Antidepressants

[scorpiogirl]

Agreed.

 

That's why I refuse to take OCD medication. Hate the way that crap makes me feel. Hate that it lowers my sex drive.

 

Working out is the best antidepressant available. Positive benefits with no negative side effects.

 

Great. That's your experience but it's irresponsible to tell someone antidepressants don't work. You don't know their situation. How are you supposed to work out if you can't even get out of bed?

 

OP, not all medication works the same for everyone. My sister used something that she swore by but when I tried it, it was terrible. And the pill that worked for me, she hated.

 

I also see a therapist. I'm in a much better place than I was.

 

Everything of the best.

[Els]

Great. That's your experience but it's irresponsible to tell someone antidepressants don't work. You don't know their situation. How are you supposed to work out if you can't even get out of bed?

 

Right. And really, if someone's depression is solved 100% by just working out, chances are theirs was mild/situational and didn't need medication anyhow. That isn't necessarily the case for a lot of other people, so it boggles the mind how people can assume that everyone else's case is similar to theirs. It's like someone with mild diarrhea telling a severely dehydrated cholera sufferer on an IV drip, "Bah, you don't need a hospital stay or any of those fancy IV drip lines! I just took a sports drink and I was fine!"

[privategal]

privategal.... I am glad to be able to reply to one of your posts. It touched me... you have been through so very much, for such a very long time.

 

I'm glad you are getting help with antidepressants. I don't know if you have ever taken them before, but they saved my life.

 

I can speak from both the healthcare professional and patient perspective when I say that there isn't a good way to predict who will do well on what antidepressant. Even within the classes of SSRIs (selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors) or SNRIs (serotonin norepinephrine reuptake inhibitors), different meds work better or worse in different people - it's basically trial and error.

 

It usually takes about 2 weeks to start working, and 6-8 weeks for maximum effect, so don't give up. Within 2 weeks I was up off the floor and back among the living. If you don't see an effect within 2-3 weeks, don't give up, and go back to your doc and try something else.

 

Yes, there can be some adverse effects - the only one I experienced was anorgasmia. It's fairly common (reported in only 1-3% of patients in clinical trials, but in my practice I think about 75% of patients have mentioned it). But anorgasmia was a nonissue when I was just trying to survive the day and get to the next day.

 

What they will prescribe for you will almost certainly be within one of the 2 classes I listed above, and it will be your prescriber's preference within those 2 classes. Again, don't hesitate to let them know if you aren't feeling better after 2 or 3 weeks.

 

I wish I could PM you.

 

You WILL feel better. I promise you. Hang in there. You have been through so much. You are moving in the right direction now. I am thinking of you.

 

 

That is so so so kind of you. I am really touched that you wanted to help me and having this empathy is invaluable to me. Im so thankful, I cant even express how much it means to me right now.

Wow.

[SammySammy]

Great. That's your experience but it's irresponsible to tell someone antidepressants don't work. You don't know their situation. How are you supposed to work out if you can't even get out of bed?

 

OP, not all medication works the same for everyone. My sister used something that she swore by but when I tried it, it was terrible. And the pill that worked for me, she hated.

 

I also see a therapist. I'm in a much better place than I was.

 

Everything of the best.

 

First of all, I never said antidepressants don't work.

 

Secondly, I think it's irresponsible to tell people a pill is the solution to their depression. The reason they will be able get out of bed.

 

Tony Robbins has done a lot of work studying what people do to go into a state of depression and what people do to get out of a state of depression. If we understand what the pills do, then we also understand the pills are a temporary solution. There are ways address depression or any other state of mind directly without relying on pills. For me, working out clears my mind and leads to me feeling good all day. Of course, other people might be different but that still doesn't mean pills are the answer. Pills don't cause permanent state change.

 

[Els]

First of all, I never said antidepressants don't work.

 

Secondly, I think it's irresponsible to tell people a pill is the solution to their depression. The reason they will be able get out of bed.

 

Tony Robbins has done a lot of work studying what people do to go into a state of depression and what people do to get out of a state of depression. If we understand what the pills do, then we also understand the pills are a temporary solution. There are ways address depression or any other state of mind directly without relying on pills. For me, working out clears my mind and leads to me feeling good all day. Of course, other people might be different but that still doesn't mean pills are the answer. Pills don't cause permanent state change.

 

 

You realize that this Tony Robbins guy has zero psychological/medical education, training, experience, or qualifications, right? He hasn't done any real study on depression whatsoever. He is a businessman/celebrity, not any sort of authority on depression. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Robbins

 

A better article on depression: https://www.psychiatry.org/patients-families/depression/what-is-depression

 

And for those who want to prioritize a lifestyle modification approach: Dealing with Depression: Self-Help and Coping Tips to Overcome Depression

[scorpiogirl]

First of all, I never said antidepressants don't work.

 

Secondly, I think it's irresponsible to tell people a pill is the solution to their depression. The reason they will be able get out of bed.

 

Tony Robbins has done a lot of work studying what people do to go into a state of depression and what people do to get out of a state of depression. If we understand what the pills do, then we also understand the pills are a temporary solution. There are ways address depression or any other state of mind directly without relying on pills. For me, working out clears my mind and leads to me feeling good all day. Of course, other people might be different but that still doesn't mean pills are the answer. Pills don't cause permanent state change.

 

 

People don't DO anything to go into a state of depression. Do you understand that, especially with women, hormones control a lot of what we feel and how we react to certain things?

 

My mother never believed in PMS so that was my mindset. Women who have mood swings are using PMS as an excuse. So colour me puzzled when I would sob in my office for a week at a time. Nothing had happened.

Or how about when I would scream at people for something that last week would've been a mild irritation.

 

Now take hormones going nuts, and add chemical imbalances and then I'd like for you to explain just exactly WHAT I would've done to go into a depression.

 

And many days, yes all I needed ( still need) is a temporary measure to get me out of my bed, into my shower, prepare a healthy meal so I can lose the weight I gained during my last depression when I thought I could tough it without medication, get me out the door to therapy and then to work where I can function normally to get me through the day.

 

When Tony Robbins shows me his medical degree and his certificate that said he specialised in psychiatry, then I'll listen to him.

[SammySammy]

You realize that this Tony Robbins guy has zero psychological/medical education, training, experience, or qualifications, right? He hasn't done any real study on depression whatsoever. He is a businessman/celebrity, not any sort of authority on depression. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Robbins

 

Better articles on depression: https://www.psychiatry.org/patients-families/depression/what-is-depression

And for those who want to prioritize a lifestyle modification approach: Dealing with Depression: Self-Help and Coping Tips to Overcome Depression

 

I realize that he gets paid because he produces results.

 

My comments were about what works for me. What has happened in my life experience. I really don't care what you or anyone else thinks of what works for me. You're more than welcome to cling to your clinical definition of depression and to think the solution lies in a bottle.

 

Many people, including myself, choose to live our lives differently.

[Els]

I realize that he gets paid because he produces results.

 

He gets paid because he's good at marketing himself.

 

My comments were about what works for me. What has happened in my life experience. I really don't care what you or anyone else thinks of what works for me. You're more than welcome to cling to your clinical definition of depression and to think the solution lies in a bottle.

 

Many people, including myself, choose to live our lives differently.

 

You have every right to choose not to take medication. In fact, as I said, if working out solves your problem 100%, then chances are your case was mild enough to not even require treatment, so of course you shouldn't take medications. I'm not sure why you think we're taking umbrage with your choice.

 

The issue I have is not with what works or doesn't work for YOU, the issue I have is with you disparaging antidepressants on a thread where a few people have specifically stated that they need them. Not everyone's case is as mild as yours was, and it's incredibly dangerous for people to be told to ignore everything their doctor said.

[SammySammy]

People don't DO anything to go into a state of depression. Do you understand that, especially with women, hormones control a lot of what we feel and how we react to certain things?

 

My mother never believed in PMS so that was my mindset. Women who have mood swings are using PMS as an excuse. So colour me puzzled when I would sob in my office for a week at a time. Nothing had happened.

Or how about when I would scream at people for something that last week would've been a mild irritation.

 

Now take hormones going nuts, and add chemical imbalances and then I'd like for you to explain just exactly WHAT I would've done to go into a depression.

 

And many days, yes all I needed ( still need) is a temporary measure to get me out of my bed, into my shower, prepare a healthy meal so I can lose the weight I gained during my last depression when I thought I could tough it without medication, get me out the door to therapy and then to work where I can function normally to get me through the day.

 

When Tony Robbins shows me his medical degree and his certificate that said he specialised in psychiatry, then I'll listen to him.

 

The crux of the disagreement is whether we are helpless victims of things that just happen to us or can we exert some sort of control over our mental and physiological states. I've seen this debate many times over many years.

 

You're free to believe what you want to believe. Do what you want to do. I couldn't care less. Not interested in trying to change your mind in the slightest.

 

But, please don't think trying to discredit me (or Tony Robbins) means your view of the world is the only one that works.

[SammySammy]

He gets paid because he's good at marketing himself.

 

 

 

You have every right to choose not to take medication. In fact, as I said, if working out solves your problem 100%, then chances are your case was mild enough to not even require treatment, so of course you shouldn't take medications. I'm not sure why you think we're taking umbrage with your choice.

 

The issue I have is not with what works or doesn't work for YOU, the issue I have is with you disparaging antidepressants on a thread where a few people have specifically stated that they need them. Not everyone's case is as mild as yours was, and it's incredibly dangerous for people to be told to ignore everything their doctor said.

 

Again, I didn't disparage antidepressants. Never said they didn't work at all. Never told anyone to ignore their doctor.

[Els]

Again, I didn't disparage antidepressants

 

Uh, yes, you did.

 

That's why I refuse to take OCD medication. Hate the way that crap makes me feel. Hate that it lowers my sex drive.

Working out is the best antidepressant available. Positive benefits with no negative side effects.

 

The 'best antidepressant' available is the one that works best for each individual, period. Usually in moderate or severe cases, several 'best antidepressants' are needed, both medication and lifestyle modification.

[SammySammy]

Uh, yes, you did.

 

 

 

The 'best antidepressant' available is the one that works best for each individual, period. Usually in moderate or severe cases, several 'best antidepressants' are needed, both medication and lifestyle modification.

 

Uh, no, I didn't.

 

In that whole post, I was referring to myself.

 

To make it perfectly clear to you I could have said "working out is the best antidepressant available for me", but that was my intent whether you got it or not.

[Els]

To make it perfectly clear to you I could have said "working out is the best antidepressant available for me", but that was my intent whether you got it or not.

 

Yeah, should probably make that clearer next time. If several different people are 'misinterpreting' your statement the same way, chances are you could have phrased it better.

[xxoo]

The crux of the disagreement is whether we are helpless victims of things that just happen to us or can we exert some sort of control over our mental and physiological states. I've seen this debate many times over many years.

 

You're free to believe what you want to believe. Do what you want to do. I couldn't care less. Not interested in trying to change your mind in the slightest.

 

But, please don't think trying to discredit me (or Tony Robbins) means your view of the world is the only one that works.

 

Of course antidepressants are not the only method that works. They are one tool in the toolbox. It would be silly to ignore that tool after others have been tried and failed to help, or if unable to try the others due to massive depression.

 

Antidepressants are a crutch of sorts. They help the person who can not get up and do the long term work to get up and take those first steps. Surely crutches are not bad for someone recovering from a broken leg simply because they are a temporary solution.

[SammySammy]

Yeah, should probably make that clearer next time. If several different people are 'misinterpreting' your statement the same way, chances are you could have phrased it better.

 

The first two sentences of that post clearly (that you conveniently chose to ignore) spoke to my personal situation. It naturally follows that the third sentence was about how I dealt with things personally also.

 

Maybe you should climb off your high horse and give people the benefit of the doubt.

[Els]

People don't DO anything to go into a state of depression. Do you understand that, especially with women, hormones control a lot of what we feel and how we react to certain things?

 

My mother never believed in PMS so that was my mindset. Women who have mood swings are using PMS as an excuse. So colour me puzzled when I would sob in my office for a week at a time. Nothing had happened.

Or how about when I would scream at people for something that last week would've been a mild irritation.

 

Now take hormones going nuts, and add chemical imbalances and then I'd like for you to explain just exactly WHAT I would've done to go into a depression.

 

Ha, this reminds me of the person who tried to tell me that all I really needed for my anxiety was a good sleep every night. My dear, of course it would help... but if I COULD actually get good sleep every night, I wouldn't even be here seeking help for anxiety, would I?

 

When Tony Robbins shows me his medical degree and his certificate that said he specialised in psychiatry, then I'll listen to him.

 

Ugh, unqualified celebrities trying to give 'health advice' really pisses me off. Just like the ones who were trying to convince people that coffee enemas cured cancer...

[Els]

Maybe you should climb off your high horse and give people the benefit of the doubt.

 

Pot, meet kettle...

[SammySammy]

Pot, meet kettle...

 

Nah. You should just stop trying to argue with people when you only understand your point of view. Believe it or not, you don't have all of the answers.

 

I know how I feel and what works for me. Nothing you say will ever change that.

[scorpiogirl]

Ha, this reminds me of the person who tried to tell me that all I really needed for my anxiety was a good sleep every night. My dear, of course it would help... but if I COULD actually get good sleep every night, I wouldn't even be here seeking help for anxiety, would I?

 

 

 

Ugh, unqualified celebrities trying to give 'health advice' really pisses me off. Just like the ones who were trying to convince people that coffee enemas cured cancer...

 

A good night's sleep might also make you less argumentative. I prescribe more naps to knock you off your high horse.

[Els]

A good night's sleep might also make you less argumentative. I prescribe more naps to knock you off your high horse.

 

 

I know, right? Then maybe I would stop telling people: "Don't exercise you stupid asshats, taking pills means you shouldn't be doing anything else and you're hallucinating if you think exercising helped you!!", too!

[HopeForTomorrow]

First of all, I never said antidepressants don't work.

 

Secondly, I think it's irresponsible to tell people a pill is the solution to their depression. The reason they will be able get out of bed.

 

Tony Robbins has done a lot of work studying what people do to go into a state of depression and what people do to get out of a state of depression. If we understand what the pills do, then we also understand the pills are a temporary solution. There are ways address depression or any other state of mind directly without relying on pills. For me, working out clears my mind and leads to me feeling good all day. Of course, other people might be different but that still doesn't mean pills are the answer. Pills don't cause permanent state change.

 

 

I would bet my 401k that you have never fulfilled the diagnostic criteria for clinical depression, based on this statement: "For me, working out clears my mind and leads to me feeling good all day."

 

Pretty much everyone feels better after working out.

 

That said, you are correct that exercise increases norepi and serotonin levels in the brain in much the same way antidepressants do. The problem is - people who are clinically depressed are often not functional enough to even get out of bed some days, let alone exercise. That is something you would understand if you ever experienced clinical depression, and IME people don't "get" it until they have experienced it. It's indescribable. It's way beyond just "feeling depressed".

 

Some people (like myself at the time) are so affected that they are incapable of recognizing that they have it; they just can't see a way out. It took someone else to get me off the floor and into the doctor's office to get the diagnosis and prescription - and I diagnose illnesses for a living. So for you to imply to such people that their "pill" won't help or that they need to do something else has the potential to be extremely damaging.

 

I will refrain from commenting on your link except to agree wholeheartedly with Elswyth above.

[privategal]

I would bet my 401k that you have never fulfilled the diagnostic criteria for clinical depression, based on this statement: "For me, working out clears my mind and leads to me feeling good all day."

 

Pretty much everyone feels better after working out.

 

That said, you are correct that exercise increases norepi and serotonin levels in the brain in much the same way antidepressants do. The problem is - people who are clinically depressed are often not functional enough to even get out of bed some days, let alone exercise. That is something you would understand if you ever experienced clinical depression, and IME people don't "get" it until they have experienced it. It's indescribable. It's way beyond just "feeling depressed".

 

Some people (like myself at the time) are so affected that they are incapable of recognizing that they have it; they just can't see a way out. It took someone else to get me off the floor and into the doctor's office to get the diagnosis and prescription - and I diagnose illnesses for a living. So for you to imply to such people that their "pill" won't help or that they need to do something else has the potential to be extremely damaging.

 

I will refrain from commenting on your link except to agree wholeheartedly with Elswyth above.

 

I have a question. Last week I could bareky function, prayed for death, debilitating sadness and everything gray, heavy and sad. Last few days, relatively normal and not too bad at all. If Im feeling better, do I still need the ad's? In confused I am so up and down.

Its a hard choice.

[MidwestUSA]

I have a question. Last week I could bareky function, prayed for death, debilitating sadness and everything gray, heavy and sad. Last few days, relatively normal and not too bad at all. If Im feeling better, do I still need the ad's? In confused I am so up and down.

Its a hard choice.

 

Do not stop taking them. You're just starting to see the positive effects. And it's not wise to stop anything abruptly.

 

May it be nothing but up for you from here out! I've been there. Been on every drug you can name, and refuse to feel shame about it.

 

Keep going, I'm thinking of you!

[HopeForTomorrow]

I have a question. Last week I could bareky function, prayed for death, debilitating sadness and everything gray, heavy and sad. Last few days, relatively normal and not too bad at all. If Im feeling better, do I still need the ad's? In confused I am so up and down.

Its a hard choice.

 

You haven't started taking them yet, correct?

 

I don't want to give you advice that your doctor should give, so that is the best source given your current and past history. But IMO you could probably go either way - wait it out and see if this trend continues, or go on the meds for awhile. It hasn't been very long since you have been really affected and I don't want to see you sink back into that, but I am so glad you are feeling better. I would probably err on the side of taking the meds for awhile, especially if you are "up and down", but that's just me. You won't need them forever.

[privategal]

Do not stop taking them. You're just starting to see the positive effects. And it's not wise to stop anything abruptly.

 

May it be nothing but up for you from here out! I've been there. Been on every drug you can name, and refuse to feel shame about it.

 

Keep going, I'm thinking of you!

 

Thank you I havent actually started them yet. I got them today. I so much appreciate your kind words. Thinking of you and sending good thoughts.