Versacehottie Posted June 6, 2016 Posted June 6, 2016 Thanks for the response. Question regarding approaching in cafes though - as a woman, what does it feel like to have a man come up to you where other people are around watching the whole thing unfold? Does this bother some women? Does it lessen the chances of a favorable response because other people are watching? If I were to do an approach, I'd probably make casual conversation and flirt a little if I sense some mutual interest, then ask for a number and let her get back to whatever she's doing while I go back to reading and maybe we can catch up later (or if it's going well we can just talk more right there some more - I gauge her response as to not be intrusive, in other words). Once I'm in an interaction that's going well, I'm fine. It's just getting into it that I struggle with. The anxiety is close to crippling! Well i think you just need to make it innocuous such as the same as you would talk to another guy, some random older lady or man or the barrista. That's why it helps to make an effort to be more outgoing in general because these conversations just happen. The goal is just to interact with others. Then if you find interest and think it's mutual, it's quick moment to amend the "goal" to flirting with the person, getting her number/contact details. If you are observant of your surroundings and not singularly focused, it becomes easier. Sometimes if you are noticed as someone who starts a friendly conversation with someone, another person will join in or vice versa, you can pull the other person in by including them. Let's say you were having a little sentence or two chat about something with the barrista and the girl behind you in line is cute, you can easily include her in the conversation. Then the two of you move to the area where you pick up the drinks and just you two can continue. You just need to keep your mind open and be more outgoing in general and then stuff happens. I get what you are saying about within a cafe that the personal space is perhaps too close or it's too quiet which kind of puts a spotlight on the whole interaction and can make it uncomfortable. I tend to think no one minds if it unfolds organically. Like if the first goal is just being friendly and outgoing and then it morphs into and potential flirting/dating thing, other people are usually tuned out by that point and she will only exchange contact with you if she wants to anyway. I think leaving that part til the end or very close to it ensures that if she wants to give it to you, she won't care or be intimidated by what others think of the interaction. If you can pull off the confident, outgoing, and she is cool, she is not going to probably care what they think anyway. I do think it's awkward if you are in a cafe and both going to stay there and then just ignore what just happened and go on with your business. So that's why I say do it at the end, as you are going to leave or she is. So even if you were not planning to leave, start talking to her, say "i'm just about to leave, but I'd love to stay in touch or take you for a drink sometime or whatever" (cooler than that), and then leave. If the anxiety is crippling, you just need to change the intention and lower the stakes. You are mainly nervous because you are putting the stakes "high" such as I want to take this beautiful girl on a date. If you reduce the stakes and practice talking with just about all sorts of people, the approach part is easier. If you start by observing others for a few days, hopefully you will see the outgoing people can start a conversation with anyone, AND it translates into opportunities of many sorts for them. Open the realm of possibilities. That's why I say do it in your every day places or even a dive-ish bar or a pub is easier than a nice bar or a club or some parties. Once it gets into nice bar, club or certain types of parties where the overall vibe is less "everyday" and more looking for a partner (whether it's gf, dating, or hookup), it IS harder because the stakes are inherently higher and just "out there". Pretty much everyone knows it's that type of place so the pressure when approaching is high! That's why you should do what I am suggesting (be outgoing, make small talk) because it will help you when you are in the more difficult, high-stakes venues too--you will be more comfortable already. BTW, a little bit of a challenge if you are both just sitting there in a cafe and you walk up to a girls table. That can be a bit much in most cases. If you are passing by for some other unrelated issue OR if there is something that stands out which warrants a direct conversation. Otherwise it probably has to be a conversation that starts out indirectly, somewhat innocently and shifts. Does that make sense? I think if you want to directly hit on her, it's better to time your leaving with her leaving, say something on way out together, or something like that. good luck. It takes a little practice but it's not impossible. I'm naturally outgoing so could pretty much talk to anyone and DO--but here's what I can pass on from that for you to apply is that if you are outgoing regularly (whether it comes naturally or you need to force it a bit), it is much easier to come up with scenarios and feel comfortable starting conversations. Basically you are practicing every day. And you are practicing when stakes are very low (ie a stranger that you don't care about), which lets you get better on those people and you are ready when your dream girl walks by. It just becomes part of you. In fact, speaking of shorter, successful, good looking guys there is one I see most mornings where I go get my morning drink. I don't know why but I see him very often even though my times vary and I don't always go there. He's very outgoing and knows the people that work there and there are a lot of regulars in there. If he started to talk to me, it would be no big deal (only a good thing) because I have already observed his outgoing nature. (my guard would be lowered and it would almost be a natural interaction). Good luck you will be fine! 1
jen1447 Posted June 6, 2016 Posted June 6, 2016 Ha! But I don't really believe in myself enough to think that the P would fall from the sky for me I had a female acquaintance from LA - a real beauty - tell me a couple of years ago, "you're f**king HOT, but your problem is you don't own it." I was floored, but I believe her. I'm a good looking guy, but I don't wear it in the way that someone like Adam Levine would. I'm not timid, but I just don't believe in myself as much as others do, I think. She even wanted to do me, but somehow, I managed to escape it! The biggest trick ppl ever pull on themselves is convincing themselves they can't do something. 1
mortensorchid Posted June 6, 2016 Posted June 6, 2016 If there was one thing I could tell you to do, I would tell you to do it. But there isn't. I would tell you as I would anyone else, but there simply isn't. I have had talks like this with myself in the past, and it's frustrating. Why does this keep happening to me? Or you? Or anyone else? The answer is that there are no interested parties and the situation wasn't right for some reason. You have to keep looking. And with that in mind ... Be friendly, be positive, never close yourself off to any opportunity, and give everyone a chance. Of course, that can also lead to your being hurt by someone, but if you don't try, you'll never know.
BronzeAgeJaeger217 Posted June 6, 2016 Posted June 6, 2016 I would have thought all of your past experiences with when that are positive would provide a good reference experience for you
Author TheBathWater Posted June 6, 2016 Author Posted June 6, 2016 I would have thought all of your past experiences with when that are positive would provide a good reference experience for you They do, but one thing I've learned is that I forget what something feels like when I'm not doing it regularly. When I get in the groove, I do well quicker than I expected. I've had my heart smashed with 3 infidelities in the last year in every LTR I attempted... So that plays a role too I'm sure. I have had a lot more women in my life than most men I know, and it does shock people to hear approach anxiety lives on. It never really goes away.
BronzeAgeJaeger217 Posted June 6, 2016 Posted June 6, 2016 They do, but one thing I've learned is that I forget what something feels like when I'm not doing it regularly. When I get in the groove, I do well quicker than I expected. I've had my heart smashed with 3 infidelities in the last year in every LTR I attempted... So that plays a role too I'm sure. I have had a lot more women in my life than most men I know, and it does shock people to hear approach anxiety lives on. It never really goes away. Ya because confidence and high self-esteem usually results from good positive past experiences, for example, its very understandable that if a guy is a virgin or never had a girlfriend before would take rejection more personally than a guy who is not a virgin and has had girlfriends before, you should get the point I'm saying
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