Pumping the Brakes [updated]

March 28, 2016

I am at somewhat of an crossroads in my relationship and I am looking for some advice.

I am dating a woman who is of vastly different culture and beliefs than I am. She is Muslim, I am not. She is somewhat liberal in her religious views, and I am not very religious at all. That has been our biggest hurdle really. This has lead to her family not approving of me, and our dating life to be kind of done in secret, almost as if we are teenagers again (I am 38, she is 35).

We also both have some baggage, if you will. I am recently divorced with an 8 year old child and big child support and student loan payment every month. This limits my financial mobility quite a bit, but I make due with the limitations fairly well I think. She is a recent graduate from dental school with some astronomical student loan bills. This limits her financial mobility quite a bit.

She kind of broke down the other day, and most of it revolved around money and the future. She basically told me she doesn't think that I am able to support her financially, and that I cant provide for a family, given my situation. She eventually wants to cut back on work and raise kids etc. She wants a big house, vacations, etc. I guess she wants her husband to do all that for her, and handle her big student loan bills as well.

I am more along the lines of, I just want to find someone I click with, fall in love with, and let the chips fall where they may. I could be ok living in an apartment for a while, building back up, etc.

We came to a head Friday and I basically told her, I want the same things she wants ultimately, I just am more realistic on how to get there. I know it will take work and take time. I told her that I am who I am, she knows that, I have not hidden anything from her. She can either accept it and agree to work on it with me, or she can move on and try to find a rich man that may be able to provide the things for her that she wants. After a tearful conversation, she told me that she really wants to work on things with me and for us to work together to be happy. She ultimately just wants to know that I am willing to work too, and that I want the same things she wants.

We hugged it out, agreed it will be a challenge, but that we can try our best and see what happens.

I have been contemplating now all weekend if I have made the right choice. I feel like there is a high possibility that I will be put in the spotlight here and criticized in the future if I don't "provide" like she wants. I make pretty good money, close to 120K a year. I have to take care of my son, and my bills too. that stuff makes the 120k a year look like an average salary after a while. Do I want to constantly feel the pressure from her if she is earning more than me, and feeling like im not working hard enough?

I am not sure this is the right thing for me at this point. I want it to be different, I want her to love me for me, not anything else...right now it feels like that may not be the case. Am I overreacting? Should I give it a chance and see what happens? Should I cut her loose and find someone that isn't so high maintenance?

Advice?

March 28, 2016

I'm being real when I say this.. it sounds like she already has someone lined up that makes more money than you but she has feelings for you, 10-1 she has an orbiter that has peaked her interest.

The religious difference is a toughie and it will never be resolved as it is her beliefs and will rear it's head when raising a child comes into play.

How do you feel about her comments about you not going to be able to support her, nice house etc. etc..?.. to me that was a big punch...

March 28, 2016

Your $120k isn't enough to provide her with the lifestyle that she wants. You probably need more like $300k.

What level of income did her parents provide for her growing up? Did her mom stay home or is she a professional? More than likely, her family has been jumping on her head over your relationship and have gotten to her.

I say cut her loose--you have way too many hurdles already in your relationship that are not going anywhere. The whole culture thing notwithstanding, she's got a style of living to which she is either accustomed or she feels entitled. If you have of a laissez-faire way of looking at your future and she's wanting details and plans right now, then that speaks to a fundamental lifestyle compatibility issue that cannot be ignored.

March 28, 2016

Well, as the title of your thread suggests, this relationship is already doomed. So the question is, do you really have anything to gain by staying longer in it?

Religion and family approval would already be major obstacles to overcome. This new issue that has come up is the final nail in the coffin. I don't even understand why she would be dating you if these are her goals in life. Is this a new relationship by any chance?

She sounds a bit unrealistic, to be honest. Why did she even bother to study dentistry and amass huge amounts of debt if she didn't really plan on practicing and just wanted a rich husband? Also, given that she wants kids, when she says that "eventually" she wants to stay home and raise them, at 35 that probably means "pretty soon". Just something to keep in mind.

March 28, 2016

How do you feel about her comments about you not going to be able to support her, nice house etc. etc..?.. to me that was a big punch...

I agree, I was pretty offended at first, but its a valid concern I think. She just put it very bluntly. For me, you love first and figure that stuff out second. She is just being practical in her thinking I guess.

March 28, 2016

Well, as the title of your thread suggests, this relationship is already doomed. So the question is, do you really have anything to gain by staying longer in it?

Religion and family approval would already be major obstacles to overcome. This new issue that has come up is the final nail in the coffin. I don't even understand why she would be dating you if these are her goals in life. Is this a new relationship by any chance?

She sounds a bit unrealistic, to be honest. Why did she even bother to study dentistry and amass huge amounts of debt if she didn't really plan on practicing and just wanted a rich husband? Also, given that she wants kids, when she says that "eventually" she wants to stay home and raise them, at 35 that probably means "pretty soon". Just something to keep in mind.

We are about 5 months in, so fairly new. I agree she is unrealistic. It is a product of basically being sheltered and catered to her whole life. She has a very "teenager" idealistic view of how her life should be. It is going to take someone earning 300K plus to give her the lifestyle she wants. There aren't many of those guys around here, not to mention that are single, never been married, or not complete *******s.

I have the potential to make 300k at a later stage in my career, if promotions go how I intend, but that is not guaranteed, and it will be 5 to 7 years before that is remotely possible.

Edited March 28, 2016 by WhirlwindGuy

March 28, 2016

I have the potential to make 300k at a later stage in my career, if promotions go how I intend, but that is not guaranteed, and it will be 5 to 7 years before that is remotely possible.

And you know what, that shouldn't even be a thing that factors into your thoughts about this relationship.

She wants the high life? Then she can provide it for herself. The idea that she is studying for a professional career, only to cut back on it and focus on raising kids when she's ALREADY 35 is crazy. She has five, six years tops to crack on with starting a family, and that's not necessarily going to be easy. I'd be surprised if that's her goal if she even bothers to work once she's qualified.

You deserve a relationship with someone who loves you and feels grateful to be in your life, where you can build each other up, support one another, feel fortunate that you've found love and tackle the hurdles that life throws at you together. She's basically saying 'if you won't/can't push yourself to earn even more than you already are, to bankroll my lifestyle, you're not going to live up to my expectations'. Some women are just like that, but you don't sound like you're the kind of guy who wants that. I can't imagine how ANYONE would want that, but she's free to go and find someone who does... good luck doing that in the next few years that she's fertile!

You don't want the same things in life.

March 28, 2016

And you know what, that shouldn't even be a thing that factors into your thoughts about this relationship.

She wants the high life? Then she can provide it for herself. The idea that she is studying for a professional career, only to cut back on it and focus on raising kids when she's ALREADY 35 is crazy. She has five, six years tops to crack on with starting a family, and that's not necessarily going to be easy. I'd be surprised if that's her goal if she even bothers to work once she's qualified.

You deserve a relationship with someone who loves you and feels grateful to be in your life, where you can build each other up, support one another, feel fortunate that you've found love and tackle the hurdles that life throws at you together. She's basically saying 'if you won't/can't push yourself to earn even more than you already are, to bankroll my lifestyle, you're not going to live up to my expectations'. Some women are just like that, but you don't sound like you're the kind of guy who wants that. I can't imagine how ANYONE would want that, but she's free to go and find someone who does... good luck doing that in the next few years that she's fertile!

You don't want the same things in life.

this is kind of how I have been feeling, and its disappointing. I had much higher hopes for this one.

I think ive decided to give it a shot and the next time she feels like breaking down or making me feel like im not pulling my weight, im going to cut it off. Hopefully that wont happen.

March 28, 2016

She's not being unrealistic, for these are her goals. To YOU they are unrealistic because of your position. You both have you head in the clouds thinking this is going to work out somehow like her making the compromise....the reality is that ain't going to happen. She has her priorities, and she is going to expect a miracle from you.

Best of luck.

March 28, 2016

She's not being unrealistic, for these are her goals. To YOU they are unrealistic because of your position. You both have you head in the clouds thinking this is going to work out somehow like her making the compromise....the reality is that ain't going to happen. She has her priorities, and she is going to expect a miracle from you.

Best of luck.

I understand what you are saying, but this also assumes people don't change, learn, or modify their behavior or ideas.

I understand they are her goals, but I could have goals to only marry a billionaire super model. While sure, they are my goals, they aren't realistic.

March 28, 2016

I agree with Smackie.

She is going to be expecting a miracle (an on-going, ever-increasing, ever-lasting sort of miracle). Or so it sounds from what you've written.

She doesn't so much want a partner with an income of $300K, as she wants a partner with $300K/year this year, increasing by 5% to 15% per year moving forward.

You're not that dude, and she's likely to be consistently disappointed with you over the coming years/decades if you stay together. If that's workable for you, have at it.

This ended my second marriage. A disappointment for us both.

Wish I'd listened more closely before getting engaged. ..... but then again, I learned a lot after it was all over.

April 5, 2016

Girlfriend and I had a "moment" a week ago or so now, and I am having a hard time putting it behind me.

Ill start off saying there have been minor things that have been digging at me for a while now, and I am trying to just see them as differences and things we can ultimately overcome. She loves to "play mommy" to me. Basically telling me how i'm doing things wrong, and how I should be doing them better. Clean up better, arrange my fridge better, budget better, have certain accoutrements around my apartment that she likes and I frankly don't care about. To me, these are just differences in our styles, and I can adapt somewhat...she doesn't seem that willing to accept that she is in my house, and to respect how I decide to live. I am by no means a slob, in fact quite the opposite, I just value certain things differently than she does. She sees the fact that I decide to spend a little more on dry cleaning because its close to my apartment as being dumb with my money, when she gets 40 dollar massages 2 or 3 times a week and I think that is a waste.

Last week she was feeling down, upset about money, etc. I was trying to be supportive and I told her that perhaps we should scale down, move in together into a smaller apartment, get rid of one of her cars, cut way back on bills for a year or so to save up and slow down. If we did that for a year, we could have enough money saved up to get a nice place.

She kind of flipped out on me, telling me that she has worked too hard to live like a student, etc etc. Basically the crux of her argument was that she wants a man who can come in and take care of her, let her slow down with work and have kids. After some back and forth a while she told me, verbatim, "You have nothing to offer but your love, and I don't know if that is enough for me!" "You're a divorced father with a lot on your plate, and you aren't ready to provide for a family!"

Whoa...I ended the conversation there and decided to step back and think about it. When we finally met and talked through this, I had some things to say. For one, I have been providing EVERYTHING for our relationship since the day we met. I have paid for all meals except maybe 2. I bought her a 500 dollar pair of Gucci sunglasses, a Tiffany bracelet for Valentines day. I took her to two NBA games with great seats. We went to Vegas on my dime, she paid for nothing. We went to the beach a few times, condos, I paid for it. I paid one of her bills one month because she was strapped and I could tell she was stressed.

After all of this, she is going to tell me I am the one that can't afford to provide. All I can provide is love...F that...That is downright insulting.

She of course was just freaking out, she didn't mean it that way, and was basically saying she is just worried that we don't make enough money to pay for our bills and live the life she wants to live (big house, cars, vacations etc.). We make plenty of money, she has a lot of student loan debt and I have a child support payment.

Basically though, after that outburst from her, I have been rethinking things quite a bit. That really caused me to hit the brakes and even reverse some. She has felt it I think, and has kind of hit the gas on her end. She has stayed with me for the past 4 nights in a row, and she has never done that before. She is doing a lot of future planning all of the sudden.

I am not sure what to do honestly. I am feeling like this is probably not the right situation or either of us. I want it to be, I really do, but I'm worried about what's going to happen once things really get real. I've decided to slow way down and let her show me something. If she has another one of these outbursts, I am completely done. I wont be disrespected like that again, especially after all I've done. Am I just prolonging the inevitable?

Right now, I almost feel like I just want to be single again for a while and reassess what the hell I am doing.

April 5, 2016

"You have nothing to offer but your love, and I don't know if that is enough for me!"

OMG, my heart dropped when I read that. Wow! just ...wow! Who does she think she is!

I don't see how you can continue in a relationship with this woman. Let her find herself the man that will give her the wallet of her dream.

April 5, 2016

I'm having a hard time getting over it too. I understand money freak outs, and am trying to give her the benefit of the doubt, but that was completely uncalled for.

It sucks too, I had high hopes for this one. Now I feel like I'm already detached and just here for the good sex, until I figure out what else to do. I'm hoping I can ultimately come back, but I feel angry around her now.

April 5, 2016

How long have you been dating?

Some things just cannot be patched up. Yes you can glue back a broken vase but it will always remain a broken vase.

April 5, 2016

This is the woman with the rich dad, correct? I suspect she grew up with certain expectations that you're unlikely to be able to fulfill. Maybe this was a one-off on her part, but I think she revealed what she really thought about your financial situation, even though that situation seems reasonably and objectively pretty good.

Frankly, even the "mommying" standing alone would be enough for me to have second thoughts. Most healthy adults would decline to be somebody else's project.

April 5, 2016

You will be better off without her. She might try to put up a front from now to erase what she has said ( and meant ). Once you are married etc. , she might force you to cut down on your child support etc. by becoming pregnant herself.

Be careful, dont get her pregnant.

This one is gold digger. I dont blame you for being with one. Hard to find one who is not, these days !

April 5, 2016

Sounds like she likes to control while telling you that you'll never be enough.

April 5, 2016

She resents the fact that you have already gotten married and had a baby and took those steps without her I think.

She looks down on you and it's pretty apparent. Yuck.

April 5, 2016

Am I just prolonging the inevitable?

In my opinion - Yes.

My opinion is based on my second wife divorcing me because I didn't make enough money for her peace of mind and satisfaction. Although I did make more while we were married than I did when we were dating. If it's not enough now, it will not be enough ever.

Consider this - what happens when things get Worse financially? Everyone has hiccups. If she's feeling discontent at this level, plan on an ugly disappointment when your life gets harder and then she dumps you just when you're feeling down and could use some support.

Right now, I almost feel like I just want to be single again for a while and reassess what the hell I am doing.

Good idea.

April 5, 2016

Sounds like she likes to control while telling you that you'll never be enough.

I agree with Boomerangmagnet here -

my painful experience taught me that a person who sees you as the solution to their problems, will always mentally & emotionally tie you to any problems in their life.

They don't see themselves as the one responsible to build their own solution. They can create or "discover" new problems indefinitely, and it's your job to soothe the problems away, or else you are defective.

Yuck. . . and, it's an unending, repetitive system. (In my experience)

April 5, 2016

After all of this, she is going to tell me I am the one that can't afford to provide. All I can provide is love...F that...That is downright insulting.

You know you read some of these threads and of course we all have that initial reaction of shock and saying “oh hell no, I would not tolerate that crap!”

Then yes we reply because many think that there is a cookie cutter solution to the OP’s issue.

While I am giving an opinion, it’s just that… but I have never been with a woman like you are describing, now let me be clear I make a decent living so well off all is relative.

I make a moderate income, but have no debt of any kind, so I’m cool. I mention because a good number I have dated make more than I do and money is the last thing on their mind.

If you have a woman who is educated and successful and independent these type of conversations never come up.

She of course was just freaking out, she didn't mean it that way, and was basically saying she is just worried that we don't make enough money to pay for our bills and live the life she wants to live (big house, cars, vacations etc.). We make plenty of money, she has a lot of student loan debt and I have a child support payment.

The above paragraph is far more concerning to me, there is this quote I got a long time ago “words mean things” and guy once those words come out you can’t take them back EVER. I’m sorry but she crossed the line.

I am feeling like this is probably not the right situation or either of us.

No, it is NOT

Right now, I almost feel like I just want to be single again for a while and reassess what the hell I am doing.

If you are here to have someone tell you that things will be cool, then whoever would tell you that is not thinking or using logic or basic reasoning.

WWG I can assure you there is so many good, caring, financially independent women with solid careers who just want an honest, attentive dude.

These days women are becoming more and more successful, more are attending college than guys there is no need (no matter how hot she might be) to suffer through the company of some selfish self-absorbed woman.

But more importantly don’t or stop making excuses for her.

April 5, 2016

You really do need to take a huge leap backwards. Anyone who can draw breath and form their mouth to tell you that all you have to provide is love needs to be booted out of your life, especially in light of how much you have paid for her in the past year. She's an ingrate and if you make the abysmal mistake of ignoring that and trying to move your life forward to cohabit with her, you are going to be miserable within 6 months and it will cost a pound of flesh for you to get out of it.

She did you a huge favor by letting you see exactly who and what she is. If you ignore this, you do so at your own emotional and financial peril.

April 5, 2016

Ok, let me play Devil's Advocate here. I'm not excusing what she said; however, she clearly wants a lifestyle that you can't provide for her. I doubt that she's going to get used to what you can afford. Why she doesn't leave is kind of a mystery.

April 5, 2016

I'm having a hard time getting over it too. I understand money freak outs, and am trying to give her the benefit of the doubt, but that was completely uncalled for.

It sucks too, I had high hopes for this one. Now I feel like I'm already detached and just here for the good sex, until I figure out what else to do. I'm hoping I can ultimately come back, but I feel angry around her now.

Unfortunately, this is how she's wired -- she's entitled. This isn't just a one off. And being with someone that's constantly picking at me would get old really fast.

Seems tolerable now but I can't imagine how your life would be married with kids. This should be an eye-opening preview.

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Pumping the Brakes [updated]

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