Cloudcuckoo Posted June 13, 2016 Posted June 13, 2016 It was difficult to know exactly where to put this, as it affects so many different relationships, but I'll start here. Reading another thread inspired me to ask, what do we really think about some of the terms related to the state of a persons mental well being? Do we still use derogatory labels to describe behaviour we fear? In spite of raised awareness of mental health issues and encouragement in understanding what illnesses such as depression or bipolar disorder to name but a few do to a person, why do we still label people 'nuts' or 'insane'? Is it really personal, or have these terms been linguistically bandied about so freely to all manner of different situations (I.e., he said I was 'crazy' to do that), that they have desensitised? What does that mean to those truly suffering poor mental health, that such terms are so commonly used in everyday language that they are seen as relatively inoffensive? Over to you...... 1
basil67 Posted June 13, 2016 Posted June 13, 2016 I think that there are a limited amount of expressions to describe someone who's engaging in illogical behaviour. Truth be told, I'm having a great deal of trouble coming up with a word which doesn't have connotations of old mental health terms to describe behaviour which is seriously off the wall. We have seen language change in the area of special needs once we started acquiring a larger vocabulary. For example, developmentally delayed; learning disability; intellectual disability etc. Perhaps it will be the same for mental health? The thing which annoys me is casual labeling with current mental health terms. Like when a person says "I think my ex has bipolar or BPD or something". I mean bipolar and BPD aren't even similar. Or when a person changes their mind a lot and are labelled bipolar. 4
basil67 Posted June 13, 2016 Posted June 13, 2016 I'd also be curious to know if there are any readers who have a mental health diagnosis who are offended by casual use of terms such as crazy or nuts. I try to be mindful of not speaking for those who are the ones who should have the voice on the topic. The term 'nothing about us without us' comes to mind. 2
elaine567 Posted June 13, 2016 Posted June 13, 2016 The thing which annoys me is casual labeling with current mental health terms. Like when a person says "I think my ex has bipolar or BPD or something". I mean bipolar and BPD aren't even similar. Or when a person changes their mind a lot and are labelled bipolar. That annoys me dreadfully as well and it is often aided and abetted by some posters here too, who make unsubstantiated "diagnoses" on the basis of their own experiences. Truth is that relationships make people "crazy", and it is amazing how many people who are "depressed" or "mad" or "bad" suddenly become completely normal once out of an unhealthy relationship. 8
todreaminblue Posted June 13, 2016 Posted June 13, 2016 (edited) i think its all in the context of how something is said....and how often it gets said.... i feel when people diagnose another with a mental illness when its bad behaviors they have(like emilia said)....theres no excuse for that...it degrades the mental illness.....and its actual severity...theres only one way to recieve a possible proper diagnosis...and thats by a professional...not a keyboard one.....and even then...professionals also make mistakes..... theres still a stigma attached to mental illness.....people are afraid...even if they dont say say it....of involving themselves in the life of a mentally ill person...especially in the dating stratasphere......and it isnt easy i guess.but neither is life...and i have dated normal men and have had them treat me badly...or behave badly with me...everything in love and life has risk....doesnt take a mental illness to make it risky as far as being called crazy...if it is said with affection...i dont mind...but if it is said over and over and over again...i may decide to act crazy to prove a point.....i dont really like being called schizo or retarded.and i have often called myself those things...and instantly thought...why did i say it.....when i dont believe it....i say it because other people believe it....and i feel their fear...so i try to make the situation lighter by bringing myself down or making fun of myself .....i am crueler and harder than anyone else will ever be towards myself.... .......i believe that i am neither of those things anyway(schizo or retarded)..i do believe i have a mental illness...i know i do.....i suffer from depression sometimes too...i get anxious....i have fun....i laugh...i cry ...i get angry...i hope i dream....i sound sort of normal dont i....perish the thought...:0)......and really.....i am just like everyone else is, who also at times, frequently or infrequently, gets unwell mentally... people should treat mentally ill people exactly the same as they would others....with respect...and compassion...that includes me treating myself that way....and i am working on that...i am cutting out the name calling about myself to others....and trying to treat myself with more compassion.....like i do treat everybody else with....i should treat myself the same way....deb Edited June 13, 2016 by todreaminblue 2
mikeylo Posted June 13, 2016 Posted June 13, 2016 It's always easier to label others as -- crazy, psycho,bipolar , etc etc than look at oneself. Apart from mental health , other labels easily thrown at others -- jealous , insecure , low self esteem , low confidence, etc etc. without taking a moment to reflect at ones own behavior. It's an easy , clean cop out. It usually makes them continuing own behavior and expecting other to suck it up or get ' help'. There are then those people who enable the ' perpetrators ' (lack of word). Most of the time the reason is that they themselves have had unsuccessful relationships and feed more negativity. That enables them more to continue own behavior and label the other. Funny thing is that the labeled person usually moves on , lol unless they have been medically diagnosed and the perpetrator ends up on ' breaking up is hard to do ' lol 1
Buddhist Posted June 13, 2016 Posted June 13, 2016 (edited) As someone with depression and anxiety I can say that being described as mentally unwell is just salt into the wound. I'm not anymore mentally unwell than anyone else out there, I just don't choke it down as easily and present a fake smile to the world in order to pretend that everything is okay. In my experience (no I don't have any bits of paper to say I'm an expert) depression is a natural condition of being force fed the lies upon which society is built and feeling the inauthenticity in that. When the person can't take playing a role for societies benefit anymore and becomes more authentic they are then labelled as 'depressed' and marginalised to the outskirts of society because they are 'mentally unstable'. Their choices are then take pills in order to make everyone else happy or continue to be authentic and be described as mentally unwell. Anxiety is nothing more than the accumulation of stress factors in your lifetime until it gets to the point where you body says, enough is enough and starts burning off the accumulated stress in the only way it has available, the fight or flight response. Being branded mentally unwell by people who quite frankly don't even know what authenticity is, is darn well insulting. It all comes down to the same thing, nothing is more frightening to a person who chokes down their own emotional discomfort daily than someone outwardly expressing their emotions authentically. They will do anything to not be in the presence of that. They will encourage you to take pills for their own benefit so they need not be confronted with the fact they are do not allow themselves authentic expression because they want to fit in. :roll eyes: Oh yes we are allowed to express certain emotions. The ones that make others feel comfortable. But don't you dare cry, feel upset, or indicate in any manner that you are unhappy with life circumstances. Positivity has become the new sickness of our age. Its enforced as a condition of being accepted. Very few people in the world actually have a bonafide mental illness. As in they are incapacitated in their ability to function within reality. Yet we have an epidemic of anxiety and depressive 'disorders'. Why is that? Could it be that the stresses in life in the modern world have outstripped the human bodies evolutionary ability to cope with the constant over-stimulation? Lets not address that issue, lets just dope up all the people who are now overwhelmed, shunt them off to the corner cubicle where others don't have to witness their distress and congratulate ourselves on how great we are that it's not us. Got news for you. It will be you (general you) , at some point in your life. Then you can feel what it's like to have people you know shun you because you are now 'mentally ill'. Edited June 13, 2016 by Buddhist 6
Satu Posted June 13, 2016 Posted June 13, 2016 I think they are terms which should not be bandied about lightly. They can be used to invalidate someone's thinking, when what is being said is inconvenient for someone. 4
todreaminblue Posted June 13, 2016 Posted June 13, 2016 (edited) hey buddhist....i dont feel admitting you are mentally unwell should be any different then saying i feel a bit sick today....when people ask we should be able to say...yeah dont feel good today..instead of yes im fine.......mental illness in my opinion is disabling...depression is disabling......how we can feel enabled and understood is through honesty...and its hard to do that when stigma is attached...the only way to to break those stereo types down..is for people to understand the crux of mental illness...we should not have to feel offended or defensive when someone asks us if we feel unwell......we dont need pity or fear from others...we need acceptance......but first before that...is the need to accept who we are...and mental illness doesnt have to always be negative...in mental illness......we see the world a different way some times.....it is evident and documented proof undeniable...at times the best art..... the best writing come from not stability and normalcy..but by instability and change..by lost souls struggling.......just as we need stability instability is the balance that makes life beautiful...and gives us appreciation of the breath we breathe.....when we come through bad times.... .by questioning who we are....by making changes .....mental illness allows us a sensitivity and a humility.a deeper more complex understanding of others struggles...... and that others who classify themselves as normal and shun the mentally ill...they dont have that sensitivity..the compassion..the deeper understanding.or the humility to accept others as they are......best wishes...in mental illness or without....the best to you always....deb... Edited June 13, 2016 by todreaminblue 1
alphamale Posted June 13, 2016 Posted June 13, 2016 In spite of raised awareness of mental health issues and encouragement in understanding what illnesses such as depression or bipolar disorder to name but a few do to a person, why do we still label people 'nuts' or 'insane'? this happens mainly due to ignorance. one can go to Wikipedia and read about bipolar disorder in ten minutes.
Buddhist Posted June 13, 2016 Posted June 13, 2016 (edited) Hi Deb, I get where you are coming from but sorry I don't agree on quite a few points. I suffered depression for over a decade, it isn't always debilitating or disabling. Sometimes it can just be a deep sense of disillusionment with life and our circumstances. None of that prevented my from doing a job to high levels of competency, or living with meaning or anything else. For someone to turn to me and say,....you are mentally ill because you are disillusioned is I'm sorry to say extremely inaccurate. Ancient cultures understood that human emotion spans a very large range in both directions. They accepted this and honoured it. When someone was bereaved they understood that the individual would need a full year to grieve. No-one came to them and said, you're depressed you need to get out more, have another child to replace the one you've lost of start dating to replace the lover you lost. That shows extreme insensitivity to what is a natural, protracted and normal process. Depression has been well understood by spiritual masters for a long time. It's a completely normal part of spiritual growth. It's a letting go of false idea's about life and that is why initiates are guided by someone further along the road than them. To assist them to move through and beyond these temporary states. My very great objection to classifying depression as a mental illness is that it implies something has gone wrong. When in actual fact it's a normal, biological response to an internal shock. And one that rights itself also when people give up thinking of it as a mental illness that cannot be gotten over without chemical intervention and someone with a pretty degree on the wall. Not everyone who feels dissatisfaction with life or a negative emotion is 'unwell'. As a people, we have fundamentally lost touch with the natural processes of life, our normal emotional responses and as a result there is a great deal of fear around anything that doesn't look like a toothpaste ad. We've been conditioned to think that life is only good when the sun is shining and people are happy. But happy is only one emotion amoung a treasure trove of emotions capable within humanity. But here, we've decided it's the only emotion we like and therefore the only one that's acceptable. You can see this played out anywhere. I have been sitting in the park, minding my own business, processing some difficult aspect of my life and a complete stranger has walked up to me, interrupted me by saying, you look sad, you don't look happy. So what? I'm having a normal human emotion here and minding my own business. It's not for you, a stranger to be telling me what I should be feeling and expressing at any given point in time. It's this interventionist mindset and a fixed idea about what constitutes quality of life that is actually the cause of much distress. If people stopped telling someone who's experienced disillusionment (which is a natural growth process) that they are somehow dysfunctional and in need of medication, they would probably move through it a hell of a lot easier and faster. I know you don't mean it, but your post is kind of an example of this. Telling me I am in denial because I won't label myself mentally ill, or unwell as you put it. My mental faculties are just fine. I make rational decisions, I pay my bills and attend to the important aspects of my life. On what other grounds are you assuming I am unwell? Because I am not presently expressing this thing called 'happiness'? That's exactly my point. Society wants to pathologise everything that is outside of a very limited range of emotional behaviour. And in doing so it creates a false perception that people outside of that narrow definition are broken and to be feared or medicated. It genuinely is quite ridiculous. How helpful is it to label negative emotion an illness? It's like labelling defecation as an illness. It's just a normal eliminative function of the body. Edited June 13, 2016 by Buddhist 4
No_Go Posted June 14, 2016 Posted June 14, 2016 My very great objection to classifying depression as a mental illness is that it implies something has gone wrong. When in actual fact it's a normal, biological response to an internal shock. And one that rights itself also when people give up thinking of it as a mental illness that cannot be gotten over without chemical intervention and someone with a pretty degree on the wall. Not everyone who feels dissatisfaction with life or a negative emotion is 'unwell'. Could you elaborate a bit on the above? What would you consider a normal disillusionment? I'm asking because I got into a 'mood' of disillusionment aroung my 28th (now I'm 31 and still there), I don't feel depressed though, just more realistic. I have friends that suggested it could be mild depression, I know that's 'armchair psychology' but your opinion made me curious... Hi Deb, I get where you are coming from but sorry I don't agree on quite a few points. I suffered depression for over a decade, it isn't always debilitating or disabling. Sometimes it can just be a deep sense of disillusionment with life and our circumstances. None of that prevented my from doing a job to high levels of competency, or living with meaning or anything else. For someone to turn to me and say,....you are mentally ill because you are disillusioned is I'm sorry to say extremely inaccurate. Ancient cultures understood that human emotion spans a very large range in both directions. They accepted this and honoured it. When someone was bereaved they understood that the individual would need a full year to grieve. No-one came to them and said, you're depressed you need to get out more, have another child to replace the one you've lost of start dating to replace the lover you lost. That shows extreme insensitivity to what is a natural, protracted and normal process. Depression has been well understood by spiritual masters for a long time. It's a completely normal part of spiritual growth. It's a letting go of false idea's about life and that is why initiates are guided by someone further along the road than them. To assist them to move through and beyond these temporary states. My very great objection to classifying depression as a mental illness is that it implies something has gone wrong. When in actual fact it's a normal, biological response to an internal shock. And one that rights itself also when people give up thinking of it as a mental illness that cannot be gotten over without chemical intervention and someone with a pretty degree on the wall. Not everyone who feels dissatisfaction with life or a negative emotion is 'unwell'. As a people, we have fundamentally lost touch with the natural processes of life, our normal emotional responses and as a result there is a great deal of fear around anything that doesn't look like a toothpaste ad. We've been conditioned to think that life is only good when the sun is shining and people are happy. But happy is only one emotion amoung a treasure trove of emotions capable within humanity. But here, we've decided it's the only emotion we like and therefore the only one that's acceptable. You can see this played out anywhere. I have been sitting in the park, minding my own business, processing some difficult aspect of my life and a complete stranger has walked up to me, interrupted me by saying, you look sad, you don't look happy. So what? I'm having a normal human emotion here and minding my own business. It's not for you, a stranger to be telling me what I should be feeling and expressing at any given point in time. It's this interventionist mindset and a fixed idea about what constitutes quality of life that is actually the cause of much distress. If people stopped telling someone who's experienced disillusionment (which is a natural growth process) that they are somehow dysfunctional and in need of medication, they would probably move through it a hell of a lot easier and faster. I know you don't mean it, but your post is kind of an example of this. Telling me I am in denial because I won't label myself mentally ill, or unwell as you put it. My mental faculties are just fine. I make rational decisions, I pay my bills and attend to the important aspects of my life. On what other grounds are you assuming I am unwell? Because I am not presently expressing this thing called 'happiness'? That's exactly my point. Society wants to pathologise everything that is outside of a very limited range of emotional behaviour. And in doing so it creates a false perception that people outside of that narrow definition are broken and to be feared or medicated. It genuinely is quite ridiculous. How helpful is it to label negative emotion an illness? It's like labelling defecation as an illness. It's just a normal eliminative function of the body.
todreaminblue Posted June 14, 2016 Posted June 14, 2016 (edited) Hi Deb, I know you don't mean it, but your post is kind of an example of this. Telling me I am in denial because I won't label myself mentally ill, or unwell as you put it. My mental faculties are just fine. I make rational decisions, I pay my bills and attend to the important aspects of my life. On what other grounds are you assuming I am unwell? Because I am not presently expressing this thing called 'happiness'? That's exactly my point. i certainly didnt mean to disrespect your opinion or make you feel my post is an effort to make you admit you are unwell...or did i say you were in denial..i will read my post again......i was trying to support ...not exhort......At the end i wrote the best to you in mental illness..or without....respecting your choice to say and believe...you dont have mental illness.....just not in so many words...... I agree with quite a few of your points you have made..and i am sorry my post is what you deem to be...part of the problem...i dont see my post that way...but that of course is my opinion... this is my opinion.....mentally fit people can get sick mentally or physically..physically fit people get sick mentally or physically...people get sick.....some choose to go to a doctor ...some do not....and thats their right to deal with whatever they are going through with how they seem fit..i am not pinpointing you here at all.........maybe myself a little as i have chosen to take a completely holistic approach to my own illness....i am not saying you are ill but i truly accept i am...its part of i believe a step forward into me understanding and healing and dealing with my own illness my way... there are varying degrees of depression..certain people ...certain degrees....some higher degrees of depression requires life intervention......i am at that degree....not right now.....i feel pretty good...but i can get to that degree....obviously ...you arent or havent been...and i am happy for you..because that place when you get to it....is mind numbing......... there is also a big difference between depression and feeling unhappiness with life and love and your situation.........not saying that you dont recognise the difference either i am stating from my own experiences and my own beliefs on depression... i dont believe i said anywhere..about conforming to others beliefs...in fact i am against it....acceptance of all people is key.............certainly there was no conforming thought of in my mind... not about you...nor myself....... i differ from you.....my depression is disabling.... i was once told theres a difference between depression and extreme sadness and discomfort with life......and i can tel you when i am depressed i dont make any major decisions at all......because i know i am not in the right frame of mind......doesnt mean i cant make decisions...but it recognises if i was well...i might make completely different decisions and i am aware of that...and that i should be able to say im unwell...without people fearing me or avoiding me or thinking me less of a person......and feel acceptance and understanding like i try to give people..... reading your post buddha...i dont know buddha.......but it seems like you have misconstrued what i wrote...and have taken offense at the very thing you dont want to associate yourself with.you believe you dont have this mental unwellness in you....so why be offended.........like being classed as mentally ill.....is a horrid thing......is it really...its just a temporary state of being right?.i am not offended by the word unwell...maybe because ...i am....sometimes self recognized and clinically recognized as unwell.... i respect your opinions anything i have posted ...was in deed said with good intentions....and i never said the word...denial.......in regards to you ....my sign off words should prove that to you...deb........ Edited June 14, 2016 by todreaminblue 1
Buddhist Posted June 14, 2016 Posted June 14, 2016 (edited) Could you elaborate a bit on the above? What would you consider a normal disillusionment? I'm asking because I got into a 'mood' of disillusionment aroung my 28th (now I'm 31 and still there), I don't feel depressed though, just more realistic. I have friends that suggested it could be mild depression, I know that's 'armchair psychology' but your opinion made me curious... Then you sound completely normal. Around 28 is about the time most people begin really questioning their path in life, the mores of society and finding much to be dissatisfied about. Astrologers call that period the Saturn Return, there is no set time frame it should last. Other cultures have rites of passages for people around that age, they are transitioning from young adults into elders. Bearing in mind that people didn't live much past 40 back then. So what you are experiencing is a well known phenomena that has existed for as long as humanity. It's just a part of life. My guess is that friends and family have been trying to re-indoctrinate you back into the beliefs you are questioning which is frustrating and prolonging your stasis. When you first become disillusioned the reaction is to reject that which you see as wrong and get pretty vocal about it. At which point others tell you, you have black and white thinking, are negative and wrong. But if you stick with it, rejection is only the first step. Pretty soon you come to a point of acceptance (that it's not likely to change) and then you re-route into how you can move forward into the life you want anyway without it changing. Completely organic process. That similar period for me lasted from around age 30 to pretty much very recently. I experienced extreme disillusionment with life, I began to see the well trodden path as something to diverge from, not something to base my life on. I had lost a job, a relationship and I was yet to figure out why I felt cursed in life because the same sets of circumstances kept playing out for me over and over. I actively began questioning the common wisdom out there because it became very plain to me that a lot of it, was BS. I felt as if I was the only one who could plainly see that these sacred cows we live our lives by are actually things we should be questioning. I listened to other people against my better instincts and popped pills and saw a therapist who basically told me I could expect to be depressed for the rest of my natural life, and she was just going to teach me how to live as a depressed person. That was the point at which I became suspicious....:roll eyes: As it turns out, I realised two things. 1. I knew what I knew about life. I don't have to go about converting everyone to my thinking. But neither did I need to get about thinking I was dysfunctional merely because I don't happen to agree with a lot of things out there. 2. That being totally disillusioned was not a lifetime sentence, it's a temporary state for taking myself down a different and more meaningful path in life. Something I have embarked upon now. And surprise, surprise I no longer experience low moods, apathy or feel lethargic. I just feel relaxed, aware and quite often inner quiet and acceptance. The natural state of humans. My depression was a combination of realising that something in my life was fundamentally wrong while not knowing what to do about it. This is why I think people taking on the mantle of 'I must be unwell' is counterproductive. It's a temporary state designed to get you to realign your life to your own values. If you resist that, your depression will stick until you stop resisting that. It's a holding pattern that dissipates fairly quickly once you realise the issue and take the appropriate measures. People often experience depression on the back of some kind of trauma, job loss, relationship loss, illness or injury etc. It's a wakeup call, that the way they are living their lives right now clearly isn't a fit to who they are. Unfortunately, in the western world particularly there are very set idea's on what constitutes success and a useful life. These idea's sandwich people into lives they are probably not well suited to while offering them little alternative. Edited June 14, 2016 by Buddhist 1
Tressugar Posted June 14, 2016 Posted June 14, 2016 When I used mental health behavioural terms it's because these ppl have been officially diagnosed as that. I don't take those terms/labels lightly. 1
Toodaloo Posted June 14, 2016 Posted June 14, 2016 Some people are crazy. Its not that they are depressed or that they have a mental illness its just that they enjoy or have an addiction to hurting people around them or causing unnecessary dramas to entertain themselves. The is just not normal behaviour. Mental illness while part of the mind is also physical. If it were not then drugs would not help in any way and treatments to help with these disorders would not help. A broken mind is the same to me as a broken leg. It needs a specialist to deal with it in order to heal properly. Having been there it does really piddle me off when people go on about how depressed they are and how they can't be bothered... well if you can't be bothered to look after yourself why should anyone else? I am sorry but being down in the dumps because you are too bone idle to get off your backside and make something of yourself is not the same as having a lack of serotonin and the physical consequences of that. Lots of lazy and bone idle people "claim" depression when in fact the solution is to get up and do something so they can be proud of themselves. Instead they take the "easy" option and take a pill. Those who are really suffering depression will know just how crippling the disease really is and that it is totally different to feeling glum and not being bothered... They will tell you how missing your pill is crippling. How its a real struggle every day. They will not whine on and on like a stuck record because they want to get better. But no I do not take offence because truth is. I probably am a bit crazy so if the shoe fits I may as well accept and wear it. 1
Buddhist Posted June 15, 2016 Posted June 15, 2016 (edited) Having been there it does really piddle me off when people go on about how depressed they are and how they can't be bothered... well if you can't be bothered to look after yourself why should anyone else? I am sorry but being down in the dumps because you are too bone idle to get off your backside and make something of yourself is not the same as having a lack of serotonin and the physical consequences of that. Strange, because having a lack of serotonin is not actually part of the diagnostic criteria for depression. All About Depression: Diagnosis If it was then diagnosing it would be simple, blood work or similar. Diagnosis however is limited to behavioural reporting and analysis. Those who are really suffering depression will know just how crippling the disease really is and that it is totally different to feeling glum and not being bothered... They will tell you how missing your pill is crippling. How its a real struggle every day. Again I don't see needing a pill as part of the diagnostic criteria for depression either. But thanks for demonstrating how interesting people's attitudes can be towards the depressed. Well you weren't as depressed as me, therefore you weren't depressed. You're just lazy. Not all depressives struggle to get out of bed, people can battle persistent thoughts of suicide ideation and feelings of worthlessness while working jobs. I lost a coworker in that exact way. One week he was there, doing this job and putting on a brave face. A week later the police found him dead by his own hand. Now if this guy had been able to feel safe to express whatever was upsetting him without being judged, told to pull his socks up and stop whinging then would it have had a different outcome for him? I don't know how, but it makes me wonder. He was very obviously putting a happy sticker on it for other people's benefit, much to his own detriment. Depression affects people in different ways and to various levels of severity. It might be worth remembering that. Likewise not all medication is effective for all people. That is why there is a wide range of it available that work on different levels. An SSRI is not effective for all depressives, serotonin imbalance is a symptom of depression not the cause of it. If it was depression would be instantly cured by a short dose of the stuff but that's not the case is it? Edited June 15, 2016 by Buddhist 1
wmacbride Posted June 15, 2016 Posted June 15, 2016 Strange, because having a lack of serotonin is not actually part of the diagnostic criteria for depression. All About Depression: Diagnosis If it was then diagnosing it would be simple, blood work or similar. Diagnosis however is limited to behavioural reporting and analysis. Again I don't see needing a pill as part of the diagnostic criteria for depression either. But thanks for demonstrating how interesting people's attitudes can be towards the depressed. Well you weren't as depressed as me, therefore you weren't depressed. You're just lazy. Not all depressives struggle to get out of bed, people can battle persistent thoughts of suicide ideation and feelings of worthlessness while working jobs. I lost a coworker in that exact way. One week he was there, doing this job and putting on a brave face. A week later the police found him dead by his own hand. Now if this guy had been able to feel safe to express whatever was upsetting him without being judged, told to pull his socks up and stop whinging then would it have had a different outcome for him? I don't know how, but it makes me wonder. He was very obviously putting a happy sticker on it for other people's benefit, much to his own detriment. Depression affects people in different ways and to various levels of severity. It might be worth remembering that. Likewise not all medication is effective for all people. That is why there is a wide range of it available that work on different levels. An SSRI is not effective for all depressives, serotonin imbalance is a symptom of depression not the cause of it. If it was depression would be instantly cured by a short dose of the stuff but that's not the case is it? I can only speak to this in terms of what my H went through with his mental health issues.It might make sense, it might be garbage. With respect to depression, in some people, it may be anomie and the feeling of a lack of connection to society. In others, it's a reaction to their life circumstances. If those are changed, the person's mental condition changes.To me, this being depressed and not depression Still others are suffering from depression. They could change their circumstances and it will still be there. In these cases, issues with brain function have been found using functional MRI's and PET scans. It can also be physically painful.Medication can help, especially when it's combined with other therapies. In other forms of mental illness, such as bi-polar disorder, schizophrenia, etc., again, new technologies are being used to find causes, and hopefully, lead to new ways of providing help that have the fewest numbers of side effects I don't like the labels "crazy" or "insane", as they are often used to stigmatize or insult.They also imply the person in question is "bad", and is somehow dangerous or choosing to act the way they do. It's also often thrown around when there is no mental illness at all. It's just being used to dismiss someone, and should the person truly be mentally ill, they are used to shame that person, as if they have somehow chosen to have a mental illness. Mental illness is real, and no one asks to develop it. It takes an incredible amount of strength to cope with it. For some, it is a huge act of courage just to get out of bed each day. 1
Toodaloo Posted June 15, 2016 Posted June 15, 2016 Strange, because having a lack of serotonin is not actually part of the diagnostic criteria for depression. All About Depression: Diagnosis If it was then diagnosing it would be simple, blood work or similar. Diagnosis however is limited to behavioural reporting and analysis. Again I don't see needing a pill as part of the diagnostic criteria for depression either. But thanks for demonstrating how interesting people's attitudes can be towards the depressed. Well you weren't as depressed as me, therefore you weren't depressed. You're just lazy. Not all depressives struggle to get out of bed, people can battle persistent thoughts of suicide ideation and feelings of worthlessness while working jobs. I lost a coworker in that exact way. One week he was there, doing this job and putting on a brave face. A week later the police found him dead by his own hand. Now if this guy had been able to feel safe to express whatever was upsetting him without being judged, told to pull his socks up and stop whinging then would it have had a different outcome for him? I don't know how, but it makes me wonder. He was very obviously putting a happy sticker on it for other people's benefit, much to his own detriment. Depression affects people in different ways and to various levels of severity. It might be worth remembering that. Likewise not all medication is effective for all people. That is why there is a wide range of it available that work on different levels. An SSRI is not effective for all depressives, serotonin imbalance is a symptom of depression not the cause of it. If it was depression would be instantly cured by a short dose of the stuff but that's not the case is it? I am agreeing and disagreeing with you. The people I am talking about are the ones who just can't be bothered. I am very aware that there are people out there who struggle very badly and getting out of bed in the morning is a major achievement. Your colleague clearly had get up and go and was not lazy (the word colleague gave it away). He clearly had something very wrong that he needed help with. But saying we can't put labels on things and we can't talk about it just closes the door to discussion. Seriously we have got to stop being so insulted all the flipping time. Its almost as if no one can say anything in case it upsets someone else. Well we all have different view points and ideas so actually if we are to also support freedom of speak and open discussion we can't start shutting the doors and saying "you can't say that"... Perhaps if people felt better able to say "I am going insane" or "I am going mad" or "Mate you are going nuts are you OK?" then perhaps just perhaps less people would have the troubles they have today. Far too often people just do not have the courage to say it as it is. What I am saying is that LIFE is a struggle. Everyone struggles, yes some are better at dealing with various things than others but each and every person will struggle. Its not depression. Its feeling a bit glum. Going about blaming depression when you just can't be bothered is an insult to those who DO suffer. I am also fully aware that there are a number of medications and therapy's. I use the term "pill" loosely to describe some form of treatment. I think you know me well enough to know this. I am also bowing out of this conversation as I am not PC and can not be bothered with a PC battering. 2
carhill Posted June 15, 2016 Posted June 15, 2016 OP, when reading your post, I looked to the bottom of the page and found this 'similar thread' http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/marriage-life-partnerships/459123-husbands-mental-health While clinical discussions can be productive and helpful, it appears you're distressed by slang terms used in a wanton and disrespectful manner, along with armchair diagnosis. The latter is particularly a problem on the internet since we all have access to the DSM and practically none of us who post on forums like this are professional practitioners or brain specialists. IMO, take away information you feel is helpful and leave the rest and report the hyperbole to those who handle such matters on private web sites such as this. Discussions are open to everyone and, yup, everyone has their own opinion and language for publishing it. Yeah, fear can be a potent motivator. However, we each handle and process fear differently. Some withdraw, others lash out, others look for solutions. Imperfect world. Brief life. Good luck! 1
OneLov Posted June 15, 2016 Posted June 15, 2016 have these terms been linguistically bandied about so freely to all manner of different situations (I.e., he said I was 'crazy' to do that), that they have desensitised? Actually, that is exactly what happened. We have neologists to blame. For the definitions of a word, we look to Oxford. crazy Pronunciation: /ˈkreɪzi/ informal adjective (crazier, craziest) 1Mad, especially as manifested in wild or aggressive behaviour: Stella went crazy and assaulted a visitor a crazy look More example sentences Synonyms 1.1Extremely angry: the noise was driving me crazy More example sentences 1.2Foolish: it was crazy to hope that good might come out of this mess More example sentences Synonyms 2Extremely enthusiastic: I’m crazy about Cindy [in combination]: a football-crazy bunch of boys More example sentences Synonyms 3(Of an angle) appearing absurdly out of place or unlikely: the monument leant at a crazy angle More example sentences 3.1 archaic (Of a ship or building) full of cracks or flaws; unsound. adverb [as submodifier] chiefly North American Extremely: I’ve been crazy busy More example sentences noun (plural crazies) chiefly North American A mad person: keep that crazy away from me More example sentences Phrases like crazy informal To a great degree; very intensely: we are just working like crazy lunatic Pronunciation: /ˈluːnətɪk/ noun 1A person who is mentally ill (not in technical use). Example sentences Synonyms 1.1An extremely foolish or eccentric person: this lunatic just accelerated out from the side of the road nuts Pronunciation: /nʌts/ informal adjective [predicative] Mad: the way he turns on the television as soon as he walks in drives me nuts insane Pronunciation: /ɪnˈseɪn/ adjective 1In a state of mind which prevents normal perception, behaviour, or social interaction; seriously mentally ill: he had gone insane More example sentences Synonyms 1.1(Of an action or quality) characterized or caused by madness: his eyes were glowing with insane fury More example sentences 1.2Extremely annoyed: a fly whose buzzing had been driving me insane More example sentences Synonyms 1.3Extremely foolish; irrational: she had an insane desire to giggle More example sentences Synonyms 2 informal, chiefly US Shocking; outrageous: they were making insane amounts of money More example sentences 2.1Astonishingly good or impressive; amazing: the peanut butter chocolate is insane Source: Oxford Dictionaries - Dictionary, Thesaurus, & Grammar Take a look at the definition of the word "lunatic." It's meaning has completely changed from that of describing a person with a mental disorder to describing a foolish or eccentric person. The definition of "crazy" and "insane" have also been broadened.
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