Screwed up...what do I do?

January 15, 2016

Go for coffee. Do not use the word 'sorry', not even if you spill hot coffee in her lap. (Well, okay, maybe )

Then let her go do her friend's hair.

Keep us posted!

January 15, 2016

I would also add to Midwests post.

Call your friends and go and see them too. Organise things to do, go to the movies or go down the gym etc.

Do something rather than sit and fret.

January 15, 2016

I would also add to Midwests post.

Call your friends and go and see them too. Organise things to do, go to the movies or go down the gym etc.

Do something rather than sit and fret.

Problem is I have very few friends that I would consider close. Being married for 13 years sometimes that happens (not always and it's not a good thing I know). Friends I do have are married and usually also tied up. But I agree, I need to find a way to keep busy. I just took the afternoon off work because I couldn't concentrate leading up to this coffee "date".

January 15, 2016

Problem is I have very few friends that I would consider close. Being married for 13 years sometimes that happens (not always and it's not a good thing I know). Friends I do have are married and usually also tied up. But I agree, I need to find a way to keep busy. I just took the afternoon off work because I couldn't concentrate leading up to this coffee "date".

Coffee dates are quite possibly the worst idea ever because they feel like job interviews. I recommend going on dates where you are actually doing something, anything, beside sitting there looking at each other directly in the eyes.

Since you are already past that point - do this. Go in a bit early and chat up the barista, make sure to tip a 5 spot or something good, maybe get a name. Calling the barista by their name later will make you seem more friendly and social. The tip will make sure they actually respond, lol. If they have any sort of menu or things to look at grab them. You can use the menu or whatever for something to look down at and make comments about if you hit an awkward silence. If things get too awkward or silent, that's when you use your distraction. "You know, I've always wanted to try the scones, espresso, whatever" and go order a few menu items that you can both try and discuss. If there are any other little shops in the area, you may mention you need something from one of them and see if she wants to go with you. Any sort of walking or moving locations will take that eye-to-eye contact out the equation and make you both feel more at ease.

What I'm getting at is that humans hate being put on the spot like a coffee dates. If you're going to do it, you need some distractions or you'll be trying to fill the vacuum with words. You can only go so far with talking before it gets weird. Even if you have to pull out your phone and show a few funny carefully selected cat pictures, do that. Also, it may help to relieve your anxiety if you make a list of subjects that you can talk about or have talked about previously. In fact, there's nothing better than beginning the date by continuing a previous conversation you were having. If you plan ahead, you can make this really fun and take the awkwardness out of it. If you go in and just order coffee and stare her in the eyes - it's gonna get weird and you're gonna get nervous. Plan, plan, plan.. and when the silence does hit - use your distractions. Even staring at a menu and making comments will take some of the pressure off her. Keep it light, funny and DO NOT DISCUSS THE RELATIONSHIP. This is your chance to show you're a fun person to be around. There is nothing you can say that will the sway the relationship. You've already beat that dead horse.

It's not what you say, it's how you make her feel. Think about it.

Edited January 15, 2016 by HereNorThere

January 15, 2016

HereNorThere is 100% right on all his posts, despite the fact he uses that disembodied cat head avatar. I especially liked his line about to win a woman, you have to be willing to lose one. It's true for winning men as well, by the way. That's to do with self-esteem. You have to work on yourself in therapy long enough to stop relying on the validation of others to feel good about yourself. It's hard to let someone go if you feel they are your only source of self-esteem. I've had my obsessions, too, but I'm observant and the people I've noticed move on well and don't get trapped in bad relationships are willing to leave the cage door open and let the object of their desires leave at any time without restraint. Because they know that just means it wasn't the right one and there will be a next. Good luck

January 15, 2016

Coffee dates are quite possibly the worst idea ever because they feel like job interviews. I recommend going on dates where you are actually doing something, anything, beside sitting there looking at each other directly in the eyes.

Since you are already past that point - do this. Go in a bit early and chat up the barista, make sure to tip a 5 spot or something good, maybe get a name. Calling the barista by their name later will make you seem more friendly and social. The tip will make sure they actually respond, lol. If they have any sort of menu or things to look at grab them. You can use the menu or whatever for something to look down at and make comments about if you hit an awkward silence. If things get too awkward or silent, that's when you use your distraction. "You know, I've always wanted to try the scones, espresso, whatever" and go order a few menu items that you can both try and discuss. If there are any other little shops in the area, you may mention you need something from one of them and see if she wants to go with you. Any sort of walking or moving locations will take that eye-to-eye contact out the equation and make you both feel more at ease.

What I'm getting at is that humans hate being put on the spot like a coffee dates. If you're going to do it, you need some distractions or you'll be trying to fill the vacuum with words. You can only go so far with talking before it gets weird. Even if you have to pull out your phone and show a few funny carefully selected cat pictures, do that. Also, it may help to relieve your anxiety if you make a list of subjects that you can talk about or have talked about previously. In fact, there's nothing better than beginning the date by continuing a previous conversation you were having. If you plan ahead, you can make this really fun and take the awkwardness out of it. If you go in and just order coffee and stare her in the eyes - it's gonna get weird and you're gonna get nervous. Plan, plan, plan.. and when the silence does hit - use your distractions. Even staring at a menu and making comments will take some of the pressure off her. Keep it light, funny and DO NOT DISCUSS THE RELATIONSHIP. This is your chance to show you're a fun person to be around. There is nothing you can say that will the sway the relationship. You've already beat that dead horse.

It's not what you say, it's how you make her feel. Think about it.

I agree with everything your saying! Totally helpful. The only thing regarding the coffee date is that it wasn't my idea. It was hers. So, perhaps she's planning on it being "weird" as you put it and ending it. I know I need to stop with that attitude, but it's tough. I've got a lot of learning / reading / healing to do. At the same time, I'm 37 years old with two kids and I feel like I've screwed myself in finding another future wife. That in itself sounds so reboundish I know. But I'm so afraid that I will be alone now. It's all so hard at getting over this.

Here's another secret. Two weeks ago it came up in a conversation that I took cipralex. I confessed to her that I hadn't been taking it for a few weeks since I was so happy and realized maybe my marriage was getting me down and I didn't really need it anymore. She said she thought it was maybe a bad idea and asked me to start taking it again and talk to my doctor. Well, I did start taking it again....about 2 weeks ago. I've been a mental mess. I think that's why I ****ed things up with her and got all paranoid. I know it is. But do I even bring this up to her?

January 15, 2016

Here's another secret. Two weeks ago it came up in a conversation that I took cipralex. I confessed to her that I hadn't been taking it for a few weeks since I was so happy and realized maybe my marriage was getting me down and I didn't really need it anymore. She said she thought it was maybe a bad idea and asked me to start taking it again and talk to my doctor. Well, I did start taking it again....about 2 weeks ago. I've been a mental mess. I think that's why I ****ed things up with her and got all paranoid. I know it is. But do I even bring this up to her?

NO!!! Do not discuss with her.

WRT the Cipralex, did you just stop or did you taper off? You can't just stop a SSRI or you will get a whole lot worse before you get back to your "normal." So it could be that his is what is contributing to your current anxiety.

Discuss the medication change with your doctor, not your gf (or whatever she is). Nothing is less sexy in the early stages of dating than discussions of anti-depressant medication.

January 15, 2016

NO!!! Do not discuss with her.

WRT the Cipralex, did you just stop or did you taper off? You can't just stop a SSRI or you will get a whole lot worse before you get back to your "normal." So it could be that his is what is contributing to your current anxiety.

Discuss the medication change with your doctor, not your gf (or whatever she is). Nothing is less sexy in the early stages of dating than discussions of anti-depressant medication.

I get what your saying, but if that's what it has been (and I believe it has been making me messed up in my thinking)...how do I explain it. Or do I just let have to completely let it go and hope she can get past it...if not, I guess this is where you guys are saying, I have to learn to let go and learn from losing one.

January 15, 2016

I get what your saying, but if that's what it has been (and I believe it has been making me messed up in my thinking)...how do I explain it. Or do I just let have to completely let it go and hope she can get past it...if not, I guess this is where you guys are saying, I have to learn to let go and learn from losing one.

Yea, pretty much that last thing.

The problem with explaining is that it just digs the hole deeper and further creates the impression of you as someone not in control of your emotions (and, by extension, yourself).

The best thing to do is to be the fun, easy going guy she was initially drawn to. Being is a thousand times better than explaining. And the explaining is useless without the being. So just BE. Yes, I know - much easier said than done. But it's the only path, imo.

What time is your coffee date?

January 15, 2016

I agree with everything your saying! Totally helpful. The only thing regarding the coffee date is that it wasn't my idea. It was hers. So, perhaps she's planning on it being "weird" as you put it and ending it. I know I need to stop with that attitude, but it's tough. I've got a lot of learning / reading / healing to do. At the same time, I'm 37 years old with two kids and I feel like I've screwed myself in finding another future wife. That in itself sounds so reboundish I know. But I'm so afraid that I will be alone now. It's all so hard at getting over this.

Here's another secret. Two weeks ago it came up in a conversation that I took cipralex. I confessed to her that I hadn't been taking it for a few weeks since I was so happy and realized maybe my marriage was getting me down and I didn't really need it anymore. She said she thought it was maybe a bad idea and asked me to start taking it again and talk to my doctor. Well, I did start taking it again....about 2 weeks ago. I've been a mental mess. I think that's why I ****ed things up with her and got all paranoid. I know it is. But do I even bring this up to her?

Yeah, it's too early to be discussing taking escitalopram. Even though SSRIs are one of the most commonly prescribed medications in the world, daters are looking for red flags and psychiatric medicines are one of them. The other poster is also right about stopping it without your doctors approval. SSRI discontinuation syndrome (big pharma's nice way to say withdrawal) is some serious business. I'm not a doctor (I'm an Internet cat) but the efficacy of SSRIs with anxiety disorders is wildly debated. Hell, the efficacy for depression is wildly debated. The serotonin hypothesis as it relates to depression has been discredited numerous times. Personally, I think you should talk to you doctor about a real anxiolytic medication like a benzodiazapine. Most doctors like to start with an SSRI simply because they have a low potential for abuse or overdose. No doctor wants to give a depressed person a bottle of pills they can use to commit suicide, ya know. If she asks about it, you just say something ambiguous and move on. "I'm definitely going to talk to my doctor about it because I don't really feel like I need it, but I've heard you shouldn't stop without consulting a medical professional" aaaaaaaaaannd pivot to the next topic of conversation (which you already know because you made a list of happy topics to discuss before you got there).

And there you go with the negative self talk again. I'm 37, 2 kids and screwed, blah, blah, future wife, blah blah. STOP IT! Let's reframe this statement shall we-

"I'm 37 years young and blessed 2 amazing children that I adore. I'm free of this toxic relationship that was draining all of my positive energy and finally have a chance to live life on my own terms. The world is my oyster and I am going to live every moment to fullest. There's just so many exciting possibilities out there for me and I can't wait to meet new people and have new experiences. I know there is someone out there who will appreciate me for me and I look forward to meeting them. In the meantime, I'm going to have as much fun as I possibly can and work on becoming a better, more confident and secure person so that when I meet this person I am ready."

And what's this "scared" talk from earlier, dude? You seriously scared of a girl? You think she's gonna stab you or something? Has she killed someone before? The absolute worst thing that could happen is that she doesn't want to see you anymore. Big freaking deal. You can't work from the scarcity angle because it isn't real. Single women aren't scarce, they are massively abundant. Each woman you date will teach you something and you can use that knowledge to get better at dating. Eventually the right one comes along and you don't screw it up because you have the sum of the knowledge you've gained over the entire span of dating.

Quit being so damn serious and just enjoy yourself. Pretend you are going to meet an old buddy and catch up for a bit. Be happy, funny, pleasant and make it a good experience for boith of you. Time doesn't move backwards, so you can't control the mistakes you've made before, so you can't worry about them either. Be present in the moment here with us. Anxiety is created when you start dwelling on the past or worrying about the future. There is only one NOW and you need to be here in it with us.

Edited January 15, 2016 by HereNorThere

January 15, 2016

Yeah, it's too early to be discussing taking escitalopram. Even though SSRIs are one of the most commonly prescribed medications in the world, daters are looking for red flags and psychiatric medicines are one of them. The other poster is also right about stopping it without your doctors approval. SSRI discontinuation syndrome (big pharma's nice way to say withdrawal) is some serious business. I'm not a doctor (I'm an Internet cat) but the efficacy of SSRIs with anxiety disorders is wildly debated. Hell, the efficacy for depression is wildly debated. The serotonin hypothesis as it relates to depression has been discredited numerous times. Personally, I think you should talk to you doctor about a real anxiolytic medication like a benzodiazapine. Most doctors like to start with an SSRI simply because they have a low potential for abuse or overdose. No doctor wants to give a depressed person a bottle of pills they can use to commit suicide, ya know. If she asks about it, you just say something ambiguous and move on. "I'm definitely going to talk to my doctor about it because I don't really feel like I need it, but I've heard you shouldn't stop without consulting a medical professional" aaaaaaaaaannd pivot to the next topic of conversation (which you already know because you made a list of happy topics to discuss before you got there).

And there you go with the negative self talk again. I'm 37, 2 kids and screwed, blah, blah, future wife, blah blah. STOP IT! Let's reframe this statement shall we-

"I'm 37 years young and blessed 2 amazing children that I adore. I'm free of this toxic relationship that was draining all of my positive energy and finally have a chance to live life on my own terms. The world is my oyster and I am going to live every moment to fullest. There's just so many exciting possibilities out there for me and I can't wait to meet new people and have new experiences. I know there is someone out there who will appreciate me for me and I look forward to meeting them. In the meantime, I'm going to have as much fun as I possibly can and work on becoming a better, more confident and secure person so that when I meet this person I am ready."

And what's this "scared" talk from earlier, dude? You seriously scared of a girl? You think she's gonna stab you or something? Has she killed someone before? The absolute worst thing that could happen is that she doesn't want to see you anymore. Big freaking deal. You can't work from the scarcity angle because it isn't real. Single women aren't scarce, they are massively abundant. Each woman you date will teach you something and you can use that knowledge to get better at dating. Eventually the right one comes along and you don't screw it up because you have the sum of the knowledge you've gained over the entire span of dating.

Quit being so damn serious and just enjoy yourself. Pretend you are going to meet an old buddy and catch up for a bit. Be happy, funny, pleasant and make it a good experience for boith of you. Time doesn't move backwards, so you can't control the mistakes you've made before, so you can't worry about them either. Be present in the moment here with us. Anxiety is created when you start dwelling on the past or worrying about the future. There is only one NOW and you need to be here in it with us.

your so damn right. Coffee date is at 4 pm. I'll focus on having a good time and just letting whatever happens happen. I'll try anyway. I'll let you know how it goes.

January 16, 2016

Ow, ow ow.

Do NOT discuss your antidepressant use, or lack of, wth her. Either by way of explanation or casual chit chat. She doesn't need to hear it, she's got the biggest event of her life in front of her if her plans go thru. Your issues pale in comparison.

Are you normally a classic over sharer?

And, I agree with others regarding stopping one. Been there done it, with the worst possible one, Effexor. If I hadn't holed myself up in my home, there's no telling what I might have done. Yikes.

Listen to decapitated cat guy. Cats know all.

January 16, 2016

Hey I hope everything worked out for you. I lightly read through all the posts and you seem like a genuine, awesome guy.

My brother suffers from depression, anxiety, self-esteem issues, and pretty much everything you seem to struggle with too. This does not make you a loser, a failure, or anything of that sort! We are all different and have our own problems. Do not look down upon yourself, I'm sure you're an amazing father and a great person, I can tell just from reading your posts.

Continue working on yourself and since I'm only 21...I can't give the most wisdom as some of the posters on here can, but the one thing I do recommend is not allowing her to be your only source of happiness if that makes sense. Do not rely on her to be happy, rely on your kids, working out, and just working on being the best person you can be. I guarantee she will notice that and find you that much more attractive.

Good luck man!

January 16, 2016

So have you had the coffee date yet??

January 16, 2016

I'm going to feel pretty guilty if she really did stab him.

January 16, 2016

I'm going to feel pretty guilty if she really did stab him.

Ha Ha....sorry guys.

She dumped me. And guess what, it really had nothing to do with my behaviour. That guy she dated in the summer and ended a 2 month thing with him, but she loved the guys young daughter....and subsequently was hanging out with them while we dated (and she told me)....well, he has offered to be the sperm donor!!! And she feels it isn't fair to me and that I deserve more. I told her, "so I was right, there is still something with this guy". And she said no, they are just going to be a big happy family. I told her come on, this guy is definitely wanting more! She disagreed and I told her, you know it's not fair for me to say that since I don't know him.

Anyway, seem to have dodged a bullet there. And I texted her later, "So your done dating?" Her: "Yes I am".

Seems a bit messed up honestly. Your going to throw away a relationship (she said I was amazing and a real catch) to have a baby with a guy that didn't work out, but is a great father who has been separated longer and you love his daughter. WTF??!!?!?! And she's just going to give up on intimacy forever? She told me there is no FWB with the guy. I guess with exception to when they conceive!! : )

Man o man, time to work on me I think...with some casual dating along the way. I love women way too much! Lol.

January 16, 2016

Hah! Sounds like you just missed a ride on the Craaaazy Train

January 16, 2016

Let that crazy witch have her turkey baster boyfriend. I honestly didn't know about all the weird IVF stuff, but that's all waaaaay too much drama for someone in your position.

Take some time to clear your head before you go back out there. You've learned some valuable lessons from this experience and you need to digest them. Take some time to really work on yourself inside and out. Get your therapy thing going, read some good books, do some physical stuff and make some male friends.

I actually think this is a good thing. I can't imagine you would have much fun dating a woman like this. She seems to have more issues than time magazine.

January 16, 2016

Let that crazy witch have her turkey baster boyfriend. I honestly didn't know about all the weird IVF stuff, but that's all waaaaay too much drama for someone in your position.

Take some time to clear your head before you go back out there. You've learned some valuable lessons from this experience and you need to digest them. Take some time to really work on yourself inside and out. Get your therapy thing going, read some good books, do some physical stuff and make some male friends.

I actually think this is a good thing. I can't imagine you would have much fun dating a woman like this. She seems to have more issues than time magazine.

You are so right again HereNoThere. I will be doing lots of reading with the material you sent me. And yeah, it's a good thing for sure. Definitely major issues there. I will miss her cooking though...damn. And the sex....double damn! Lol.

January 17, 2016

Sorry Radarsat, but at least now you can free your mind and date others (I'm sure sex & cooking are resourses that you can find elsewhere).

This woman was sooooooo messed up. To me it was clear from post 1 about her that she's just fishing for a daddy and the whole IVF / AI story is a bluff. Take her dumping you as a blessing in disguise. This person was sick in the head and you're just starting to see the tip of the iceberg (I'd bet money the "sperm donor" "ex" she was banging throughout your dating episode)

Ha Ha....sorry guys.

She dumped me. And guess what, it really had nothing to do with my behaviour. That guy she dated in the summer and ended a 2 month thing with him, but she loved the guys young daughter....and subsequently was hanging out with them while we dated (and she told me)....well, he has offered to be the sperm donor!!! And she feels it isn't fair to me and that I deserve more. I told her, "so I was right, there is still something with this guy". And she said no, they are just going to be a big happy family. I told her come on, this guy is definitely wanting more! She disagreed and I told her, you know it's not fair for me to say that since I don't know him.

Anyway, seem to have dodged a bullet there. And I texted her later, "So your done dating?" Her: "Yes I am".

Seems a bit messed up honestly. Your going to throw away a relationship (she said I was amazing and a real catch) to have a baby with a guy that didn't work out, but is a great father who has been separated longer and you love his daughter. WTF??!!?!?! And she's just going to give up on intimacy forever? She told me there is no FWB with the guy. I guess with exception to when they conceive!! : )

Man o man, time to work on me I think...with some casual dating along the way. I love women way too much! Lol.

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