Here we go again

May 10, 2016

Well, i guess I'm back on the wagon...this feels like an alcoholics tale sometimes, i sware.

After my fiasco with the dentist, the x coming back and mixing things up, i was determined to just throw a big F U to everyone and go have fun friday. Friday morning i jumped on OK Cupid again for the first time in a while, and lo and behold a really cute woman was a 95% match with me...that was interesting, probably the highest match I've gotten there. I messaged her and we chatted throughout the day.

That afternoon i said, F it...why not...I asked her if she was interested in coming out with me to my friends art show (my friend is an artist and had a gallery show opening that night) I wasn't putting ANY weight into it, but i figured, I'm going to go do me, if she wants to come, it could be fun...strangely enough she said sure.

We met at a bar and had a drink beforehand, just to vet each other out a bit. The conversation just flowed naturally, we laughed, talked, laughed got closer...it was just nice. She agreed to continue the date and so did I.

From that point forward, we really had no plan. We were going to go to the gallery and just wing it. I was trying hard not to even care, after the ****storm of women i have dealt with i just didn't have the energy.

We went to the gallery, i grabbed us some wine and we met my friend...chatted for a minute and walked around, laughed at some of the art, marveled at some of it, just had a really fun comfortable time together. I was just being myself, not "I'm on a first date guy" and she seemed pretty relaxed too. We were enjoying ourselves. We grabbed some cheese and crackers and went outside to talk more. I almost fell in the fountain, she dropped her crackers everywhere, hilarity ensued...well...kinda...

We both agreed dinner sounded good, so i busted out OpenTable and we did a random pick of something in the area. Ended up at a really fancy high end restaurant that was amazing. Had some good food, ordered a bottle of wine, we sat on their back patio and finished the wine, had some cheese cake, and talked by the fire. From there we drove to another bar, spent a brief time there and she commented she was getting tired so i drove her home.

She invited me in...uh oh...Turned out i was a gentleman. we played with her dog in the backyard and ended up just kinda of cuddling on the couch until she fell asleep. I woke her up, walked her to her bed and tucked her in, kissed her forhead and showed myself out.

Was that just one of the most awesome dates I've been on?!? What the hell...

On the way home she text me and told me she had a great time, sorry she fell asleep and she wanted to see me again soon.

Next day she had plans with her family, i was just cleaning up. She asked if i wanted to go have a beer when she got done. So I picked her up at 9pm and we went to a local place, drank 2 beers each and just talked and talked and talked.

Wow, this girl is really cool. She seems really low maintenance, she is gorgeous, ticks all the boxes I have (granted i don't have many) and we seem to get along really well.

We went back to her house and sat on the back patio and i massaged her shoulders. It got late, and we went in, were back on the couch and embraced bit...still hadn't even kissed at this point. She fell asleep again, and this time pulled me down to spoon with her on the couch. We both fell asleep.

Woke up about 4am and she invited me to her bed, but insisted it wasn't for sex...i was exhausted so thats fine...of course one thing lead to another...we didn't have sex, but we did just about everything but.

I barely slept that night (try sleeping in a button down hugo boss shirt, jeans, etc) She woke up about 630 and we just talked and talked..made out, talked more, messed around, talked more...didnt get out of bed until 2pm.

I had to go meet my mom for lunch for mothers day. On the way out, i mentioned we should get together soon and go see a movie or something. She said, how about tonight? So i said sure.

We had a great evening just exploring...never made it to the movie, but enjoyed ourselves doing everything else.

I asked her if she was OK hanging out this much. I typically like to hang out with someone I'm potentially interested in a lot because it helps me get to know them and if i really have a real interest. She said she was exactly the same and has enjoyed every moment of our time together. Monday we got up and i went to work, she did too. I text her that day and said I would like to come over some evening and make her dinner. She said any time, and I jokingly said, see you this evening...she agreed, we laughed at our craziness...and i went over and made her an amazing dinner (if i should say so myself). We ate, had wine, talked at the dinner table about our past relationships, crazy online dating, etc. We were in bed by 10 and asleep by 1015.

Today there is a tech / social event that we are both supposed to go to, not planned, but just a coincidence. So we agreed to ride together and perhaps spend the night again.

Is this crazy? Im not saying I'm totally in love with this girl, I think she is pretty awesome, there is definitely chemistry and we seem to get along REALLY well...but I really am skeptical at being burned, as its happened continuously for a while. I know most people don't hang out this much early on, but we are both enjoying it and are agreeable to it.

Am i doing it again? I REALLY didn't want to go fall in like with someone right now, i was pretty much in "F women, I'm gonna be a dude" mode, but then this happened...

Is this ok? Someone talk some sense in to me. Am i sabotaging this? I hope not, she seems like a really compatible girl. I would love to magically find "the one" this way, but i feel so turned around and jaded, i worry I'm not thinking about anything clearly.

Advice?

May 10, 2016

You seem to develop strong feelings easily. Only a month ago you were telling us you were planning to marry your dentist gf.

May 10, 2016

You seem to develop strong feelings easily. Only a month ago you were telling us you were planning to marry your dentist gf.

And not long before your dentist gf, you were falling passionately in love with another woman.

May 10, 2016

That's why he's called Whirlwind Guy. Who cares? It's fun, right? Have fun. Fall in love. Fall out of love. Fall in love again.

May 11, 2016

**** it. Do you big dawg.

May 11, 2016

And not long before your dentist gf, you were falling passionately in love with another woman.

Well first girl, I admittedly did fall for pretty quickly. She unfortunately was caught up with a married guy and it was never going to work. Shame, I do like her, but she is toxic for me and ultimately its better it didn't work out. I haven't had a connection like her before, nor have I had one since. It was some weird visceral attraction thing that I don't even really know how to explain.

Dentist girl was different, it took a little while to ramp up, but I could see myself marrying her at one point. Unfortunately, the differences started to rack up though, and I just couldn't see a way forward. The differences got to be more and more apparent, she saw them and I did, even though we didn't want to admit it. Ultimately we are just too far apart to reconcile them I think. Shame, I do care about her a lot, on some level i do love her, she is an extremely kind and caring woman. I think we will remain great friends, we just aren't made to be together like that. We have come together, shared our concerns, and agreed it would be better to just be friends in the future.

New girl, well, the jury is still out. She seems pretty awesome. We have had a great time together. I like her. She doesn't seem to have any big red flags. We spent basically Saturday through today together (aside from work). She made it clear to me that she doesn't warm up easily, and she has been told she has issues with showing affection. So far I can see it, but that's ok with me. She laughs at me because she can tell I really like her, and she finds it cute. She says she likes me as a person but still needs to get to know me. I am OK with that too, I know everyone isn't as crazy as me. We agreed to slow it down a bit and do our own thing for a few days. We may see each other again on Sunday. Im not ready to say anything about a future with her, but on initial assessment, we have a ton in common, I find her extremely attractive, she finds me attractive, and we have a lot of fun together. That is enough for me, for now. I hope things continue to develop, and who knows what the future may hold.

Im 38, and never been much of a dater. Ultimately I am looking for someone I can connect with and eventually marry. That said, I feel like im pretty particular in who I chose to actually see. I rule out dozens of potential interests (chat, text, phone calls, etc) Maybe my vetting process is strong? I feel like I can make a pretty good call on whether or not I will have a connection with someone before I actually even see them. I feel like, out of the 3 serious dates now that I have went on, I have gotten really lucky (or unlucky depending on how you look at it), and have had sparks. If I would have went out with everyone that showed interest, I seriously doubt that number would be much higher, if at all.

Look, I have no clue what im doing. I'm just putting myself out there and looking for Ms. Right...I wear my heart on my sleeve, and am an extremely honest, forthright person. You know where I am at, at all times. No games, very few filters, etc. I'm sure I'm doing this completely wrong, but, so far I've enjoyed all of it. The fun, the pain, the excitement, the anticipation...it feels good to live again honestly.

I want to find something or someone that lasts and that I really feel like I can be myself with. That's really it.

May 20, 2016

Anyone ever dated someone that has trouble showing affection? Girl I recently started seeing had told me from the get go that she is usually pretty slow to warm up and show affection. We have been hanging out quite a bit and have been having a really good time, but she can be kind of reserved and cold sometimes. I am not putting a whole lot of weight into it, its only been a couple of weeks. She has expressly said she really enjoys spending time with me and she does like me, but holding hands, arms around each other, kissing, etc only comes if or when I initiate it. I can tell she kind of feels bad, and when I step back and give her space that I feel like she is asking for, she typically responds by sending me a sweet text, or saying something to reassure me. I just really think she has some hang ups on affection based on her past experience, and that is totally OK.

I am OK with this for now. I am hoping that when or if she warms up finally, she will be more affectionate. My question is, for now, how do I approach it? I can be very affectionate; I prefer it actually. Do I hold back and match her level, or do I just continue to be me and let her step back if she feels like she needs to?

This is one of the more normal girls I have met in ages, we are extremely compatible on a lot of levels. This is one that I feel like could be an issue if we don't manage it correctly, and I don't want to do it wrong.

Thoughts?

May 20, 2016

It depends how important her imitating is to you.

When you do initiate does she remain cold or is she receptive to your touch?

Personally, I'm an extremely affectionate person and I need a partner to be the same, both giving and receiving affection especially having been married to a man who wasn't. I thought I could deal with my ex not being that way but in the end I came realize I'm just not built like him and need to be shown I'm loved as much as told I'm loved. That's just me tho.

May 20, 2016

It's one thing to say "This, this and this is a problem for me", but it's quite another to voice it as an issue, and expect you to accept it, hands down, no questions asked.

What is her reasoning behind her reticence?

Is there an underlying cause?

If it needs addressing through counselling, would she be willing to work on it?

It takes effort to overcome a potential deal-breaker. And in my eyes, from my PoV, this could be one....

Would she make that effort?

Is she worth asking?

May 20, 2016

Anyone ever dated someone that has trouble showing affection? Girl I recently started seeing had told me from the get go that she is usually pretty slow to warm up and show affection. We have been hanging out quite a bit and have been having a really good time, but she can be kind of reserved and cold sometimes. I am not putting a whole lot of weight into it, its only been a couple of weeks. She has expressly said she really enjoys spending time with me and she does like me, but holding hands, arms around each other, kissing, etc only comes if or when I initiate it. I can tell she kind of feels bad, and when I step back and give her space that I feel like she is asking for, she typically responds by sending me a sweet text, or saying something to reassure me. I just really think she has some hang ups on affection based on her past experience, and that is totally OK.

Thoughts?

WWguy, I will be honest with you.

I have dated guys and felt the same. Reserved, guarded, some would even say a bit cold.

However, in retrospect I just wasn't all that into those guys, because I later learned when I was very into a guy, I was basically all over him.

Couldn't keep my hands off him! Warm and affectionate.

You can take from that what you will, but that was my experience.

Edited May 20, 2016 by katiegrl

May 20, 2016

WWguy, I will be honest with you.

I have dated guys and felt the same. Reserved, guarded, some would even say a bit cold.

However, in retrospect I just wasn't all that into those guys, because I later learned when I was very into a guy, I was basically all over him.

Couldn't keep my hands off him! Warm and affectionate.

You can take from that what you will, but that was my experience.

Well this is part of my concern too, and its obviously fine if she just isn't in to me, sometimes that happens. The thing is, she says the opposite. Sometimes when she is on, she is REALLY on and things get kind of crazy...but most of the time she is just kind of aloof and disinterested, or at least comes across that way.

She says this is just how she is, and it has been a problem for her in past relationships. Some guys can't deal with the fact that she takes a while to warm up and connect. She warned me from the get go. She has had some really bad dating experiences, lost her father at a young age, tragically, her sister died suddenly as well...so a lot of things probably built this into her. I think she is a really great woman, and I would like to make it past this...im hoping that with time, she does open up more.

I can tell she tries to connect in her way, and I find it extremely endearing, but its still different to get used to. She also talks a lot about having a future with me, she always asks me over, wants to spend time with me, etc. so her signs say she is interested, but she is also very reserved in ways other women I have been with aren't.

Part of me says I need to not reward her aloofness with my affection and only show affection when she shows it first. That isn't me though, so the other part of me says be yourself and just be patient while she comes around. I also don't want to annoy her with my affection either. I know she would say lets just be ourselves and have fun, stop analyzing everything...so that's what I try to do right now.

We're supposed to spend the weekend together (she asked me to come stay with her) and I plan on bringing it up if the time is right.

May 20, 2016

Reserved is one thing, and emotionally unavailable is another.

If she is naturally reserved, she might warm up over time, but if she's emotionally unavailable, thats a bigger problem.

May 21, 2016

I was that woman who had trouble showing affection with my ex, and I think I will with my next significant other, to be totally honest. It sucks because then the person you are dating thinks you aren't into them when that's totally not the case.

I was raised in a household with my single mom, grandmother & uncle. My uncle never showed affection towards me, but both my mom & grandmother did.

Then my mom got married and her husband NEVER showed her affection. So I never really learned until later, how important showing affection to a significant other really is.

With my ex, I made it a point to tell him I was really into him even if I had trouble showing it. When he was affectionate with me, I DID reciprocate, but the reciprocation took a little time.

So please, please don't give up on this girl yet.

May 21, 2016

I was that woman who had trouble showing affection with my ex, and I think I will with my next significant other, to be totally honest. It sucks because then the person you are dating thinks you aren't into them when that's totally not the case.

I was raised in a household with my single mom, grandmother & uncle. My uncle never showed affection towards me, but both my mom & grandmother did.

Then my mom got married and her husband NEVER showed her affection. So I never really learned until later, how important showing affection to a significant other really is.

With my ex, I made it a point to tell him I was really into him even if I had trouble showing it. When he was affectionate with me, I DID reciprocate, but the reciprocation took a little time.

So please, please don't give up on this girl yet.

Interesting philosophical point:

Initially, we become what we see, what is modelled for us, but later we become what we do.

That popped into my consciousness one day, and I consider it to be true.

Edited May 21, 2016 by Satu

May 21, 2016

its only been a couple of weeks.

A COUPLE OF WEEKS!!! why is she not hanging on you like a cheap sweater???

seriously, tho- Some people just weren't raised to be physically affectionate. I know I wasn't. I wasn't raised in a family that hugged and kissed. To this day, I rarely initiate a hug with a friend. I don't mind if they come in to hug me, but unless I am VERY close to this person, I do not even think to hug them.

That said, once I am very comfortable with a significant other, I can be very affectionate. Even so, my last boyfriend, who was VERY touchy-feely, often complained it seemed like I wasn't very physically affectionate with him. The thing is- I never thought I wasn't...what that teaches me is that everyone has their own comfort level of what feels 'normal.' No other boyfriend has complained about this, however.

Your original post could've been written about me. I do not get touchy-feely until I'm super into a guy, and probably after we've slept together. That's just how I operate.

The fact that she is super open with you about it, and has spoken to you about it rationally tells me that you are not going to have problems with her. You need to either decide to be patient, or move on if you really crave lots of touching in the initial stages of dating...

If it were me, I'd be ok with the guy I like initiating touching, but he needs to understand I might not be reciprocating totally. Like, I had a date play with my hand recently, and I literally didn't know what to do with myself...I really felt nothing, even though I was into him...it's just to me, I barely know this guy. so even if there is attraction, it still seemed weird and unnatural to me. I didn't mind it, so I didn't stop it...but I also wasn't super into it. now if i were in love with the guy, or elated from hot sex with the guy, then i'd be all about touching him all the time....see the difference?

So if you are asking what you should do, go ahead and touch her how you normally want to, but explicitly have a conversation before hand and tell her to stop you if she ever feels uncomfortable and that you won't judge her for it. done and done.

but 'future' talk after A COUPLE OF WEEKS of dating???

...are we just letting that hang there? that's pretty extreme, and to me, you totally buried the lead.

May 21, 2016

A COUPLE OF WEEKS!!! why is she not hanging on you like a cheap sweater???

seriously, tho- Some people just weren't raised to be physically affectionate. I know I wasn't. I wasn't raised in a family that hugged and kissed. To this day, I rarely initiate a hug with a friend. I don't mind if they come in to hug me, but unless I am VERY close to this person, I do not even think to hug them.

That said, once I am very comfortable with a significant other, I can be very affectionate. Even so, my last boyfriend, who was VERY touchy-feely, often complained it seemed like I wasn't very physically affectionate with him. The thing is- I never thought I wasn't...what that teaches me is that everyone has their own comfort level of what feels 'normal.' No other boyfriend has complained about this, however.

Your original post could've been written about me. I do not get touchy-feely until I'm super into a guy, and probably after we've slept together. That's just how I operate.

The fact that she is super open with you about it, and has spoken to you about it rationally tells me that you are not going to have problems with her. You need to either decide to be patient, or move on if you really crave lots of touching in the initial stages of dating...

If it were me, I'd be ok with the guy I like initiating touching, but he needs to understand I might not be reciprocating totally. Like, I had a date play with my hand recently, and I literally didn't know what to do with myself...I really felt nothing, even though I was into him...it's just to me, I barely know this guy. so even if there is attraction, it still seemed weird and unnatural to me. I didn't mind it, so I didn't stop it...but I also wasn't super into it. now if i were in love with the guy, or elated from hot sex with the guy, then i'd be all about touching him all the time....see the difference?

So if you are asking what you should do, go ahead and touch her how you normally want to, but explicitly have a conversation before hand and tell her to stop you if she ever feels uncomfortable and that you won't judge her for it. done and done.

but 'future' talk after A COUPLE OF WEEKS of dating???

...are we just letting that hang there? that's pretty extreme, and to me, you buried the lead.

I agree it's early. But if they feel connected and see a future, why not

May 21, 2016

It sounds like it just doesn't come natural for her to initiate a lot of physical contact. If that is something that really bothers you then it could be a problem down the road but it would be a much bigger deal if she was uncomfortable with YOU initiating contact. Maybe it will get better with time and if it doesn't, you can make the choice then whether it is a problem. My family isn't big on hugs and when I was young initiating physical contact was completely unnatural to me. But when I discovered how crucial this was to develop any relationships with women I started doing it constantly while dating and now enjoy being a super touchy feely guy.

May 21, 2016

This sounds pretty much like my problem atm. The last 2 girls I was with were super touchy-feely and did all the work in terms of initiating physical contact. Then I thought that's how most girls were, but reading this post made me realize it's not uncommon for girls to seem un-affectionate but still like you.

I think the fact you two have very open communication means it should work out.

May 21, 2016

I agree it's early. But if they feel connected and see a future, why not

maybe i'm just cynical, or maybe it's cause it takes me a while to fall in love...i thought that most people thought of it as a red flag if someone was so into talking about a future together after a few dates?

pretty sure there was a post i came across recently where a girl said a guy asked her for exclusivity on the 5th date...i think the commenters were 50/50 on whether this was a good idea or not.

May 23, 2016

When do you typically bring up the exclusivity talk? Should you bring it up, or just let things develop naturally?

I am, admittedly, bad at dating. I usually fall quickly and move fast. It has been to my own detriment twice so far. I am trying, with my new relationship, to let things develop organically at a natural pace. So far, they have gone really well. Still pretty fast, but I don't think either of us feel it has been forced.

We have spent multiple nights together, had sex a handful of times, been on about 4 real dates and a few other "hang out" type dates. Do you think im out of line for considering bringing up exclusivity at this point?

I personally am not dating anyone else. I decided a couple of dates in that I wanted to just focus on her, as I enjoyed spending time with her. I tried dating multiple people before, and it was too stressful and expensive. I haven't told her that I would expect her to do the same. I haven't expected her to do the same, but I have a feeling she isn't seeing anyone else either. We've spent plenty of time together, i'm not sure when she would have had time. I would like to think, especially since we are already sexually intimate, that she has decided to not see anyone else, but I know you should never assume.

We have been seeing each other for about 2.5 weeks, spending a ton of time together. Do you think I should bring up exclusivity, or just let it go a while and see what happens? I'm leaning on waiting a couple of more weeks, to about a month in, and then talking about it. We have plans to go out of town on the 3rd of June, which would be a month for us. I thought that it would be a good time to have the talk, perhaps?

Edited May 23, 2016 by WhirlwindGuy

May 23, 2016

I approach exclusivity between 3 to 5 dates. Never any longer especially if we are intimate.

May 23, 2016

I think that sounds like a good plan.

If it makes you feel any better, my boyfriend and I just clicked in a way in which things moved quickly early on. About a week and a half in, we went exclusive and deactivated our OLD profiles, and two weeks in was the first boyfriend/girlfriend label. Some people might think that's too fast, but it just seemed right for us, and we'll be celebrating our first anniversary and moving in together next month, so...things seem to be moving along just fine.

May 23, 2016

I think if you both feel very comfortable with eachother that you don't even have to talk about the exclusivity.

In my past I've had a couple of FWB, it was allways clear that we could do whatever we wanted. But one day I started a FWB with a girl and after 6 months we did not have any sex with another person from the very beginning of our FWB.

So I think that if everything is allright, it is very easy to not feel the need to date or have sex with another person.

May 23, 2016

I approach exclusivity between 3 to 5 dates. Never any longer especially if we are intimate.

If you are sexually active with someone forget about letting things develop organically. You first need to be safe. If you and her are having sex with 2 other partner and those are also having sex with 2 other partners at the end having sex with this 1 woman is like having sex with 36 people.

May 23, 2016

I approach exclusivity between 3 to 5 dates. Never any longer especially if we are intimate.

I guess this is where things get muddy for us. I kind of had the same idea, but we've done a lot of "multi day" type dates.

For instance...

I came over Friday this weekend and just left this morning. We have plans to hang out again Wednesday. Friday through Monday...1 date? 4? We went out twice, stayed in all day Saturday and watched movies in bed...

I guess when you do things a little unorthodox, it confuses things a bit maybe.

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