What do you want your ws to know ( but maybe don't want to say to them)

[beatcuff]

I think I would want my wife to know that nothing in my life even comes close to the devastation of D-Day. Not even the death of those close to me.

 

bury a child then we can talk.

 

the sad part of this entire thread is the continued lack of communication. the real question is why you do NOT tell them.

[Liam1]

Shatteredlady:

 

Thank you for your post. I can see that you are still in pain.

 

I can't answer all your questions, but in my experience in talking to men that had affairs, they complain about the wife, SOMETIMES, to ease their own guilt and to make themselves feel less like the ass they are acting like.

 

SOME, tell the OW they love them because it is obvious that that is what the OW NEEDS to hear to keep the gravy train going.

 

I think the "competition" that many OW feel is mostly created by the MM. I don't know of many who say "I love my wife. I just want sex on the side" (& even if they do it's hard to believe). Most feel it's necessary to trash the W to justify their behavior to the OW (& frequently themselves).

 

This logic on the why of why The OW feels in "competition" with the wife is likely true.

 

I, numerous times in emails, in texts and in person, warned my OW that I was only in this affair for sex, nothing more. Thank goodness my wife was able to resurrect the emails and phone texts by using a forensic computer analyst.

 

Still, I agree, the OW just truly did not believe what I told her.

 

Why?

 

Well, because she had never loved her husband, ever. It later came out that she only married him for his income. So, she figured I had to feel similarly.

 

But men are totally different from women. Testosterone increases sex drive.e

 

Estrogen has the opposite effect.

 

There is a book that interviews people after a transgender surgery. It was interesting to note that the men who became women said that after receiving estrogen therapy, they were SHOCKED at their loss of libido.

 

The women who became men were SHOCKED at how, after testosterone therapy that their sex drive skyrocketed.

 

I think men and women have different motivations for affairs. Truly.

 

The few men who claim they still obsess about the OW are likely stuck in the never ending honeymoon phase of the affair. In those cases, the OW must be very good at hiding their true personality or the OM, never truly loved his wife, IMO.

 

But, in my experience, men far less often pine over an ended affair. Sometimes it happens, but it does not appear to be the norm among my men friends.

 

Liam. You bring a perspective to these forums which is incredibly valuable. For some reason there are few unfaithful MM writing on forums.

 

All affairs are different. Different people with different natures getting involved for different reasons....(more often than not) with many similarities.

 

I think the "competition" that many OW feel is mostly created by the MM. I don't know of many who say "I love my wife. I just want sex on the side" (& even if they do it's hard to believe). Most feel it's necessary to trash the W to justify their behavior to the OW (& frequently themselves).

 

The thing I frequently read from OW is "He can't love his W or he wouldn't be doing this!". Instinctively I find myself believing the same things. How can someone have a good marriage, a happy home, love AND have an affair?'.

 

I understand OW saying "He chose to work on his M. He threw away the chance of happiness & returned to a blah, passionless, loveless marriage because of the kids, or money or whatever...". It's easier to believe than the alternative.

 

It's heartbreaking as a BS. It must be heartbreaking as an OW.

 

I hear the words, you're not the first MM I've heard say what you do. On some level I kind of understand it. My H says he never imagined I'd ever find out.

 

Maybe it more of a woman thing... My heart can't comprehend how it's possible to love, truly love your W AND tell another woman all those things & do all of those things. I get why so many OW feel the way they do. It's so bloody confusing!

 

I find it easier to empathize with a (single) OW than a WS who has no intention of ever leaving his W because she's his love. I believe it! I just don't get it!

 

(When both WS are married I think it's a bit different....or I've never experienced that & don't analyse it)

Edited March 10, 2016 by Liam1

[wmacbride]

bury a child then we can talk.

 

the sad part of this entire thread is the continued lack of communication. the real question is why you do NOT tell them.

 

 

when I wrote the OP, I was thinking back to things I wish I had said, not necessarily things I wanted to say now, though the two may certainly overlap.

 

As I mentioned in a post above, I am not so great at verbalizing feelings, but am better at writing them out, which is what I did. I started a blog, more for myself than anything else, but it became fairly popular. My former ws read it, and told me that he hadn't realized how bad it had been for me. In effect, it became a defcto form of communication between us about the A.

 

In my case, I couldn't just talk to him face to face, pick up the phone, fire off an email or text to him to tell him how I felt. He was gone for months shortly after i found out he'd had an A, and it all had to be put on hiatus until he came back.

 

There is also the concept that it's not so much the telling the ws about how you felt or still feel as it is wanting them to understand it. I have talked, ad nauseum to my H about it, he has listened, he has empathized, he has been there for me. Has he ever really understood the feelings? Probably not.

 

To make comparison, my friend was in a marriage where her H was physically abusive to her, and we talk about it when she needs to. I can listen, I can empathize, I can provide support, but not having been in that situation myself, will I ever completely understand the depth of how much he has hurt her?

No.

 

To make it worse, we also had an ow who fit the "bunny boiler" model who had fixated on me and trying to get back at me. She is a serial ow who gets a huge ego boost out of being with married guys, but when a bs stands up to her, she can't handle that.

[Liam1]

To make it worse, we also had an ow who fit the "bunny boiler" model who had fixated on me and trying to get back at me. She is a serial ow who gets a huge ego boost out of being with married guys, but when a bs stands up to her, she can't handle that.

 

My experience with the OW has been the same.

 

We have been to the police, to attorneys. She only then stopped stalking and harassing in person.

 

Instead, she now has other people calling and harassing my wife.

 

The police say the best thing to do with a stalker is to ignore, ignore, ignore.

 

Any type of attention positive or negative is viewed as positive attention by the stalker.

 

We never answer the phone, now. My wife's work calls are screened.

[merrmeade]

I love you, I've forgiven you, I want to stay married to you but you have to try harder than you sometimes do. I have to be number 1 in your life and I need to know that I am and most importantly you need to SHOW me that I am. Not just because of the A but because it was always what I needed and you didn't do it - now you must because if you don't I will end our marriage - sooner or later I will feel sufficiently undervalued by you that I will take my chances alone.

 

Your choice. Actions have consequences. And the consequences last a long time.

 

And I have said this once but I won't repeat it again and again. If he can't make the effort to remember, I can't make the effort to stay married.

ALL of this ^^^

[TrustedthenBusted]

bury a child then we can talk.

the sad part of this entire thread is the continued lack of communication. the real question is why you do NOT tell them.

 

I can only imagine. If you are saying you went through that, then I really feel for you. That's the absolute worst thing I can fathom.

 

 

On the communication thing...You know, I think most of us HAVE said these things to our spouses in one way or another. The question wasn't what we (maybe) haven't said, but what we want them to know and understand.

 

I've told my wife that this was the worst thing ever...but I can't say for sure that she really understands that I mean it, or what that's like for me.

 

She also knows if the ever pulled this crap again, I'd be gone. But I don't know for sure if she understands how completely gone from her life I would be.

 

I could say it again...but how do you say something like that and not make it sound like a threat? Better, in my opinion to just hope she never makes me prove it.

[merrmeade]

Former cheater here: My wife said almost these exact words to me many times.

 

The truth is, in my case, and perhaps in many other affairs, that the husband somehow believed that no one would get hurt. They think they will never confess or get caught and life will go on as usual at home and the side thing is, well.........just a side thing. Sex on the side with a willing OW.

 

Personally, I never elevated the OW above my wife. In fact, as crazy as this sounds, I felt sorry for her husband and was so so glad that I was not her husband.

 

I know it's a double standard, but I looked down on her.

 

Men are dogs when it comes to sex, but woman are supposed to be less interested in pure raw sex and more interested in love and all that in order to have sex. I know that sounds crazy, but that is what I was thinking and a lot of men I talk to who had affairs, tell me the same.

 

Although, every now and then there is some guy that claims to have loved the OW. In those cases, I have to wonder why he would stay married.

Thank you for the truth, and pointing out the double standard and all the other facts of the reality, but how do you feel about it? If you think it's obvious, it really is not and I'm not trying to dig at you. Personally THIS is what I want from my WH. When he give me this kind of honesty about why and how he thought it does help. But I also want to hear in detail how he feels. I want to know if it's still about his shame and if any of it is about me - yet.

[Liam1]

Thank you for the truth, and pointing out the double standard and all the other facts of the reality, but how do you feel about it? If you think it's obvious, it really is not and I'm not trying to dig at you. Personally THIS is what I want from my WH. When he give me this kind of honesty about why and how he thought it does help. But I also want to hear in detail how he feels. I want to know if it's still about his shame and if any of it is about me - yet.

 

Merremead:

 

I am not sure of your question. What do I feel about what? The affair, the aftermath, the OW? The wife?

 

I am not sure I feel shame. What I do feel is very stupid. I risked losing someone I love for a meaningless roll in the hay with a woman I did not like or respect. .....A woman I would never ever consider marrying.

 

In my case, at this point, it is really all about my wife, now.

 

Except for the trust issue, in many ways my wife and I are closer than we ever were. Thanks to counseling we now communicate far better and therefore that aspect of the relationship is better.

 

Also, now I run from flirtatious women. As soon as they start going down that road, I simply walk away.

[ladydesigner]

Merremead:

 

I am not sure of your question. What do I feel about what? The affair, the aftermath, the OW? The wife?

 

I am not sure I feel shame. What I do feel is very stupid. I risked losing someone I love for a meaningless roll in the hay with a woman I did not like or respect. .....A woman I would never ever consider marrying.

 

In my case, at this point, it is really all about my wife, now.

 

Except for the trust issue, in many ways my wife and I are closer than we ever were. Thanks to counseling we now communicate far better and therefore that aspect of the relationship is better.

 

Also, now I run from flirtatious women. As soon as they start going down that road, I simply walk away.

 

Liam1 your posts are very nice to read. It's good to hear the really remorseful WS's here. I am glad that R is going well for you and your wife.

[Red123]

Shatteredlady:

 

Thank you for your post. I can see that you are still in pain.

 

I can't answer all your questions, but in my experience in talking to men that had affairs, they complain about the wife, SOMETIMES, to ease their own guilt and to make themselves feel less like the ass they are acting like.

 

SOME, tell the OW they love them because it is obvious that that is what the OW NEEDS to hear to keep the gravy train going.

 

 

 

This logic on the why of why The OW feels in "competition" with the wife is likely true.

 

I, numerous times in emails, in texts and in person, warned my OW that I was only in this affair for sex, nothing more. Thank goodness my wife was able to resurrect the emails and phone texts by using a forensic computer analyst.

 

Still, I agree, the OW just truly did not believe what I told her.

 

Why?

 

Well, because she had never loved her husband, ever. It later came out that she only married him for his income. So, she figured I had to feel similarly.

 

But men are totally different from women. Testosterone increases sex drive.e

 

Estrogen has the opposite effect.

 

There is a book that interviews people after a transgender surgery. It was interesting to note that the men who became women said that after receiving estrogen therapy, they were SHOCKED at their loss of libido.

 

The women who became men were SHOCKED at how, after testosterone therapy that their sex drive skyrocketed.

 

I think men and women have different motivations for affairs. Truly.

 

The few men who claim they still obsess about the OW are likely stuck in the never ending honeymoon phase of the affair. In those cases, the OW must be very good at hiding their true personality or the OM, never truly loved his wife, IMO.

 

But, in my experience, men far less often pine over an ended affair. Sometimes it happens, but it does not appear to be the norm among my men friends.

 

My H has stated that he never thought of the MOW after the A ended unless I brought her up. He stated that he really didn't even like her after about a month(the A was about 3 months) and was already attempting to end things long before I found out. I find it hard to believe that he doesn't have any found memories but he insists that she was clingy, obsessed and really unrealistic. She is also physically not his type and he said the chemistry after about a month was terrible. I don't operate like that at all so I always felt he must be just saying this, but reading your posts maybe that's actually true.

[Liam1]

My H has stated that he never thought of the MOW after the A ended unless I brought her up. He stated that he really didn't even like her after about a month(the A was about 3 months) and was already attempting to end things long before I found out. I find it hard to believe that he doesn't have any found memories but he insists that she was clingy, obsessed and really unrealistic. She is also physically not his type and he said the chemistry after about a month was terrible. I don't operate like that at all so I always felt he must be just saying this, but reading your posts maybe that's actually true.

 

In my experience, based on talking to other men who have had affairs, it is rare for the Married man to truly care about the OW.

 

In a majority of cases, she is just sexually aggressive, available and easy.

 

My Marriage counselor told me that most affairs are initiated by the OW.

 

I have to take the marriage counselor's word for that because in my affair the OW WAS also the initiator. In my business life I have also been approached by women who appear to be looking for affairs throughout my career.

 

My OW and I were one day simply talking as friends and suddenly she started talking about sex toys, and how she liked to watch porn, and then outright mentioned prior affairs and how she was looking to supplement her marriage with another affair. I took the bait.

 

I can not speak for everyone, but my personal truth is that the OW was not someone I was instantly attracted too. I was not even attracted to her at all. She was just attractive enough so that I could consider taking her up on her offer for an affair.

 

I don't recall actually ever liking her. I do recall thinking that she could not hold a candle to my wife in the looks department as well as intellect.

 

She was just sexually available and made that very clear, very quickly.

 

I do think of the OW, but only when posting here or if she makes a stalker contact with my wife.

 

At those times, my thoughts are not flattering ones, and my most common thought is that I wish I never met someone like her, and I am glad my wife is not like her.

Edited March 11, 2016 by Liam1

[TrustedthenBusted]

My H has stated that he never thought of the MOW after the A ended unless I brought her up.

 

Take this to heart. Especially if your husband's affair partner was married or seeing other people.

 

The way it works for many men is this: If a man is really interested in a woman, he generally becomes protective, and possessive. He doesn't want any other man touching her, or garnering her attention. We want to know ( and do our level best to ensure ) that we are the only man she is sleeping with.

 

However, if he doesn't really mind that she is SLEEPING with another man, even if that man is her husband....well, then he probably doesn't mind if she gets hit by a bus either.

 

Very easy to put the latter type out of sight, and mind.

[Red123]

Take this to heart. Especially if your husband's affair partner was married or seeing other people.

 

The way it works for many men is this: If a man is really interested in a woman, he generally becomes protective, and possessive. He doesn't want any other man touching her, or garnering her attention. We want to know ( and do our level best to ensure ) that we are the only man she is sleeping with.

 

However, if he doesn't really mind that she is SLEEPING with another man, even if that man is her husband....well, then he probably doesn't mind if she gets hit by a bus either.

 

Very easy to put the latter type out of sight, and mind.

That's interesting. At the beginning I asked(a few times) if it bothered him she was with her husband because I saw communication where she was livid that he and I were sleeping together. He said it never bothered him and even when she asked he never did because he didn't care. She thought she was destined to be with my H and said she would never sleep with her H while being with mine. When he said your married of course you sleep together, the next week she made up a story about her H finding out about the A and forcing her to sleep with him. We are pretty sure her H never knew. When my H and I split up he was frantic when I went away for a few days that I might sleep with an old boyfriend who was in the area I travelled to. He didn't say it at the time, but told me once we got back together.

[ShatteredLady]

I believe that there are different types of affairs between different people. Of course! Duh!

 

The thing that I notice a lot is single OW seem to think in some way that 'Wives' are a different kind of woman. I think I felt the same way when I was young to a certain degree. I'm a hapless romantic at heart. My M was so very different!

 

As a young woman if your bf cheats on you its natural to think 'He's a bad one' or 'He messed-up' (whatever! Dump him!) but when it's a W being cheated on it must be, to a certain extent, her fault! It's a bad marriage or he wouldn't cheat. Why would he?!?

 

I don't think of myself as old or self absorbed. My marriage isn't some stale, relationship of obligation. (Sometimes deep inside I feel just as I did at 25! I'm not old. I'm shocked that I'm in my 40's. That was so old!). We had/have a love story. We were/are passionate, romantic, soul mates & all that crap still. A ring on my finger hasn't stopped me being a WOMAN.

 

We didn't settle. I'm NOT the "old ball & chain". I'm a woman just like you! Deeply in love with my life partner. Destroyed, broken hearted, insanely stressed, haunted with anxiety & very, very confused....just like a loving single OW. I can't comprehend how the love of my life can make these choices, can do these agonizing things.

 

What's wrong with him!! What we have is REAL!!

 

The OW can't understand why he 'has it all' & throws it away for something shallow like his miserable M. The W can't understand why he 'has it all' & throws it all away for a temporary fling, a meaningless 'high' that he's NEVER going to leave for.

 

We're women. We don't get-it. We think that he's made/is making a huge mistake & will come to his senses. He's lost & confused, feels a responsibility because women's hearts are involved. He will eventually do the right thing for him & his heart because we're 'meant to be', 'have a unique connection' are 'soul mates' & the other relationship is transient & based on shallow things, not LOVE....

 

The single OW & the betrayed W have a lot more in common than we want to see.

[dichotomy]

I have told her many things - some made a difference some did not.

 

 

As for the rest - If I wanted her to know - I would have said it to her. It for the best for me to keep it to myself.

[MidnightBlue1980]

In my experience, based on talking to other men who have had affairs, it is rare for the Married man to truly care about the OW.

 

In a majority of cases, she is just sexually aggressive, available and easy.

 

My Marriage counselor told me that most affairs are initiated by the OW.

 

I have to take the marriage counselor's word for that because in my affair the OW WAS also the initiator. In my business life I have also been approached by women who appear to be looking for affairs throughout my career.

 

My OW and I were one day simply talking as friends and suddenly she started talking about sex toys, and how she liked to watch porn, and then outright mentioned prior affairs and how she was looking to supplement her marriage with another affair. I took the bait.

 

I can not speak for everyone, but my personal truth is that the OW was not someone I was instantly attracted too. I was not even attracted to her at all. She was just attractive enough so that I could consider taking her up on her offer for an affair.

 

I don't recall actually ever liking her. I do recall thinking that she could not hold a candle to my wife in the looks department as well as intellect.

 

She was just sexually available and made that very clear, very quickly.

 

I do think of the OW, but only when posting here or if she makes a stalker contact with my wife.

 

At those times, my thoughts are not flattering ones, and my most common thought is that I wish I never met someone like her, and I am glad my wife is not like her.

 

Liam, you horrify and scare me. I do not mean that in a disrespectful way but more in being so alarmed at how women do not know men are so different from us, how they look down at us. I'm no kid, I wish I knew this stuff about men years ago. It sickens me that men see the world as divided between their wife (virtuous) and other men's wives who stray (definitely not virtuous).

 

In my situation, xMM lured me in with I love yous which were my undoing and he was prepared to continue a LTA for years. After it ended and he showed me what I meant (nothing), my husband said, at least you found this out now, only 5 months, he would have let you waste years and wreck your whole life for him and it would have turned out all the same.

 

I have a very good friend who has listened to my saga and read the equivalent of Moby Dick in my emails about xMM. He has said very similar things as you have and it has opened my eyes. He says men are ruled by testosterone and in xMM's case as he had not had sex or anything in 3 years, he would say anything to have any sort of physical contact. He warned me that you just cannot believe a word men say when they want sex. He said some, not all, will lie to get it, stop at nothing and not care about you, I am just an object. Other guys, he says, are not any more honorable, they are just more direct, and will say they would like to hook up but not play the love card. In any event, he has been instructing me to "put a knife in it" when a guy shows interest and I've been doing it. He says what women view as mean, men view as worthy of respect. He says men respect a married woman who tells them to basically never speak to them again like that.

 

It is disturbing that xMM probably feels for me what you feel for xOW, no respect. I need this tough love because he's coming back with the I love yous, as you saw in my other post, he's still in his celibate marriage, and I admit, women fall for that stuff. I need to believe that he sees me as you would. It's definitely sobering.

Edited March 12, 2016 by MidnightBlue1980

[road]

Liam, you horrify and scare me. I do not mean that in a disrespectful way but more in being so alarmed at how women do not know men are so different from us, how they look down at us. I'm no kid, I wish I knew this stuff about men years ago. It sickens me that men see the world as divided between their wife (virtuous) and other men's wives who stray (definitely not virtuous).

 

 

 

All men do not look down on woman.

All men want to get layed, relayed, overlayed, parlayed, and delayed.

All men would like to do every woman that they find attractive.

 

 

However that does not mean all men will try to have sex every time they see a woman that they find attractive.

 

 

All men do not see all other women as "easy".

[66Charger]

Protective.

 

If you want to know if your man loves you, see how protective (not jealous) he is when the shot hits the fan. When Midnight had a dark day, only one of the men she was with, came looking for her, scouring the planet to find her. Protect her. Even going so far as to contact the other guy, inquiring about her safety.

 

Have you any idea how hard that must have been. No, you really dont.

 

This man who came for you was not the OM. While you are questioning the love of a OM, who wasnt there, you are missing the true love of he who was.

 

That man was your husband. He was protecting you. Thats how a Man shows his love. That was a very strong action that you appear to take for less.

Thats what your BS (and WS) wants you to know. You really don't want to lose that. Better know what you are doing. I am not sure why you still "need to believe", that which actually occured. The man who loves you will hear your call of distress.

 

Just a anonymous LS opinion.

Edited March 12, 2016 by 66Charger

[Mrs. John Adams]

Protective.

 

If you want to know if your man loves you, see how protective (not jealous) he is when the shot hits the fan. When Midnight had a dark day, only one of the men she was with, came looking for her, scouring the planet to find her. Protect her. Even going so far as to contact the other guy, inquiring about her safety.

 

Have you any idea how hard that must have been. No, you really dont.

 

This man who came for you was not the OM. While you are questioning the love of a OM, who wasnt there, you are missing the true love of he who was.

 

That man was your husband. He was protecting you. Thats how a Man shows his love. That was a very strong action that you appear to take for less.

Thats what your BS (and WS) wants you to know. You really don't want to lose that. Better know what you are doing. I am not sure why you still "need to believe", that which actually occured. The man who loves you will hear your call of distress.

 

Just a anonymous LS opinion.

 

66...my dear friend

You are so spot on. Even when i was the most vile....John was my protector. Why? Because he loves me.

 

Oh how I wish I had understood that so many years ago. how I wish when i felt he did not care....i could have seen that he was protecting...always protecting.

[MidnightBlue1980]

Protective.

 

If you want to know if your man loves you, see how protective (not jealous) he is when the shot hits the fan. When Midnight had a dark day, only one of the men she was with, came looking for her, scouring the planet to find her. Protect her. Even going so far as to contact the other guy, inquiring about her safety.

 

Have you any idea how hard that must have been. No, you really dont.

 

This man who came for you was not the OM. While you are questioning the love of a OM, who wasnt there, you are missing the true love of he who was.

 

That man was your husband. He was protecting you. Thats how a Man shows his love. That was a very strong action that you appear to take for less.

Thats what your BS (and WS) wants you to know. You really don't want to lose that. Better know what you are doing. I am not sure why you still "need to believe", that which actually occured. The man who loves you will hear your call of distress.

 

Just a anonymous LS opinion.

 

I'm really touched. You read my posts. Thank you for such a on-point post. You are right. 100%. H was the only one trying to find me, going so far as to try to get ez-pass and the credit card company to tell him my whereabouts. I had forgotten my phone by accident, so I was truly untraceable, gone. He knew me and it was such a dark day I considered just driving off, disappearing forever.

 

I probably shouldn't be married with kids and if he wanted to leave, I'd let him go. But he wants to be here, so you are right. I will try harder.

[66Charger]

Wishing you and your family, well

Edited March 13, 2016 by 66Charger

[Liam1]

Midnight:

 

You should be horrified. I hope it IS a wake up call to you.

 

They may treat them with respect, but that does not mean they actually respect them.

 

But don't take my word for it that most married men who are approached by married women seeking affairs do not love, like or respect the OW.

 

To satisfy your curiosity, why not dress up as a man and go to a men's club or a sporting event where a large percentage of men congregate and listen to the conversations they have about the women they have affairs with

 

If a married man is professing his love for you and it is real but he is still with his wife after about six months or a year of an affair and he is telling you that he does not love his wife but can not leave for money or the kids........He is without a doubt playing you.

 

If a guy is still calling you after dday perhaps in a very small percentage of cases he is truly not in love with his wife, but then the question you need to ask yourself is why is he not man enough to set her free and to divorce her and marry you? If he loved you, why would he string you along like that. If he does not love his wife, why would he make his life miserable and stay with her.

 

The truth is most likely that he just wants his cake and eat it too.

 

Sex with some strange is exciting to men. Women really want love and romance.

 

I resisted advances from sexually aggressive married woman seeking affairs for most of my marriage. I only took the bait once.

 

But I assure you, I did not respect the woman's choice. I treated her with respect, but I was glad I was not her husband.

 

My affair partner was a serial cheater and her first affair partner's marriage ended in divorce. When it did he broke off with her and two years later married someone else.

 

She claims he had told her he loved her, but if he did, why did he not marry her when his marriage broke up? Instead of marrying his affair partner after his marriage broke up. He broke off with his affair partner and later started dating someone new.

 

 

Liam, you horrify and scare me. I do not mean that in a disrespectful way but more in being so alarmed at how women do not know men are so different from us, how they look down at us. I'm no kid, I wish I knew this stuff about men years ago. It sickens me that men see the world as divided between their wife (virtuous) and other men's wives who stray (definitely not virtuous).

 

In my situation, xMM lured me in with I love yous which were my undoing and he was prepared to continue a LTA for years. After it ended and he showed me what I meant (nothing), my husband said, at least you found this out now, only 5 months, he would have let you waste years and wreck your whole life for him and it would have turned out all the same.

 

I have a very good friend who has listened to my saga and read the equivalent of Moby Dick in my emails about xMM. He has said very similar things as you have and it has opened my eyes. He says men are ruled by testosterone and in xMM's case as he had not had sex or anything in 3 years, he would say anything to have any sort of physical contact. He warned me that you just cannot believe a word men say when they want sex. He said some, not all, will lie to get it, stop at nothing and not care about you, I am just an object. Other guys, he says, are not any more honorable, they are just more direct, and will say they would like to hook up but not play the love card. In any event, he has been instructing me to "put a knife in it" when a guy shows interest and I've been doing it. He says what women view as mean, men view as worthy of respect. He says men respect a married woman who tells them to basically never speak to them again like that.

 

It is disturbing that xMM probably feels for me what you feel for xOW, no respect. I need this tough love because he's coming back with the I love yous, as you saw in my other post, he's still in his celibate marriage, and I admit, women fall for that stuff. I need to believe that he sees me as you would. It's definitely sobering.

[MidnightBlue1980]

Midnight:

 

You should be horrified. I hope it IS a wake up call to you.

 

They may treat them with respect, but that does not mean they actually respect them.

 

But don't take my word for it that most married men who are approached by married women seeking affairs do not love, like or respect the OW.

 

To satisfy your curiosity, why not dress up as a man and go to a men's club or a sporting event where a large percentage of men congregate and listen to the conversations they have about the women they have affairs with

 

If a married man is professing his love for you and it is real but he is still with his wife after about six months or a year of an affair and he is telling you that he does not love his wife but can not leave for money or the kids........He is without a doubt playing you.

 

If a guy is still calling you after dday perhaps in a very small percentage of cases he is truly not in love with his wife, but then the question you need to ask yourself is why is he not man enough to set her free and to divorce her and marry you? If he loved you, why would he string you along like that. If he does not love his wife, why would he make his life miserable and stay with her.

 

The truth is most likely that he just wants his cake and eat it too.

 

Sex with some strange is exciting to men. Women really want love and romance.

 

I resisted advances from sexually aggressive married woman seeking affairs for most of my marriage. I only took the bait once.

 

But I assure you, I did not respect the woman's choice. I treated her with respect, but I was glad I was not her husband.

 

My affair partner was a serial cheater and her first affair partner's marriage ended in divorce. When it did he broke off with her and two years later married someone else.

 

She claims he had told her he loved her, but if he did, why did he not marry her when his marriage broke up? Instead of marrying his affair partner after his marriage broke up. He broke off with his affair partner and later started dating someone new.

 

As a woman, I feel for your AP. I see you look at her with disdain but I see a woman who is searching for something in all the wrong places. Women are now pushed to ask like we are men, capable of handling casual sex, but we (mostly) are not. We get attached. Underneath the bravado, we feel a great deal and we fall in love when we get intimate.

 

Men are different too. You don't typically fall in love, unless you are really in love with the person. It's all very sad.

 

I cannot relate to the feeling of using someone but I believe you that he was using me. I have heard it from H and two other male friends who know us both. I trust men's opinions on other men. My good friend calls him "the weasel". xMM knows my friend knows and he will not look him in the eyes and only looks at the floor. He won't approach me when my friend is standing next to me but as soon as he walks away, he comes right over.

 

Why he would purposely use me, I guess its for sex, he is not getting it. But I am wiser now. It still does hurt but I guess that is what separates me from the animals.

[katielee]

All men want to get layed, relayed, overlayed, parlayed, and delayed.

All men would like to do every woman that they find attractive

 

Really concerning... Not sure I believe

[MidnightBlue1980]

Really concerning... Not sure I believe

 

It's true. I have had several guy friends tell me this. I am learning about who men really are. NOW, they don't all act on it, many love their wives and they resist...but they are not like us. You have to not think of men as women with a p*nis. They are entirely different beings.