Does she think I am damaged goods?

[elaine567]

You do not feel you are damaged goods, you see yourself as good relationship material as you are a realtor make a decent salary and are a decent person.

BUT and it is a huge but, no-one dating you really cares that your kids go to a good school and your ex wife lives in a 5k a month property all taken care of by you. That is not a positive, that is a huge negative, if not a dealbreaker, especially as you yourself live in a dingy rented room, (you cannot even take anyone to it is so bad), alternating with your wife's sofa... who can really respect such a man?

You are basically looking for a woman to share rent with so you can get a place of your own, or an independent woman, who owns her own property, so you can sponge off her.

What decent woman wants to get into that complicated mess?

Who wants to effectively subsidize your ex wife and kids and take a back seat too? No family of her own either as you are done with all that...

 

Here, you either continue to sacrifice yourself or you make changes, it is up to you.

[drew_meister]

So, a few things here...

 

1. I hope you sought legal advice for this. I have seen "agreements" ignored in court by judges because proper documentation was never drawn up. So for instance, the guy had been giving his ex child support payments in cash for 10 years (he worked as an "off the books" laborer, and his ex came back and got him for 10 years of BACK child support

 

2. Are you actually divorced, legally?

 

3. Who cares about the tax writeoff when you are borderline homeless? How much do you make, and what percentage of your income is going to this boondoggle?

 

We have been legally divorced for 4 years. The agreement was submitted to family court and signed off on by the judge. I hired an attorney to draft the agreement.

 

I guess this is anonymous, so here goes... My income varies tremendously as it is entirely commission based. I've averaged about $150-200K the last 3 years. That assumes about $10-15M in real estate transactions/year which is about what I sustain. I have a broker license so I can keep more of my commission but leaving my firm would result in fewer leads and less stability. Anyway, I budget my income as $10K/month so I can survive lean months. The boondoogle gets $5000. Uncle Sam and State of CA only get about $1500 thanks to all my write-offs. Car payment plus gas and insurance is about $1200. Medical insurance $500. Rent and utilities about $1000. That leaves me about $800 to live off of. It's actually much higher than that as I average more than $10K/mo. It just gets stressful when I don't have a commission for a while and bank accounts take a nose dive...

 

Then move... I live in a town I can afford. I don't live in Monaco, or Hawaii, or Tokyo. Because I can't afford it.

 

Sounds like another reason to MOVE.

 

But your expenses would go WAY down. Who cares how much money you make, if you cannot afford your own place to live. Again, you are borderline HOMELESS

 

If I leave the area my income takes a huge hit. That means we must sell the house, uproot the kids, and we all end up living in a $hitty area? Believe me, I've considered it many times but it just seems like too much sacrifice - then what if I still wind up alone and single??? Somehow I found a women who would tolerate all my ***** for two years. Now I've met another one who really likes me but I know this thing is a huge elephant in the room.

 

Please, I'd love some advice on how to get out of this mess without uprooting the whole family...

[JoeSmith357-1]

No she can't. She makes about $3K/mo. Even though she has an MBA, she didn't use it right away and then became a stay at home mom. She's in her 40's now so it's a worthless piece of paper. She's studying to become a licensed therapist as she really has no career path otherwise. She's either working or toting the kids back and forth from school, soccer, ballet etc. She's an excellent mom.

 

If she's toting kids around everywhere, including soccer and ballet, she's financially overextended herself.

 

You don't live the life of a gypsy so your kids can go to a nice school, go to ballet, soccer.

 

When financial times are tough, sometimes kids lifestyles need to be adjusted as well as yours.

 

I grew up poor, and I have a teenage son and am divorced.

 

So I HAVE (AM still!) walked in your shoes. And I love my son, but not to the point that I would be homeless so he could play sports, do ballet, and maybe go to a nicer school. Seriously, how bad can the schools be in San Francisco of all places?

[Toodaloo]

Please, I'd love some advice on how to get out of this mess without uprooting the whole family...

 

Move your family to a smaller home in the local area. As you work in real estate you will be able to find somewhere faster than others anyway.

 

Move in with your parents and save every dime from not renting that ****ty little room to save for a massive deposit and small mortgage on a little place that has space for you and your children so you have some security for them.

 

You may think you are doing the right thing by them but you are not.

 

Children need BOTH parents to be stable.

[JoeSmith357-1]

Somehow I found a women who would tolerate all my ***** for two years. Now I've met another one who really likes me but I know this thing is a huge elephant in the room.

 

Let's be real here. We all know nothing about the details about how/why the relationship with the previous woman you lived with for 2 years ended, but would it be fair to speculate that your sending HALF of your monthly income to your ex had something to do with it? When making long term plans, speaking for myself, I would not be making long term plans with someone with that much of a financial boat anchor around their neck.

 

That "white elephant in the room" will be there until your kid is through college most likely.

 

Please, I'd love some advice on how to get out of this mess without uprooting the whole family...

 

Sometimes, what is the best for you, and the best for your family is to move. To extricate yourself from the crippling financial situation you have gotten yourself into.

 

If I leave the area my income takes a huge hit. That means we must sell the house, uproot the kids, and we all end up living in a $hitty area?

 

There's plenty of nice areas with much less cost of living.

 

You are completely ignoring the fact that you live in the 5th most expensive city in the US for cost of living.

 

Move somewhere that you might make 1/3 of what you are now, but your mortgage would be under $1000.

 

It's absolutely not sustainable for you to be sending HALF of your budgeted income to your ex. That's ****ing nuts no matter how you slice it...

 

How old are your kids/kid?

[drew_meister]

If she's toting kids around everywhere, including soccer and ballet, she's financially overextended herself.

 

You don't live the life of a gypsy so your kids can go to a nice school, go to ballet, soccer.

 

When financial times are tough, sometimes kids lifestyles need to be adjusted as well as yours.

 

I grew up poor, and I have a teenage son and am divorced.

 

So I HAVE (AM still!) walked in your shoes. And I love my son, but not to the point that I would be homeless so he could play sports, do ballet, and maybe go to a nicer school. Seriously, how bad can the schools be in San Francisco of all places?

 

Mind you until November I was living in a decent loft with my ex-GF. I had to give it up as $2500/mo. didn't make any sense. I could take on a roommate and still have space for my kids. I moved into this tiny place to save up until I figure out what to do next.

 

Soccer isn't that expensive. My parents pay for the ballet. They are very sympathetic to my situation.

Edited July 7, 2016 by drew_meister

[drew_meister]

Move your family to a smaller home in the local area. As you work in real estate you will be able to find somewhere faster than others anyway.

 

Move in with your parents and save every dime from not renting that ****ty little room to save for a massive deposit and small mortgage on a little place that has space for you and your children so you have some security for them.

 

You may think you are doing the right thing by them but you are not.

 

Children need BOTH parents to be stable.

 

Nothing in SF that can fit a family is under $1 million unless we move to the hood. And I mean hood. Not going to happen. I sell our house and I'm priced out of the area.

 

My parents live in Walnut Creek which is 20 miles away but like the other side of the world because you need to cross the Bay Bridge. It's OK for weekends, which is when I mostly take the kids, but not commuting. Just the gas, bridge toll, and parking space in SF would be more than half my rent!

[CarrieT]

Nothing in SF that can fit a family is under $1 million unless we move to the hood. And I mean hood. Not going to happen. I sell our house and I'm priced out of the area.

 

My parents live in Walnut Creek which is 20 miles away but like the other side of the world because you need to cross the Bay Bridge. It's OK for weekends, which is when I mostly take the kids, but not commuting. Just the gas, bridge toll, and parking space in SF would be more than half my rent!

 

Concur. People who don't live here don't understand the dynamics. My new husband and I rent just south of the city (Montara). When we started dating, four years ago, I desperately wished for a better house than he was renting (lost his ownership due to a divorce). At that time, a 4-bedroom house was in the $3k range. Now it is $6k. If my husband could have bought the house he was renting when he got divorced, it would have been a $300k house. It is now a $1.2m house and is pretty crappy.

 

I understand that uprooting your whole family isn't practical for financial reasons. However I don't believe your wife's MBA is worthless because of her age. And becoming a therapist? I think she has got the easy life. And, unfortunately, you *are* damaged good for the time being. Sadly, when the real estate bubble bursts and rentals become more available, so will your subsequent income.

 

Out of curiosity, is there a longterm plan with your property? Or does your ExW get it forever?

[Toodaloo]

if you are not prepared to compromise then I am afraid that is your choice.

 

Just remember that you are not going to see a penny of the money that you are ploughing into that house... Not one penny.

 

You either change something and rebuild or you stay stuck as you are.

 

Your choice.

 

Good luck with whatever you decide to do.

[drew_meister]

Let's be real here. We all know nothing about the details about how/why the relationship with the previous woman you lived with for 2 years ended, but would it be fair to speculate that your sending HALF of your monthly income to your ex had something to do with it? When making long term plans, speaking for myself, I would not be making long term plans with someone with that much of a financial boat anchor around their neck.

 

That "white elephant in the room" will be there until your kid is through college most likely.

 

 

 

Sometimes, what is the best for you, and the best for your family is to move. To extricate yourself from the crippling financial situation you have gotten yourself into.

 

 

 

There's plenty of nice areas with much less cost of living.

 

You are completely ignoring the fact that you live in the 5th most expensive city in the US for cost of living.

 

Move somewhere that you might make 1/3 of what you are now, but your mortgage would be under $1000.

 

It's absolutely not sustainable for you to be sending HALF of your budgeted income to your ex. That's ****ing nuts no matter how you slice it...

 

How old are your kids/kid?

 

I really didn't want to open up this can of worms but here we go...

 

From 3 years ago.. http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/dating/383528-i-m-father-without-kids-dating-sucks

 

Ex-wife is from Japan. Right after the divorce, she took the kids to Japan (see thread above). Nothing I could. I convinced her to come back but here we are. She refuses to live in any city without a large Japanese community. Kids go to a Japanese school in addition to regular school. So if I move to an up-and-coming affordable city like Salt Lake City or Asheville, NC, she ain't coming. She'll just move back to Japan. So it's SF, LA, NY or a handful of other places.

[preraph]

Look, I'm not saying you're doing anything wrong, but most women would not want to see how comfy you are in your ex's house or like that you were totally supporting her (though a divorced single mother might LOVE that). I think your best bet is to find a different woman, one with kids who's been through all this custody mess and can see that you are taking care of things, and one who is making her own living and has her own home so you can spend time there mostly.

 

But now, a lot of women are not going to want all your money going to a different woman and kids IF there is not enough to live on with them. If your ex only has joint custody, she should be able to work. I realize that doesn't mean she can make enough money as she needs. There's gov't help for that as well. But at some point she is going to have to at least try to work and take less money from you IF you are splitting the childcare.

[drew_meister]

Out of curiosity, is there a longterm plan with your property? Or does your ExW get it forever?

 

Equity is split 50/50. It is written that as soon as our youngest (10) turns 18, either of us may sell without the other's consent. Attorney advised it may not be legally enforceable but she will honor it. That I know. It's worth about $1.4M and we have about $600k equity. So I have $300k equity.

[Gaeta]

I would not date you.

 

You wanting the kids to remain in this house is an excuse. Sell it, sell it now and both move on with your life. She can buy herself a nice condo with her share and you go about your business.

 

One of my friend is in this situation. Her boyfriend has a house, in which he does not live, and his ex-wife lives in with their 2 kids.

 

All of his money goes to that house, the ex and kids. The ex needs him over there all the time for swimming pool problems, yard problems, furnace problems, name it. It drives my friend crazy. Like you, because he gave his ex the house to live in he finds himself living in a ****ty little apartment with no furniture.

 

They have been dating for 2 years and they have been fighting about it for 2 years.

 

Before bringing someone else in your life, get your own life on track.

[JoeSmith357-1]

I really didn't want to open up this can of worms but here we go...

 

From 3 years ago.. http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/dating/383528-i-m-father-without-kids-dating-sucks

 

Ex-wife is from Japan. Right after the divorce, she took the kids to Japan (see thread above). Nothing I could. I convinced her to come back but here we are. She refuses to live in any city without a large Japanese community. Kids go to a Japanese school in addition to regular school. So if I move to an up-and-coming affordable city like Salt Lake City or Asheville, NC, she ain't coming. She'll just move back to Japan. So it's SF, LA, NY or a handful of other places.

 

If she is an American citizen, she can't just move the kids out of state, let alone out of the country without your permission and by going through the courts. You have parental rights.

 

My ex wanted to move out of state for a job, she had to get my permission to relocate my child (which I granted).

 

I get him every summer and holidays. It sucks sometimes not being so close. But it's ok.

 

I see a little more where you are coming from, but this to me would be unacceptable on so many levels.

 

She's manipulating you , so at least if you recognize it, and apparently accept it, then you have to deal with the ramifications. Which are living like a homeless guy.

 

Just out of curiosity what did you do when the market fell out of real estate in 2008-2012?

[sc0316]

Mind you until November I was living in a decent loft with my ex-GF. I had to give it up as $2500/mo. didn't make any sense. I could take on a roommate and still have space for my kids. I moved into this tiny place to save up until I figure out what to do next.

 

Soccer isn't that expensive. My parents pay for the ballet. They are very sympathetic to my situation.

 

Then you can sell the house and rent two loft apartments for the same price (2.5k/mo x2 vs. 5k/mo). You each can net 300k of equity. Also, can't you take the Bart to SF from Walnut Creek? Finally, 1.2k/mo for car payment plus gas plus insurance is a lot!

[JoeSmith357-1]

It's my understanding that there are cheaper places in Oakland too... just saying

[drew_meister]

If she is an American citizen, she can't just move the kids out of state, let alone out of the country without your permission and by going through the courts. You have parental rights.

 

My ex wanted to move out of state for a job, she had to get my permission to relocate my child (which I granted).

 

I get him every summer and holidays. It sucks sometimes not being so close. But it's ok.

 

I see a little more where you are coming from, but this to me would be unacceptable on so many levels.

 

She's manipulating you , so at least if you recognize it, and apparently accept it, then you have to deal with the ramifications. Which are living like a homeless guy.

 

Just out of curiosity what did you do when the market fell out of real estate in 2008-2012?

 

Back in 2012 when we divorced, Japan was not even a signatory of the Hague Convention on International Child Abduction. They signed it in 2013, and enacted in 2014 but it really hasn't gotten any better.

 

Japan still carries child abduction 'black hole' stigma despite signing to Hague Convention: expert | The Japan Times

 

So long story short, she can just take the kids whenever she wants and I'd face a huge legal fight to get them back.

 

of course she is manipulating me and I recognize it. What would you do if you were in my shoes? I could be spiteful but would be taking down her, me, and my kids in the process. I just keep telling myself 8 more years until I am paroled...

 

As for real estate volatility, you shift to rentals and leases when real estate sales are down. 2008-2012 really wasn't that bad in SF. Housing is ALWAYS in demand here.

[SwordofFlame]

What do the kids feel about living in Japan? Would there kicking and screaming not even faze her?

[drew_meister]

Then you can sell the house and rent two loft apartments for the same price (2.5k/mo x2 vs. 5k/mo). You each can net 300k of equity. Also, can't you take the Bart to SF from Walnut Creek? Finally, 1.2k/mo for car payment plus gas plus insurance is a lot!

 

$5K/mo that is tax deductible. That is about $3500/month post taxes since rent is not tax deductible. So $2500 for her (it's probably closer to $3000 now as our landlord didn't raise rent at all during lease) and $1000 left for me. Same exact situation for me but now kids live in a *****tier place and I don't build any equity. At least while I've been subsistence living these past few years, I built some in equity in the house.

 

Yes you can BART from Walnut Creek but is a 40 year old man living with his parents any better for dating than a bachelor studio downtown?

 

I leased the car 2 years ago. 11 months left on $750/mo payment. It would cost more to terminate lease early. Insurance, gas, car wash, parking etc is $450/mo. You need a car as a realtor. Yes many times I can take MUNI or BART but you never know when you need one for a client.

[drew_meister]

What do the kids feel about living in Japan? Would there kicking and screaming not even faze her?

 

Youngest wouldn't mind. Oldest would probably hate mom for life. That's probably the reason she is still here...

[Redhead14]

Talk to a financial analyst/planner . . . get out from under this. You can still ensure that the children have a roof over their heads, a decent education and have two healthy, parents who are fully there for them, instead of being run ragged and exhausted.

 

There is a solution if you start thinking outside of the box you've built yourself.

[sc0316]

$5K/mo that is tax deductible. That is about $3500/month post taxes since rent is not tax deductible. So $2500 for her (it's probably closer to $3000 now as our landlord didn't raise rent at all during lease) and $1000 left for me. Same exact situation for me but now kids live in a *****tier place and I don't build any equity. At least while I've been subsistence living these past few years, I built some in equity in the house.

 

Yes you can BART from Walnut Creek but is a 40 year old man living with his parents any better for dating than a bachelor studio downtown?

 

I leased the car 2 years ago. 11 months left on $750/mo payment. It would cost more to terminate lease early. Insurance, gas, car wash, parking etc is $450/mo. You need a car as a realtor. Yes many times I can take MUNI or BART but you never know when you need one for a client.

 

Ok, so you have about 4.5k post tax to divide between you guys for housing. Wouldn't it be fair to rent two decent places like 2.5k vs. 2k (which is feasible in the east bay)? But it's your choice. I just feel bad for your ex-gf.

Edited July 7, 2016 by sc0316

[Grapesofwrath]

I think "damaged goods" is an ugly term and is degrading. If you use it about yourself, then I imagine you view people through that lens as well, which is hurtful. So first, let's loose the hurtful language.

 

You are not damaged goods. You are not great relationship material right now, either, so I can understand why she doesn't want to get deeply involved. Getting divorced and raising kids is tricky business and takes a massive financial toll. It will take a while to sort it all out. In the meantime, she probably wants to keep it light with you because she doesn't really see a future with you, or even a short-term sense of security with all this shuffling about. She may also want to protect her own security and not get involved with someone who she feels may want to latch on to her for security. (I have been in this position, and there is nothing less attractive than a man who doesn't have his own $h!t together, looking at you to provide a home base.)

[ExpatInItaly]

To respond to your initial question:

 

Damaged goods isn't the term I would use; that's pretty harsh.

 

But I also wouldn't get involved with a man in your situation either. You're far too attached to your ex, whatever the reasons are.

 

If a man had the b*lls to cook me dinner in his ex-wife's house, that would be the last date. There are way too many boundaries being crossed and most women would not be comfortable with this set-up at all.

[elaine567]

If a man had the b*lls to cook me dinner in his ex-wife's house, that would be the last date. There are way too many boundaries being crossed and most women would not be comfortable with this set-up at all.

 

Ditto...

_____________________