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My ex-GF says I raped her

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By chev
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Arieswoman Established Member

Arieswoman

Posted
Posted

SoThatHappened,

You've distorted jabron's words (saying he thinks rape is a farce - that is NOT what he stated)

Perhaps you can let Jabron speak for himself?

katiegrl Established Member

katiegrl

Posted
Posted
Oof. Even if you didn't rape her, you've done a lot of things that will make it look plausible in the eyes of a judge. Good luck...

 

Not trying to trivialize things... cuz I happened to think the OP's behavior was atrocious in ALL respects. I hope this is a lesson learned for him because between the aggressiveness of how he approached having sex with her and the stalking, he's got some issues to resolve.

 

However, in the eyes of the LAW, rape (date rape) can't be proved here.

 

It's clearly a he said/she said at this point..

 

It is very difficult to prove rape (unfortunately) even when the evidence is NOT circumstantial and hearsay/he said/she said.

 

Not sure what he can do about the defamation.

 

Move out of town? Start a new life?

  • Like 1
CarrieT Established Member

CarrieT

Posted
Posted
CarrieT,

Post # 31

 

 

Maybe they do maybe they don't. :rolleyes:

 

I was asking the OP about this as it his response would indicate what his attitude was towards this child - because that's what she was - and what his motivations were.

 

I think it's very relevent. :)

 

I don't believe it is any stretch to guess what a 13-year old's motivations are regarding sex. In this regard, I believe you are bating the OP.

Arieswoman Established Member

Arieswoman

Posted
Posted

And can I remind everyone of the OP's original words;

 

I didn't always ask if she wanted to just started pulling her pants down
.

 

I would suspect OP that you now realise what you did was disrespectful and abusive.

 

Yes, you need to speak to a solicitor/attorney.

 

Are you in Mexico by any chance?

Arieswoman Established Member

Arieswoman

Posted
Posted

CarrieT post #54

 

I don't believe it is any stretch to guess what a 13-year old's motivations are regarding sex. In this regard, I believe you are bating the OP.

 

That's your opinion.

 

You may be clairvoyant, I am not.

 

That's why I was asking to see what the OP said. :)

Jabron1 Established Member

Jabron1

Posted
Posted
It is the law - flout it at your peril.

CPS Legal Guidance

 

I have flouted it, especially many times as a kid.

 

I had sex so many times on drink or ecstasy. Who knows what the deal was there?

 

Luckily, I haven't fallen upon a nutter yet.

 

The crap I've read on here regarding 'rape' really isn't real life at all, as far as I'm concerned.

 

Take this from someone who was a big raver as a teen, and someone who's family runs clubs.

katiegrl Established Member

katiegrl

Posted
Posted
I have flouted it, especially many times as a kid.

 

I had sex so many times on drink or ecstasy. Who knows what the deal was there?

 

Luckily, I haven't fallen upon a nutter yet.

 

The crap I've read on here regarding 'rape' really isn't real life at all, as far as I'm concerned.

 

Take this from someone who was a big raver as a teen, and someone who's family runs clubs.

 

Jabron, I agree deeming this "rape" is a stretch at this point, years later. And impossible to prove in a court of law.

 

However, I DO believe she felt very violated but was probably in denial about that during their RL.

 

Often times we don't acknowledge how angry and violated we felt until after the RL is over and we gain more clarity.

 

Similar to the Stockholm Syndrome.

 

I think she needs to get some therapy and so does he.

 

Just pulling down her pants after she said no is NO way to approach sex with your GF.

 

It's overly aggressive and just wrong IMO.

 

Would you not agree?

  • Like 4
xxoo Established Member

xxoo

Posted
Posted
I dated a girl from grade 7-12. We broke up like 6 years ago. During the relationship we had sex pretty much daily. I'll admit, I was a bit pushy. I was a horny teenager. I didn't always ask if she wanted to just started pulling her pants down. She NEVER tried to stop me. Sometimes she would say no but I'd ask again and she'd say yes. She never, ever tried to push me away or move away.

 

 

Sounds like she was coerced, especially considering her age :(

  • Like 3
SoThatHappened Established Member

SoThatHappened

Posted
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Sounds like she was coerced, especially considering her age :(

 

Not disagreeing, but look what happens when you reverse what you bolded:

 

During the relationship we had sex pretty much daily. I'll admit, I was a bit pushy. I was a horny teenager. I didn't always ask if she wanted to just started pulling her pants down. She NEVER tried to stop me. Sometimes she would say no but I'd ask again and she'd say yes. She never, ever tried to push me away or move away.

 

I said "Knock it off" when my girl went down on me while I was changing oil underneath a vehicle. Am I a rape victim?

 

Every man I know in a long-term relationship has begged/pleaded for sex after being told "no." Are they rapists?

xxoo Established Member

xxoo

Posted
Posted
Not disagreeing, but look what happens when you reverse what you bolded:

 

 

 

I said "Knock it off" when my girl went down on me while I was changing oil underneath a vehicle. Am I a rape victim?

 

Every man I know in a long-term relationship has begged/pleaded for sex after being told "no." Are they rapists?

 

The parts you highlighted make me worry that she was raped every day :(

  • Like 2
SoThatHappened Established Member

SoThatHappened

Posted
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Well, I hope that wasn't the case, and only chev knows whether or not he was pushy every day, or she told him "no" everyday.

 

chev?

Jabron1 Established Member

Jabron1

Posted
Posted

Just pulling down her pants after she said no is NO way to approach sex with your GF.

 

It's overly aggressive and just wrong IMO.

 

Would you not agree?

 

It's impossible for me to say without being there.

 

Sex always sounds distasteful after the event. Especially from the person who initiated it.

 

For as much as people might find it distasteful, I don't think it sounds illegal.

 

I'm just shocked at how literal people take rape laws or whatever. I read on here the other day that 2 drinks means that a person can't consent. Well, I'll tell you that almost the entire club can't consent to sex then. And a lot of these people are getting laid that night.

 

I wonder if people have actually lived in the real world and gone on a good night out ever - or if they are just reading fine print.

 

No one lives their life around this stuff. It's practically irrelevant.

  • Like 1
katiegrl Established Member

katiegrl

Posted
Posted
Well, I hope that wasn't the case, and only chev knows whether or not he was pushy every day, or she told him "no" everyday.

 

chev?

 

It's also possible that was their little "dance" together too. Some couples get off on that game.... he wants sex, she says no (but really means yes).... he "takes" her and it's a turn off for both.

 

NOT suggesting that is what happened here.... but it's possible.

 

It's not uncommon for one party to feel very bitter and angry once a RL ends.. and as such to accuse the other of godonlyknowswhat after the fact.

 

I work in law I KNOW this....

 

Again, not suggesting this is what happened, but IMO we just don't have enough evidence here to draw any definitive conclusions.

 

I do suspect though as I said before, that she felt very violated during the RL, perhaps for other reasons too (not just the aggressive way he came at her for sex)... and is lashing back now in the only way she knows how.

 

Too many ambiguities though to draw a definitely conclusion IMO.

  • Like 6
GunslingerRoland Established Member

GunslingerRoland

Posted
Posted

It all depends on how you imagine the context in your mind. I could easily imagine the scenario with a scared girl giving in to her boyfriend, and I can also imagine with a totally willing girl giving playful pushback.

 

 

I think the fact that this continued on for 6 years and it never even occurred to him that he was coercing her says something. Also the fact that it had nothing to do with their eventual breakup.

 

 

Really all in all it sounds like a normal teenage relationship.

 

 

Convincing someone to have sex with you after they originally said no, is not rape or coercion unless there is some sort of threat or at least implied threat of something whether it be force, or blackmail or something.

 

 

Also I'm hoping that we can agree that once a couple is regularly having sex that while legally the standard for consenting is still there, that there is an obvious difference. I don't ask for consent from my wife before having sex with her. It would be totally normal to tear your regular sex partners clothes off without verbally asking for their consent in a normal relationship... neither partner would consider anything abnormal about it

  • Like 2
katiegrl Established Member

katiegrl

Posted
Posted
It's also possible that was their little "dance" together too. Some couples get off on that game.... he wants sex, she says no (but really means yes).... he "takes" her and it's a turn off for both.

 

 

I meant it's a turn ON for both.

introverted1 Established Member

introverted1

Posted
Posted

I think it is really hard... No, I think it is impossible to know what happened between OP and his gf.

 

When I was in junior/senior high it was common for boys to be pushy about sex. Girls were the gate-keepers and it was pretty well drummed into us that sex was inappropriate, something only a certain type of girl did. So it was common to see a dance played out where the guy would ask, typically more than once, and be told no, also sometimes more than once, but ultimately that no became a yes and both parties were happy with the outcome. The no was a requirement to ensure that the girl did not appear too eager, not an actual expression of a desire not to engage.

 

Is that what happened with the OP and his gf? Who knows. Was OP possibly overly invested in his own pleasure and not attenuated enough to the desires of his gf? Quite possible. But did he cross the line into rape? That's a significant charge and not one to be leveled lightly, imo.

 

My take is that OP should confer with a lawyer who can help him understand the various legal issues here.

  • Like 2
xxoo Established Member

xxoo

Posted
Posted

Really all in all it sounds like a normal teenage relationship.

 

As a former teenage girl, and a current parent of a teenage girl, that's disturbing :( Is coercion that common?

 

When I was a teen, only one boy acted this way, and to this day I describe him as "date rapey". I did not have sex with him, but I had to physically remove myself from the situation to prevent it because he kept pushing past my "no" and removing my clothes. That's crazy. I dumped him.

 

I guess I was lucky to have comparison and realize how wrong this behavior was. A 13 year old girl could easily think it's normal and that a girlfriend is expected to comply, whether she wants it or not.

  • Like 3
salparadise Established Member

salparadise

Posted
Posted
So it was common to see a dance played out where the guy would ask, typically more than once, and be told no, also sometimes more than once, but ultimately that no became a yes and both parties were happy with the outcome. The no was a requirement to ensure that the girl did not appear too eager, not an actual expression of a desire not to engage.

 

My take is that OP should confer with a lawyer who can help him understand the various legal issues here.

 

Yes, exactly. The NO always means NO stuff is unrealistic - wishful thinking on the part of a few women's groups. If a guy doesn't learn to get past initial resistance he'll eventually be a 40 year old virgin.

 

Chances are that she won't take any further than she has already. Pressing charges would require her to come back to your state (if that's where you were at the time) and go through a lengthy trial where her early sexual proclivities will be made public.

 

There is probably a statute of limitations (check for your state), and even if it's longer now it may have been shorter at the time, and that may be the limit that stands. The chances of being convicted under such circumstances are minimal. It will look just like it does here––it was fine at the time, but now she'd like to do some damage. You should be careful as to any statements you make, including on internet forums, that could be self incriminating.

 

No pushback, no contact whatsoever. After this much time has passed it's unlikely that she will do anything more than whine to her new boyfriends. Contact a lawyer if it will make you feel any better, but the main thing is to not give her any extra motivation or anything she could use against you.

  • Like 3
noelle303 Established Member

noelle303

Posted
Posted
Yes, exactly. The NO always means NO stuff is unrealistic - wishful thinking on the part of a few women's groups. If a guy doesn't learn to get past initial resistance he'll eventually be a 40 year old virgin.

 

:eek: Guys who persist even after I tell them ''no'' are a huge red flag for me. I don't like to be disrespected and dismissed in terms of my own decision making skills. If you make a pass at me, and I refuse you, you pleading further is showing me that you don't put much value on my autonomy.

 

Of course, playful interactions in relationships when one person is initiating sex, and the other purposefully denies just for fun's sake are not included in this.

 

However, only OP and his GF know whether what he describes were playful interactions or coercion on his part. My guess, considering her age and the fact that she confided in only 3 people in the past 6 years, tells me it was probably coercion. She was a child herself, in what was probably her first relationship and she did not feel secure in standing her ground. OP, you should have been paying a better attention to her body language and made sure she actually did want the sex to happen or was simply complying and changing her answer to ''yes'' to placate you.

 

But, you were also very young and probably not interested in her that much, you just cared that she changed the answer to yes.

 

Now, since you seem to have the ability of introspection and you obviously look at your behavior after the break-up with criticism of yourself, why don't you try to acknowledge that she was emotionally hurt during this sexual relationship the two of you had and apologize? You admit that there were times you were ''pushy'' and she is expressing that she felt coerced, so why not actually tell her you're sorry if that is how you made her feel?

  • Like 2
Haydn Established Member

Haydn

Posted
Posted

Blokes don`t get raped by women.

jen1447 Established Member

jen1447

Posted
Posted
Yes, exactly. The NO always means NO stuff is unrealistic - wishful thinking on the part of a few women's groups. If a guy doesn't learn to get past initial resistance he'll eventually be a 40 year old virgin.

 

Chances are that she won't take any further than she has already. Pressing charges would require her to come back to your state (if that's where you were at the time) and go through a lengthy trial where her early sexual proclivities will be made public.

 

There is probably a statute of limitations (check for your state), and even if it's longer now it may have been shorter at the time, and that may be the limit that stands. The chances of being convicted under such circumstances are minimal. It will look just like it does here––it was fine at the time, but now she'd like to do some damage. You should be careful as to any statements you make, including on internet forums, that could be self incriminating.

 

No pushback, no contact whatsoever. After this much time has passed it's unlikely that she will do anything more than whine to her new boyfriends. Contact a lawyer if it will make you feel any better, but the main thing is to not give her any extra motivation or anything she could use against you.

 

OP already answered about some deets like statute of limitations

 

The age of consent in my country is 12 if the partner is less than 2 years older, 14 if the partner is less than 5 years older and then 16 for full consent.

 

We are the same age, within 3 months.

 

I'm pretty sure we started having sex at 13 years old.

 

but we still don't know what country he's in, which makes all our criminal speculations moot bc the laws vary and we don't know how they apply to him specifically. Would be nice to know that before we either clear him or decide to press charges. ;)

 

IMO, very generally, there's no need to prepare for a possible criminal defense unless you think a charge is imminent, and there's no real indication of that happening here. If OP wants to retain counsel to pursue a civil defamation case of his own, ok, but that seems about equally as likely to come off as his ex's rape prosecution, given the limited info that could be convincingly considered slander. (Plus there's sth to be said for not playing ball, both in terms of not looking guilty and moving on in life.)

 

The most likely outcome here is that nothing at all will happen.

  • Like 3
jen1447 Established Member

jen1447

Posted
Posted
OP already answered about some deets like statute of limitations

 

Actually he didn't answer about SoL, sorry. Could have swore I read that. :confused:

  • Like 1
Satu Established Member

Satu

Posted
Posted

All these opinions are interesting, but the only people who can write the bottom line are the courts of law.

 

Goodbye dear thread.

 

Poof... Satu is gone...

  • Like 3
Buddhist Established Member

Buddhist

Posted
Posted
I'll admit, I was a bit pushy. I was a horny teenager. I didn't always ask if she wanted to just started pulling her pants down. She NEVER tried to stop me.

 

So in your mind because she didn't feel as if she could fight off a teenaged boy that was as good as consent? Kay.....

  • Like 2
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