etherealbliss Posted January 17, 2016 Posted January 17, 2016 When I go on first (or even sometimes second dates) I usually do not initiate physical contact of any kind at all. I wait for the guy to initiate because I'm not sure what is the comfort level or expection of different guys. My question is, is this a turn off for guys? For example if you go out on a date or two with a woman and she doesn't touch you and waits for you to initiate, do you take this as a signal that she isn't interested? Or do you initiate yourself and don't think much of this? I'd appreciate some input and feedback regarding this as I don't know if this is the reason my dates don't last past the second date! Thanks!
Wewon Posted January 17, 2016 Posted January 17, 2016 When I go on first (or even sometimes second dates) I usually do not initiate physical contact of any kind at all. I wait for the guy to initiate because I'm not sure what is the comfort level or expection of different guys. My question is, is this a turn off for guys? For example if you go out on a date or two with a woman and she doesn't touch you and waits for you to initiate, do you take this as a signal that she isn't interested? Or do you initiate yourself and don't think much of this? I'd appreciate some input and feedback regarding this as I don't know if this is the reason my dates don't last past the second date! Thanks! I've found this to be the norm. I can think of only a few times that the woman initiated contact.
carhill Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 IDK, older here haven't dated in awhile but when dating while exW and I were waiting for D to be final I met a couple ladies for the first time after contact on OLD we gave each other a hug. I think it was pretty mutual, meaning I didn't grab them or anything. I don't read anything positive or negative into a lady being physical or not on the first couple dates. If things flow I keep showing up. If not, not. I've never been in a rush for stuff. Other guys may be different!
Qboro90 Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 In my experience this is usually normal for most girls. It varies though depending on each girls self security and comfort level with the guy she's going in the date with. It's not attractive to me to have a girl be overly affectionate on a first or second date because I want to work for it a little bit and make sure she's not just giving herself away. That being said, small efforts like reaching over to hold his hand as he drives you home after the date is something I really like and appreciate. Something as small as that can give the guy the assurance that you are having a good time. And it will also give him the confidence to initiate a kiss or more physical contact because he's not completely in the dark as to what you're feeling. 2
Robratory Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 When I go on first (or even sometimes second dates) I usually do not initiate physical contact of any kind at all. I wait for the guy to initiate because I'm not sure what is the comfort level or expection of different guys. My question is, is this a turn off for guys? For example if you go out on a date or two with a woman and she doesn't touch you and waits for you to initiate, do you take this as a signal that she isn't interested? Or do you initiate yourself and don't think much of this? I'd appreciate some input and feedback regarding this as I don't know if this is the reason my dates don't last past the second date! Thanks! There's a difference between not initiating physical contact and signaling a lack of interest. As for physical contact, most women on a first or even second date don't suddenly lunge at you and ram their tongues down your throat, something I hear guys do, but women trying to signal interest will certainly tap the guy's arm or hand when making a point. In general, don't overthink what men do or what women do. I'm sure you know basic social etiquette. If you're on a date and feel like it, there's nothing wrong with socially appropriate touching. If you tap your date on the shoulder when you go, "Oh, hey, check this out!" and gets all weird, that's his problem, not yours. 2
SwordofFlame Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 I'll initiate physical contact and flirt, but if that is not reciprocated, than it's a turn off. 6
Nilfiry Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 Oh the games. My philosophy is, if you want to, just do it, and if you are uncertain, asking is a legitimate approach. The real turn off is always expecting the other to start things first. If you meet someone who is just like you, you are going to be in awkward situations for a while. The key in deciding when to initiate or ask is in paying attention to your date. Gestures, conversation topic, and emotional state are generally things that are easy to read without being a detective. 3
sambolini Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 This is a good question. As a guy, I've been in both situations where I've initiated, and she's initiated. With my most recent ex gf, at the end of our first date when I dropped her off, we hugged and she gave me a quick peck on the lips before bidding me good night. It was perfect. That peck let me know she was interested, but also showed me that she wasn't going to give it up easily. When I've initiated, I've reached for their hand, put my arm around them...something to break that first initial barrier of physical contact. I'm fine with it either way...each person and situation is unique, so I tend to go with the flow and adapt to what naturally happens between the two of us. 1
insert_name Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 I have had the girl come on to me once on a first date and it was really weird because that just never happens with women and I must admit because it never happens it made me doubt her character- ie, does she throw herself at all the guys like that? She was a pretty girl so potentially she could have done this with loads of guys. In a perfect world women would physically initiate more, but because of how easy it is for an average girl to get male attention it is always going to make a guy wonder if he is special or whether she does this all the time. 1
smudge21 Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 I have a question for the guys... If you thought a woman was attractive after meeting her in person, but she didn't flirt with you, would you not feel any chemistry/spark and would any spark you felt die if they didn't show any flirtatious behaviours? For me, it would depend on not so much how attractive I found her, more how attracted I was to her. But yes, if there wasn't any kind of flirting, then I'd probably hold back on the flirting too. Lets face it, on a first date, two strangers are trying to size each other up and getting to know the other person, wondering if there's anything more that could happen. Therefore if there was no spark then that could be the end of anything, but I'm one who would want to have a few dates before making that assumption, afterall the first date is always the nervous one. Come the third or fourth, people relax and start being themselves. I guess then I wouldn't be surprised if there was no flirting from either party but it wouldn't put me off seeing them again if I were attracted to them, and they were happy to meet up again of course. In answer to the first question too (which in many ways is related to what I said above) I would only initiate a first move if I had signs that that is what she wanted me to do. My last "date" (although we were just out as friends) changed when halfway through the night she held my arm and then started sitting closer, never taking her eyes off me, lots of contact throughout. Those signals just made it feel right that I had to go for the kiss, and luckily she returned it. But I know for a fact I wouldn't have gone there if she hadn't have given me those signals.
TaraMaiden2 Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 When I go on first (or even sometimes second dates) I usually do not initiate physical contact of any kind at all. I wait for the guy to initiate because I'm not sure what is the comfort level or expection of different guys. My question is, is this a turn off for guys? For example if you go out on a date or two with a woman and she doesn't touch you and waits for you to initiate, do you take this as a signal that she isn't interested? Or do you initiate yourself and don't think much of this? I'd appreciate some input and feedback regarding this as I don't know if this is the reason my dates don't last past the second date! Thanks! The comment below, in my opinion, is an example of double standards... In my experience this is usually normal for most girls. It varies though depending on each girls self security and comfort level with the guy she's going in the date with. It's not attractive to me to have a girl be overly affectionate on a first or second date because I want to work for it a little bit and make sure she's not just giving herself away...... My personal philosophy is more in line with Nilfiry's: Oh the games. My philosophy is, if you want to, just do it, and if you are uncertain, asking is a legitimate approach. The real turn off is always expecting the other to start things first. ..... This is 2016. Gone are the days - or they well should be - where a guy is expected to make the move in the 1st/2nd date, but a woman is thought of 'giving herself away'. This smacks of the bias shown when it comes to considering previous number of relationships. It's still more "acceptable" for a guy to have had 5 relationships (even in quick succession) than it is for a woman. So if she decides to take the initative, she's 'giving herself away' but if she's reticent, and "mouse-like" she's not into you, awkward and unapproachable.... Jeesh.... can we we ever win..? OIP: I suggest my perennial adage as advice: If it feels good (right) do it; When in doubt - don't. 3
salparadise Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 I have a question for the guys... If you thought a woman was attractive after meeting her in person, but she didn't flirt with you, would you not feel any chemistry/spark and would any spark you felt die if they didn't show any flirtatious behaviours? Depends on how you define flirt. If she wouldn't make eye contact, acknowledge my presence or engage in polite conversation, then yea I'd probably write her off as an ice queen with an issue, or conclude that she didn't like me in particular due to incompatible wavelengths. If she engaged socially but if fell short of flirting then I would probably not be affected. 2
Leucine Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 I'll initiate physical contact and flirt, but if that is not reciprocated, than it's a turn off. This. I have rarely had the woman initiate physical contact, but she should obviously reciprocate when I do or it's not going anywhere. 1
salparadise Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 For example if you go out on a date or two with a woman and she doesn't touch you and waits for you to initiate, do you take this as a signal that she isn't interested? No, I don't expect a woman to initiate physical contact on a first or second date. I pay attention to other social cues and if I'm getting positive feedback I will initiate (if I feel like it). That's not to say I'd be put off; I just don't expect it. Women are socialized to be reticent and demure and wait for the man to take the lead. Physical contact is a major barrier. It's tricky. Ladies... if you want to green light a guy, two things: a) eye contact with a little smile, sustained slightly longer than in the average conversation, and b) a brief, light touch on the forearm or hand during conversation. If you do these things and the guy doesn't pick up on it, he may be on the asperges's spectrum or have other serious confidence issues. 3
Otter2569 Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 I had a similar situation yesterday: on a date, it was nice but a little awkward. she invited me over her house for drinks and to watch football. Conversation was good but hard to pick up on the signals. She showed signs of interest but it didnt flow like other dates i had been on. Couldn't tell if she was nervous, shy or not interested which made me unsure so I kept it polite not wanting to make a move and overstep my bounds - especially since we know a lot of the same people. I can usually tell when a woman is interested but then again some are shy or more reserved at first. When in doubt - dont whip it out!! 1
LoveRefreshed Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 I generally escalate a woman's physical contact. Push the boundary just a smidge. If she is shy on contact, I'll touch her arm or her shoulder is all. If she is a arm toucher, I'll try to touch her leg or put my arm around her waste a little. It's not a turn off for me if girls aren't so forward. I think I like the rush of being a little risky so if anything, I like when they make me go for it rather than make it obvious. 1
Sunlight72 Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 It's fun either way. If she makes little touches on my hand, arm, etc. it's nice A hug is nice. If we're standing listening to music, or walking, gently bumping into me because we're comfortably close together is sweet. Maybe a little butt grab, if we're being silly and playful (you cheeky monkey!). Practically laying on me while screaching loud laughter like a drunken slob would be too much. Does that help? 2
soph-walker Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 Depends on how you define flirt. If she wouldn't make eye contact, acknowledge my presence or engage in polite conversation, then yea I'd probably write her off as an ice queen with an issue, or conclude that she didn't like me in particular due to incompatible wavelengths. If she engaged socially but if fell short of flirting then I would probably not be affected. I would define flirting as not only making physical contact..arm touching, leg (?!) touching, looking at my dates lips, extended gaze, but also talking in a suggestive manner, alluding to sex, teasing sort of talk. If a woman didn't do any of the above with a guy and the guy was initially interested in her, would this make him not feel a spark or frisson?
SwordofFlame Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 I would define flirting as not only making physical contact..arm touching, leg (?!) touching, looking at my dates lips, extended gaze, but also talking in a suggestive manner, alluding to sex, teasing sort of talk. If a woman didn't do any of the above with a guy and the guy was initially interested in her, would this make him not feel a spark or frisson? That's a turn off. I experience this from women a lot early on in dating. I now just treat it as disinterest and move on each time. 1
soph-walker Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 That's a turn off. I experience this from women a lot early on in dating. I now just treat it as disinterest and move on each time. Ah, I imagined this being the case. I only ask as I had a date recently where I felt so ridiculously physically attracted to my date that it actually made me feel nervous and therefor didn't dare to flirt, he had given me a few signs he was interested although I completely didn't escalate/reciprocate and I am kicking myself for not doing so as it resulted in him telling me I seemed quiet and didn't feel a spark.
Miss Peach Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 I am reserved when first getting to know people but I have no trouble with maintaining a conversation, eye contact, etc. I tend to go a bit slow physically as it's not in my nature naturally to touch people in conversation unless I've known them for a long time. A good chunk of guys it's not an issue; especially if I'll hug and kiss them at the end of the date. I've talked to a few guys I've gone out with (including my BF) about this. BF had trouble knowing whether I was into him the first few dates so he tried kissing me to see if I allowed it and was into it. I've met a few other guys who try to kiss me at the end of the date as a test. I've had a few that didn't ask me out again because they weren't sure of my interest. I was actually a but surprised that the BF asked me out when we first met as we met in a group setting and I didn't give him any overt signs. But he picked up I let him into my personal space and a few other things that many guys would miss. I've found some guys need a big sign to know whether the woman is interested or just being polite. I recommend to push yourself a little bit on a first date if you're feeling it so that the guy gets a few hints. Many guys won't put themselves out there (unless REALLY interested and want to chance it) unless they get sufficient signs. 1
hasaquestion Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 When I go on first (or even sometimes second dates) I usually do not initiate physical contact of any kind at all. I wait for the guy to initiate because I'm not sure what is the comfort level or expection of different guys. My question is, is this a turn off for guys? For example if you go out on a date or two with a woman and she doesn't touch you and waits for you to initiate, do you take this as a signal that she isn't interested? Or do you initiate yourself and don't think much of this? I'd appreciate some input and feedback regarding this as I don't know if this is the reason my dates don't last past the second date! Thanks! It is normal. I'd expect a girl not to initiate. I think the key is more whether or not they respond to my initiating. What's more of a problem is if you're on a date with a guy, and he's trying to flirt with you, and you're not responding to it. Then he's going to decide you are uninterested. That's why giggly girls are good at having men around. They naturally give dudes positive signals. Whereas if you're super stoic all the time, and he's trying to hit on you and not getting any affirmative signals, he might come to the conclusion you just aren't interested. 2
salparadise Posted January 18, 2016 Posted January 18, 2016 I would define flirting as not only making physical contact..arm touching, leg (?!) touching, looking at my dates lips, extended gaze, but also talking in a suggestive manner, alluding to sex, teasing sort of talk. If a woman didn't do any of the above with a guy and the guy was initially interested in her, would this make him not feel a spark or frisson? I don't think you can define it precisely. It can be extremely subtle, sometimes too subtle for the other to pick up on. Or it can be too overt to create intrigue. With my girlfriend of four months (amazing relationship thus far) she wasn't giving off a lot of signals on the first date. I knew I liked her but wasn't sure if she liked me. After the date she texted and said hoped we could do it again. That was the encouragement I was looking for. I would probably have asked her out again anyway, but I appreciated the overt green light. We didn't get touchy feely on the second date either. She suggested we share a dessert and I took that as a cue that she was feeling attracted and comfortable. It was the third date that we really broke the ice and after that we were off to the races. But I've had my share that went the other way too. It doesn't do much good to overanalyze it all. Sometimes the chemistry works one way but not both ways. In the younger days it seemed that the women were pickier. But in the second chapter it has seemed that I've been the one being more selective. Either way, you just have to accept it and keep on keeping on.
WaitingForBardot Posted January 19, 2016 Posted January 19, 2016 ... That's why giggly girls are good at having men around. They naturally give dudes positive signals. ... This is a great observation... Not that the signals have to be giggles OP, but you must give/return positive signals of some sort if you want a man, a respectable man in any case, to continue to escalate. For example if you want him to touch you, you don't necessarily have to touch him first, but you should be putting yourself close enough to him that there will be some casual contact while standing, sitting, etc. Proximity is a strong indicator of interest. 1
BronzeAgeJaeger217 Posted January 19, 2016 Posted January 19, 2016 When I go on first (or even sometimes second dates) I usually do not initiate physical contact of any kind at all. I wait for the guy to initiate because I'm not sure what is the comfort level or expection of different guys. My question is, is this a turn off for guys? For example if you go out on a date or two with a woman and she doesn't touch you and waits for you to initiate, do you take this as a signal that she isn't interested? Or do you initiate yourself and don't think much of this? I'd appreciate some input and feedback regarding this as I don't know if this is the reason my dates don't last past the second date! Thanks! I want to say Yes it is a turn off but at the same time I feel I shouldn't because its what expected
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