Wish wife had more friends...

[GunslingerRoland]

Studies show the average person has 3 close friends. So while it would be better if your wife had a few more friends, I'd say you are by far more of the aberration with dozens of people you consider friends. I know a few people like you, complete social butterfly's who make friends everywhere. But it's not the norm. And it's always an interesting dynamic when you have someone with a strong extroverted personality like yours and someone with a strong introverted personality like hers.

 

 

But there is so much angst there that goes far beyond the number of friends. You guys are pulling in two opposite directions and don't seem to have any consideration for each other's nature.

 

 

Your wife will never be the life of the party, you will never be a homebody, but can you guys work your way back to that middle ground that it sounds like you had at the start of the relationship?

 

 

If you guys watch a tv show together, then the rule should be that you watch it together, it's not 1983 anymore, tv is on demand. You don't miss it by being out. She can watch her shows on her time.

 

 

Meanwhile try to find some activities together that she actually wants to do that you guys can do together, or as a whole family.

[TrustedthenBusted]

It's about codependence and enabling in this marriage. an extremely damaging environment for the kids, growing up with these parents as role models.

 

wow. that was a lot of analysis based on one thread on the interweb.

[BettyDraper]

Nah, I really don't think it's this. She is actually very complimentary of me personally, and is a big fan in general.

 

I agree with you that most people want to be liked. I think what makes her stand out a bit is how she handles the folks who inevitably don't.

 

I know I'm coming across as a bit selfish on this. And maybe I am. But I really just want her to be happy, even if selfishly, I want that so I can be happier myself.

 

It's hard watching someone you love struggle, and over time, having to be the person who bears the weight of aftermath of these failed friendships also gets tiresome.

 

I've really tried to understand anxiety and depression over the last 10 or so years. I really have. It's her, most of her family, a lot of her BFFs...etc. Everyone is on one med or another, ya know?

 

I understand it. I get that it's not intentional and is a sickness.

 

But still, sometimes I just want to shout " Can you all just like...NOT be sick for like a week please?"

 

UNfair? Totally. But everyone has their limits no?

 

It appears that you believe that you're above anyone who struggles with anxiety, depression or any other mental illness and needs medication. This attitude is why the stigma against mental illness is so strong and I'm sure that it doesn't help your wife.

 

Just remember that arrogance almost always results in being knocked off your high horse by life. I have seen this play out many times.

 

I'm wondering if you would be better off with a woman who is more like you....someone who vivacious and perfect.

Maybe your wife should be with someone who is more understanding and humble as well.

Edited June 21, 2016 by BettyDraper

[Mr. Lucky]

I'm wondering if you would be better off with a woman who is more like you....someone who vivacious and perfect.

Maybe your wife should be with someone who is more understanding and humble as well.

 

It's about codependence and enabling in this marriage. an extremely damaging environment for the kids, growing up with these parents as role models.

 

I remember a time not so long age when this forum was more supportive and less judgmental. The OP started a thread entitled "Wish wife had more friends..." and now he's an arrogant husband and lousy parent? And this armchair analysis is under the guise of helping him with his issue?

 

Ill advised in the literal sense of the words...

 

Mr. Lucky

[TrustedthenBusted]

It appears that you believe that you're above anyone who struggles with anxiety, depression or any other mental illness and needs medication. This attitude is why the stigma against mental illness is so strong and I'm sure that it doesn't help your wife.

 

Just remember that arrogance almost always results in being knocked off your high horse by life. I have seen this play out many times.

 

I'm wondering if you would be better off with a woman who is more like you....someone who vivacious and perfect.

Maybe your wife should be with someone who is more understanding and humble as well.

 

I certainly do not feel above anyone. If that's how I'm coming across then my sense of humor is missing the mark.

 

But as for anxiety and depression and it's effect on my life, and my perception of it, you are way out of line. I don't suffer from it, and I Thank God that I don't. When I feel anxious, or stressed, I am LUCKY that a quick trip to the beach or a ride down a bike trail cures me.

 

But just like I am supposed to understand that depression and anxiety drive behaviors that aren't intentional and in many cases cannot be helped, I think it's also helpful to understand that it can simply be VERY DIFFICULT to be around 24/7. Especially when it's people you love and care about and depend on. Getting frustrated occasionally doesn't make me a horrible person. Wishing things were easier doesn't make me a horrible person.

 

One of my sisters has a severely autistic child. Of course we all love my nephew very much, and he gets the best care. But when I call my sister and ask how she's doing, sometimes she is incredibly frustrated and angry and says things she doesn't mean the next day. She just has her limits.

 

Sometimes it just sucks and we vent.

[BettyDraper]

I remember a time not so long age when this forum was more supportive and less judgmental. The OP started a thread entitled "Wish wife had more friends..." and now he's an arrogant husband and lousy parent? And this armchair analysis is under the guise of helping him with his issue?

 

Ill advised in the literal sense of the words...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Do you think that the OP's words about his wife being on medication and her interaction style were supportive or nonjudgemental?

 

It is rarely the case that one spouse is the cause of every difficulty in a marriage.

 

I feel that TTB's attitude might be contributing to the problems he's having with his wife.

[BettyDraper]

I certainly do not feel above anyone. If that's how I'm coming across then my sense of humor is missing the mark.

 

But as for anxiety and depression and it's effect on my life, and my perception of it, you are way out of line. I don't suffer from it, and I Thank God that I don't. When I feel anxious, or stressed, I am LUCKY that a quick trip to the beach or a ride down a bike trail cures me.

 

But just like I am supposed to understand that depression and anxiety drive behaviors that aren't intentional and in many cases cannot be helped, I think it's also helpful to understand that it can simply be VERY DIFFICULT to be around 24/7. Especially when it's people you love and care about and depend on. Getting frustrated occasionally doesn't make me a horrible person. Wishing things were easier doesn't make me a horrible person.

 

One of my sisters has a severely autistic child. Of course we all love my nephew very much, and he gets the best care. But when I call my sister and ask how she's doing, sometimes she is incredibly frustrated and angry and says things she doesn't mean the next day. She just has her limits.

 

Sometimes it just sucks and we vent.

 

Yes, we all have our limits and of course it's difficult to deal a family member who is ill. Since your wife is anxious and depressed, have you ever considered that the outings you want her to go on might make her feel worse?

 

Frustration and wishing for a different life are part of the human condition at some time or another. However, looking down on someone you love just because they are introverted and depressed doesn't make you look very kind. Sorry but the superiority you feel towards your wife is obvious. Maybe you aren't aware of it or you don't want to believe that you think that way but the arrogance is there.

 

Have you ever thought of reading some articles or books about how to handle depression in a marriage? There are also publications about positives of introversion.

 

If you would rather not look at those resources, I would advise accepting that not everyone is like you nor should they be. My response would be the same if your wife posted a thread complaining about how much you go out and how many friends you have. Live and let live.

[Popsicle]

I'm having trouble understanding why this has to be an issue. So you both have different friendship styles and don't like each others friends all that much? That will probably never change. The best you can do is make a little more time for each other - spending time alone with each other so you can connect instead of growing apart due to different socializing styles.

 

For the record, I seem to always be attracted to my opposite. I am usually the more social one and I PREFER it that way. I appreciate it and see the good in it. I think maybe you should try to do that. If she were more social, she could potentially get into trouble that you don't want to deal with.

[BettyDraper]

I'm having trouble understanding why this has to be an issue. So you both have different friendship styles and don't like each others friends all that much? That will probably never change. The best you can do is make a little more time for each other - spending time alone with each other so you can connect instead of growing apart due to different socializing styles.

 

For the record, I seem to always be attracted to my opposite. I am usually the more social one and I PREFER it that way. I appreciate it and see the good in it. I think maybe you should try to do that. If she were more social, she could potentially get into trouble that you don't want to deal with.

 

I didn't even think of that and you're absolutely right. TTB's wish that his wife would be more social could backfire on him.

His wife may become so social that she may not want to spend time at home anymore.

The OP's wife could also strike up an inappropriate relationship with another man again since she is someone who needs a lot of attention.

Edited June 22, 2016 by BettyDraper

[TrustedthenBusted]

Originally Posted by Popsicle View Post

I'm having trouble understanding why this has to be an issue. So you both have different friendship styles and don't like each others friends all that much? That will probably never change. ... If she were more social, she could potentially get into trouble that you don't want to deal with.

 

It's not a major issue, but if you've read the thread, you'll note that my concern is that her current style of managing friendships most often ends in sadness, and the burning of bridges. I'm frustrated because I don't want my wife to be sad, least of all, at her own hand.

 

As for kind of "trouble" she can can into. She's already gotten into it. In the worst way - an affair. I happen to think her high need for adoration coupled with a relatively low number of sources contributed to the affair, and her therapist agreed. This was evidenced in the AP she chose, who, by just about any measure, ( including my wife's ) was not an attractive person. The result was a short, awkward and sexually dysfunctional affair that only got physical because it HAD to in order to keep riding the praise train.

 

So while most men might be glad that their formerly wayward spouse keeps her social circle very small, thinking this may prevent trouble, I feel the opposite. I feel like if she realized how many people think she's wonderful, then hearing it from one jerk at the office water cooler wouldn't be such a big deal. Although honestly, I don't spend a moment's time concerned about that.

 

 

The OP's wife could also strike up an inappropriate relationship with another man again since she is someone who needs a lot of attention.

 

Yep. She sure could. And if she did, that would be her choice. I just want her to be happy, and she's not happy much of the time. And I see it manifested most often in the stress she experiences managing these singular, emotionally draining friendships.

Edited June 22, 2016 by TrustedthenBusted

[Popsicle]

It's not a major issue, but if you've read the thread, you'll note that my concern is that her current style of managing friendships most often ends in sadness, and the burning of bridges. I'm frustrated because I don't want my wife to be sad, least of all, at her own hand.

 

As for kind of "trouble" she can can into. She's already gotten into it. In the worst way - an affair. I happen to think her high need for adoration coupled with a relatively low number of sources contributed to the affair, and her therapist agreed. This was evidenced in the AP she chose, who, by just about any measure, ( including my wife's ) was not an attractive person. The result was a short, awkward and sexually dysfunctional affair that only got physical because it HAD to in order to keep riding the praise train.

 

So while most men might be glad that their formerly wayward spouse keeps her social circle very small, thinking this may prevent trouble, I feel the opposite. I feel like if she realized how many people think she's wonderful, then hearing it from one jerk at the office water cooler wouldn't be such a big deal. Although honestly, I don't spend a moment's time concerned about that.

 

i had a feeling that this is what your concerned about. That your wife's style of having codependent one-on-one friendships could lead her to another affair. You know, people who have that style of friendship don't change mostly because it's due to introversion. There is nothing wrong with it either. (Not all introverts cheat). The remedy for this issue between you and your wife is to spend more quality one-on-one time together.

[TrustedthenBusted]

i had a feeling that this is what your concerned about. That your wife's style of having codependent one-on-one friendships could lead her to another affair. You know, people who have that style of friendship don't change mostly because it's due to introversion. There is nothing wrong with it either. (Not all introverts cheat). The remedy for this issue between you and your wife is to spend more quality one-on-one time together.

 

Thank you. To be clear, I'm not at all concerned that she will get into another affair. Not one bit.

 

i'm not saying it can't happen - because Lord knows it can - but it's not on my radar, or anything that i worry about.

 

My concern for her is as stated: Her happiness, and by extension, mine.

[Popsicle]

Thank you. To be clear, I'm not at all concerned that she will get into another affair. Not one bit.

 

i'm not saying it can't happen - because Lord knows it can - but it's not on my radar, or anything that i worry about.

 

My concern for her is as stated: Her happiness, and by extension, mine.

 

Maybe she's just a depressive. Some people are just like that. My mom and exH are that way. Nothing makes them feel satisfied. I bet your wife wasn't even happy with her AP!

[TrustedthenBusted]

Maybe she's just a depressive. Some people are just like that. My mom and exH are that way. Nothing makes them feel satisfied. I bet your wife wasn't even happy with her AP!

 

She wasn't. I discovered her journal where she called him "gross" and "creepy" and asked herself 1000 times why the hell she was doing this.

 

And yes, sometimes I do think she is a bit depressive. Usually quicker to point out the negative before the positive. Glass helf empty type I guess.

 

But when she is happy, she is very bright and funny and adventurous and inclusive. That's the girl I miss.

[BettyDraper]

She wasn't. I discovered her journal where she called him "gross" and "creepy" and asked herself 1000 times why the hell she was doing this.

 

And yes, sometimes I do think she is a bit depressive. Usually quicker to point out the negative before the positive. Glass helf empty type I guess.

 

But when she is happy, she is very bright and funny and adventurous and inclusive. That's the girl I miss.

 

Was your wife always depressive or did something trigger that?

[TrustedthenBusted]

Was your wife always depressive or did something trigger that?

 

You know...as I think back, she sort of was. She wasn't really a negative Nancy or anything, but she did bend toward the negative side of things. I remember when we were first dating, one of the things she liked about me was the way I never said anything bad about anyone, and didn't allow those around me to badmouth anyone either.

 

I know you think I'm badmouthing my wife in this thread, but I don't think I am. I am describing her behavior and its results, and what I've noticed about her relationships.

 

Anyway, of course the discovery of the affair was a big thing. She struggles with shame and embarrassment over that still. As mentioned, I didn't catch her with Brad Pitt. It was quite the opposite. So I think maybe she's just not as happy with her life in general these days.

 

I mean take someone who doesn't handle scrutiny, judgement or criticism very well, and now have them married to someone to whom they have given some of the most horrible reasons to warrant scrutiny, judgement and criticism.

[BettyDraper]

You know...as I think back, she sort of was. She wasn't really a negative Nancy or anything, but she did bend toward the negative side of things. I remember when we were first dating, one of the things she liked about me was the way I never said anything bad about anyone, and didn't allow those around me to badmouth anyone either.

 

I know you think I'm badmouthing my wife in this thread, but I don't think I am. I am describing her behavior and its results, and what I've noticed about her relationships.

 

Anyway, of course the discovery of the affair was a big thing. She struggles with shame and embarrassment over that still. As mentioned, I didn't catch her with Brad Pitt. It was quite the opposite. So I think maybe she's just not as happy with her life in general these days.

 

I mean take someone who doesn't handle scrutiny, judgement or criticism very well, and now have them married to someone to whom they have given some of the most horrible reasons to warrant scrutiny, judgement and criticism.

 

You've raised an excellent point about the judgement and criticism. My guess is what your wife was desperate for attention when she had the affair. That doesn't make sense given the timing but desperate actions are rarely sensible.

 

What do you intend to do about this situation?

Edited June 23, 2016 by BettyDraper

[TrustedthenBusted]

You've raised an excellent point about the judgement and criticism. My guess is what your wife was desperate for attention when she had the affair. That doesn't make sense given the timing but desperate actions are rarely sensible.

 

What do you intend to do about this situation?

 

Well now I don't know. Apparently if I try to help, I'm an a-hole, and if I do nothing I'm an enabler. hahahaha. jk.

 

I'll do what I always do. I'll tell her how I'm feeling, and express my concerns in a way that doesn't set off any landmines. She's pretty sensible, and when she feels I may be right about something, she will eventually say so.

 

We're headed out to the lake this afternoon for a weekend with her BFF, hubby, and all the kids. Leaving in a couple hours actually. Should be a nice time.

 

There really isn't anything to "do" at this point, because things are pretty much fine. I guess the next time she and BFF are on the skids, I'll maybe ask my wife how she is feeling about it all, and then maybe talk to her about how BFF's way of relating to people is just different from wife's. ( BFF is more like me - bigger network - more social etc )

[TrustedthenBusted]

So interesting followup after the weekend on the lake. Was having a grand ol' time boating with the fam, and watching all the kids play and snorkel etc etc...

 

At one point my wife swims out to where i'm floating on a tube and tells me, in a very nice way, to be careful about some of the jokes I make in front of the other couple. That they are sensitive to certain things, and may take some of the stuff I say out of context.

 

I say OK, no biggie - I can tone it down, although I really couldn't think of anything that was too off color up to this point. Then she tells me that I made a comment about how her friend's husband backed the trailer up a little crooked, and BFF was bothered by it.

 

I remember the comment exactly. BFF asked me how he did, and I said it was a little "cattywampus" but no biggie, and I appreciated his help, as usually I have to do all the launching and loading by myself.

 

Anyway, wife heard the response, and a few hours later, when BFF used the word cattywampus in a sentence in a kind of snarky way, the light went off. She was offended. Really? Seemed like a big leap to make, but wife was sure of it, to the point where she came to ask me to be very careful about what I say for the rest of the weekend.

 

It should be noted that I deeply respect the hubby's skills in everything he does. And I consider the two of us close enough where we could pick on eachother for little mistakes - which we do all the time. I mean, it's been like 4 years now... he's no stranger.

 

Anyway, wife was going on about how she really has to watch what she says around BFF, and how little things can set her off, and there was all this analysis of how this comment or that comment might have been taken and then the kicker.... Wife says " I just need to be careful here because she's my best friend, and I don't want to say anything that is going to set her off."

 

I understood, thanked her for telling me all this, and said I only had one question. " Isn't the very definition of 'Best Friend' that one friend you can TOTALLY be yourself around, and will love you and accept you for being exactly who you are? I would think, in fact, that the ONLY person you didn't have to mind your p's and q's around is your best friend. At least that's how it is for me. "

 

She smiled at me and said " You're totally right. Just please don't F up the weekend."

 

So I watched my jokes, made sure to ask more questions than I answered, and we had a fine time. I think we both made our points, and we'll see how it goes form here.

[noelle303]

So interesting followup after the weekend on the lake. Was having a grand ol' time boating with the fam, and watching all the kids play and snorkel etc etc...

 

At one point my wife swims out to where i'm floating on a tube and tells me, in a very nice way, to be careful about some of the jokes I make in front of the other couple. That they are sensitive to certain things, and may take some of the stuff I say out of context.

 

I say OK, no biggie - I can tone it down, although I really couldn't think of anything that was too off color up to this point. Then she tells me that I made a comment about how her friend's husband backed the trailer up a little crooked, and BFF was bothered by it.

 

I remember the comment exactly. BFF asked me how he did, and I said it was a little "cattywampus" but no biggie, and I appreciated his help, as usually I have to do all the launching and loading by myself.

 

Anyway, wife heard the response, and a few hours later, when BFF used the word cattywampus in a sentence in a kind of snarky way, the light went off. She was offended. Really? Seemed like a big leap to make, but wife was sure of it, to the point where she came to ask me to be very careful about what I say for the rest of the weekend.

 

It should be noted that I deeply respect the hubby's skills in everything he does. And I consider the two of us close enough where we could pick on eachother for little mistakes - which we do all the time. I mean, it's been like 4 years now... he's no stranger.

 

Anyway, wife was going on about how she really has to watch what she says around BFF, and how little things can set her off, and there was all this analysis of how this comment or that comment might have been taken and then the kicker.... Wife says " I just need to be careful here because she's my best friend, and I don't want to say anything that is going to set her off."

 

I understood, thanked her for telling me all this, and said I only had one question. " Isn't the very definition of 'Best Friend' that one friend you can TOTALLY be yourself around, and will love you and accept you for being exactly who you are? I would think, in fact, that the ONLY person you didn't have to mind your p's and q's around is your best friend. At least that's how it is for me. "

 

She smiled at me and said " You're totally right. Just please don't F up the weekend."

 

So I watched my jokes, made sure to ask more questions than I answered, and we had a fine time. I think we both made our points, and we'll see how it goes form here.

 

Some people are just really sensitive. Personally, I also like relaxed friendships and people who can both take a joke and dish it out (my best friends and I literally insult each other all the time).

 

But it seems like you adapted very well to the company you were in. For what it's worth, I don't think your wife's friendship with this woman is going to last that much. If she needs to always be mindful of what she is saying and anxious over the friend's reaction, she is going to be exhausted and tired of it sooner or later.

[BettyDraper]

I believe that being in a close relationship with someone still requires being respectful of her feelings. Friendship is not carte blanche to be relentlessly critical or rude. That said, I don't think that your comment was terrible at all. It seems like the BFF may not be healthy for your wife but your wife has to make that decision for herself.

 

I've had a couple of former friends say that they couldn't be "real" with me but their comments were often quite insulting. One of them told me that I didn't know how to dress and I needed to let her give me a makeover. The other one told me that since I was not having children, I was not giving my husband anything worthwhile in our marriage. I doubt that comments like that are necessary or respectful. They also could not take what they dished out which was ridiculous. If a person enjoys being brutally honest, she can't get upset when others responds to her in kind.

[TrustedthenBusted]

I believe that being in a close relationship with someone still requires being respectful of her feelings. Friendship is not carte blanche to be relentlessly critical or rude. That said, I don't think that your comment was terrible at all. It seems like the BFF may not be healthy for your wife but your wife has to make that decision for herself.

 

.

 

Couldn't agree more.

 

There is just a world of difference between being respectful, and walking on eggshells.

 

At one point wife says to me " I know you probably think this is just silly drama, and maybe it is but..."

 

So at least there is some hope that my wife recognizes that this kind of stuff makes her life more difficult.

[spanz1]

all I can add is, a man that is not afraid to use the term "cattywampus" in public has MY vote!