My husband's lies. Is this a form of cheating?

[JamesM]

 

I don't see being outed for a crush as "embarrassing".

 

It is embarrassing but not something to lie about. If it is innocent, then it shouldn't become an issue. And to have a crush is different than discussing a woman like a piece of meat.

[LifesontheUp]

I'm not sure I agree with the posting about this is normal when it is clear that in all this time he hasn't worked there he is still asking about her.

 

What would clearly hurt and make me think about my marriage is that he lied, and lied and lied when you asked him about it. You see, it would make me wonder what else he has lied about.

[cozycottagelg]

Is he still asking his co-workers about her daily even after you confronted him?

[Lady2163]

Wow. First off OP, do t do anything rash or hasty because of something you read from an anonymous stranger on the Internet. All too often, their past (mine included) influence their responses.

 

Now, point blank, two wrongs don't make a right. Or in this case, three wrongs. You snooped and you lied. For some reason that you haven't mentioned here, you don't trust him.

 

I had zero qualms about my now exH having a bachelor party. No problem at all. One of my coworkers and friend was along for the entire duration. I told coworker, I'd prefer it that soon to be husband not exchange bodily fluids and I didn't want him kept out to 500 AM (our flight left at 600 AM). They went bar hoping at all the strip clubs and I did learn the details later, nothing happened that gave me worry. Again, I had no trouble, because even falling down drunk ( which he was) I TRUSTED HIM.

 

Fast forward to a boyfriend who flirted with everyone behind my back and in front of my face. He constantly talked about how great this or that woman was, how sexy, it was never ending, demeaning and constantly made me feel poorly about myself. Which was probably his goal. He was a narcissistic jerk. Imhad no sense of security with him and I threw a fuss when a coworker was having a strip club bachelor party. It was a fight for weeks. I happened to be chatting f with his boss at a social and when I mentioned I wasn't too keen on the whole thing, she conveniently scheduled him to be 4 hours away that day. I didn't ask her to, but was overjoyed and got her a Starbucks gift card.

 

Near the end of the relationship, we were out to dinner and he was blatantly flirting with the waitress. The waitress was visibly uncomfortable. I finally told him, "Do you have any idea how awkward this is for her? Do you have any idea how disresctful it is for me? She knows we're a couple and you can't stop touching her or flirting with her right in front of me. She doesn't make enough money to put up with this crap."

 

Now, if your husband has normally been respectful and courteous in the 26 years of marriage, I don't know that you should be too worked up. You should have known beforehand if he was an inappropriate flirt - or realized it long before now,

 

Men talk, banter and look. GENTLEMEN don't do it around their wives, children or girlfriends. It's the difference between being classy or trashy. Real men can Hang with the fellas, be frat boys and still make sure their woman is secure enough and respected enough that it isn't an issue. Geez, I have men friends who cheerfully refer to me as their girlfriend and bring me flowers. Their wives laugh about it. They're like brothers or cousins to me. Ive known them my whole life. I eat at their house, they eat at mine.

 

Now here's the thing people aren't going to like. If your husband is truly innocent, he deserves someone better than you. You're a snoop and a liar. If I was innocent and my partner did what you did, they'd never see my phone or tablet again. Honestly, I think it would push me away and take years to recover. Largely, because (again, if I was innocent) I'd be hypersensitive as to WHY they needed to look at my phone secretly. I'd be thinking THEY have the guilty conscience.

[RRM321]

Thanks for all of the responses. It does make me feel *somewhat* better that this is probably innocent. However, I do feel disrespected and still somewhat betrayed that he could carry on about this other woman, whether it is "guy talk" or not. From the perspective of the wife, I guess it's just hard to accept that it's "normal" for a man to talk nasty about another woman, and especially that it should be perfectly understandable and acceptable.

 

I am trying to relax about this, but I haven't been sleeping, and I have been sick at my stomach for weeks. I know logically that nothing real is going on, but more than anything, I am just hurt. Very hurt.

 

 

Well, I think as a wife you are entitled to being honored and respected. I think he owes you that. Explain to him what you really need from him emotionally. Even without the MILF banter 26 years together doesn't preclude you from needing some real heart to heart care. You want to feel irreplaceable and uniquely significant in his life - and he should be able to express that.

 

As for the banter, I think it's reasonable that you express your distaste for the the sexist behavior as well. Might as well stand up for the sisters.

 

The thing about his phone, is that the explicit nature of what you found doesn't square with the ease with which you found it.

 

In an unencumbered marriage personal phones are conspicuous, even willfully shared if the need arises. With an affair, they disappear completely in a total lock-down. The behavior is very noticeable, and tends to persist somewhat even after the affair ends.

 

Try not to escalate the snooping because, that could create the very phone behavior we are citing and itself become a destructive marital issue. Being nosy was perfectly harmless but, has left you feeling insecure and you don't want this to become an infinite loop of checking, feeling, and checking again.

Edited February 22, 2016 by RRM321

[VeveCakes]

I find is disgusting the co workers are sneaking pics and texting them of this woman. She's there to work not to be sexualized for CS. This behaviour is appalling. She's being treated like a total piece of meat, but that's ok because "frat boys" right? It's sexual harassment and oh yeah, she's probably asking for it for just breathing right?

 

OP I would be livid and hurt. No way would I be ok with my mantexting his friend every day about another woman whether anything happened or not, completely disrespectful.

[RRM321]

Now here's the thing people aren't going to like. If your husband is truly innocent, he deserves someone better than you. You're a snoop and a liar. If I was innocent and my partner did what you did, they'd never see my phone or tablet again. Honestly, I think it would push me away and take years to recover. Largely, because (again, if I was innocent) I'd be hypersensitive as to WHY they needed to look at my phone secretly. I'd be thinking THEY have the guilty conscience.

 

I think you've made a colossal leap to arrive at this point, and unfairly so. After all, you had a co-worker keep tabs on your exH, and your boyfriend's boss reassign him 4 hours away from temptation.

 

She was bored and interested, that's what it means to be nosy. Let's not overstate this. I'm going to open my kids backpack later to make sure they did ALL their homework. That doesn't make me the secret police.

 

90% of cheating is discovered by accident, not by spying. Me thinks thou dost protest too much.

Edited February 22, 2016 by RRM321

[JamesM]

 

Now, point blank, two wrongs don't make a right. Or in this case, three wrongs. You snooped and you lied. For some reason that you haven't mentioned here, you don't trust him.

 

 

Now here's the thing people aren't going to like. If your husband is truly innocent, he deserves someone better than you. You're a snoop and a liar. If I was innocent and my partner did what you did, they'd never see my phone or tablet again. Honestly, I think it would push me away and take years to recover. Largely, because (again, if I was innocent) I'd be hypersensitive as to WHY they needed to look at my phone secretly. I'd be thinking THEY have the guilty conscience.

 

Totally disagree!

 

He should not even be worried that his WIFE would have free access to his phone. My wife is welcome to look at mine. I have no password. She has told me I can look at hers.

 

Why would he need to keep it secret from her? Give me one good reason why a spouse would be angry that his or her phone was looked at by the other.

 

She did nothing wrong, because looking at a spouse's phone should not be about a lack of trust. There should be an openness between two married individuals. In fact, one of the signs of cheating is...keeping a phone private.

[Lady2163]

I think you've made a colossal leap to arrive at this point, and unfairly so. After all, you had a co-worker keep tabs on your exH, and your boyfriend's boss reassign him 4 hours away from temptation.

 

She was bored and interested, that's what it means to be nosy. Let's not overstate this. I'm going to open my kids backpack later to make sure they did ALL their homework. That doesn't make me the secret police.

 

90% of cheating is discovered by accident, not by spying. Me thinks thou dost protest too much.

 

Oy....It didn't even cross my mind that his boss would send him across the state, nor did I ask her. And since my ex was the first of his friends to get married, I didn't want to risk them thinking it was *funny* to miss our flight.

 

I love it when people compare grown men to children...

[Lady2163]

Totally disagree!

 

He should not even be worried that his WIFE would have free access to his phone. My wife is welcome to look at mine. I have no password. She has told me I can look at hers.

 

Why would he need to keep it secret from her? Give me one good reason why a spouse would be angry that his or her phone was looked at by the other.

 

She did nothing wrong, because looking at a spouse's phone should not be about a lack of trust. There should be an openness between two married individuals. In fact, one of the signs of cheating is...keeping a phone private.

 

Permit me to point out something to you, please. IF she did nothing wrong, why did she feel the need to make up a story? Why did she wait until husband was gone to look at his phone? Why not pick it up in front of him and start scrolling?

 

Everyone has different levels of privacy. Point blank: OP knew the level of privacy both she and her husband expect. Some women, many women my age and older, the purse was a sacred thing. As my mom told me once, "I'm not hiding anything (besides the Christmas present list), I just don't want it messed with. Okay, that and her husband often used her wallet as his ATM and neglected to tell her. Back in the day when people write letters, he would open mail from her mother or brother. He wasn't close to them, he never wrote them or called them, he was just being nosy.

[GunslingerRoland]

It doesn't sound like their is cheating taking place... but he lied. Then again you lied too.

 

 

That is the tough thing in this situation, if you had come clean with your own sins it would have put him on the spot. Now you're both playing this lying game of cat and mouse with each other.

 

 

Whatever your expectations are for him, put your foot down, and tell him clearly. But if it is to not lie, then you need to do the same for him.

[RRM321]

Oy....It didn't even cross my mind that his boss would send him across the state, nor did I ask her. And since my ex was the first of his friends to get married, I didn't want to risk them thinking it was *funny* to miss our flight.

 

LOL ...and your rationalization is more valid than her's because ? ? ?

Bueller? Anyone? Anyone?

 

The line between curiosity and spying is not hard to discern. Let's not overstate things.

 

The #1 cause for a lie is fear. She already admitted to being terribly scared so, I don't think we should expect her to have reacted like Dr. Phil.

 

Experience informs us that one risk of telling someone in an affair HOW you discovered them - is that they use the feedback to become a better liar, most people know that instinctively, and it too induces fear.

[Lady2163]

LOL ...and your rationalization is more valid than her's because ? ? ?

Bueller? Anyone? Anyone?

 

The line between curiosity and spying is not hard to discern. Let's not overstate things.

 

The #1 cause for a lie is fear. She already admitted to being terribly scared so, I don't think we should expect her to have reacted like Dr. Phil.

 

Experience informs us that one risk of telling someone in an affair HOW you discovered them - is that they use the feedback to become a better liar, most people know that instinctively, and it too induces fear.

 

Methinks thou makes no sense.

[JamesM]

Permit me to point out something to you, please. IF she did nothing wrong, why did she feel the need to make up a story? Why did she wait until husband was gone to look at his phone? Why not pick it up in front of him and start scrolling?

 

She saw it there and was curious. Or perhaps inside she had a gut feeling that something was wrong. She did not make up a story.

[Lady2163]

My husband recently left the house, accidentally leaving his phone behind. I have never felt I had any reason not to trust him, but my curiosity got the best of me and I looked at his phone. I saw things I was not expecting, nor was I prepared to see.

 

He works for a large construction company, which requires him to work in factories all over the state. There is one particular factory that he has not been to for over a year and a half, but some of his coworkers have been there for the last few months doing work. There were text messages from him to those coworkers asking about a particular woman who worked at that factory, referring to her as "his new wife". He texted one coworker, "tell my sweetie I said hi". One coworker snapped a picture of her while she wasn't paying attention and sent it to him telling him, "Here's your little MILF. She's a hot piece of ass". His response? "Me likey".

 

As far as I can tell from phone records, etc...he has never had any contact with her outside of work. I did my homework and found out exactly who she is. Rather than tell my husband I went through his phone, I told him someone told me that he had a crush on this woman. He got all kinds of defensive, even going as far as calling one of the coworkers he had texted about her, and making a big production of it. When I showed him a picture of her, he responded by saying that yes she works there, but that he doesn't know her. He continues to deny that he has ever talked to his coworkers about her, blah blah blah.

 

I do NOT believe anything sexual has happened, and he has not been to that location (which is 2 hours away) in over a year and a half. He does not use social networking, and quite honestly knows nothing about computers, e-mail, etc....he only recently got a smart phone and barely knows how to use it for anything other than calling/texting.

 

I am really hurt and bothered by the fact that it has been over a year and a half since he has been at that location, but he is still talking about her to his coworkers and asking if they've seen her. To me, it feels like he is cheating without actually having any contact with this person. If he is still asking/talking about her after all this time, then it seems that he might be more than a little smitten with her. I have never had any reason not to trust him until now. I HATE IT that he looked me right in the face and denied everything. We have been together for 26 years and I have never caught him lying to me before. I can't sleep, and I feel like I don't even know who he is now.

 

What is your opinion of this situation? Please help!

 

James, re read paragraph three. She chose to make up a "story" that someone told her he has a 'crush' on this woman. That is manipulative as hell. That's almost the sign of a narcissist - using imaginary peer pressure to control behavior. IE: "People are saying..." She also hid her true actions.

[JamesM]

James, re read paragraph three. She chose to make up a "story" that someone told her he has a 'crush' on this woman. That is manipulative as hell. That's almost the sign of a narcissist - using imaginary peer pressure to control behavior. IE: "People are saying..." She also hid her true actions.

 

You are correct. I was not finished with my post and I was interrupted, so I couldn't phrase it how I meant it.

 

Let me try again.

 

My take on it was that she "made up the story" not to manipulate but to see how he would respond. She wanted him to say something that confirmed what she found on the phone. Instead he lied about it all. It is not narcisstic at all IMO.

 

If my own wife had looked at my phone and found what the OP did, then she would have confronted me with the phone info. If I were this husband, then I would have denied that I did it or simply got angry that she looked at my phone and avoided having to actually say what my relationship was with this woman.

 

The question would be: if he confessed, then would she have confessed looking at his phone? I don't know.

[Betrayed1987]

Lady123.....I am the FURTHEST thing from narcissistic and manipulative. I was curious. Period. I didn't tell him the truth in the beginning because I wasn't thinking rationally, and I was in shock at what I had seen. I didn't think it through completely because my emotions were all over the place and I panicked.

 

AND for you to imply that he should leave me after 26 years because I looked at his phone ONCE (and btw found inappropriate messages about another woman).....???? What is wrong with you? I asked for help, not to be slammed and diagnosed as a manipulative narcissist. Way to blame the victim. Stay off of this thread if you can't abstain from being disrespectful and hateful. That's not what I asked for. Thanks anyway.

[RRM321]

James, re read paragraph three. She chose to make up a "story" that someone told her he has a 'crush' on this woman. That is manipulative as hell. That's almost the sign of a narcissist - using imaginary peer pressure to control behavior. IE: "People are saying..." She also hid her true actions.

 

She's nowhere near the narcissism scale - which is more closely related to your attempt to turn the whole thing back on her for looking at his phone. (Are we still discounting the manipulation of you xBF and xH's boss?)

 

Me thinks thou has an NPD ax to grind?

 

This woman has been married for 26 years - I'm inclined to bow to her best instincts. She could teach us all a lot.

[Betrayed1987]

THANK YOU RRM321! And also thanks to everyone else who has given helpful, insightful, honest, and respectful help and advice. I plan to come clean to him about my "narcissistic, manipulative behavior" (I.E. Looking at his phone once in the last 15 years that he has owned one). I just need to calm my nerves first and wait until the time is right. Today isn't that day, but it will come. I need to get my head together first so I don't do or say anything impulsive out of anger. Yeah.....I'm clearly a narcissist.

[SJS]

OP, does your husband have guy friends outside of work, or does he have a hard time making them? Could this be a way to be "in" with the guys? In no way am I condoning his behavior (I'd be upset too), but wonder if he just keeps the talk going so he fits in. I could be totally off too....

[Lady2163]

She's nowhere near the narcissism scale - which is more closely related to your attempt to turn the whole thing back on her for looking at his phone. (Are we still discounting the manipulation of you xBF and xH's boss?)

 

Me thinks thou has an NPD ax to grind?

 

This woman has been married for 26 years - I'm inclined to bow to her best instincts. She could teach us all a lot.

 

You are so off base. Just ridiculously obtuse. And intentionally missing the point of what it means to trust or mistrust your partner.

 

But, you know what...here goes...I was asking xbf boss if she and other ladies wanted to go out and do something since he would be tied up with sexist caveman activity that I wasn't in favor of. Neither was she and so he was sent out of town. I didn't even know he wasn't at the bachelor party until the next day (this was before cell phones), when long distance cost money.

 

I'm from an area of the country where it is often considered a rite of passage to "kidnap" the groom or bride. It wouldn't have been funny if he'd been kept out all night and missed the flight. There is also the custom of visiting the bride and groom on their wedding night, Often waiting just ten or 15 minutes after the lights go out to knock on the door or window. So yes, I had a mutual friend we both worked with be his chauffeur and keep his friends from buying him a blowjob from a stripper I'm a horrible, manipulative person. NOT! Oh - and I told him the next day that "John" was his unofficial babysitter. Since events were pretty fuzzy and he was miserably sick, he was kind of glad there was one person who kept him out of the hospital and the doghouse.

 

The OP snooped and found something she deemed offensive and inflammatory. I'd bet money the guy isn't having an affair. He hasn't been to that area in 18 months and has been mentioned, WS keep their phones glued to them. I think this guy is entitled to know his wife is snooping and he really has no privacy. But, you think she is entitled to lie to her spouse.

 

And I have no idea what the abbreviation NPD means. Nor am I going to bother to look it up.

[Lady2163]

THANK YOU RRM321! And also thanks to everyone else who has given helpful, insightful, honest, and respectful help and advice. I plan to come clean to him about my "narcissistic, manipulative behavior" (I.E. Looking at his phone once in the last 15 years that he has owned one). I just need to calm my nerves first and wait until the time is right. Today isn't that day, but it will come. I need to get my head together first so I don't do or say anything impulsive out of anger. Yeah.....I'm clearly a narcissist.

 

Why not just come clean and tell him what you did and why you did it? Why the junior high school shenanigans? Why not admit you lied and you don't respect his privacy? You looked up this woman. You've put time and thought into this.

 

Get it out there. Because yes, I do think you're manipulative to make up a story and let him think people are telling you things like this. He's probably ripped as hell at whichever coworker he imagines got you wound up.

 

Betty Broderick was the perfect wife as well.

[Lady2163]

Lady123.....I am the FURTHEST thing from narcissistic and manipulative. I was curious. Period. I didn't tell him the truth in the beginning because I wasn't thinking rationally, and I was in shock at what I had seen. I didn't think it through completely because my emotions were all over the place and I panicked.

 

AND for you to imply that he should leave me after 26 years because I looked at his phone ONCE (and btw found inappropriate messages about another woman).....???? What is wrong with you? I asked for help, not to be slammed and diagnosed as a manipulative narcissist. Way to blame the victim. Stay off of this thread if you can't abstain from being disrespectful and hateful. That's not what I asked for. Thanks anyway.

 

I missed this earlier. I'm giving you support by keeping it real. It may not be want you want to hear. What is wrong with you that you couldn't confront him with the truth after 26 years? You may have panicked, but you also manipulated. I could possibly get over a partner looking at my phone without my knowledge, but the subterfuge was totally wrong. Maybe I missed it, but I don't see you admitting that making up the story was wrong, that is why I think you might have some narcissistic tendencies.

 

i suggest you tell him sooner rather than later. Waiting is not going to make this any better.

[RRM321]

You are so off base. Just ridiculously obtuse. And intentionally missing the point of what it means to trust or mistrust your partner.

 

But, you know what...here goes...

 

I'll accept you and your experience, no need to explain or defend.

 

It's not your concepts of trust I take issue with, just the chronological measure in this thread. A singular instance of looking at someone's phone in a 26 year relationship is not a significant measure from which to infer the level of prior trust. Her current doubt appears to be genuinely brand new.

[Lady2163]

I'll accept you and your experience, no need to explain or defend.

 

It's not your concepts of trust I take issue with, just the chronological measure in this thread. A singular instance of looking at someone's phone in a 26 year relationship is not a significant measure from which to infer the level of prior trust. Her current doubt appears to be genuinely brand new.

 

I'm not as certain as you are we are getting the whole truth and complete story. As much as I loathe to minimize one person's tragedy, I just think of stories on here that are so much more heartbreaking. OW finds out she is pregnant and an OW in the same week. Spouse is undergoing treatment for disease and learns partner has been a serial cheater.

 

And then there is this.

 

I don't talk to my mother the same way I talk to my Army buddies. I don't talk to my friend who is a 60 year old nun the same way I talk to my best girlfriend. I've never been in a relationship where I'd want my partner to know everything I I ever said. I can be catty about other women, I can be descriptive of my sex fantasy with David Cassidy, but I probably wouldn't want either to have made it back to my partner. This man was having some off-color fun with his coworkers. He never intended his wife to see and I'm guessing he doesn't talk to her that way or about other women to her.

 

Men and women often have different senses of humor. The OP is more like Jeff Foxworthy, while her husband is more like Larry the Cable Guy. Maybe even a bit more like Ron White. Okay, that means nothing if you don't like theblue collar comedy gang.

 

She got a snapshot of what they are like at work. And from that snapshot, she accessed their phone bill, then got a picture of this woman, hatched a plan to make up a cockamamie story and called out her husband. Do you think he wants her to know he's a Neanderthal with the boys? He's had no phone contact with the woman and hasn't been to her area in 18 months. No proof there was any kind of affair, just pg-13 talk.