Connect, disconnect, and reconnect.

[sjclsnb]

I been a long time observer on this forum and I figure I would register and look for advice on my current situation. I've known this girl for a long time, 8 or so years. She is a great girl, attractive, smart, a great mother to her 4 yr old, but alas she is very emotionally guarded. I met her when I became good friends with her mothers boyfriend, and I took a liking to her immediately but I never did anything about it, I was going through some personal issues with my parents divorce and didn't think she would go for someone like me. 2.5 years ago she gets ahold of me out of the blue and asks me to dinner. We go have a great time a week later completely ghosts. I figure that she just wasn't that into me, it happens. 3 months later gets ahold of me again and I spend the entire summer trying to get with this girl, nothing materializes, things go south we break all contact until the next spring. That time I wasn't playing any games, things go south rather quickly and again lose all contact. As you might have guessed she came back in early July, we meet up, have fun, make plans to go out again and she introduces me to her daughter. That was huge for me, she is very protective of who she introduces to her daughter. She is in the process of buying a house, and I was driving along one day and spotted a French horn at a garage sale, she is a huge fan of how I met your mother so I scooped it up and painted it blue and told her I had something for her when she gets her house. It's nothing major I spent 5 dollars on it and it to me was nothing more of a thoughtful friendly gesture, but I think it triggered the flight response in her. She has become very distant, ignores texts, refuses to make plans, and tells me we want different things. Now I've looked around enough on this site to know what most of you will say, don't think it hasn't dawned on me, but what I don't get is why she keeps trying to start something with me if she knows what I'm after? I will not settle for being her friend, ultimately I'm too attracted to her and see her in a different light. She had dated some real winners, like I said I've known her for awhile, and still has to maintain contact with daughters father who is an emotionally abusive jerk. I end up feeling so bad about myself for getting so frustrated with her, but I have to know that I'm not being played with. We have never been in a committed relationship with each other, we have not been intimate so you could say I've never really been hurt other than the thought of some failure on my part. I've tried seeing it her way, I've said everything I could think of to calm her fears, I've talked to her friends but it leads no where. Is she just broken beyond repair? Will she ever come out of it and fully believe that voice in her head that tells her to get a hold of me? Ultimately I think I'm what she has always looked for, decent guy, attractive, smart, stable well paying job. I just don't know, what are your thoughts?

[ExpatInItaly]

Are you sure she was ever interested in being more than friends?

 

Her pulling away and saying you want different things could be an indication that she doesn't want to take it further but senses that you do. Or, if things are bad with her ex, he could be making threats or pulling guilt trips if he knows she's been seeing you. She's certainly got some inner struggles but it's not your responsibility to fix them and you can't be expected to just wait around either.

 

There isn't much you can do but let her know that you don't want to continue this push-pull, and she should call you only if she wants and truly feels ready for something more. Just be aware that she might not ever be able to give you what you want.

[La.Primavera]

There has to come a point where you stop making excuses for her and make ultimatum. Either she is willing to meet you half way and give you the respect you deserve or you are done for good.

 

She can’t keep rejecting you then coming back months later. She may have good reasons for being guarded but it is still unacceptable to treat someone that way. You need to assert yourself and be willing to stick by your decision. If she doesn’t want to be in a relationship, fine, but no more games. You will need to move on a meet someone else.

 

Her loss will be someone else's gain.

[sjclsnb]

Thanks for the replies. I knew I should have been a little more clear on the wanting different things. I'm almost positive that she wanted more than just friends, between the flirting, and the fact that my feelings have remained concrete every time we have done this. I told her from the get go, this time, I didn't just want to be her friend. She tells me that I want something serious and she wants the same thing but doesn't think that she is ready and for some reason seems to think that I want to get there right now. It's not the case, I have to spend time with her and her daughter before I could ever think of something serious, because its not just her that I have to be sure about. As far as her ex they haven't been together since around the time of her daughters birth, the little girl was a "surprise", but I know he still abuses her emotionally and uses her daughter against her. The tipping point has come I have made it known that she can't keep doing this, ultimately she becomes defensive and hides away because it becomes too much for her. Like I said in the first post she has never really hurt me, its never been a committed relationship and its obvious to me see has made progress on herself each time and is probably why I give it the chance, I however don't walk into it blindly.

[Redhead14]

I been a long time observer on this forum and I figure I would register and look for advice on my current situation. I've known this girl for a long time, 8 or so years. She is a great girl, attractive, smart, a great mother to her 4 yr old, but alas she is very emotionally guarded. I met her when I became good friends with her mothers boyfriend, and I took a liking to her immediately but I never did anything about it, I was going through some personal issues with my parents divorce and didn't think she would go for someone like me. 2.5 years ago she gets ahold of me out of the blue and asks me to dinner. We go have a great time a week later completely ghosts. I figure that she just wasn't that into me, it happens. 3 months later gets ahold of me again and I spend the entire summer trying to get with this girl, nothing materializes, things go south we break all contact until the next spring. That time I wasn't playing any games, things go south rather quickly and again lose all contact. As you might have guessed she came back in early July, we meet up, have fun, make plans to go out again and she introduces me to her daughter. That was huge for me, she is very protective of who she introduces to her daughter. She is in the process of buying a house, and I was driving along one day and spotted a French horn at a garage sale, she is a huge fan of how I met your mother so I scooped it up and painted it blue and told her I had something for her when she gets her house. It's nothing major I spent 5 dollars on it and it to me was nothing more of a thoughtful friendly gesture, but I think it triggered the flight response in her. She has become very distant, ignores texts, refuses to make plans, and tells me we want different things. Now I've looked around enough on this site to know what most of you will say, don't think it hasn't dawned on me, but what I don't get is why she keeps trying to start something with me if she knows what I'm after? I will not settle for being her friend, ultimately I'm too attracted to her and see her in a different light. She had dated some real winners, like I said I've known her for awhile, and still has to maintain contact with daughters father who is an emotionally abusive jerk. I end up feeling so bad about myself for getting so frustrated with her, but I have to know that I'm not being played with. We have never been in a committed relationship with each other, we have not been intimate so you could say I've never really been hurt other than the thought of some failure on my part. I've tried seeing it her way, I've said everything I could think of to calm her fears, I've talked to her friends but it leads no where. Is she just broken beyond repair? Will she ever come out of it and fully believe that voice in her head that tells her to get a hold of me? Ultimately I think I'm what she has always looked for, decent guy, attractive, smart, stable well paying job. I just don't know, what are your thoughts?

 

There is enough information here for me to make an educated guess. It appears that she has a fear of intimacy. People with this fear are in an emotional catch-22. They both want an emotional connection and fear it at the same time. Which causes the "dance" you two have been going through. She gets to a point where she wants an needs an emotional connection, makes that attempt, and when it appears that that connection might be happening between you two, she pulls away because it causes anxiety. She will use distancing/sabotaging tactics -- and it's likely and unconscious/automatic response. In addition, I venture to say that the boyfriend who was abusive, etc., was exactly the type she would be attracted to. Her negative self worth would be validated by poor treatment. It's what she thinks she deserves. Consciously, she knows he's bad for her, internally, she deserves it.

 

She will appear to be coming on stronger until she just can't stand the closeness, she feels smothered/boxed in.

 

The fear of intimacy usually starts in childhood. If the connection to her parents was detached or disorganized, it starts there usually and/of some kind of physical or emotional abuse. She never had the opportunity to fully connect and develop trust. She basically would have ended up "living inside" of herself and deal with things on her own. A child raising a child. In addition, internal negative feeling about themselves develops as well. Fear of intimacy sometimes starts in adulthood, but there has to have been significant trauma, some type of extreme physical or emotional abuse.

 

The negative internal thinking that they are somehow not good enough to be loved, is likely the reason she resisted your gift. She feels undeserving and/or it is a sign of emotional attachment on your part, which is scary to her. She is not playing with you, she is experiencing an internal war that causes her to retreat into her safety zone, which doesn't include a partner.

 

Having a relationship with her will be very difficult for YOU. It takes a ton of patience and understanding to deal with being pushed away often and suddenly at times.

 

I'm what she has always looked for, decent guy, attractive, smart, stable well paying job. I just don't know, what are your thoughts? -- As great as you sound, in her world, she is looking for Perfection. On some level she knows there's no such thing as perfection -- therefore, she doesn't have to worry about finding it or the emotional connection it would bring.

 

Unless you are a very strong, secure, independent person, I would advise you to end the relationship entirely. It would be very difficult, as you said, to simply remain friends with her with the deeper feelings you have for her while knowing she could never return it.

Edited September 3, 2015 by Redhead14

[Satu]

There is enough information here for me to make an educated guess. It appears that she has a fear of intimacy. People with this fear are in an emotional catch-22. They both want an emotional connection and fear it at the same time. Which causes the "dance" you two have been going through. She gets to a point where she wants an needs an emotional connection, makes that attempt, and when it appears that that connection might be happening between you two, she pulls away because it causes anxiety. She will use distancing/sabotaging tactics -- and it's likely and unconscious/automatic response. In addition, I venture to say that the boyfriend who was abusive, etc., was exactly the type she would be attracted to. Her negative self worth would be validated by poor treatment. It's what she thinks she deserves. Consciously, she knows he's bad for her, internally, she deserves it.

 

She will appear to be coming on stronger until she just can't stand the closeness, she feels smothered/boxed in.

 

The fear of intimacy usually starts in childhood. If the connection to her parents was detached or disorganized, it starts there usually and/of some kind of physical or emotional abuse. She never had the opportunity to fully connect and develop trust. She basically would have ended up "living inside" of herself and deal with things on her own. A child raising a child. In addition, internal negative feeling about themselves develops as well. Fear of intimacy sometimes starts in adulthood, but there has to have been significant trauma, some type of extreme physical or emotional abuse.

 

The negative internal thinking that they are somehow not good enough to be loved, is likely the reason she resisted your gift. She feels undeserving and/or it is a sign of emotional attachment on your part, which is scary to her. She is not playing with you, she is experiencing an internal war that causes her to retreat into her safety zone, which doesn't include a partner.

 

Having a relationship with her will be very difficult for YOU. It takes a ton of patience and understanding to deal with being pushed away often and suddenly at times.

 

I'm what she has always looked for, decent guy, attractive, smart, stable well paying job. I just don't know, what are your thoughts? -- As great as you sound, in her world, she is looking for Perfection. On some level she knows there's no such thing as perfection -- therefore, she doesn't have to worry about finding it or the emotional connection it would bring.

 

Unless you are a very strong, secure, independent person, I would advise you to end the relationship entirely. It would be very difficult, as you said, to simply remain friends with her with the deeper feelings you have for her while knowing she could never return it.

 

-- ^^^ This ^^^--

[sjclsnb]

Wow! thank you redhead. I would like to say that your response was eye opening, but honestly it's nothing I haven't previously thought about. I do view myself as a strong and independent person, I have spent most of my adult life on my own, spending most of my time focused on my career, I have never "needed" anyone but would ultimately like to find someone to settle down with and raise a family and am well aware that its most likely not going to be with her.

 

I guess my biggest question is why she keeps choosing to come back? It's not a two week on, two week off, back and forth, it's 4 to 6 months of zero contact and it is not me who initiates it. Why, if she is looking for perfection, does she think that anything will be different?

 

I know with someone like her, trying to figure out her actions may be a futile effort, and I have asked her why she comes back and she tells me its because she likes me and feels we want the same thing but then it all becomes too serious for her, pinning the blame on me when all I ever really ask for is to spend time together and get to know each other. She didn't have the best childhood, I don't think she has ever seen what a stable relationship looks like, but prior to her daughters birth she didn't seem to have these issues or at least weren't large enough to present themselves. I think that having a life turned upside down with the strain of having a baby so young and an abusive relationship with the father would make a person act that way. I'm not trying to make excuse for her, what she does is not right, but I am able to see things from that perspective and it does help.

 

She has had boyfriends in between the times when we were talking, I guess they were just able to remain disconnected enough to allow that to happen. I'm not willing to do that, it's not what I'm looking for and I wont sacrifice just because beyond that emotional wall is someone I really do like. Thanks for the replies everybody, it's nice to get other peoples input.

[Redhead14]

Wow! thank you redhead. I would like to say that your response was eye opening, but honestly it's nothing I haven't previously thought about. I do view myself as a strong and independent person, I have spent most of my adult life on my own, spending most of my time focused on my career, I have never "needed" anyone but would ultimately like to find someone to settle down with and raise a family and am well aware that its most likely not going to be with her.

 

I guess my biggest question is why she keeps choosing to come back? It's not a two week on, two week off, back and forth, it's 4 to 6 months of zero contact and it is not me who initiates it. Why, if she is looking for perfection, does she think that anything will be different?

 

I know with someone like her, trying to figure out her actions may be a futile effort, and I have asked her why she comes back and she tells me its because she likes me and feels we want the same thing but then it all becomes too serious for her, pinning the blame on me when all I ever really ask for is to spend time together and get to know each other. She didn't have the best childhood, I don't think she has ever seen what a stable relationship looks like, but prior to her daughters birth she didn't seem to have these issues or at least weren't large enough to present themselves. I think that having a life turned upside down with the strain of having a baby so young and an abusive relationship with the father would make a person act that way. I'm not trying to make excuse for her, what she does is not right, but I am able to see things from that perspective and it does help.

 

She has had boyfriends in between the times when we were talking, I guess they were just able to remain disconnected enough to allow that to happen. I'm not willing to do that, it's not what I'm looking for and I wont sacrifice just because beyond that emotional wall is someone I really do like. Thanks for the replies everybody, it's nice to get other peoples input.

 

I guess my biggest question is why she keeps choosing to come back?

 

She has had boyfriends in between the times when we were talking

 

She is likely having the same struggle with them and bouncing back and forth to whoever can deal with it at the time. She is doing to them what she is doing with you and they are doing what you are doing.

[Versacehottie]

Thanks for the replies. I knew I should have been a little more clear on the wanting different things. I'm almost positive that she wanted more than just friends, between the flirting, and the fact that my feelings have remained concrete every time we have done this. I told her from the get go, this time, I didn't just want to be her friend. She tells me that I want something serious and she wants the same thing but doesn't think that she is ready and for some reason seems to think that I want to get there right now. It's not the case, I have to spend time with her and her daughter before I could ever think of something serious, because its not just her that I have to be sure about. As far as her ex they haven't been together since around the time of her daughters birth, the little girl was a "surprise", but I know he still abuses her emotionally and uses her daughter against her. The tipping point has come I have made it known that she can't keep doing this, ultimately she becomes defensive and hides away because it becomes too much for her. Like I said in the first post she has never really hurt me, its never been a committed relationship and its obvious to me see has made progress on herself each time and is probably why I give it the chance, I however don't walk into it blindly.

 

Hmmm, just a thought on part of it. Do you think when she keeps telling you she is not ready but then comes back a few months later that she is trying to string things along hoping that at some point she will feel ready and/or to keep you locked into her? I think when you guys get close but she knows you are relationship oriented and she still doesn't feel ready she pulls away so she doesn't have to go full on then and ruin it--effectively postponing and postponing the decision due to her lack of readiness. Just might be where her head is at BUT needless to say you shouldn't WAIT for it. Date others if it was meant to be, she'll be back. Plus if she hears about you dating others might light a fire under her. It's complicated though. Mine is just a possible guess--she could be more into guys who treat her back or just never going to be into you enough. Good luck

[sjclsnb]

That could very well be the case and yes I have thought about that as well, I can't ask about those things because she is such an emotional vault.

[Redhead14]

Hmmm, just a thought on part of it. Do you think when she keeps telling you she is not ready but then comes back a few months later that she is trying to string things along hoping that at some point she will feel ready and/or to keep you locked into her? I think when you guys get close but she knows you are relationship oriented and she still doesn't feel ready she pulls away so she doesn't have to go full on then and ruin it--effectively postponing and postponing the decision due to her lack of readiness. Just might be where her head is at BUT needless to say you shouldn't WAIT for it. Date others if it was meant to be, she'll be back. Plus if she hears about you dating others might light a fire under her. It's complicated though. Mine is just a possible guess--she could be more into guys who treat her back or just never going to be into you enough. Good luck

 

That is exactly what people with fear of intimacy do and struggle with. They are torn. Between wanting a relationship and not and cannot make that decision. They are in constant limbo and therefore any partners the try to be close too are also. This is the epitome of the string along. It is however not the intention. They simply cant make the decision either way.

[sjclsnb]

Thanks versacehottie, yes it does appear to be the case and has told me she tries to be the girl I want, she recognizes that I am relationship oriented, but doesn't understand that in order for me to make it a commited serious relationship it would have to be a lot of time spent getting to know her and her little girl and she shouldn't worry about it being serious now. I can't say anymore to her, it sucks we always end up this way, but im realizing it's no fault of mine and I do feel bad for her because I can see glimpses of the parts of her that want something real and wants to trust somebody.

[Versacehottie]

oh i'm sorry. I'm afraid I don't have any excellent solution except to go on and live your life. My personal belief is that people CAN come out of the not ready stage but it's is very hard to predict which ones and under what circumstances. It's not worth trying to predict it anyway. You gotta take care of you first. Actually sometimes that's the thing that gets them to wake up.

 

Think about it. Right now, she always knows you're "there". Good ol' steady, reliable. That gives her all the time in the world to "make this decision". She actually may have already decided and it could be that she's just not that into you. However, course of action to root out which and put yourself in the best position is the same. Go on with life. Don't wait for her but see what happens. She needs a shake up I think. Though honestly, if she takes breaks of up to 4 months to me that sounds like she's not ready to change any time soon. That said, your life, including your love life, can change in a day. Just do what's best for you now. Trying to prove you're a great guy is not necessary. You've done the baseline work of that already. She'll deserve more of that, when and if you are dating or bf/gf. Good luck

[coryreply]

Have you guys had a real, honest conversation with each other? How would she react if you confronted "the fear of intimacy" that you see in her?

[Redhead14]

Have you guys had a real, honest conversation with each other? How would she react if you confronted "the fear of intimacy" that you see in her?

 

That would be dicey because the fact that he has Seen Into Her will cause anxiety and possibly anger and resentment. Fear of Intimacy also involves the fact that they don't like themselves for various reasons and so they are guarded so as to prevent anyone from getting close enough to see the "real" them and possibly judge or criticize. In there minds, intimacy is spelled Into Me See . . .

[sjclsnb]

Versacehottie, obviously I have thought about that, that I was just the fall back guy and maybe to a point I could be, but the off periods are no contact at, no social media, no text, no nothing. I truly believe she gets a hold of me because a part of her wants the same thing even though a bigger part of her won't let that happen. The last time we did this ended pretty badly I honestly thought I would never hear from here again, probably why it took her almost a year to get a hold of me. In between I don't sit and wait, I feel bad for a little bit, shake it off and continue my life, even seeing people and even had a girlfriend or two (not at the same time obviously).

 

Coryreply, we have not had an actual conversation she avoids them like the plague, and it takes me getting entirely too frustrated and upset for her to say anything and if i have a fault in this its because I can get a little tempermental, probably not a good mix and it shouldn't be like that. I cannot be entirely faulted for wanting answers.

 

Redhead, you are very insightful, I appreciate you taking the time to give your input. I believe you are absolutely right, me being able to see into her shuts her down and its not even her outright telling me, she seems to forget that I knew her well before she had major issues with intimacy, I pay attention to things she posts or what she reads (always into the sappy love stories, nicholas sparks or what not) about wanting the very same things she says she cant let her self be vulnerable enough to let happen. It's all very confusing, especially to a person that doesn't let past relationships keep me from trying to find meaningful connections with people.

[sjclsnb]

Last September I started a thread about an emotionally guarded girl I was seeing. It's here, http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/dating/545993-emotionally-guarded-girl.

 

For those not wanting to read here is a short rundown. She's a single mom and I've known her for many years, for the past three we have been doing this dance of connecting, disconnecting and reconnecting. We talk and hang out for a while then she goes cold, no contact for 4 to 6 months and then we somehow find our way back. Last September I got entirely to fed up with the what seemed like games and things got heated between us and we broke all contact that is until about 5 weeks ago. As you could probably tell we started talking again. It was my fault this time, I guess, I sent her something that I thought she might enjoy, but this time without the intent of trying to start anything. We begin to talk daily, she apologizes for being a quote "douche and a horrible person" I tell her it's okay and not to think like that, she eventually asks me to hangout which I respectfully decline saying I just don't want to go through that again. I eventually break down, we go out and have a great time and make plans to go out again. We text throughout the days leading up, laughing, joking, the usual. We go out again and spend the night with each other, something that has never happened previously. There was chemistry and a spark and we both entered that night not planning for that to happen, it just did. We continue to talk for a few weeks, nothing changes, flirting, joking and then one day she goes cold. Avoiding, not answering texts, no flirting nothing and things have seem to have gone south again.

 

Tuesday I ask to see her this weekend she tells me she is busy with her daughter and Easter. Today she tells me that she works today but after she is having drinks with her girlfriend who invited her yesterday so obviously she had free time just not for me and I call her out as I have before. Am I wrong for being upset?

 

I'm at a loss here, I know most of you will say cut your losses and most likely thats what will happen I just don't know what to make of it. She was very different this time, more open, very clear flirting, sending cute pictures, good morning texts most days, talking about going camping and fishing this summer, making me dinner among other things and then one day its I don't have time for serious (who's talking serious), or some other excuse she has used before. It's like she feels like she's getting close and then gets scared and runs away. Has anyone had a succesful relationship with someone like this?

[phineas]

Buddy,

She isn't attracted to you.

Sorry.

She likes you but not THAT way.

 

I had a woman like this also a few yrs back.

it went on for yrs where she would get close then disappear. then come back ect.

I got tired of it.

 

Last time she came around I invited her over for dinner & a movie.

She came over & I tried to sleep with her.

When she wouldn't i calmly told her to leave because she had nothing to offer me.

 

Harsh, yes.

But I haven't heard from her in about 3yrs.

so i'm not losing any sleep over it.