unluckie Posted February 25, 2016 Posted February 25, 2016 I have a long term friend who I am falling in love with but who is pulling away from from me. In a nutshell we've been friends for over 9 years. We developed a deep friendship over the years but about 18 months ago things changed. He started calling me a lot more than he used to before, and in one conversation told me how he was finally at that point in his life where he wanted a serious relationship. One day, soon after, he invited me to visit him (different city) and took me out to dinner (nothing unusual in that) and asked me if I was happy being single, or if I was looking for a relationship. I told him I was happy being single, which I was. At the moment I wasn't sure if he was hinting or if he was just chatting but I wasn't attracted to him so let it go. Although almost immediately after that (I dunno if it's because he put the idea in my mind) but I started really liking him. I called him a couple of times after that as he had gone a little cold and after that he started calling again. To cut yet another long story short about 6 months ago we took a trip, just us. Throughout the trip nothing happened AT ALL between us and I figured I'd misunderstood the whole situation and that maybe he didn't feel that way about me. I'm really bad at giving signals and I did not give him deliberate signals as I was wavering about whether I wanted to be with him or not, but I may have done so subconsiously I couldn't know. I am not a flirt at all so it's not likely. Again, I'll cut this short, but since the trip he's been calling me a little less but still keeping in some contact. Now, for the last two months he's gone completely cold. Zero calls and we've only spoken because I caved twice and called him. I even arranged to meet him as I was sent to a work event near his workplace (we live in different states) and he agreed but said that he had this event out of town, but he would try to be back. He then texted me during the day to say he would be back a little late and then called me just before we were due to meet to say he was still driving. He said I could take a later flight if I wanted and stay for him to get back to get dinner(WTF??) and I obviously said no and flew home as planned. I would assume its common courtesy is to call the friend you bailed on and he totally would have done that in the past, called me the very next day to apologise and to check how my trip had been, but not this time! I have heard nothing from him. What is going one? You do not treat a friend of 9 years like this, and a very very good friend at that. I'm interpreting it as one of two. Either he liked me and is now pulling away because he doesn't see things happening, or if he's got a girlfriend he hasn't told me about. Or he senses I now really like him and is pulling away so I don't make a move on him? I am just so confused and miserable about it. I really miss him. The whole point of this thread is that I am falling hopelessly in love with him. Do you think he ever liked me? And if he did and now doesn't or never did, is there any going back? We are clearly not friends anymore (he has gone so cold) so I guess I've got nothing to lose. I'm trying to figure what the optimum way of doing something to move this along is. I could let it go, but I think I will regret it if I do and I really think he has decided we're not friends anymore so there is no point in not doing anything because of preserving the friendship.
Satu Posted February 25, 2016 Posted February 25, 2016 All you can do is talk to him, and tell him what you've just told us. If you don't, all you'll have is uncertainty. 2
ExpatInItaly Posted February 25, 2016 Posted February 25, 2016 My guess is that he did have feelings for you in the past, but now has met someone else. Because you have been friends so long, I would just ask him what's up. I would not do so in a confrontational way, but simply say you've noticed the friendship has cooled considerably and were wondering if there's something on his mind. Let him fill in the blanks. Then you'll at least have an answer and won't be stuck wondering what the heck happened. 1
Author unluckie Posted February 26, 2016 Author Posted February 26, 2016 I have a horrible feeling he may have met someone else. This may not be the case because he has never mentioned any other girl to me but even if it is I feel like I really need to do something to see if he feels the same way. Would it be a little weird to just see him for the first time in months and tell him I'm falling in love with him? I don't know how else to play it. He has gone so cold that we barely speak on the phone anymore and we don't meet much anyway coz we're in different states. It's impossible to crank up the flirting and see what happens 'naturally'.
ExpatInItaly Posted February 26, 2016 Posted February 26, 2016 I have a horrible feeling he may have met someone else. This may not be the case because he has never mentioned any other girl to me but even if it is I feel like I really need to do something to see if he feels the same way. Would it be a little weird to just see him for the first time in months and tell him I'm falling in love with him? I don't know how else to play it. He has gone so cold that we barely speak on the phone anymore and we don't meet much anyway coz we're in different states. It's impossible to crank up the flirting and see what happens 'naturally'. Yes, that's too much. I would follow the suggestion I made in my earlier post. Just say you've noticed he's been pretty quiet and you're wondering what's up. You've been friends for 9 years. You should feel comfortable asking that. 1
Author unluckie Posted February 26, 2016 Author Posted February 26, 2016 Yes, that's too much. I would follow the suggestion I made in my earlier post. Just say you've noticed he's been pretty quiet and you're wondering what's up. You've been friends for 9 years. You should feel comfortable asking that. I tried last time I spoke to him. I didn't make a big deal out of it, I just said 'I'm just checking you're still alive. I never hear from you anymore, what's up?' He didn't even answer, he was quiet for like a second said 'mmm' and then he just changed the subject completely. We talked for like 20 minutes more and then he started yawning in a really exaggerated way so I was like 'ok, you'd better go sleep' and that was the last I heard from him I will try and ask him again, ask him why he's gone cool. But I know him so well I know exactly what he'll say, he'll just go, 'I haven't cooled at all. I'm just super busy.' He will not talk about his feelings no matter what. I guess I can try. I need to know if it's a 100 % never going to happen, or if there's a chance. If it's a no I can try to move on. I guess at the moment it looks like a 100% never going to happen
ExpatInItaly Posted February 26, 2016 Posted February 26, 2016 I tried last time I spoke to him. I didn't make a big deal out of it, I just said 'I'm just checking you're still alive. I never hear from you anymore, what's up?' He didn't even answer, he was quiet for like a second said 'mmm' and then he just changed the subject completely. We talked for like 20 minutes more and then he started yawning in a really exaggerated way so I was like 'ok, you'd better go sleep' and that was the last I heard from him I will try and ask him again, ask him why he's gone cool. But I know him so well I know exactly what he'll say, he'll just go, 'I haven't cooled at all. I'm just super busy.' He will not talk about his feelings no matter what. I guess I can try. I need to know if it's a 100 % never going to happen, or if there's a chance. If it's a no I can try to move on. I guess at the moment it looks like a 100% never going to happen If you've already tried to talk to him and he wasn't responsive, I think you need to start finding your own closure. You can't force him to open up if he doesn't want to. If you feel you really need to know, just ask him what he's been up to, how work's going, if he's met someone special, blah blah. I have a feeling he has. 1
brokengirl85 Posted February 26, 2016 Posted February 26, 2016 Hi I think he Never liked you to begin with. Sorry :_( You took that question about you being single and imagined a whole different story. He's treating you like one would treat a friend. You don't feel obligated to communicate every day, or to ask how your trip was every single time. You both are friends!! You could have just texted him your trip was fine! Why are you making things difficult? This guy has zero romantic interest on you. He doesn't see you as a female in a romantic way. He might guess your feelings have changed for him and he's going cold because he might feel uncomfortable. You need to set priorities here. Keep him as a friend and forget the whole romantic thing, or try to seduce him with the risk of losing your friendship and, moreover, with almost no chance he'll reciprocate. 1
Erik30 Posted February 26, 2016 Posted February 26, 2016 I think he used you for your attention when he was feeling lonely. He probably met someone, so now he doesn't need you anymore and prefers to spend his time with the new girl.
smackie9 Posted February 26, 2016 Posted February 26, 2016 I think he wasn't feeling anything from you so he just backed off. He hinted, and you admitted that you were not attracted to him and he got that, that's why he went cold. Through out your post there was nothing in there that you expressed interest or made yourself look very available....you took a flight home instead of delaying and have dinner. No interested woman would be miffed about him being late, and would have made the compromise to see him. To him this was not a good sign coming from you. If you want a man to approach you, want you, you need to flirt like the dickens, dress sexy, use your body language to show that you are interested. If you don't put it out there they will not come to you. 3
smudge21 Posted February 26, 2016 Posted February 26, 2016 I'd say he reached out, tested the water and you rejected the idea. After being friends for that long, can you imagine the nerves involved to actually have feelings for someone but you know that if you do the wrong thing, you risk losing a long term friend. Well, you can, because you're there right now. So speak to him, find out. Yes, he may have someone else, but then again, he may not. This may be two people who deep down, after 9 years, want more but each is too afraid to ruin what they currently have. Obviously, none of us can know for sure, only you and him know the answer here. Surely though, after this long your friendship is strong enough to be able to be honest with each other. 3
brokengirl85 Posted February 27, 2016 Posted February 27, 2016 I'd say he reached out, tested the water and you rejected the idea. After being friends for that long, can you imagine the nerves involved to actually have feelings for someone but you know that if you do the wrong thing, you risk losing a long term friend. Well, you can, because you're there right now. So speak to him, find out. Yes, he may have someone else, but then again, he may not. This may be two people who deep down, after 9 years, want more but each is too afraid to ruin what they currently have. Obviously, none of us can know for sure, only you and him know the answer here. Surely though, after this long your friendship is strong enough to be able to be honest with each other. Really? Are you implying that a simple question as if she liked being single is testing the waters? This kind of comments let OP imagination flow and believe he rejected her because she said she was ok single. No good. If he was interested, she would had noticed in a VERY strong way, not with a simple question anyone could ask to anyone. If a guy is interested in sex, there's no friendship or fears or bs that could interpose his desires. Please do not encourage OP and let her believe there was something where it obviously there was nothing. Cmon
smudge21 Posted February 27, 2016 Posted February 27, 2016 Really? Are you implying that a simple question as if she liked being single is testing the waters? This kind of comments let OP imagination flow and believe he rejected her because she said she was ok single. No good. If he was interested, she would had noticed in a VERY strong way, not with a simple question anyone could ask to anyone. If a guy is interested in sex, there's no friendship or fears or bs that could interpose his desires. Please do not encourage OP and let her believe there was something where it obviously there was nothing. Cmon Sorry, but I got from the OP that there's two people who have had a very close friendship for 9 years. In that situation anyone would struggle to want to change it, take it further, end it, whatever. Just as much as this is confusing for her, it could've been just as confusing for him too, hence why he may (note: may) have kept it low key, rather than blurting it out and risk losing the friendship. Following that he went quiet. Your presumption that as a man he would have no problem in just openly expressing his feelings is a little off - we're not all one dimensional beings only interested in women simply for sex. No one can truly know what he was thinking, but I do agree I would never want someone to build up false hope just on the basis of one persons opinion, hence why I said they should talk to each other. People come here for opinions not facts, and I gave mine, whether that be right or wrong, just like we all did. I would hope the OP understands that. 1
brokengirl85 Posted February 27, 2016 Posted February 27, 2016 Sorry, but I got from the OP that there's two people who have had a very close friendship for 9 years. In that situation anyone would struggle to want to change it, take it further, end it, whatever. Just as much as this is confusing for her, it could've been just as confusing for him too, hence why he may (note: may) have kept it low key, rather than blurting it out and risk losing the friendship. Following that he went quiet. Your presumption that as a man he would have no problem in just openly expressing his feelings is a little off - we're not all one dimensional beings only interested in women simply for sex. No one can truly know what he was thinking, but I do agree I would never want someone to build up false hope just on the basis of one persons opinion, hence why I said they should talk to each other. People come here for opinions not facts, and I gave mine, whether that be right or wrong, just like we all did. I would hope the OP understands that. If he were interested he wouldn't let her hanging. He's obviously not interested and he's going cold to discourage any possible advance of OP. No men us scared to break a friendship when there's sex involved. Have you read or watch he's not that into you? There's a whole chapter dedicated to this
smackie9 Posted February 27, 2016 Posted February 27, 2016 He's isn't uninterested, he is discouraged. 2
smackie9 Posted February 27, 2016 Posted February 27, 2016 No men us scared to break a friendship when there's sex involved. Have you read or watch he's not that into you? There's a whole chapter dedicated to this Sex is meaningless when it comes to a 9 year deeply connected friendship. He is thinking with his heart not his penis. Real life is more complicated than what you see in the movies. 2
Versacehottie Posted February 28, 2016 Posted February 28, 2016 (edited) I'd say he reached out, tested the water and you rejected the idea. After being friends for that long, can you imagine the nerves involved to actually have feelings for someone but you know that if you do the wrong thing, you risk losing a long term friend. Well, you can, because you're there right now. So speak to him, find out. Yes, he may have someone else, but then again, he may not. This may be two people who deep down, after 9 years, want more but each is too afraid to ruin what they currently have. Obviously, none of us can know for sure, only you and him know the answer here. Surely though, after this long your friendship is strong enough to be able to be honest with each other. Yes this^^^ IMO, guys are much more cautious about wrecking a great, deep friendship with a girl. And don't want to overstep. If you think about it, it makes sense. Guys don't typically have the kind of close friendships with each other that girls have with other girls. So when they have that, it makes sense that they would be more cautious than us to ruin it--because it is not an easy thing to re-generate. Also guys can be more realistic than us that things sometimes/often don't work out, and sometimes their own ways mess up dating relationships. Something they don't necessarily want to visit on one of their best girl friends, only to mess up everything. OP, IMO you needed to/need to give him more positive and reassuring signs before (FLIRT MORE!!). I do think that he was trying to test the waters but not getting anything back from you, felt rebuffed. The trip might have sealed the deal, in that he believes there is no chance. Also I think it is very possible that the trip may have been where he decided that he doesn't have romantic feelings for you. I lean toward rebuffed though because unless you were an awful travel companion, he would still want to be your friend and would have no reason to be avoiding you now. I think he's avoiding you because you acted uninterested and failed to make things happen on the trip which he may have hoped went a different way than it did--so he's hurt. Sure he could be dating someone right now. It could be nothing special or it could be the beginning of something serious. I still think being as close as you have been for 9 years and if you did catch on that he was feeling similarly, that you probably still have a chance. There is probably 'more' there between you two than anyone new. You should probably do something so you have no regrets. I'm torn on how. I think you could bring it up again (who cares if you already said it!) just that he seems different etc (whatever expat said). Or you can just lay it all on the line and be direct like satu said. I agree with whoever said that we are all here to give our opinions and the OP can weigh it out and take whichever advice she feels best serves her situation. It's a little pessimistic to always jump to "he must have someone else", no? And defeatist. I guess I always ASSUME single people are or have the option to date others---so yeah, assume they are. That they are mulling options, having crushes, going on dates whatever. But no point in letting it defeat you. If he is dating someone, there is no reason to assume that she's won and you've lost. No one here has the answer or a crystal ball to that. There is only one person that does: him--and if he's like a lot of people, this is a moment in time, the end point is not decided either. So you feel this now; you think something is there enough to consider it a regret if you do nothing; you miss him in your life as your best friend, potentially more. Those are about as good reasons as ANY to do something. Actually the two parts I'd be the most "worried" about is: that the trip changed his mind about you (be honest with yourself) or that he would have no intention of dating long distance. I have many couple friends who started out as friends; sometimes with a long history. I know sometimes these stories can give false hope since their stories worked out and maybe yours will/maybe it won't. Get confident, that's your best asset. BTW, I much more believe the REAL stories I know rather than the book or movie, he's just not that into you. A)that was about the sh*tty relationship book ever written. It capitalized on a great one liner from a TV series. The one liner has value which applies to some situations--more useful when the guy is someone you are newly dating not someone you have known for years. Beyond that the book sucked--if I recall, same as the relationship history of the authors. B)the movie has little relevance to the book or actual relationship advice. Another moment of trying to capitalize on the momentum of the one-liner and subsequent book. The different scenarios (an affair, a broken relationship, and a pretty straightforward and clear new relationship) actually didn't seem to demonstrate a good example of HJNIY like it did in the sex in the city episode. As far as using it as your benchmark as suggested, I think it would be far more worthwhile to poll your friends, scan the data in your own life or even ask here if people know stories of couples who began as friends and how it came to be that they were couples. The ones I am thinking of in my own life all started out a little rocky to be honest but became the most solid couples I know for the most part. No false hope though--you have to believe in yourself--your situation is unique and your own. There's no telling how it will ultimately work out. But I believe it can. Good luck Edited February 28, 2016 by Versacehottie 1
Versacehottie Posted February 28, 2016 Posted February 28, 2016 If a guy is interested in sex, there's no friendship or fears or bs that could interpose his desires. Please do not encourage OP and let her believe there was something where it obviously there was nothing. Cmon I don't believe that blanket generalizations serve the OP or anyone much better than those of us who see her situation COULD work out positively. Guys are more multi-dimensional than a simple, limited generalization applied to one and all. If it was that easy, we would have them completely figured out. I tend to give the majority of them more credit. Maybe you should too.
brokengirl85 Posted February 28, 2016 Posted February 28, 2016 I don't believe that blanket generalizations serve the OP or anyone much better than those of us who see her situation COULD work out positively. Guys are more multi-dimensional than a simple, limited generalization applied to one and all. If it was that easy, we would have them completely figured out. I tend to give the majority of them more credit. Maybe you should too. I write based on facts. And yes, generalizations based on experience. Point is, this guy is not interested. And you're not helping encouraging OP to keep insisting on something never existed, to begin with.
Versacehottie Posted February 28, 2016 Posted February 28, 2016 I write based on facts. And yes, generalizations based on experience. Point is, this guy is not interested. And you're not helping encouraging OP to keep insisting on something never existed, to begin with. uhh, ok. how exactly do you have the facts on this internet stranger's life and the one of her guy friend and what's in his head? I think to some extent we all write with generalizations in mind. Blanket statements, though, are limiting and don't represent "facts". ALL guys do not all react the same way. Maybe you've seen too many movies where the guy comes running at the end. Not so true. Crystal ball, none of us have. I agree that it is possible that he is no longer interested. I don't agree that encouraging people to act with confidence and on their own instincts is a bad course of action. It's better, in this case, than living with regrets. Actually it's the best course of action to get what you want. Dating and falling in love takes risks and yeah sometimes you will get hurt. She will get just as hurt sitting on the sidelines doing nothing because some person on the internet without a crystal ball and maybe their own bias is telling her she has no chance. Actually that is the guaranteed way NOT to get this guy. To get him, she needs to take a leap of faith. It may or may not work out. She can protect her heart from a direct answer from him, assuming it's "no, not interested". OR she can take an indirect hit from never having tried--not getting him and being disappointed in herself, which I actually think are more hurtful than the directness of knowing. We can agree to disagree. I think that the absolutes and handing over all the power to the other party as if some end point is clearly decided just isn't healthy thinking in a situation like this. Same as handing over the outcome and totality of decision making to an internet board. OP can gather opinions and make her own decision. good luck to you.
brokengirl85 Posted February 28, 2016 Posted February 28, 2016 uhh, ok. how exactly do you have the facts on this internet stranger's life and the one of her guy friend and what's in his head? I think to some extent we all write with generalizations in mind. Blanket statements, though, are limiting and don't represent "facts". ALL guys do not all react the same way. Maybe you've seen too many movies where the guy comes running at the end. Not so true. Crystal ball, none of us have. I agree that it is possible that he is no longer interested. I don't agree that encouraging people to act with confidence and on their own instincts is a bad course of action. It's better, in this case, than living with regrets. Actually it's the best course of action to get what you want. Dating and falling in love takes risks and yeah sometimes you will get hurt. She will get just as hurt sitting on the sidelines doing nothing because some person on the internet without a crystal ball and maybe their own bias is telling her she has no chance. Actually that is the guaranteed way NOT to get this guy. To get him, she needs to take a leap of faith. It may or may not work out. She can protect her heart from a direct answer from him, assuming it's "no, not interested". OR she can take an indirect hit from never having tried--not getting him and being disappointed in herself, which I actually think are more hurtful than the directness of knowing. We can agree to disagree. I think that the absolutes and handing over all the power to the other party as if some end point is clearly decided just isn't healthy thinking in a situation like this. Same as handing over the outcome and totality of decision making to an internet board. OP can gather opinions and make her own decision. good luck to you. Good luck to you too. I'm pretty sure about what I stated in this thread. We'll see.
Versacehottie Posted February 28, 2016 Posted February 28, 2016 Good luck to you too. I'm pretty sure about what I stated in this thread. We'll see. lol, you say it like you are placing a bet on the OP's life. It's not a contest; so you can let that part go at least with regards to me. That's the part you don't get in what I'm saying. I don't see it as a failure if she tries even if he is not interested. (and have admitted he may not be/may no longer be). You are saying she should bow out since you are presuming she has no chance, adopt a defeatist attitude. Based on what she has stated here, i think that would be the wrong choice for her to build her own self esteem and confidence with dating, as well as have a chance with this guy. I care less about being "right". More so am about helping the OP. It's not like some threads where the person keeps trying with a person who has repeatedly told them they are not interested and that person fails to give up or move on. This OP hasn't given it a real shot yet. I say she should not apply bitter theories to her life and bet the outcome of her life on those sorts of things. Evaluate the source. If anything, based on her first post the OP needs to be more open, more flirty with this guy or another and make sure that her interest is clear. IMO, regardless of the outcome, she will get the best personal growth and clarity to try with him 2
Author unluckie Posted March 3, 2016 Author Posted March 3, 2016 So update: He called me days after we were meant to meet in his city, I couldn't talk (legit reason he knows about), he told me he would call me again, emphasised the HE would call, so I waited. Nada. Finally I cracked and called him days later, he cancels the call. Sends me a message like an hour later saying ' sup, I'm out at dinner I'll call you next week'. Next week? WTF, nobody at all could be that busy. All of this is so totally out of character, he would in the last 9 years have NEVER behaved like this. If he couldn't talk he would have taken the call and told me he couldn't talk or sent me a message straight away. He clearly had his phone on him if he was able to cancel the call. This is just plain rude. Am I crazy to be leaning to what Smackie said, that he is pulling away because he thought I was not interested and is a little upset by it? Why else would you suddenly pull away if you genuinely liked the person as a friend? Also, I don't know if this is my imagination but I'm convinced he was having dinner with a girl. I can't explain how devastated I am right now, my face is so puffed from all the crying. Lol.
Author unluckie Posted March 3, 2016 Author Posted March 3, 2016 Yes this^^^ IMO, guys are much more cautious about wrecking a great, deep friendship with a girl. And don't want to overstep. If you think about it, it makes sense. Guys don't typically have the kind of close friendships with each other that girls have with other girls. So when they have that, it makes sense that they would be more cautious than us to ruin it--because it is not an easy thing to re-generate. Also guys can be more realistic than us that things sometimes/often don't work out, and sometimes their own ways mess up dating relationships. Something they don't necessarily want to visit on one of their best girl friends, only to mess up everything. OP, IMO you needed to/need to give him more positive and reassuring signs before (FLIRT MORE!!). I do think that he was trying to test the waters but not getting anything back from you, felt rebuffed. The trip might have sealed the deal, in that he believes there is no chance. Also I think it is very possible that the trip may have been where he decided that he doesn't have romantic feelings for you. I lean toward rebuffed though because unless you were an awful travel companion, he would still want to be your friend and would have no reason to be avoiding you now. I think he's avoiding you because you acted uninterested and failed to make things happen on the trip which he may have hoped went a different way than it did--so he's hurt. Sure he could be dating someone right now. It could be nothing special or it could be the beginning of something serious. I still think being as close as you have been for 9 years and if you did catch on that he was feeling similarly, that you probably still have a chance. There is probably 'more' there between you two than anyone new. You should probably do something so you have no regrets. I'm torn on how. I think you could bring it up again (who cares if you already said it!) just that he seems different etc (whatever expat said). Or you can just lay it all on the line and be direct like satu said. I agree with whoever said that we are all here to give our opinions and the OP can weigh it out and take whichever advice she feels best serves her situation. It's a little pessimistic to always jump to "he must have someone else", no? And defeatist. I guess I always ASSUME single people are or have the option to date others---so yeah, assume they are. That they are mulling options, having crushes, going on dates whatever. But no point in letting it defeat you. If he is dating someone, there is no reason to assume that she's won and you've lost. No one here has the answer or a crystal ball to that. There is only one person that does: him--and if he's like a lot of people, this is a moment in time, the end point is not decided either. So you feel this now; you think something is there enough to consider it a regret if you do nothing; you miss him in your life as your best friend, potentially more. Those are about as good reasons as ANY to do something. Actually the two parts I'd be the most "worried" about is: that the trip changed his mind about you (be honest with yourself) or that he would have no intention of dating long distance. I have many couple friends who started out as friends; sometimes with a long history. I know sometimes these stories can give false hope since their stories worked out and maybe yours will/maybe it won't. Get confident, that's your best asset. BTW, I much more believe the REAL stories I know rather than the book or movie, he's just not that into you. A)that was about the sh*tty relationship book ever written. It capitalized on a great one liner from a TV series. The one liner has value which applies to some situations--more useful when the guy is someone you are newly dating not someone you have known for years. Beyond that the book sucked--if I recall, same as the relationship history of the authors. B)the movie has little relevance to the book or actual relationship advice. Another moment of trying to capitalize on the momentum of the one-liner and subsequent book. The different scenarios (an affair, a broken relationship, and a pretty straightforward and clear new relationship) actually didn't seem to demonstrate a good example of HJNIY like it did in the sex in the city episode. As far as using it as your benchmark as suggested, I think it would be far more worthwhile to poll your friends, scan the data in your own life or even ask here if people know stories of couples who began as friends and how it came to be that they were couples. The ones I am thinking of in my own life all started out a little rocky to be honest but became the most solid couples I know for the most part. No false hope though--you have to believe in yourself--your situation is unique and your own. There's no telling how it will ultimately work out. But I believe it can. Good luck Versacehottie. I think the trip was good, sure there are some tensions when anyone travels together but we were ok. At times we annoyed each other but we kinda fell into a couple role without the sex and romance and actually got on super well. I have not dealt so well with exes I have gone on trips with. I really cannot see any thing that happened on the trip that would have made him change his mind, unless he changed his mind because he thought nothing would ever happen so he kinda gave up. Also, now I've stopped crying and calmed down I've realised two things. 1. If he does have another girl and even if its serious (he's not the kinda guy to date casually - I actually think he's never had a girlfriend, or if he has he has never told me about it) I still think I need to do something. This is a situation where I cannot respect another woman's rights, too much has gone on between us for me to just roll over and let it happen without at least saying something. There is defintely no friendship anymore so I guess it can't hurt. I think too much confusion has happened for me to try and drop hints and flirt. I just don't think that would work he'd think I was playing him. I need to be explicit. I can't say 'oh I'm in love with you' but I was thinking of saying 'would you consider you and me having a relationship?'
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