katiegrl Posted June 28, 2016 Posted June 28, 2016 Lol, I've said that to myself plenty of times honestly.. His sister and brother in law lives in town near us.. They are very close to him. When I was driving around with him, I said, "if you have no where to go, why don't you go by your sisters house?" He told me she said no and she didn't want to get involved in him and their dad's drama. When I think about it now, if it meant him sleeping on the street, who in their right mind would really tell their brother no? Makes me wonder a lot considering how close they are to begin with. Makes ME wonder about HIS mental state.... As I said, it isn't just about him being broke all the time. That is just a "symptom" of a much larger "disease." The disease being he is emotionally unstable, histrionic, irresponsible and IMO he needs professional help! His family clearly wants nothing to do with him... no doubt he has probably caused much emotional havoc and turmoil in their lives too. Is this want YOU want for yourself? Driving him around at all hours of the night because he has no place to go? A grown man with a job? Among all the other histrionics and instability he brings to your life? Are you sure he HAS a job?
Author vc87 Posted June 28, 2016 Author Posted June 28, 2016 Sick father or not, broke at 29 is pretty unsatisfactory. Does the dad (who I'm assuming is at least 55) not have any money saved to cover his expenses? It's an unfortunate situation for sure, but it sounds like neither one of them bothered to save anything in the event that something unexpected happened. I don't know the whole story but that sounds like very, very poor risk management for two grown adults. I'm 29, I could easily pay some household expenses for my dad, who has also been in poor health for years -- fortunately, he worked hard, lived below his means his whole life, and saved his money to pay for his own things rather than blow it all and hand someone else the bill when things went south. The father makes his decision not to save his money the son's problem, and the son's making his decision not to save his money your problem. I don't see the appeal. How do you see things getting better? He never does the things you ask him to do and is totally dependent on you. You've been funding his life, but still his poor decisions and inability to do better have rendered him essentially homeless and you're wondering if it's worth fixing? It's not your responsibility to cover for his (and/or his father's) poor decisions. Until he actually changes, which it doesn't sound like he'll ever do, he'll be an anchor holding you down as long as you're with him. If I were you, I'd leave him ASAP. The family has not done itself any favors and it's highly unlikely they'll ever do you any. Another big reason why I feel bad for my boyfriend is because his family life has not been that great - his mother passed away when he was 18. His father had to retire early (he's 60 but he honestly looks like he's 80 health wise - he's on a lot of different pills and medications) his father had to retire early about 6 years after that because he was got too sick to work. My boyfriend's father is very abusive mentally to him, saying horrible things to him, and sometimes even physically as well. Earlier this year there was huge fight his dad attacked him and the neighbors called the cops to come.. At first believe him because he called me crying, I thought he was doing a dramatic episode again.. Like how good his sickly father beat him up.. But then he sent me the paperwork that the cops gave him, so I felt terrible that I didn't believe him.. His dad does supposedly have a lot of medical bills, but he gets a pension check every month as long as a disability check so he does have a good amount of money coming in every month to cover his bills.. My boyfriend is claiming that one of the checks was messed up and hasn't come so he had a kick in the help out but I just don't buy it..
katiegrl Posted June 28, 2016 Posted June 28, 2016 My boyfriend is claiming that one of the checks was messed up and hasn't come so he had a kick in the help out but I just don't buy it.. Good you're starting to catch on. It is always something isn't it. And it is always going to BE something because he is emotionally and mentally unstable among all the other things everyone else has mentioned. One crazy excuse after another.... that makes absolutely no logical sense.
Author vc87 Posted June 28, 2016 Author Posted June 28, 2016 Makes ME wonder about HIS mental state.... As I said, it isn't just about him being broke all the time. That is just a "symptom" of a much larger "disease." The disease being he is emotionally unstable, histrionic, irresponsible and IMO he needs professional help! His family clearly wants nothing to do with him... no doubt he has probably caused much emotional havoc and turmoil in their lives too. Is this want YOU want for yourself? Driving him around at all hours of the night because he has no place to go? A grown man with a job? Among all the other histrionics and instability he brings to your life? Are you sure he HAS a job? I do know for a fact that he has a job.. I have seen his pay stubs and I know he's not making that part up. My boyfriend has mentioned to me plenty of times that after his last relationship ended, and he moved back in with his father to help take care of him.. He was really depressed and down in the dumps and he was not himself at all.. He told me that a lot of his friends and family members were concerned for him and that even his sister said that he needed to see a therapist because she was so worried about him being depressed. He told me that ever since we started talking and dating that I completely saved and changed his life and brought him out of that.. He says he's the happiest she's ever been in his entire life. But he also says he would never want to live without me. I really do worry that if we ever broke up, he would fall down that path again very easily, and I would just hate to see something happen to him, would feel so guilty.
MissBee Posted June 28, 2016 Posted June 28, 2016 (edited) Look not trying to be mean or anything just being blunt...but this is another case where what is described by the OP something or someone so extraordinarily screwed up yet make excuses for them or justify why they “love” or “care” for them… or “oh they are not REALLY that bad” This issue is not about the “broke dude” we don’t know him, but more about what “issues” the OP has going on with her life and self-esteem that tolerates being with someone like this. Some people hang on to broke people because they believe that is all they deserve. I have to agree with this. We all are free to choose who we want to be with and who we choose, make excuses for etc. says a lot about us. The whole "I'm not really happy, it's not really what I want, he is xyz bad quality BUT I love him and he's actually not that bad..." story is as old as time itself. Someone doesn't need to be a "bad person" for you not to date them or for them not to be a match for you and where you are in life. It's dangerous to think that way. It's not about some purity of good and bad. We all have good and bad qualities. Relationships are about mutual love, respect, trust, commitment, teamwork and working well together where being with them enhances your life and vice-versa and someone may be a "good person" but not have the necessary ingredients for such a relationship. I agree that vc87, it's up to you to take stock of what you really NEED and want in a partner and if weighing it all, this man is truly the BEST you can do. I notice you say he is a good guy and won't cheat....look...I get the appeal of that...but lots of guys are good and don't cheat and also don't have the other issues your guy does. Don't let fear of cheating allow you to settle for someone. You may not be doing this consciously, but since you mention he loves you more than anyone else, is good, and won't cheat, think about if some fear of cheating is making you choose a man who you know doesn't match up because part of you feels like if he has to depend on you and is in such a poor (literally and figuratively) position, he will have no choice but to worship the ground you walk on because you "gave him a chance." This is a common story as well. Women choosing men not on the same level as them partly because this man needs them in some way and they have more control, even though they technically don't like him being dependent, but some part of it is subconsciously comforting and secure (as you mention) because this guy after all is a borderline bum and maybe not many women would want them anyway and they do so much for this guy that he will be eternally grateful and never stray. But that's not a way to live. Figure out what you need and want in a man and maybe why you feel like this guy is "IT" in spite of all the challenges. You can't change him but you can certainly make choices when you start being honest with yourself. Edited June 28, 2016 by MissBee 3
Larryville Posted June 28, 2016 Posted June 28, 2016 Good you're starting to catch on. No K clearly she’s not… I do know for a fact that he has a job.. He told me that ever since we started talking and dating that I completely saved and changed his life He says he's the happiest she's ever been in his entire life. But he also says he would never want to live without me. I really do worry that if we ever broke up, he would fall down that path again very easily, and I would just hate to see something happen to him, would feel so guilty. Justification behavior
MissBee Posted June 28, 2016 Posted June 28, 2016 You are looking at this the wrong way. She told him no because she knows him and she knows it's the same sh$t over and over again so she is not getting involved again. She loves her brother, don't doubt it but the difference is that she is not blinded by being in love with him like you are. She knows how to set boundaries, you don't. Exactly. As I mentioned in my first post, the dad and the bf seem to have a VERY dysfunctional and bizarre relationship. The sister seems to know all about this and has done well to extricate herself from it. VC87, you just came around 15 months ago. The sister has likely had a LIFETIME of seeing firsthand her brother's issues and this situation with him and the dad, that you may possibly not be privy to at all. It's more likely that you're the one who doesn't really know the full extent of these issues and not that she's not that close to him. She is likely very close to him, hence after years and years of this mess has made the wise choice to extricate herself and have some self-love and boundaries to not be mired in their drama....whereas you're the newbie who is driving him around and giving him money and hoping for the best and have been suckered into this dysfunction. 1
Gaeta Posted June 28, 2016 Posted June 28, 2016 Another big reason why I feel bad for my boyfriend is because his family life has not been that great - his mother passed away when he was 18. His father had to retire early (he's 60 but he honestly looks like he's 80 health wise - he's on a lot of different pills and medications) his father had to retire early about 6 years after that because he was got too sick to work. That does not excuse his behavior. I had people that had it much tougher than your boyfriend and they don't parasites on people surrounding them. My boyfriend's father is very abusive mentally to him, saying horrible things to him, and sometimes even physically as well. Earlier this year there was huge fight his dad attacked him and the neighbors called the cops to come.. At first believe him because he called me crying, I thought he was doing a dramatic episode again.. Like how good his sickly father beat him up.. But then he sent me the paperwork that the cops gave him, so I felt terrible that I didn't believe him.. Then he needs to move out. His father cannot be in such a bad health condition if he can beat up his 29 year old son. Your BF is living there to suck what he can out of his father. Probably a roof over his head. His dad does supposedly have a lot of medical bills, but he gets a pension check every month as long as a disability check so he does have a good amount of money coming in every month to cover his bills.. My boyfriend is claiming that one of the checks was messed up and hasn't come so he had a kick in the help out but I just don't buy it.. There you go. BF has no reasons to be living under his roof.
Author vc87 Posted June 28, 2016 Author Posted June 28, 2016 Good you're starting to catch on. It is always something isn't it. And it is always going to BE something because he is emotionally and mentally unstable among all the other things everyone else has mentioned. One crazy excuse after another.... that makes absolutely no logical sense. Oh believe me, most of the time he starts with these overly dramatic things I don't believe him at all unless he has actual proof.. (Like the police papers).. That's a huge problem in itself I'm sure.. There have been countless times where he claimed he was going to jail for unpaid tickets saying he needed money or would have to go.. I offered to help him of course, but at the time, he said he couldn't take my money.. I was if if means you going to jail why wouldn't you? Somehow "he got the money" he needed from people he works with so they saved him from having to go.. Sometimes I really think he starts this stuff to get a reaction out of me
MissBee Posted June 28, 2016 Posted June 28, 2016 Who cares how "good" he is or how much he cares about you if he can't take care of himself? Who cares how crazy he is about you if he's destitute, crying, and living on the street? How can you possibly care about having someone's love when they have the financial sense and security of a 3 year old, and like a 3 year old, are totally dependent on you for everything? This man is a really just a big child. Would you be that devastated if a 3 year old had developed an affinity for you, and then suddenly decided they didn't like you anymore (as fickle 3 year olds tend to do)? Essentially, why are you so concerned with the love of someone who can't even wipe their own ass? VC87, the above may be difficult to read, but read and re-read it and take all the time you need (no need to answer to us) to ask yourself these questions. Your bf has his own issues, but trust and believe, when we choose people like this and hanker for their love and want to fix them and help them and cash all these blank checks under the guise of love, we usually have our own issues about boundaries, self-worth, self-love, self-esteem and so on. Of course your bf doesn't want to "live without you," from your description, he can barely even live with you! I mean, no one should find that line appealing, but especially not from someone who is borderline homeless, of course they can't live without you. He has his own reasons for loving you and mostly loving what you do FOR him as well, but you need to figure out some concrete reasons why you love him and one tip is that "feeling bad" for someone should NEVER be the major basis of your relationship. Relationships aren't about alms and charity and fixer-upper projects. 1
Gaeta Posted June 28, 2016 Posted June 28, 2016 Oh believe me, most of the time he starts with these overly dramatic things I don't believe him at all unless he has actual proof.. (Like the police papers).. That's a huge problem in itself I'm sure.. There have been countless times where he claimed he was going to jail for unpaid tickets saying he needed money or would have to go.. I offered to help him of course, but at the time, he said he couldn't take my money.. I was if if means you going to jail why wouldn't you? Somehow "he got the money" he needed from people he works with so they saved him from having to go.. Sometimes I really think he starts this stuff to get a reaction out of me VC: I understand a girl being sucked in this drama for 3-4-5 months before opening he eyes but 15 months?? Anyone around has tried to shake some sense into you like your parents and friends? Or you hide all of this to them. 1
Author vc87 Posted June 28, 2016 Author Posted June 28, 2016 VC: I understand a girl being sucked in this drama for 3-4-5 months before opening he eyes but 15 months?? Anyone around has tried to shake some sense into you like your parents and friends? Or you hide all of this to them. When I tell my friends about this they kind of wonder why I put up with it, and they tell me to end things are ready if I'm not entirely happy.. They tell me that things won't change and that I'll be better off on my own. Being alone never bothered me, I was single for so long before this, but it kind of freaks me out a little bit now honestly after dating him for so long.. Part of me feels like I put up with this because I don't want to be on my own again.. I put myself through this because I worry I won't find someone better.. I tell my mom a lot about these episodes when they happen.. she feels sorry for him too.. She thinks he's a good guy and she likes him a lot but but she also did tell me that he's not marriage material
Gaeta Posted June 28, 2016 Posted June 28, 2016 When I tell my friends about this they kind of wonder why I put up with it, and they tell me to end things are ready if I'm not entirely happy.. They tell me that things won't change and that I'll be better off on my own. Being alone never bothered me, I was single for so long before this, but it kind of freaks me out a little bit now honestly after dating him for so long.. Part of me feels like I put up with this because I don't want to be on my own again.. I put myself through this because I worry I won't find someone better.. I tell my mom a lot about these episodes when they happen.. she feels sorry for him too.. She thinks he's a good guy and she likes him a lot but but she also did tell me that he's not marriage material It's 15 months, not 15 years. It's time to end it. I am not sure what you want for yourself but it's certainly not having children with such a dramatic unreliable irresponsible man. 1
Author vc87 Posted June 28, 2016 Author Posted June 28, 2016 Exactly. As I mentioned in my first post, the dad and the bf seem to have a VERY dysfunctional and bizarre relationship. The sister seems to know all about this and has done well to extricate herself from it. VC87, you just came around 15 months ago. The sister has likely had a LIFETIME of seeing firsthand her brother's issues and this situation with him and the dad, that you may possibly not be privy to at all. It's more likely that you're the one who doesn't really know the full extent of these issues and not that she's not that close to him. She is likely very close to him, hence after years and years of this mess has made the wise choice to extricate herself and have some self-love and boundaries to not be mired in their drama....whereas you're the newbie who is driving him around and giving him money and hoping for the best and have been suckered into this dysfunction. The father was very abusive towards his sister too which is why she kind of doesn't want anything to do with him, she distances herself a lot you avoid the drama that you avoid the drama and verbal abuse. The father is pretty much miserable because he can't do anything, he lost his wife, he can't work or do anything that he used to find enjoyable because he so sickly.. in a way, I guess he is just waiting to die because he so miserable and he takes it out on the wrong people. His meds mess with him a lot too mentally.. so I think that's why my boyfriend is the center of the abuse.. His dad can be very cruel so I guess messes with my boyfriend to a lot mentally
MissBee Posted June 28, 2016 Posted June 28, 2016 The father was very abusive towards his sister too which is why she kind of doesn't want anything to do with him, she distances herself a lot you avoid the drama that you avoid the drama and verbal abuse. The father is pretty much miserable because he can't do anything, he lost his wife, he can't work or do anything that he used to find enjoyable because he so sickly.. in a way, I guess he is just waiting to die because he so miserable and he takes it out on the wrong people. His meds mess with him a lot too mentally.. so I think that's why my boyfriend is the center of the abuse.. His dad can be very cruel so I guess messes with my boyfriend to a lot mentally That's very unfortunate, but that's something your boyfriend has to decide also for himself if he's willing to deal with. The sister got out out of it, your bf is still around, and it's quite awful, but it's something your bf has to come to deal with on his own. You feel bad for the bf who probably feels bad for the dad, but all this feeling bad helps no one, as it just sets up a series of codependent ties where he is taking care of dad because he feels bad, you are taking care of bf because you feel bad, but bf is still being used and abused and you're also being used in this scenario, and no one's happy. Focus on yourself and why you feel you can't do better. That will take you a much farther way than thinking that this is the BEST situation you could be in. It's a very very low bar and you have to address for yourself why you feel this just like the dad needs to address his own issues and bf needs to address his own issues. What is sure is, things will not magically change and no amount of love or "help" will fix this and your bf has problems that have nothing to do with you and that can't be fixed by you. In relationships we all have to take responsibility for our own issues and baggage and work on them in order to be an equal, emotionally available partner...if the person cannot do this, then being a "good person" or "loving us" doesn't matter. It's like the dad, deep down he may be a "good guy" or love his kids in some twisted way....but he has issues that prevent him from being a responsible, loving dad and no matter what your bf does or his kids do to appease him they never will unless he fixes and takes ownership of his own mess...same with bf...your love for him or his for you cannot erase or cure these other issues that aren't being addressed. 1
Author vc87 Posted June 28, 2016 Author Posted June 28, 2016 VC87, the above may be difficult to read, but read and re-read it and take all the time you need (no need to answer to us) to ask yourself these questions. Your bf has his own issues, but trust and believe, when we choose people like this and hanker for their love and want to fix them and help them and cash all these blank checks under the guise of love, we usually have our own issues about boundaries, self-worth, self-love, self-esteem and so on. Of course your bf doesn't want to "live without you," from your description, he can barely even live with you! I mean, no one should find that line appealing, but especially not from someone who is borderline homeless, of course they can't live without you. He has his own reasons for loving you and mostly loving what you do FOR him as well, but you need to figure out some concrete reasons why you love him and one tip is that "feeling bad" for someone should NEVER be the major basis of your relationship. Relationships aren't about alms and charity and fixer-upper projects. You know I never really thought of it that way until reading what you said.. I kind of feel foolish for not realizing that sooner but you're totally right. my boyfriend doesn't want to live without me, He always tells me I'm the best thing that's ever happened to him but it makes me wonder now like if it's only because I support and enable him.. of course he wouldn't want to give that up 1
normal person Posted June 28, 2016 Posted June 28, 2016 I put myself through this because I worry I won't find someone better.. You can't possibly be serious. The guy is borderline homeless and totally dependent on you. Any man capable of maintaining a job and reasonable budget would be objectively "better." I know this guy has had a rough time, but at some point he needs to help himself. And he's not. I tell my mom a lot about these episodes when they happen.. she feels sorry for him too.. She thinks he's a good guy and she likes him a lot but but she also did tell me that he's not marriage material Obviously he's not marriage material. You knew that already. Unless you were planning on marrying him out of sympathy or pity.
Author vc87 Posted June 28, 2016 Author Posted June 28, 2016 You can't possibly be serious. The guy is borderline homeless and totally dependent on you. Any man capable of maintaining a job and reasonable budget would be objectively "better." I know this guy has had a rough time, but at some point he needs to help himself. And he's not. Obviously he's not marriage material. You knew that already. Unless you were planning on marrying him out of sympathy or pity. I do just want to clarify, because a lot of people keep says he's homeless - his father let him back in his house after this whole money fiasco happened.. He's not getting kicked out with no where to go, sure if it did get to that point someone in his family would let him stay with them But I try telling him that on an almost daily basis, he tells me all the time he wants to be successful and make me proud and he's using me as a motivation.. But I tell him that nothing going to change unless he takes the steps to do it.. Even if he doesn't want to leave his current job because he's going to plumbing school in the fall, he could at least work weekends or take on a second job to make extra money.. There's no excuse for it. I work full-time, I have bills.. I never once asked anybody for a dime even when I wasn't as financially as secure.. I never turn down the opportunity to make money either because I'm trying to save as much as I can.. I'm a lot more motivated than him I guess
ExpatInItaly Posted June 28, 2016 Posted June 28, 2016 Stop bankrolling him. See how the relationship pans out. 1
frus69 Posted June 28, 2016 Posted June 28, 2016 (edited) .. I put myself through this because I worry I won't find someone better.. Are you fat and ugly or something? Wait, even fat and ugly girl probably has higher self-esteem.. .. I tell my mom a lot about these episodes when they happen.. she feels sorry for him too.. She thinks he's a good guy and she likes him a lot but but she also did tell me that he's not marriage material Look, there is nothing wrong for a woman to be the bread winner in the family. This guy is maybe "nice" but he is also a loser. But if you don't mind taking care of a loser as long as he loves you selflessly, then I'd say go for it. However you don't seem to want to be the "man" of the household, and I don't know if he loves you selflessly. Figure out what you want girl, but get one fact straight first : he will always be a loser.Because he has no reason to work hard Edited June 28, 2016 by frus69 1
Author vc87 Posted June 28, 2016 Author Posted June 28, 2016 Are you fat and ugly or something? Wait, even fat and ugly girl probably has higher self-esteem.. Look, there is nothing wrong for a woman to be the bread winner in the family. This guy is maybe "nice" but he is also a loser. But if you don't mind taking care of a loser as long as he loves you selflessly, then I'd say go for it. However you don't seem to want to be the "man" of the household, and I don't know if he loves you selflessly. Figure out what you want girl, but get one fact straight first : he will always be a loser.Because he has no reason to work hard lol definitely not fat or ugly - I get a lot of attention and guys are always interested in dating me. I know I say I worry that I won't find someone to take his place but I know eventually I would - I tend to bounce back from things but it's just the intial fear until I do that's stopping me because I don't want to be lonely.
CarrieT Posted June 29, 2016 Posted June 29, 2016 it's just the intial fear until I do that's stopping me because I don't want to be lonely. Sounds like you seriously need to be on your own for a while to learn to be by yourself - and love yourself - before you can find someone truly worthy. Fear of loneliness is an awfully silly reason to be subjected to this. 4
frus69 Posted June 29, 2016 Posted June 29, 2016 lol definitely not fat or ugly - I get a lot of attention and guys are always interested in dating me. I know I say I worry that I won't find someone to take his place but I know eventually I would - I tend to bounce back from things but it's just the intial fear until I do that's stopping me because I don't want to be lonely. If you know you will find someone better, then do it. You are scared of that little temporary loneliness before you find Mr.Perfect? Come on, you are a big girl are you? You should be scared you are wasting your time on him, and missed your Mr.Perfect. And the more time you waste, the older you get, the less desirable you are, the harder you find that Mr.Perfect. You weight the pros and cons
Author vc87 Posted June 29, 2016 Author Posted June 29, 2016 Sounds like you seriously need to be on your own for a while to learn to be by yourself - and love yourself - before you can find someone truly worthy. Fear of loneliness is an awfully silly reason to be subjected to this. For the longest time before I started dating my boyfriend, I was so content and be on my own didn't bother me.. I deleted a lot of ****ty guys when I was younger and they kind of left me feeling that I would be OK just being a cat lady when I'm older lol.. But when I started dating my boyfriend now that all changed, and he showed me really how great love and a relationship could be.. In the beginning things really couldn't of been more perfect between us.. Whenever he had money issues and was broke, I was just felt like I wanted to help him.. Like I said in a bunch of other replies, my boyfriend really is a great guy and he has a great heart and he loves and cares about me a lot.. We do you just get along great and have a natural chemistry.. always do enjoy each other's company.. He always says that if you love someone you should stand by them in good times and bad, including the hardships, and part of me still wants to give him a chance because he does have a point.. But there also comes a point when you just feel like there's only so much drama and negative and bad you could take..
frus69 Posted June 29, 2016 Posted June 29, 2016 Like I said in a bunch of other replies, my boyfriend really is a great guy and he has a great heart and he loves and cares about me a lot.. We do you just get along great and have a natural chemistry.. always do enjoy each other's company.. He always says that if you love someone you should stand by them in good times and bad, including the hardships, and part of me still wants to give him a chance because he does have a point.. But there also comes a point when you just feel like there's only so much drama and negative and bad you could take.. Stand by them in good times and hardships means like a successful business man going through financial crises then yes, support him through the bad time until he stand back up again. Unfortunally, it doesn't apply to your bf, he is just incapable. Some people just cant make it, they are just poor their whole life. Why not just accept it and be the bread winner of the household? Since he is so great,great heart, great company etc etc?? If you cant accept it then don't waste your time.
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