Is full disclosure [of an affair] always best [after the marriage has ended]?

March 24, 2016

Even after the marriage has ended?

My SO and I are in counseling and this came up in therapy last night. Our relationship started as an affair. He never admitted to a PA, only to an EA. His ex claimed, on several occasions during their separation, that she didn't want to know if our affair was physical but asked about it equally as often. She holds me 99% responsible for him leaving and they have a cordial enough relationship now where their kids are concerned.

Our therapist strongly believes he needs to come clean with her, and tell her everything. Not just the extent of our relationship, but also the years and issues they had leading up to it. He is torn. In his mind, the damage is done, the marriage is over and there's no point in causing her additional pain. I see his point, but I also wonder if coming clean would aid in her moving on and coming to terms with things. Allow her to stop wondering if she did something wrong, if she could have changed the outcome, etc. And selfishly on my end, I wonder if it would help shift some of the blame off of me and put some part of it on him.

So, my question is to the BS - would you want to know the truth, even after the marriage was over? Or would it only cause more pain and set you back further?

March 24, 2016

to answer the question from the title --- no, it's definitely not ALWAYS the best. it can actually be harmful... even dangerous in some situations.

His ex claimed, on several occasions during their separation, that she didn't want to know if our affair was physical but asked about it equally as often.

from experience -- she knows it was a PA. trust me.

this entire - tell me did you do it...! no, WAIT! DON'T TELL ME, I DON'T WANNA KNOW! - is typical for folks who already do KNOW (deep down) but aren't ready to have that finally confirmed.

Not just the extent of our relationship, but also the years and issues they had leading up to it.

he should most definitely address this part -- this is the most important part... to tell her where did things go wrong for him before the affair; the affair was (so it seems) a consequence of that so i don't think it's relevant for her to know the details of YOUR relationship.

but he should be honest with her; there is a lot of unresolved and unsaid in the air between them, no?

So, my question is to the BS - would you want to know the truth, even after the marriage was over? Or would it only cause more pain and set you back further?

sure but i'm personally almost pathologically addicted to truth. i was dumped once, seemingly out of the blue and asked him if there was someone else; he denied but i could read him well and knew he was lying. he felt guilty and came clean about it months after that.

i honestly didn't care. i was more curious than anything else. when the relationship is over and he doesn't love me anymore... that's all that matters.

HOWEVER - some folks need time to rewrite their history. when you don't know about the affair - you start wondering what parts of happy memories were fake, what were right and honest, if that person was happy AT ALL ar any point... you're tortured by a lot of things you wouldn't be if you knew what was going on in the background of those memories. admitting to an affair may seem pointless when the marriage is over but it can most definitely bring RELIEF to a lot of people.

your SO should be honest about issues prior to the affair more than anything else though. i think she needs that more than knowing about the PA.

March 24, 2016

If a relationship has ended in divorce...I don't necessarily think full disclosure is always the best answer.

In reconciliation... Yes

March 24, 2016

Our therapist strongly believes he needs to come clean with her, and tell her everything.

As there are kids involved and she needs to be strong here, unravelling the past and causing her to revisit it from a different, potentially more devastating perspective, is madness IMO.

I guess she has that part of her life well boxed up by now. She may or may not "believe" it was an EA deep down, but I guess part of her coping mechanism will be to believe it was just an EA.

Telling her it was actually a PA, may assuage his guilt, but who is going to pick up the pieces if SHE now falls apart?

March 24, 2016

i honestly didn't care. i was more curious than anything else. when the relationship is over and he doesn't love me anymore... that's all that matters.

HOWEVER - some folks need time to rewrite their history. when you don't know about the affair - you start wondering what parts of happy memories were fake, what were right and honest, if that person was happy AT ALL ar any point... you're tortured by a lot of things you wouldn't be if you knew what was going on in the background of those memories. admitting to an affair may seem pointless when the marriage is over but it can most definitely bring RELIEF to a lot of people.

your SO should be honest about issues prior to the affair more than anything else though. i think she needs that more than knowing about the PA.

Thanks for your reply. Yes, there is a lot left unsettled between them. I agree with you that she does know the extent of it. His refusal to admit it, I think, causes her to question exactly what you described above.

March 24, 2016

As there are kids involved and she needs to be strong here, unravelling the past and causing her to revisit it from a different, potentially more devastating perspective, is madness IMO.
I guess she has that part of her life well boxed up by now. She may or may not "believe" it was an EA deep down, but I guess part of her coping mechanism will be to believe it was just an EA.
Telling her it was actually a PA, may assuage his guilt, but who is going to pick up the pieces if SHE now falls apart?

Fair point. Problem is, I don't think she's boxed anything up. I think she's waiting for him to get through his "midlife crisis" and go back. If she holds him accountable for the affair, or outwardly blames him for it, she can't take him back as easily.

As for the kids, she makes life difficult enough as it is where they're concerned. I certainly don't want to do anything to compound that.

March 24, 2016

I personally believe in the truth but clearly its not popular. I think there is a way to deal with this especially when there is children involved then to let the other person learn about it any other way.

This is one reason why I will always fight my xW seeing our kids. Thankfully she has done a great job of alienating them herself but why have them around someone that cant own up to there own mistakes.

Just my two cents.

C

March 24, 2016

Even after the marriage has ended?

My SO and I are in counseling and this came up in therapy last night. Our relationship started as an affair. He never admitted to a PA, only to an EA. His ex claimed, on several occasions during their separation, that she didn't want to know if our affair was physical but asked about it equally as often. She holds me 99% responsible for him leaving and they have a cordial enough relationship now where their kids are concerned.

Our therapist strongly believes he needs to come clean with her, and tell her everything. Not just the extent of our relationship, but also the years and issues they had leading up to it. He is torn. In his mind, the damage is done, the marriage is over and there's no point in causing her additional pain. I see his point, but I also wonder if coming clean would aid in her moving on and coming to terms with things. Allow her to stop wondering if she did something wrong, if she could have changed the outcome, etc. And selfishly on my end, I wonder if it would help shift some of the blame off of me and put some part of it on him.

So, my question is to the BS - would you want to know the truth, even after the marriage was over? Or would it only cause more pain and set you back further?

Chances are she knows and just wants him to admit it. Why hide it and lie? come clean and tell the truth. Everybody can heal and move on in a healthier way.

March 24, 2016

It's been 20 years since I divorced and those last three years were pretty bad. I still don't want to know if he cheated or not. I'd prefer not to know if he was "double dipping."

I just don't see how this is going to change things for anyone involved. They will still be divorced. They will still not be reconciling. I get that they have kids, I don't see how this can make it any better for them.

Personally, I'd get a second opinion.

March 24, 2016

Why are you in couples counseling and what would any of this have to do with your marital issues??

I'm not connecting the dots between your counseling and your therapist wanting your husband to discuss your personal matters with his ex wife.

Could your therapist be a crackpot?

March 25, 2016

It's been 20 years since I divorced and those last three years were pretty bad. I still don't want to know if he cheated or not. I'd prefer not to know if he was "double dipping."

I just don't see how this is going to change things for anyone involved. They will still be divorced. They will still not be reconciling. I get that they have kids, I don't see how this can make it any better for them.

Personally, I'd get a second opinion.

STD tests maybe? If he was cheating wouldn't you want to get tested for your own peace of mind?

March 25, 2016

Based solely on what you describe it would be cruel to tell his xBW anything about the affair. It would only hurt so why would anyone think it's a good idea?

March 25, 2016

Why are you in couples counseling and what would any of this have to do with your marital issues??

I'm not connecting the dots between your counseling and your therapist wanting your husband to discuss your personal matters with his ex wife.

Could your therapist be a crackpot?

We are not yet married. We are in counseling to help us deal with the way we started this relationship and the best way to move forward for all involved, most especially our kids.

His ex is still very bitter and hurt, understandably. Her anger is hurting the kids, and his relationship with them. I think that's the main reason the therapist thinks he should "come clean" with her. The therapist seems to think him finally being honest with her, and I guess validating what she already "knows" will help her move on.

March 25, 2016

We are not yet married. We are in counseling to help us deal with the way we started this relationship and the best way to move forward for all involved, most especially our kids.

His ex is still very bitter and hurt, understandably. Her anger is hurting the kids, and his relationship with them. I think that's the main reason the therapist thinks he should "come clean" with her. The therapist seems to think him finally being honest with her, and I guess validating what she already "knows" will help her move on.

If she is having difficulty coming to terms with him being in the kids lives due to him having an EA, I can only feel once she KNOWS it was definitely a PA, she will hate him even more.

How is that going to smooth any paths?

"I knew you were a [inset expletive of choice], now I KNOW you were a conniving, lying, evil [inset expletive of choice].

Sleeping with two women at the same time, and you''ve been lying to me, all this time????

Pfft!

YOU don't deserve to be anywhere near my kids..."

March 25, 2016

If she is having difficulty coming to terms with him being in the kids lives due to him having an EA, I can only feel once she KNOWS it was definitely a PA, she will hate him even more.
How is that going to smooth any paths?
"I knew you were a [inset expletive of choice], now I KNOW you were a conniving, lying, evil [inset expletive of choice].
Sleeping with two women at the same time, and you''ve been lying to me, all this time????
Pfft!
YOU don't deserve to be anywhere near my kids..."

Her concern isn't him being in their lives. She would never keep them from him, even if she had full disclosure. I doubt she'd even try to tighten the reigns, as she knows she'd fair far worse in court.

March 25, 2016

STD tests maybe? If he was cheating wouldn't you want to get tested for your own peace of mind?

I was in the military during a time when they tested us twice a year. I already get tested once a year and have the assumption that people who care about their health and body do the same.

I'm under the impression that her SO has been separated and divorced for over a year.

How long had the SO not been having sex with his wife?

Having the SO "come clean" about the affair isn't going to make their life any better at this point. It won't change anything for the positive.

I realize there are some diseases that may incubate for more than a year. But you're implying that the OP and her partner were not safe or were promiscuous. I haven't read the backstory, so I'm not sure that is an issue.

March 25, 2016

I was in the military during a time when they tested us twice a year. I already get tested once a year and have the assumption that people who care about their health and body do the same.

I'm under the impression that her SO has been separated and divorced for over a year.

How long had the SO not been having sex with his wife?

Having the SO "come clean" about the affair isn't going to make their life any better at this point. It won't change anything for the positive.

I realize there are some diseases that may incubate for more than a year. But you're implying that the OP and her partner were not safe or were promiscuous. I haven't read the backstory, so I'm not sure that is an issue.

No, this is not an issue. They have been separated for almost three years and by both of their admissions, they were not intimate or sharing a bed for 2-3 years prior to that.

March 25, 2016

No I do not think it is necessary to divulge the details. What is the point? Anything positive about their relationship that she may have been able to hang on to will be destroyed. She will have so many questions and doubts. Sure it might make him feel better and relieve his guilt but no way. Let it be and move on.

As for yourself, I am sure you feel bad and there are people that will judge you because you had an affair but sometimes things happen. I never thought I would say that but they just do. People who have affairs because they are bored or are malicious is a different story but I do feel there are people that end up in affairs for a number of different reasons.

March 25, 2016

They are divorced and apparently cooperating at coparenting currently so I'm not seeing any point to this.

No one with half a brain would even think that a man would leave his wife for OW without boinking the OW first so it's dumb for anyone to deny it and dumb for anyone to pretend to believe the denials.

If she hadn't slept with him for years before the divorce then his/your sex life is none of her business.

If this is a parenting issue between him and her, then it's not really much of your business either.

The way I see it, there are a whole lotta people meddling and stirring up $h1+ that really doesn't matter and really isn't any of their concern.

Wise ol' Uncle Oldshirt's solution to all of of this is for -

-the XW to get a boyfriend and move on with her life.

- SO to be as cooperative and good a father as he can be going into the future and put the past behind him and not worry about her resentment and other issues.

- the therapist to deal with XW's resentment in a positive future-focused manner and leave other people's sexlives and personal matters out of it.

- and for you to stay out of their parental matters.

If everyone does that, everything else will fall into place.

Edited March 25, 2016 by oldshirt

March 25, 2016

They coparent well enough, as long as it's what she wants. But I agree, their coparenting issues are not my business and I do not get involved.

I think the therapist's recommendation is coming from specifics we have shared with her where his ex is concerned. For example, I have a good relationship with his kids. I've known them for 6 years and our daughters are friends and are in school together. Since they separated, she has badmouthed me to the kids, interrogates them about me (we spend a few hours a month together with our kids). She sends me horrible texts and emails, which I ignore. She then cries and apologizes to him for her outbursts to me, saying that she does it because I stole him, I made him replace her, and she hates me so much and just wants me to go away.

The therapist seems to think by him being honest without her about the state of their marriage prior to the divorce, and the events leading up to it, it will help her shift some of the blame to him, and off of me. And will lessen the badmouthing and interrogation where the kids are concerned. I think the therapist believes she is stuck in limbo, not willing to face the reality as he's never been completely honest with her.

I'm not sure I agree, hence my original question...

March 25, 2016

They coparent well enough, as long as it's what she wants. But I agree, their coparenting issues are not my business and I do not get involved.

I think the therapist's recommendation is coming from specifics we have shared with her where his ex is concerned. For example, I have a good relationship with his kids. I've known them for 6 years and our daughters are friends and are in school together. Since they separated, she has badmouthed me to the kids, interrogates them about me (we spend a few hours a month together with our kids). She sends me horrible texts and emails, which I ignore. She then cries and apologizes to him for her outbursts to me, saying that she does it because I stole him, I made him replace her, and she hates me so much and just wants me to go away.

The therapist seems to think by him being honest without her about the state of their marriage prior to the divorce, and the events leading up to it, it will help her shift some of the blame to him, and off of me. And will lessen the badmouthing and interrogation where the kids are concerned. I think the therapist believes she is stuck in limbo, not willing to face the reality as he's never been completely honest with her.

I'm not sure I agree, hence my original question...

Your therapist needs to be fired. Her logic is so flawed.

Why?

The BS was not having an affair and never looking to end her marriage and see her family broken up.

The BS will always view the AP as the one to blame. There is no motivation for the BS to stop hating and forgive the AP. This BW I am afraid will never have the motivation to stop blaming you and forgive you.

However the BS is motivated to forgive the WS because there is no way the BS can recover their marriage and still hate their WS.

So when her exWH gives her a full confession she will let him be forgiven because her actions show that she still wants her family together.

Yes the BW will give the ex WH some initial heat though his confession will never take any of the heat off of you from her.

So if you get her exWH to try this tactic please let us know how it works.

March 26, 2016

They coparent well enough, as long as it's what she wants. But I agree, their coparenting issues are not my business and I do not get involved.

I think the therapist's recommendation is coming from specifics we have shared with her where his ex is concerned. For example, I have a good relationship with his kids. I've known them for 6 years and our daughters are friends and are in school together. Since they separated, she has badmouthed me to the kids, interrogates them about me (we spend a few hours a month together with our kids). She sends me horrible texts and emails, which I ignore. She then cries and apologizes to him for her outbursts to me, saying that she does it because I stole him, I made him replace her, and she hates me so much and just wants me to go away.

The therapist seems to think by him being honest without her about the state of their marriage prior to the divorce, and the events leading up to it, it will help her shift some of the blame to him, and off of me. And will lessen the badmouthing and interrogation where the kids are concerned. I think the therapist believes she is stuck in limbo, not willing to face the reality as he's never been completely honest with her.

I'm not sure I agree, hence my original question...

I honestly think your therapist has malicious motive here, wants this new relationship to implode, assuming that it can't sustain the inevitable fallout between your bf and his ex. As others said her reasoning makes zero sense.

The ex may logically know that she won't fare well in court, but hearing about the affair when she's already in the throes of grief would, I think, send her into a rage that would manifest as a vicious custody battle.

I really hope your bf chooses not to do this. If the ex-wife isn't specifically asking for details from him about the affair (which may come later, and at that point could be considered a normal phase of the grieving process, I think), no good can come of it.

March 26, 2016

I'm trying to imagine this. I think it depends on the person and whether they are seeking information about the affair or not. Some people go into denial; they don't want to know or accept what happened. Some would just draw a line and say that was in the past, why bother. Others would always want the truth. The ex probably knew there was something not making sense. There were gaps and explanations that didn't fit.

It's bound to be hurtful for her to find out and no doubt there would be fallout. If she is actively seeking this information, then maybe it would be right for him to tell her. If she is not, then what would be the purpose of telling her? I am wondering how this suggestion could have come about from a counsellor. Is there some issue in your relationship that requires this confession from him to his ex? If that is the case, then no, I don't think she should be told to save your relationship with him. She has been through enough and offloading on her for your own reasons would not be right.

March 26, 2016

I'm trying to imagine this. I think it depends on the person and whether they are seeking information about the affair or not. Some people go into denial; they don't want to know or accept what happened. Some would just draw a line and say that was in the past, why bother. Others would always want the truth. The ex probably knew there was something not making sense. There were gaps and explanations that didn't fit.

It's bound to be hurtful for her to find out and no doubt there would be fallout. If she is actively seeking this information, then maybe it would be right for him to tell her. If she is not, then what would be the purpose of telling her? I am wondering how this suggestion could have come about from a counsellor. Is there some issue in your relationship that requires this confession from him to his ex? If that is the case, then no, I don't think she should be told to save your relationship with him. She has been through enough and offloading on her for your own reasons would not be right.

Agreed. While ultimately not my choice, I do not want him to do anything to set her back further. And I'm definitely not in favor if it's for our benefit only. However, she does ask often, which leads me to question if some level of discussion may be beneficial to her.

March 26, 2016

They coparent well enough, as long as it's what she wants. But I agree, their coparenting issues are not my business and I do not get involved.

I think the therapist's recommendation is coming from specifics we have shared with her where his ex is concerned. For example, I have a good relationship with his kids. I've known them for 6 years and our daughters are friends and are in school together. Since they separated, she has badmouthed me to the kids, interrogates them about me (we spend a few hours a month together with our kids). She sends me horrible texts and emails, which I ignore. She then cries and apologizes to him for her outbursts to me, saying that she does it because I stole him, I made him replace her, and she hates me so much and just wants me to go away.

The therapist seems to think by him being honest without her about the state of their marriage prior to the divorce, and the events leading up to it, it will help her shift some of the blame to him, and off of me. And will lessen the badmouthing and interrogation where the kids are concerned. I think the therapist believes she is stuck in limbo, not willing to face the reality as he's never been completely honest with her.

I'm not sure I agree, hence my original question...

I see your therapist's point...but I don't share his/ her hope that telling will achieve the desired effect.

My H (fMM) disclosed to the xBW - for his own reasons - and she chose not to believe him. She chose to believe that his leaving her was just a ruse to get her to agree to MC. During the D, she did not stop trying to lure him back. Even seeing me, knowing he and I and the kids were living as a family did nothing to dull her conviction that he would ultimately take her back. Even when the D was finalised. Even when we M. She clung to limbo, she clung to hope. She just wasn't ready to accept reality.

Now, many years later, she has moved in with a man, who shares the same first name and appearance as my H. We're hoping that it's a sign she's moving on, finally - even if he's a knock-off of my H. But before she was ready, she simply wasn't ready.

Your SO's S2BXBW may be in a similar space. Telling her will achieve nothing in relation to getting her to move on. She'll just tune it out, the same way she's been tuning out his role and her own in the death of their R. She is deeply invested in her own view of how things went down, and she simply can't afford to consider alternatives at this stage. Maybe in a decade or so, you'll also be lucky.

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Is full disclosure [of an affair] always best [after the marriage has ended]?

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