Author yxalitis Posted March 4, 2016 Author Posted March 4, 2016 I read this thread with interest because I am an Asian woman. From what I read, I gather that you are more attracted to J. I would suggest: 1) back off on the physical part with both, and continue to get to know each woman. Really, you know little about them. G already "suggested that you can't kiss anyone else now...". I think there's a cultural issue here. You think you are not making a commitment, but hey, kissing is in Asian's eyes. You just don't go around and kiss multiple people, ok? It is really important to know how a person deal with frustration which can only be revealed when the opportunities arise. 2)quit seeing one of them now and take a chance. You will be making your best guess on who will make the best partner for you. To do that, It is very important to know what is important to you and how important the attributes are. For example, social awkwardness how important is that to your life? For me, it comes down to 3C: Chemistry, Compatibility, Communication. When I can't decide who to date (1st date), I secretly "grade" them on each then compare total score. The highest score wins!! :-)) Problem solved. Thank you very much for you insight, it's very helpful. It seems G likes me more, but I like J more... So J and I had our dinner date last night. She revealed over dinner that both her marriage and her ex were somewhat abusive relationships. Sher didn't go into details and changed the subject. About her most recent ex she said she "kept going back to him, but this time will be different" We didn't talk about ex's much to be honest, it was a great night, I enjoy her company, we get along very well, and the conversation is very good. Over dinner she had asked for help moving some plants, and offered to help me pack and move on Sunday. But I have some nagging doubts about her ability to have a normal, healthy relationship. Her ex was a misogynistic, dominating, selfish person, who forced sex on her within two weeks. But, here's the thing I don't get, having been forced to have sex, she decided to stay with him, as they had that level of intimacy now... Huh? Isn't that rape? Don't you report that to the police and get a restraining order? Is she only capable of feeling emotion for abusive people?? Under what set of circumstances do you fall in love with what is effectively your rapist? So after dinner I walked her to her car. And... She refused a kiss, absolutely adamantly. I talked to her...holding her gently trying to reassure her that it's: "just a kiss" "Don't think this doesn't mean I don't like you, I do like you... it's just too early, later on sure, not problem, but I don't want what happened last time to happen again" "Are you not going to help now, to punish me for not kissing you?" I didn't answer, I just hugged her goodbye, and drove home. I know, I should have just let her go, right? Too much trouble, too hard! Go for the easy girl who obviously likes you, who you like, and who doesn't have all this baggage... I decided to ring her when I got home... I'll help her tomorrow, and talk to her as well... God help me, why do I always go for the troubled girls??
Jabron1 Posted March 5, 2016 Posted March 5, 2016 yxaltis, I like you, and I don't want to piss you off anymore than I already have. If you want me to tell you what I think, warts and all, I will. If not, I'll bugger off
Author yxalitis Posted March 5, 2016 Author Posted March 5, 2016 yxaltis, I like you, and I don't want to piss you off anymore than I already have. If you want me to tell you what I think, warts and all, I will. If not, I'll bugger off Please share your thoughts Jabron, I have a feeling i know what you will say anyway.. But I'll share today's developments first. J has organised my delivery for $100 less than my best attempt...Chinese connections and haggling... We went to look at the trees she wanted, but they were the type that have deep roots in a massive ball, it would have taken much too long to dig it out, so we just went and had coffee instead. Over coffee I asked her why she didn't report him after the assault. She said it wasn't totally like that, she did accept him, but he was very pushy and forceful about it...it wasn't rape per se, but she still felt very pressured by him... I then asked her the more pointed question of why she stayed with him after that? She answered that it is her nature to be with the man she is intimate with, no matter how that occurred...she's only been intimate with her ex husband and this ex bf, who was her first relationship after 16 years. We then just chatted about normal things, when she abruptly said "I don't want to go home yet, and want to spend more time with you" She said: "Let's go and pack!" Like, that was exciting for her... So, we did, she helped me pack up for hours, then we sat in my room, and I offered her a foot massage. She agreed, washed her feet, then lay on the bed. I ended up giving her a full body massage, clothed, which she enjoyed. Then we went on a walk, halfway we sat down and talked again, about her feelings towards relationships etc. (Paraphrasing like a mofo here): "I know I can get a man easy, but I don't want that, I want to find someone I can connect with, someone I can spend a long time with and enjoy the company. Like just now packing, working out how to do it, working together, this is how I grow close to someone...not by physically touching, holding hands, kissing, but be being together and learning about them. Making love with someone after you are IN love is profound, it's amazing." "Are you prepared to wait for me, are you sure when so many of your past relationships have happened so quick..." "I might not be your cup of tea" Well, that was a short summary of about 30 minutes talking. We walked back to her car, and on the way she said: "I've had such a good time today with you, you are great company, I enjoy spending time with you" We have now spent 6 days together since last Saturday...which is surprising as it just seems so natural. If I wanted a quick relationship with a woman totally into me, I'd go with G, who is fun, happy, sexy, beautiful...in fact now I've massaged J, I discovered G has a better body... So why aren't I... I dunno...because I like drama? Hey, at this stage both woman are still in play...I haven't burnt any bridges with either... I honestly don't know either of them well enough to know for sure which one is more suitable for me... But I know I want to explore each for longer... Both are truly amazing woman with different outlooks on love and life. Can't I have both?
Author yxalitis Posted March 6, 2016 Author Posted March 6, 2016 (edited) I saw G on the Sunday... She is VERY keen on me, she was pretty disappointed I hadn't seen her since Thursday, and pretty much insisted I see her on Sunday. We went on a winery tour, which in Melbourne means an area called Yarra Glen, a fair hike out (40km). This was her suggestion, and was a great idea. We had a great day, she took so many selfies of us it's almost ridiculous. (J never does this, she took a photo of her dinner on Friday night, but never of us.) After about 5 hours I drove her hone, ...but when she realised I was nearly at her house he turned to me. "What! No, I want to stay with you..." "I have to go home and pack the last of my things" "I want to help you!" This means a 30 minute trip to my place, then another back to drop her off, then a return trip...*sigh! But I hate to disappoint people, so I agree... She does help me, and there was more work than I thought... But finally I've got everything ready, and we lie on the bed, exhausted. I'm so hot and sweaty she suggest I have a shower, so i do. Now I'm on the bed with her, clean, just in my shorts, and she starts to get frisky. OK, we got pretty hot and heavy. she ended up in her underwear...but we don't have sex. I drop her off, come home, and all I can think of is J. Damn...I thought after that G would be front in my mind... The problem with G is we just can't talk like I can with J J has all 3 'C's although the Chemistry is perhaps one sided at this stage... G is lacking the Communication aspect...and I'm sorry, but that's important. She also seems a little needy. AND she also told me her visa ends this year, then she has to return to China She even said that I could go live with her in China... NOPE! So if the time with G is limited to 9 months...that's not really what I want. Edited March 6, 2016 by yxalitis
Jabron1 Posted March 6, 2016 Posted March 6, 2016 (edited) Over coffee I asked her why she didn't report him after the assault. She said it wasn't totally like that, she did accept him I could have told you that. She's talking bollocks. Look, women categorize men in one of three ways: 1. The lover 2. The provider 3. The friend I don't accept anything less than #1. My whole game is about being number 1. I walk away from anything less than that. It sounds like you are number 1 in G's eyes. But you are number 2 or 3 in J's eyes. With a different guy, she would be sleeping with him much sooner. She's talking bollocks and needs to be dumped. I need to tell you about one of the girls I'm currently seeing. This is a typical case, and a good example of how the game works. So, a girl I'm seeing has multiple suitors. She won't commit to anyone. She has guys following her on Facebook, giving her attention, listening to her problems, running her about, and helping her do stuff. She has her landlord running her about in a Lamborghini and taking her out on shopping trips. Yet, I will offer her nothing but a good time. If she doesn't like it, she can f' off. I get laid for doing very little, and I get respected - because I act like a man, and that puts me well above the other guys. Sure, I have to keep my game tight, and she constantly tests me to see what she can get away with. But I get what I want, because I won't settle for anything less. These other guys get exploited, because they are playing the sort of game that you are. Sometimes she even has one of these orbiters drive her to meet me. They are delivering her to me. How pathetic is that? Women do not respect nice-guys; they exploit them. Sure, be nice. But do it from a position of strength. To be course, you're either her boyfriend or her girlfriend. If you're not f'ing her, you're her girlfriend. I would start fading on her. She would have to up her game considerably to keep me around. Understand that women are playing a game too. She will do as much as she feels necessary to keep you around. She has deemed that it isn't necessary to kiss you. You're already on the hook. She will lose her respect for you as a man, then she'll get bored and end up with someone else. A jerk like me will come along and screw her in the first couple of dates. You'll think 'but I did all this stuff for her!' Doesn't matter. That's not how sexual attraction works. Alpha f'ks; beta bucks. If you aren't her alpha, walk away and spend time with another girl. Edited March 7, 2016 by Jabron1
Author yxalitis Posted March 7, 2016 Author Posted March 7, 2016 I could have told you that. She's talking bollocks. Look, women categorize men in one of three ways: 1. The lover 2. The provider 3. The friend I don't accept anything less than #1. My whole game is about being number 1. I walk away from anything less than that. It sounds like you are number 1 in G's eyes. But you are number 2 or 3 in J's eyes. With a different guy, she would be sleeping with him much sooner. She's talking bollocks and needs to be dumped. I need to tell you about one of the girls I'm currently seeing. This is a typical case, and a good example of how the game works. So, a girl I'm seeing has multiple suitors. She won't commit to anyone. She has guys following her on Facebook, giving her attention, listening to her problems, running her about, and helping her do stuff. She has her landlord running her about in a Lamborghini and taking her out on shopping trips. Yet, I will offer her nothing but a good time. If she doesn't like it, she can f' off. I get laid for doing very little, and I get respected - because I act like a man, and that puts me well above the other guys. Sure, I have to keep my game tight, and she constantly tests me to see what she can get away with. But I get what I want, because I won't settle for anything less. These other guys get exploited, because they are playing the sort of game that you are. Sometimes she even has one of these orbiters drive her to meet me. They are delivering her to me. How pathetic is that? Women do not respect nice-guys; they exploit them. Sure, be nice. But do it from a position of strength. To be course, you're either her boyfriend or her girlfriend. If you're not f'ing her, you're her girlfriend. I would start fading on her. She would have to up her game considerably to keep me around. Understand that women are playing a game too. She will do as much as she feels necessary to keep you around. She has deemed that it isn't necessary to kiss you. You're already on the hook. She will lose her respect for you as a man, then she'll get bored and end up with someone else. A jerk like me will come along and screw her in the first couple of dates. You'll think 'but I did all this stuff for her!' Doesn't matter. That's not how sexual attraction works. Alpha f'ks; beta bucks. If you aren't her alpha, walk away and spend time with another girl. That is EXACTLY what I was thinking, and I've had another woman Id ated a while ago do much the same...we were on a "no-sex until I'm ready" relationship, but passionate kissing and fondling was OK... Then a week after asking me to go away on a weekend with her to "get to know each other more, but not to sleep together " (Riiiight...) she abruptly ended our relationship because (in reality) she chose the other guy... He ended up being a jealous prick, and when she broke up with him, he assaulted her... I can see that happening with J..for all her talk about taking it slow, the last guy f'ed her on the second week, and she ended up with him for 9 months. I STILL don't know how that works...I mean, seriously? When I gave her the massage, it got pretty intimate, nothing overtly sexual (I didn't ouch her anywhere inappropriate, but I got damn close). As we talked afterwards I said that the massage was a good way to get intimate, she disagreed! "Actually, that made me uncomfortable" (She certainly didn't seem that way during the massage). "I'll respect you more if we keep the physical contact to a minimum" This is my game plan for her...(Yeah, I do think she's worth pursuing...even though you disagree) I've invited her over for dinner on Wednesday... It will be champagne and Seafood Laksa, I'm cooking. If I still get cockblocked, I'll end it. Two weeks and 8 dates is enough to kiss someone.
Jabron1 Posted March 7, 2016 Posted March 7, 2016 "I'll respect you more if we keep the physical contact to a minimum" Wow, just wow. She is talking complete nonsense. Always focus on a woman's actions - not her words. And always escalate. Two weeks and 8 dates is enough to kiss someone. It's insane. I think even the women here will agree with me on that. To clarify, I'm not saying don't be a good person. I'm saying respect is paramount. Those other guys sound like horrible people (though I would take what she says about her ex's with a grain of salt), but she probably respected them. Only do good deeds for people who respect you. If someone doesn't respect you, and you start doing nice things to try and win their favour, their opinion of you will only lower. 1
Author yxalitis Posted March 7, 2016 Author Posted March 7, 2016 Wow, just wow. She is talking complete nonsense. Always focus on a woman's actions - not her words. And always escalate. It's insane. I think even the women here will agree with me on that. To clarify, I'm not saying don't be a good person. I'm saying respect is paramount. Those other guys sound like horrible people (though I would take what she says about her ex's with a grain of salt), but she probably respected them. Only do good deeds for people who respect you. If someone doesn't respect you, and you start doing nice things to try and win their favour, their opinion of you will only lower. UPDATE: J has just agreed to go to a luxury hotel with me in April, including in room spa.
Jabron1 Posted March 7, 2016 Posted March 7, 2016 UPDATE: J has just agreed to go to a luxury hotel with me in April, including in room spa. Be honest: are you taking her to a luxury hotel as a way of having sex? Are you planning on that being the big moment?
Author yxalitis Posted March 7, 2016 Author Posted March 7, 2016 Be honest: are you taking her to a luxury hotel as a way of having sex? Are you planning on that being the big moment? It's a month away, she obviously wouldn't have agreed (and quite happily,with enthusiasm), if she doesn't expect things to develop before then. She made sure it was a good date for her (school holidays) which actually brought the day closer. I've already mentioned how much I love sharing a glass of champagne in a spa, with candles all around, (you know: that romantic nonsense that "doesn't work"), so she knows that will be on the cards this night... I am a charmer Jabron, maybe I don't get laid as often as I would if I was more of a player. But I've had my fair share of quick sex, leading to quick relationships, that just burn me out. I have G if I wanted that, CAN have that...she's sexy, hot, passionate, and totally into me... But I can't explain more that...I see J as someone worth pursuing... True, you've have dumped her after one date, I imagine you give up after any person fails to accept your escalating tactics... But how many of those people could have turned out to be amazing partners, not just amazing lays?
Jabron1 Posted March 7, 2016 Posted March 7, 2016 It's a month away, she obviously wouldn't have agreed (and quite happily,with enthusiasm), if she doesn't expect things to develop before then. She made sure it was a good date for her (school holidays) which actually brought the day closer. I've already mentioned how much I love sharing a glass of champagne in a spa, with candles all around, (you know: that romantic nonsense that "doesn't work"), so she knows that will be on the cards this night... I am a charmer Jabron, maybe I don't get laid as often as I would if I was more of a player. But I've had my fair share of quick sex, leading to quick relationships, that just burn me out. I have G if I wanted that, CAN have that...she's sexy, hot, passionate, and totally into me... But I can't explain more that...I see J as someone worth pursuing... True, you've have dumped her after one date, I imagine you give up after any person fails to accept your escalating tactics... But how many of those people could have turned out to be amazing partners, not just amazing lays? Mate, as long as you have lots of money, and that sort of thing is just part of your lifestyle and she's just tagging along, all is good. She's just entering your world. That's normal. But, I don't think it's ever a good idea to try and impress a woman with money - that's all. When I hear words like 'luxurious', alarm bells go off in my head. Most of my dates only cost around £30 Anyway, I got to get some sleep. Tomorrow I'm going out on the hunt, because I've got the day off, and I plan on ditching that girl I talked about a couple of posts back. Might start a journal about it...
Author yxalitis Posted March 7, 2016 Author Posted March 7, 2016 But, I don't think it's ever a good idea to try and impress a woman with money - that's all. When I hear words like 'luxurious', alarm bells go off in my head. Most of my dates only cost around £30 You've never dated a Chinese woman I take it...
SammySammy Posted March 7, 2016 Posted March 7, 2016 Very interesting thread. I just wanted to ask if you feel that you can have sex with G, why haven't you?
Author yxalitis Posted March 7, 2016 Author Posted March 7, 2016 Very interesting thread. I just wanted to ask if you feel that you can have sex with G, why haven't you? Because I don't want to get involved with her, then break up with her because I "found someone better" I don't want to hurt anymore people...
AMJ Posted March 7, 2016 Posted March 7, 2016 Most of my dates only cost around £30 Anyway, I got to get some sleep. Tomorrow I'm going out on the hunt, because I've got the day off, and I plan on ditching that girl I talked about a couple of posts back. Might start a journal about it... 30 euro! That's the cost of 2 drinks in most places here. CA is way too expensive. I was about to say- why are you messing around with that girl you described, Jabron...she sounds like she's a little game player too. And too much trouble for sex. But more importantly, I think OP has a different motive than you do. I don't think he has any trouble attracting or keeping women around, or getting laid...I think he's looking for a relationship. To me it sounds like OP can have a relationship with either of these women. I don't get why he can't pick between the two. They're completely different people- albeit both sexy former dancers- but don't you click more with one than the other?
Jabron1 Posted March 7, 2016 Posted March 7, 2016 You've never dated a Chinese woman I take it... I haven't actually. But, I've dated enough nationalities (including Asians) to know that women are wired the same. Cultural differences are negligible.
Jabron1 Posted March 7, 2016 Posted March 7, 2016 I was about to say- why are you messing around with that girl you described, Jabron...she sounds like she's a little game player too. And too much trouble for sex. She's a very good game player, but a piss-poor human being. She's a good looking girl, and the sex is very good - I'll give her that much. She also keeps my game razor sharp. But, more importantly, I'm getting complacent. I have to admit it. And, I have to rectify it. It's getting to the point where keeping her in my orbit is contrary to my dignity. So, she's getting ditched.
Author yxalitis Posted March 7, 2016 Author Posted March 7, 2016 30 euro! That's the cost of 2 drinks in most places here. CA is way too expensive. I was about to say- why are you messing around with that girl you described, Jabron...she sounds like she's a little game player too. And too much trouble for sex. But more importantly, I think OP has a different motive than you do. I don't think he has any trouble attracting or keeping women around, or getting laid...I think he's looking for a relationship. To me it sounds like OP can have a relationship with either of these women. I don't get why he can't pick between the two. They're completely different people- albeit both sexy former dancers- but don't you click more with one than the other? I do, it's J. But, it's early days, and you know how people can reveal aspects of themselves as your progress in a relationship...things that aren't so good...?
Gershwin Posted March 7, 2016 Posted March 7, 2016 Man, you're not being honest with both women & they, especially G, most likely think you are not seeing anyone else (not correcting her 'boyfriend' comment was misleading). You're not multiple dating, you're juggling. And it's plain that neither woman is right for you if you want long term relationship & you'll end up hurting both and yourself. Maybe take a break from dating them & decide what you want first. Also do you just want to date exclusively Chinese women or was that a coincidence? 1
AMJ Posted March 7, 2016 Posted March 7, 2016 I do, it's J. But, it's early days, and you know how people can reveal aspects of themselves as your progress in a relationship...things that aren't so good...? I do know. But, that's the risk we all take, right? There's going to be bad traits about anyone you end up with. I say put all your focus on J and don't ditch the other one completely...just prioritize.
Jabron1 Posted March 7, 2016 Posted March 7, 2016 (edited) I think it's fair to say that your multi-dating experiment is over - at least for now. You've pretty much ruled out G, and you've gone all in on J. Do the fair thing and let G go. I strongly recommend that you develop more options elsewhere though and soon. Edited March 7, 2016 by Jabron1
SammySammy Posted March 7, 2016 Posted March 7, 2016 I think it's fair to say that your multi-dating experiment is over - at least for now. You've pretty much ruled out G, and you've gone all in on J. Do the fair thing and let G go. I strongly recommend that you develop more options elsewhere though and soon. I've been thinking along the same lines. Two weeks is too soon to be choosing between two women. He needs more time. And more options.
Author yxalitis Posted March 7, 2016 Author Posted March 7, 2016 I think it's fair to say that your multi-dating experiment is over - at least for now. You've pretty much ruled out G, and you've gone all in on J. Do the fair thing and let G go. I strongly recommend that you develop more options elsewhere though and soon. Yeah, right now the last thing I need is MORE f&cking options... These woman aren't just my dates, they occupy all my time! I've seen J on Saturday, Sunday, Monday, Wednesday, Friday, Saturday. I will see her tonight (Tuesday), Wednesday, and one of the weekend days. I've seen G on the Tuesday, Thursday, Friday, Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday, and she popped over last night to give me dinner as I was moving. When EXACTLY Am I supposed to fit new girl in that mix? J helped me pack on the Saturday, then I gave her a very intimate massage. I consider that an escalation in Jabron's terms, I was massaging her bare bum in a G-string. G INSISTED on coming over on the Sunday (To the bemusement of my flatmates) to ALSO help pack, we got a bit frisky on the bed... I do have to at least slow down with G...a LOT... And I do have a reason...she's only got 9 months on her Visa... I will tell her i don't want to fall in love with someone who can't stay. Besides the dinner she brought...pickled chicken legs and duck legs...yuck! On Wednesday J is coming to my place for a dinner and champagne to celebrate my new place, we'll talk as we always do for ages...
Author yxalitis Posted March 7, 2016 Author Posted March 7, 2016 I do know. But, that's the risk we all take, right? There's going to be bad traits about anyone you end up with. I say put all your focus on J and don't ditch the other one completely...just prioritize. Exactly what I'm doing.
joseb Posted March 7, 2016 Posted March 7, 2016 I don't get why or how you are spending every day with these women. That would drive me nuts. I have 2 days a week where I'd meet up with girls, the rest of the time is for the other parts of my life 2
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