents live with her and they were in the background when she opened the door. Otherwise I might have given her a big hug and at least a kiss on the cheek. Instead she opened the door, I saw her parents hanging in the background and I do the customary hello routine.

 

After driving her to the event, it was a meet up. So there goes the potential for any 1 on 1 bonding time. It felt like we were total friends on that evening. When we got back to my car I got desperate to establish something physical so I ill timed a hand holding play call. It backfired when she asked "what are you doing?"

 

But honestly, what made her say "what are you doing?"

 

A. The awkward first kiss

B. The casual indifference Monday-Saturday of that week

C. Lack of PDA on that very date

 

I truly believe it was option B. Had I been more forward with her the day after our first kiss, I might be singing a different tune now. All you may be saying "OK so what? What good is analyzing all this?" Well I think it teaches me a valuable lesson for next time. A first kiss doesn't guarantee a budding relationship. It must continue to be nurtured and pursued... especially the few days right after. That's such a critical time period, and I do believe I turned her off when I acted so casual and platonic. She probably felt a little rejected and confused when I didn't escalate on her flirty-ish text that she sent me mid-week of that week.

 

By the time I saw her for the meet up Saturday, she had probably already moved me halfway to the friend zone.

 

Now we don't know her thinking for sure, but I definitely believe this to be most likely accurate.

 

So next time I kiss a girl and we hit it off, I won't be content setting a date a week from now and then "playing it cool/casual" until the next date.

 

No more games and no more trying to play all these "cool casual" rules/tricks. I simply got too into my head rather than trusting my gut. The real me would have messaged her more the day after. Instead I thought I had it in the bag and didn't need to do anything to further cultivate the budding relationship.

 

Hopefully I will get another chance soon with another single lady that I'm attracted to.

Edited July 29, 2016 by sc0316

[Teknoe]

Yeah I will just text her on her bday and wish her a great day.

[RecentChange]

OMG stop over thinking everything - I am gonna say it, it's really unattractive! I think if any girl had any idea how much you pour over every detail, every interaction they would be cringing.

 

I agree - all this over thinking, reading into everything demonstrates the opposite of confidence (which is very attractive) and gives off a fem vibe.

[winny]

Teknoe - You cannot "make" anyone like you. Ever!

You are thinking because you texted less so her interest went down... And otherwise you would have been successful in "making" her like you. I dont think so. Yes she might have felt bit confused, but you were not her official BF so she cannot expect you to keep her entertained. And if she was interested then as soon as you met her she would have felt delighted. There are people here on Loveshack who come and ask questions about why some person didn't text them and when they receive a text or meet them a week later - then they get overjoyed. Their liking doesn't go down because of how many texts were sent or not and they even themselves make up excuses for the person not texting them.. LOL

Instead of trying to do things and hoping that those might result in someone liking you, try being yourself and doing things which you would normally do because of who you are - good things, bad things... make yourself vulnerable and show your true self (flaws included). Because that way if someone likes you then they like you for who you are and if they dont... you dont have to think so much... coz you were just being yourself. So stop this analysis of every move. It looks like everything you do is done with an expectation of making a girl like you.... when u helped some old lady... u should help her without thinking whether the gal will like u as a result of it or not....

I hope I am making sense.

And once again - If u want to maintain your sanity stop this over analysis.