Flakiness is a defining feature of Millennials/Generation Y?

April 5, 2016

I'm flaky. I don't know what it is but having constant access to technology is something I find very stressful. So I periodically freak out and ignore the phone for a while. But communicating in person is fine for me. I just freak out at the thought of texting. Because my smartphone is with me all the time, I feel that there is pressure for me to be available at all times and sometimes I can't deal with it. I also feel that that pressure isn't always imagined because I think some genuinely do expect you to get back to them on their timetable.

I'm a girl scout so when I am away on camps in remote places with no phone connection, I find it so easy and liberating and it really gives me a sense of inner calm because I know that even if I wanted to, I wouldn't be able to communicate with the outside world.

Case in point! One other colleague and I were without cell phones. The colleague finally bought one.

My boss made the most evil face, like something from a movie and said, "Now it doesn't matter where he is... I can get him."

Boss is in his 60s, so expectations of availability isn't just among millennials. Millennials are just the first to grow up with it.

I find it strange, too, how quickly older generations seem aghast when I tell them I don't have a phone. "But what would you DO?!?!?!" (if XYZ)

I don't know... whatever you did?!?! WHATEVER MY ANCESTORS DID DURING THE 1980s! Walk! Enjoy a quiet night! Ahhhhh!!!! (now I'm ranting )

Now add the stress of five people texting/calling/wanting information/your time/your energy, all with the expectation you'll be instantly available no matter what...

It's precisely that pressure that makes people *ghost*, I'd wager.

I was actually chatting with a guy a few months ago who is probably your age group, 25, and he was telling me about the constant texts/emails/chats. He apologised for not responding to me immediately when he was out. I was like I'm 43, we are not married/dating/etc why would he respond straight away?

Why is it if it's overwhelming that you simply don't limit the applications you use and opt out of push messages on your smart phone? That's what I do.

Is there pressure to be on the latest social media app?

April 5, 2016

The impression I get is not so much maliciousness as a core value difference and lack of comprehension of what traditional accountability means. So it's not so much "I said I'd meet Jen at 7 but I don't give a damn about the time," moreso "I know we said we'd meet at 7 and it's 8:10 now, what's the problem?"

Why is that you think? Is that an age thing, being older/wiser or do you think values are changing in a way that they will stick around as the person ages?

April 5, 2016

It could be that, because of growing up in the instant information and communication age, they don't feel that being physically present is that important since they're virtually present 24/7. Perhaps that old adage 'I'll be late for my own funeral' has no meaning anymore.

About the only thing that bugs me about the young adults I've hired is that they don't focus on their work, rather have their attachment to the instant communication network stuck to themselves and are always interfacing with it instead of solely on work. Generally, the only solution is firing them. They won't give it up and they don't care. OK. It is what it is. I'd rather hire an old guy who moves slower, brings the old metal lunch box, and focuses on work for 8. The old guys are usually safer too, not unimportant in my line of work. Kids think they're invincible.

April 5, 2016

I find it interesting that there is a term for it now -- ghosting -- when "ghosting" has always been something that happens.
I find it really fascinating. It seems so unhealthy.

Yeah there wasn't divorce court in the 1950s. It was, "Hey Baby, I'm going to run around the corner and get a pack of cigarettes." The guy would just leave under the ospices of getting cigarettes and never come back and leave the wife with their 3 or 4 children to fend for themselves. He would move 15-20 miles away and start a new life.

Now, it's a little harder to abandon people with the Internet. But there's always the choice to de-friend or block. So I guess Millennials aren't without a choice, but it is definitely harder when people are much more trackable.

April 5, 2016

Yeah there wasn't divorce court in the 1950s. It was, "Hey Baby, I'm going to run around the corner and get a pack of cigarettes." The guy would just leave under the ospices of getting cigarettes and never come back and leave the wife with their 3 or 4 children to fend for themselves. He would move 15-20 miles away and start a new life.

Now, it's a little harder to abandon people with the Internet. But there's always the choice to de-friend or block. So I guess Millennials aren't without a choice, but it is definitely harder when people are much more trackable.

Do you find that you have less privacy than you would like?

April 5, 2016

Why is that you think? Is that an age thing, being older/wiser or do you think values are changing in a way that they will stick around as the person ages?

I guess I don't know. I can't really verify if they grow out of it in a lot of cases, but again I can say that it doesn't quite manifest like with typical ppl who are just plain disrespectful of other people's time. It's really odd. Not to marginalize Y ppl but it's almost like trying to train a dog not to do sth when it just fundamentally doesn't understand what you want.

April 5, 2016

I guess I don't know. I can't really verify if they grow out of it in a lot of cases, but again I can say that it doesn't quite manifest like with typical ppl who are just plain disrespectful of other people's time. It's really odd. Not to marginalize Y ppl but it's almost like trying to train a dog not to do sth when it just fundamentally doesn't understand what you want.

Yeah, I have limited experience of this. Perhaps it's the result of looser boundaries with so many influences through social media.

April 5, 2016

Great question. See I'm not sure either way.

Its so much easier to ghost nowadays. I mean, back before the days of Caller ID and answering machines, you had someone's number meant that you could pretty much guarantee getting some sort of an interaction w the person if you were persistent enough (and didn't care about being a stalker), if only because they couldn't screen out your calls as they can nowadays w your calls/texts/fb messages.

So if people back in the day were less flakey, it could be that they knew they'd be held accountable back then in a way that they wouldn't have to deal w today. Nowadays you can simply screen out subsequent communication from the date you ghosted on, in a way you couldn't a generation or so ago.

People nowadays marry later too. So 40 years ago most 20-somethings were too busy w their families to even MAKE plans to flake on.

Edited April 5, 2016 by Imajerk17

April 5, 2016

Yes the journalist woman (who is 28 and posts about her dating experiences regularly) as well as others mention that flakiness could come from the ease of erasing people from your life.

It's interesting that so far some see modern life as having too much access in a detrimental way, others almost in a positive way in that it allows for more flexibility.

I think I might start leaning towards the thought that extroverted flakes have greater exposure perhaps.

April 5, 2016

No disagree, Gen X is different and specifically excluded.

I am not looking to discuss online dating but the Millennials experience in growing up in such a socially accessible and hectic environment.

Yeah, agree - I'm a Gen-xer and I would not say I grew up in this socially accessible world. I didn't really feel ultra- and overly-connected in the way we all are now until I was in my 30s, so it really was a different environment.

April 5, 2016

Well I know people from my age group are very flaky but I have no reference, I haven't experienced people from an older generation as thoroughly so I can't compare the degrees of flakiness.

I do know that at school timeliness is no longer taught as a virtue, and that they are not very strict about being on time any more... If you are too late with an assignment you just get a small penalty to your grade, my parents told me that if they were late with an assignment they got the lowest grade possible, even if it was just one hour late. That sort of mentality has had a pretty big influence I think.

April 5, 2016

Well I know people from my age group are very flaky but I have no reference, I haven't experienced people from an older generation as thoroughly so I can't compare the degrees of flakiness.
I do know that at school timeliness is no longer taught as a virtue, and that they are not very strict about being on time any more... If you are too late with an assignment you just get a small penalty to your grade, my parents told me that if they were late with an assignment they got the lowest grade possible, even if it was just one hour late. That sort of mentality has had a pretty big influence I think.

Very interesting, some parents might chime in.

I'm Eastern European and went to school during communist times so my point of reference is a little different - having grown up under a dictatorship

April 5, 2016

Why is it if it's overwhelming that you simply don't limit the applications you use and opt out of push messages on your smart phone? That's what I do.

Is there pressure to be on the latest social media app?

There totally is. I use Facebook, Twitter, Instagram which is a lot less than some of my friends. I have no interest in snapchat or taking selfies. But on online dating some men will ask me if I have KiK or Whatsapp but I can't be bothered downloading it. 'Why can't we just talk on the site?' I think. :S I hate that on Facebook it records when you have been online. Sometimes I see a message from someone and I'm unable to reply straight away then they will get mad at me because they know I have seen it and didn't reply straight away. I don't know but I just hate conducting friendships and dating online with messaging. I much prefer talking in person or on the phone.

Another thing that bugs me is when talking to someone via online dating, I'd rather the conversation was geared quickly towards a date but with some men, as soon as I reply they will start texting me asking what I'm doing on a certain day like "What have you been up to today?" and it's like "why are you treating me, a virtual stranger, like your online buddy?". I just find it kind of weird. So it tends to make me feel pressure because it's like I'm expected to develop some kind of online bond when all I'm interested in is meeting people to go on dates with and then take it from there.

April 5, 2016

Certainly have common ground with you when it comes to online dating. I find the familiarity of a stranger annoying, I dabbled in it again but gave up quickly. I MUCH prefer meeting men in real life because I screen out the pushy ones. That's definitely not a generational thing.

Regarding social media influences though: I think this will calm down. I read more and more about backlash against Tinder and conducting so much of life online. - from younger generation, I mean

April 5, 2016

Ever since I joined LoveShack I'm a total flake. It rules my life.

April 6, 2016

I always assume some in their early 20s are flakier because they don't know what it's like until it has happened to them a few times. Then most learn.

Has flakiness prevailed though and remained in people in their late 20s+?

I casually socialise at sport events with a younger crowd and I haven't noticed them being less reliable. I don't tend to make serious commitments with that age group though.

The problem with this worldly 28 year-old labeling all millennials as "flakes" is multifaceted. First, she has zero experience/empirical data to support her assertion; she has never met a 20 something Boomer or Gen X. She's basically arguing that compared to a 60 something Boomer or 40 something Gen X individual, a 20 something millennial is "flaker." Well, I'd definitely agree with her that 60 year-olds are generally more mature than 20 year-olds.

Second, how does being more connected make it easier to disappear? Up until the last 20 years, unless a person knew where you lived, you could literally avoid them like the plague. It was much harder to track someone's whereabouts in previous generations. If anything, it's much harder to dodge someone now than 50 years ago. Remember, when you had to carry a watch and meet people at preset times at designated landmarks?

Third, Boomers and Gen X individuals use social media too. So, if it was affecting 20 year-olds in negative ways wouldn't it affect 60 year-olds relatively? Why aren't they "flakes?" Does their social media-less upbringing protect their character when exposed to the same Facebook? Today, I saw many 50 years checking their phones in the middle of their nursing shifts at the same rate of those in their 20s.

Hmmmm, I'd say the author's opinion piece is just that -- an opinion. That opinion is more than likely supported with anecdotal reasoning and limited contact with those outside her young generation. Even then, she's comparing 60 year-old Boomers with 20 year-old millennials. In other words, what Mr. Lucky said.

Edited April 6, 2016 by OneLov

April 6, 2016

OP,

Check this out

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/23/opinion/sunday/social-networking-in-the-1600s.html?pagewanted=all&_r=1

Did you know back in the 1600s that coffee houses were destroying our society?

Or the number (no pun intended ) that telephones did on our great-great grandparents? I'm surprised the human race managed to survive .

But we did..... And we will ... At least for now. Lol.

But back to your question about privacy, I think you have the option to be less private but no one can force you to disclose information. I just think you have to be more aware that the information may reach far more individuals than you ever intended. But social media can't project your thoughts; it will only memorialize and project your voice.

April 6, 2016

Not sure what age or why, but flaking is like an epidemic. I thought it was due to the many options ladies seem to have, but I've read several threads from women complaining of the same thing. IDK........shrugs

I've tried OLD and its almost a sure thing. I stopped dating one on one, the traditional way and just started making my plans with friends and inviting. If they showed up cool, if not, it wouldn't put a hole in plans.

April 6, 2016

Yes the thread is purely based on opinions, I think even if we tried to define flakiness exactly we would struggle because everyone's views are slightly different.

I suppose the reason why her article grabbed me is that a) I know her work and she is very social and b) she is talking about her own generation.

I've been very keen to hear mostly from the 18-30 crowd for this reason, I wanted to hear their views and experiences as opposed to older generations judging them.

Thirdly, the difference between me (43 years old, Gen X) and a 28 year-old is that I know what it's like to fully function as an adult without social media. For a big chunk of my young life I wasn't constantly connected, I know how unimportant and meaningless it is ultimately. It's apparent from the thread I think that Millennials feel completely differently and that it's a constant source of anxiety.

That repeated exposure to YOLO has to affect you in a way that it didn't previous generations because they could get away from it. Now it's 24/7 marketing to make people feel bad about themselves if they aren't keeping up enough.

April 6, 2016

Ever since I joined LoveShack I'm a total flake. It rules my life.

I'm typing this in bed, haven't got up yet

April 6, 2016

I don't know how bad flakiness is when compared to previous generations but, from my experience, it is pretty bad to the point where you can't rely on many people.

I have had "friends" say they will pick me up and they never did. People who said they will come to an location to meet me and never happened. Even though it is on a smaller scale, I even ask for services and either they are late or doesn't show up.

It's bad enough that I have gotten used to doing things on my own. I would rather walk 6 miles round-trip to get to a place than call on someone to give me a ride there. My definition of "reliable" is simply too high for most people of my generation to meet......but then again, I would say the same to the previous generations as well so this is not strictly my generation's problem.

With that said, I am living in the lower-income areas. It is a possibility that I may find more trustworthy people in the middle-class or higher communities.

FYI: I am 29 years old.

April 6, 2016

I don't know how bad flakiness is when compared to previous generations but, from my experience, it is pretty bad to the point where you can't rely on many people.

I have had "friends" say they will pick me up and they never did. People who said they will come to an location to meet me and never happened. Even though it is on a smaller scale, I even ask for services and either they are late or doesn't show up.

It's bad enough that I have gotten used to doing things on my own. I would rather walk 6 miles round-trip to get to a place than call on someone to give me a ride there. My definition of "reliable" is simply too high for most people of my generation to meet......but then again, I would say the same to the previous generations as well so this is not strictly my generation's problem.

With that said, I am living in the lower-income areas. It is a possibility that I may find more trustworthy people in the middle-class or higher communities.

FYI: I am 29 years old.

Thank you for your perspective.

Do you and your friends try to keep up with whatever the latest thing is and perhaps often over commit?

April 6, 2016

Thank you for your perspective.

Do you and your friends try to keep up with whatever the latest thing is and perhaps often over commit?

I noticed from many people up to even the age of 50+ try to keep up with anything new that comes out. I work at Walmart and I see at least 30-40% of all customers I check out with the iPhone 6, for example. I don't see a lot of the newer model cars but, once again, I am in the lower-income areas so that isn't surprising. However, most people do have vehicles but that is basically a necessity down here in Jacksonville so that evens out a bit. I also noticed there is a lot of debt problems as well, which tells me they try to keep up with everyone else.

In my opinion, I feel it is like 60% who keeps up with the latest trends (and they are the most vocal so it feels even more than it really is) and the other 40% just doing what is best for them.

I fall in the latter. While I do have interest in the latest tech, I also don't do everything necessary to achieve it. Perhaps I should put more effort into it though.

April 6, 2016

In my opinion, I feel it is like 60% who keeps up with the latest trends (and they are the most vocal so it feels even more than it really is) and the other 40% just doing what is best for them.

I fall in the latter. While I do have interest in the latest tech, I also don't do everything necessary to achieve it. Perhaps I should put more effort into it though.

I don't know whether you should put more effort into it but I think you are right. A lot of noise from a relatively small majority.

April 6, 2016

I think some behaiviors that would be classified as "flakiness" pre-social media, are better interpreted as higher flexibility, made possible by the continuous communication that is thrust upon us by social media.

For example, lets consider the concept of being late. Before everyone had a cell phone, it was pretty important to show up at a pre-specified time. The consequences for being late were quite harsh- you risked not being able to find your friends. Today, timeliness is still valued, but there is more room for flexibility. Its possible to play things by ear more because it is so much easier to get in touch.

So, i think technology/ social media enables greater flexibility. This is not always bad, but it does IMO lead to such qualities as timeliness to decrease in importance.

On the other hand, the increased flexibility comes at a cost. You can expect others to be more accomodating to your last-minute updates, but those expectations work both ways. To manage the fluidity, communication is even more important. In my experience, millenials tend to be pretty responsive. Of course, older generations have had to adapt as well.

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Flakiness is a defining feature of Millennials/Generation Y?

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