FadedSign52 Posted December 31, 2015 Posted December 31, 2015 Maybe because they are more insecure than more outgoing guys.... I don't know though 2
Author tuxedo cat Posted December 31, 2015 Author Posted December 31, 2015 I feel like i just don't know how to play the game. There's an art to early dating that clearly eludes me - the flirting, the coyness, the just enough amount of interest. It's all a mystery to me. I'm better at the later stages, at forming a deeper bond. Once I have a guy's interest I can usually keep it, at least for a time, but I suck at first impressions. It feels like this delicate balance, this facade, that anything minor can break. I hate it. It really is a game. I've been told by people who know me really well that I'm a very genuine person. But I'm not a good actor. I can't fake confidence or whatever it is you need to allure the opposite sex. I've heard that nearly 50% of people are shy but most shy people are able to disguise it with social skills. I'm in the minority of people whose vulnerabilities are unprotected and bare, with no affectations to fall back on. The funny thing is this is a quality I actually find endearing in others. I find it cute when a guy is shy or nervous around me, so I can't even get in the head of someone who finds it a turn off. I texted him after we spoke a thought that I had and he never responded - that was six hours ago. Screw him.
Snakechammah Posted December 31, 2015 Posted December 31, 2015 When I first read your thread, I thought hey that's me, I'm a little shy too.... but when I read further and you mentioned you've already slept with him on the second and third date, and had pot too, that's when I realized that could be the problem. How can you be shy and then sleep with someone so soon? When you have sex with a someone (in this case an almost stranger that you've just met) you basically open up so many levels of yourself, trusting him with your insecurities, exposing your emotional, physical and spiritual vulnerability. Women tend to develop attachment after sex. And we get hurt more when things don't develop into something more committed. Never give your vulnerability away on a plate to someone who hasn't proven his love. I don't think shyness is the factor that drove him off. You can't possibly be shy and then go naked in the same sentence. The story that Carhill has given was the epitome of shyness - nothing happened until months later - THAT is true shyness. My advice would be to actually embrace your SHYNESS, be a little coy, a little aloof and please don't give too much too soon. I wish you all the best for 2016. May you find a good man next year (tomorrow!) 7
Author tuxedo cat Posted December 31, 2015 Author Posted December 31, 2015 When I first read your thread, I thought hey that's me, I'm a little shy too.... but when I read further and you mentioned you've already slept with him on the second and third date, and had pot too, that's when I realized that could be the problem. How can you be shy and then sleep with someone so soon? When you have sex with a someone (in this case an almost stranger that you've just met) you basically open up so many levels of yourself, trusting him with your insecurities, exposing your emotional, physical and spiritual vulnerability. Women tend to develop attachment after sex. And we get hurt more when things don't develop into something more committed. Never give your vulnerability away on a plate to someone who hasn't proven his love. I don't think shyness is the factor that drove him off. You can't possibly be shy and then go naked in the same sentence. The story that Carhill has given was the epitome of shyness - nothing happened until months later - THAT is true shyness. My advice would be to actually embrace your SHYNESS, be a little coy, a little aloof and please don't give too much too soon. I wish you all the best for 2016. May you find a good man next year (tomorrow!) Right, that also confused me. How could he call me shy when I slept with him so soon? I'm really regretting doing that. Do you think the shyness thing was just an excuse?
Snakechammah Posted December 31, 2015 Posted December 31, 2015 I also want to add from your writing, you sound like a lovely person - intelligent, articulate, gentle, very feminine... these are all such sweet attributes. I am sure many guys will definitely be attracted to that. Just remember not to be swayed by a man's charms, his mere words, and your desire to be loved that you give yourself away too soon. Holding back can be very useful in the long run. 2
Author tuxedo cat Posted December 31, 2015 Author Posted December 31, 2015 Thank you! What you wrote actually made me tear up a little, it was so sweet. Hope you have a fabulous new year as well! 1
Author tuxedo cat Posted December 31, 2015 Author Posted December 31, 2015 Okay, so the other guy I've been seeing and actually like a lot better indicated tonight in text that he sees us going in the direction of exclusivity. He seems pretty into me. Also, I mentioned something offhand about being shy and he said, "Yeah, you're shy, but not in a bad way. I don't mind." His personality is very different from that other guy. He's an extrovert. I had him take the MBTI and he scored ESTJ (I'm an INFP/INFJ). I think it may just be shy guys who have such a problem with my personality. This comment he made followed a conversation I had with my introverted, often jerky ex, who I still keep in touch with from time to time as a friend, where he tried to convince me that my shyness is basically pathological and I need help. 1
SincereOnlineGuy Posted December 31, 2015 Posted December 31, 2015 I've seen this guy I met on OKCupid three times over the past month and a half. He excited me at first - he seemed like a serious guy who was looking for a meaningful connection. After our first date he was very interested and immediately scheduled our next. On our second date he told me he was open to something meaningful with me, but his behavior suggested otherwise. From there on, even though he kept scheduling new dates I got the sense that he wasn't really feeling me. He was all over me physically when we were together but he didn't ask me many questions about myself and didn't try to connect. It felt like his interest in me was only physical. After our third date (last week), I felt frustrated enough by his lukewarm behavior that I finally had a phone conversation with him today about what he was looking for. He told me basically that he's been on the fence, feels very physically attracted to me, really enjoys our conversations and finds me interesting, but doesn't feel that we have a "deep connection." I've heard this from guys before (this is the main form of rejection I get) and since I knew it wasn't going to work with him decided it couldn't hurt to press him for a bit more clarity. He said that on our first date he misattributed my reserve to a lack of interest in him but then realized when I opened up on our second and third dates and demonstrated interest in him, that I was just shy at the start which he finds a turn off in women. For the record he is very shy, dry and serious himself, actually strikingly so. This doesn't bother me in guys as I find it relatable but I've noticed shy guys never seem to want to be with shy women. He told me he wanted to keep seeing me to see if his feelings developed but only felt that there was 30% chance that he'd want a relationship, and he didn't want to get my hopes up. Of course I told him I wasn't interested. And he said, "can we be friends then because I find you interesting and would like to get to know you better?" He kept pushing it. That just hurt more. If you find me so interesting to talk to and are so physically attracted, why would you write me off for anything more? I've had many of my dating experiences follow this exact script. Shy-ish guy and I go on a first date. Guy seems extremely interested on and immediately following said date. Sometimes even volunteers that he is looking for a relationship. On second date, he is a bit more reserved and detached. By third date he's totally disengaged emotionally but can't get his hands off me. Then I confront him about his intentions, he says he's not feeling a connection with me but implies that he wants to keep seeing me in a casual fwb way. When I say I'm not into that he begs me to stay platonic friends with him. So weird. It's upsetting to hear because my shyness around strangers isn't something I have a lot of control over. I do make an effort to engage, but I guess it's not enough. The few guys who have been patient enough to get to know me better have usually fallen for me, but they're a rarity and they were people who already knew me well through work or friends. Unfortunately, I'm in a place now where online dating is my only real option. I don't have a lot of friends or connections in this city. This conversation has gotten me so down that I almost feel like taking a break from dating. What should I do to address this problem? Is it the type of guys I'm seeing? I notice this problem crops up more with submissive/shy guys but don't feel like I have a big enough dating sample to draw any firm conclusions. More than anything, I just wish I could find a guy who accepts me for who I am. Your best course of action is the same as that for anyone... meeting more people is priority number one. Only don't limit yourself to doing so only when the pressures of dating are present. Shove yourself out there and maybe take a class somewhere, in something you're truly interested in. Maybe have dinner at the school on class night each week... just, put yourself around many more people. and EVEN IF you look toward others and think that 1 in 25 take interest in them, and that for you it is merely 1 in 40 ... that isn't a significant setback when you are causing yourself to meeeeeeeet LOTS of people. 2
oberkeat Posted December 31, 2015 Posted December 31, 2015 (edited) I'm an introverted guy myself, but definitely not shy. I've been on dates with plenty of shy women and not one has ever worked out. I often find them very hard to read and usually end up running out of patience with each one. I'm not sure if it's a confidence issue or not, but confident women really turn me on. I'm also not good at coaxing a shy girl out of her shell. I actually interpret shyness in a woman as a sign of lack of interest. OP, if you are reserved around men, this is a problem you need to fix. If you are contributing nothing to the interaction, not flirting, men who are not desperate guys will interpret that as disinterest and end their pursuit of you. If a woman is reserved around me, not giving me signals, not holding up her end of the conversation etc, I end the conversation with her right there. Edited December 31, 2015 by oberkeat
BronzeAgeJaeger217 Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 Social-awkwardness, social anxiety will not screw your chances as much since you are a girl for obvious reasons
oberkeat Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 (edited) Social-awkwardness, social anxiety will not screw your chances as much since you are a girl for obvious reasons Indeed there will always be men willing to have sex with a woman regardless of her personality flaws, but like SwordofFlame, I personally have no patience for a woman who is too reserved. I went on a few dates with women like that, and it was like pulling teeth. I came away from those dates thinking the girl had zero personality. Edited January 1, 2016 by oberkeat
Author tuxedo cat Posted January 1, 2016 Author Posted January 1, 2016 Indeed there will always be men willing to have sex with a woman regardless of her personality flaws, but like SwordofFlame, I personally have no patience for a woman who is too reserved. I went on a few dates with women like that, and it was like pulling teeth. I came away from those dates thinking the girl had zero personality. Are you reserved/introverted yourself? If so I think it's hypocritical for you to assume a girl has no personality just because she's shy when surely you'd be offended if someone drew the same conclusion about you.
oberkeat Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 (edited) Are you reserved/introverted yourself? If so I think it's hypocritical for you to assume a girl has no personality just because she's shy when surely you'd be offended if someone drew the same conclusion about you. I am naturally reserved and introverted and most of my hobbies are things people enjoy by themselves. But I have also developed social skills and opinions that enable me to hold a conversation on almost anything with the person sitting across the table from me when I go on dates. So, I speak from experience on this: In life there are things that require us to open up, such as an important job interview, giving a presentation, or going on a date. You can't be reserved all the time. You can't sit passively, not flirting, contributing little enthusiasm or interest, or no energy, and expect the other person to want to see more of you. That goes for both genders. How do you expect a guy to think you like him, if you don't open up? You are giving them nothing to latch onto, nothing that will make an impression. Edited January 1, 2016 by oberkeat
Author tuxedo cat Posted January 1, 2016 Author Posted January 1, 2016 I am naturally reserved and introverted and most of my hobbies are things people enjoy by themselves. But I have also developed social skills and opinions that enable me to hold a conversation on almost anything with the person sitting across the table from me when I go on dates. So, I speak from experience on this: In life there are things that require us to open up, such as an important job interview, giving a presentation, or going on a date. You can't be reserved all the time. You can't sit passively, not flirting, contributing little enthusiasm or interest, or no interesting opinions on things, and expect the other person to want to see more of you. That goes for both genders. How do you expect a guy to think you like him, if you don't open up? You are giving them nothing to latch onto, nothing that will make an impression. I absolutely do contribute and give opinions. I don't sit there mutely. I'm just not an extrovert and a •bit• shy on a first date. That's really the extent of my shyness. If a guy doesn't have the patience to get to know me better then he's not someone I would trust opening up to anyway. 2/4 guys I met in the last 2 months online had no problem with my initial shyness. They were also the more 'extroverted men of the bunch.
Maggie4 Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 No way, Tux! Your Dad is right. This guy is a jerk. He wanted a sex crazed nympho to jump his bones, and when you weren't as wild in bed as he had hoped, he called it your "shyness", because he had already picked that up as a possible point of insecurity. And he was right: you did start to question yourself, and ask this question on the forum, as if you have a problem. Stop with the introvert extrovert thing. You've met a no good man from online. Don't start to question yourself. There are plenty of weirdos online, so you'd better not criticize yourself everytime it doesn't work out. Often no reason is given at all. And next time, whenever anything starts to hurt (I'm talking your description of the sex you had), DO NOT tolerate it. Oh, and he wanted to have oral sex and you didn't want to, and that's why he's turned off. And how is that your fault?! Why is he making it like you've been rejected for being yourself, when the truth is he just didn't get what he wanted in bed? 3
BronzeAgeJaeger217 Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 Indeed there will always be men willing to have sex with a woman regardless of her personality flaws, but like SwordofFlame, I personally have no patience for a woman who is too reserved. I went on a few dates with women like that, and it was like pulling teeth. I came away from those dates thinking the girl had zero personality. I'm referring to the fact that women still expect men to approach and make the first move, be the initiators
emerald86 Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 (edited) Okay, so the other guy I've been seeing and actually like a lot better indicated tonight in text that he sees us going in the direction of exclusivity. He seems pretty into me. Also, I mentioned something offhand about being shy and he said, "Yeah, you're shy, but not in a bad way. I don't mind." His personality is very different from that other guy. He's an extrovert. I had him take the MBTI and he scored ESTJ (I'm an INFP/INFJ). I think it may just be shy guys who have such a problem with my personality. This comment he made followed a conversation I had with my introverted, often jerky ex, who I still keep in touch with from time to time as a friend, where he tried to convince me that my shyness is basically pathological and I need help. I am an INFP as well, and I'm just like you when it comes to shyness. Not too shy, but probably noticeably shy. As far as dating goes, I have had guys that have liked me, and guys that didn't. The first guy I dated was in between shy and outgoing, and he complained that I wasn't expressive enough. He also complained that I was too awkward - which I probably was. After him, I dated an outgoing guy and then a shy guy. My shyness was never really a problem with either of them, so I think it really depends on the guy. Seems like the guy you mentioned in the original post is just not the one for you! You most certainly deserve better. Always be yourself. Edited January 1, 2016 by emerald86 1
Bobbi7 Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 (edited) I'm tired of guys using the "shyness" as an excuse on women! Seriously, since when in the heck do women wear the pants in a relationship??? What, so females are suppose to be loud, crude, dancing on bars with her titties hanging out? Men are suppose to be talkative and outgoing, women are suppose to be passive and lady like. Usually when a guy calls me out on my shyness, I NEXT them. There is nothing wrong with being shy. People treat shyness like its a disease or something. There are guys that can easily see my shyness/call me out and there are some that they either see it or don't mind it/don't call me out on it. And simply when they don't call me out on it, I feel at ease and comfortable. Or they don't see my shyness at all because they make me come out of my shell.... Edited January 1, 2016 by a LoveShack.org Moderator Merge 1
Rejected Rosebud Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 Social-awkwardness, social anxiety will not screw your chances as much since you are a girl for obvious reasons The OP said that her shyness is causing her troubles, that's why she made this thread. It's not cool for you to dismiss her problems because she is a girl. Seriously. 1
BluEyeL Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 I think you are oberanalyzing. Who cares why a guy doesn't like you? Sure, you can always work on improving you dating skills but in general, don't let people bring you down. You just need one man and if you consistently put yourself out there you'll find him. Also, I think women talk way too much about the relationship and way too early. The best course of action before yo are a couple (and to some extent even after that) is to say nothing , observe what he DOES (how often he asks you out, do you become exclusive without you having to ask, does he introduce you to people important in his life, does he treat you well), not sleep with men until you are a couple (NOT on the second date) and be chill. Drop the guys who don't ask you to be their girlfriend within 3-4 months and don't do the above . Talk less, chill more and look for your own interests. You seem like a wonderful person and I hope you find love in 2016! 2
nicco Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 He used your shyness as an excuse to avoid having to go exclusive with you. He already got the goods on the second and third date, and basically while you two were in bed you asked him a "shoot himself in foot question". Quote: I asked him what he was looking for the next morning and he said he was open to anything and asked me what I wanted. I said something more meaningful and he responded "I can definitely do that." Answer 1: Nothing more than friends Result: You two don't sleep together Answer 2: Tell her what she wants to hear Result: You two will sleep together Benefit of the doubt, at the end maybe the sex wasn't connecting. --- As for finding a guy that like shy girls. You will definitely find one, but you have to run into more guys in public or through work, since you don't have many friends. I like shy girls, but I swear I can never find the one. The few I did find we didn't match, because of hobbies. Since you're doing OLD and you went on 3 dates, I wouldn't say *you're 100% shy. 2
oberkeat Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 I'm tired of guys using the "shyness" as an excuse on women! Seriously, since when in the heck do women wear the pants in a relationship??? What, so females are suppose to be loud, crude, dancing on bars with her titties hanging out? Men are suppose to be talkative and outgoing, women are suppose to be passive and lady like. Usually when a guy calls me out on my shyness, I NEXT them. There is nothing wrong with being shy. People treat shyness like its a disease or something. There are guys that can easily see my shyness/call me out and there are some that they either see it or don't mind it/don't call me out on it. And simply when they don't call me out on it, I feel at ease and comfortable. Or they don't see my shyness at all because they make me come out of my shell.... Some folks seem to think women can do no wrong when it comes to the dating game. If OP were male I think she'd be getting a very different type of advice right now, instead of all these replies telling her not to change herself or make no adjustments. No one is saying OP needs to "wear the pants" or be bouncing off the walls. The fact is, her shyness is causing problems in her interactions with men, and she needs to make adjustments, open up a little. I don't want to be dating someone who brings no energy or personality to the interaction, and expects the man to bear the full burden of entertaining all the time. That sh*t is boring. Like I said, I've been on dates with girls who were like that, and I had little desire to see them again.
Rejected Rosebud Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 I don't want to be dating someone who brings no energy or personality to the interaction, and expects the man to bear the full burden of entertaining all the time. That sh*t is boring. Like I said, I've been on dates with girls who were like that, and I had little desire to see them again. She already said she's not like that. :rolleyes: OP I don't think you need to worry about a guy accepting your shyness, just like everybody else in dating you are looking for a person who you're compatible with on many levels, you just weren't compatible with this guy. I agree with BlueEye though that I don't think you need to be discussing all of this with a guy you barely know, you two just didn't connect and / or he really isn't looking for anything anyway, with anybody. Do you mind me asking why you sleep with guys you date so early?? No judging!! I just want to know, because THAT isn't very shy!!!
Author tuxedo cat Posted January 1, 2016 Author Posted January 1, 2016 I am an INFP as well, and I'm just like you when it comes to shyness. Not too shy, but probably noticeably shy. As far as dating goes, I have had guys that have liked me, and guys that didn't. The first guy I dated was in between shy and outgoing, and he complained that I wasn't expressive enough. He also complained that I was too awkward - which I probably was. After him, I dated an outgoing guy and then a shy guy. My shyness was never really a problem with either of them, so I think it really depends on the guy. Seems like the guy you mentioned in the original post is just not the one for you! You most certainly deserve better. Always be yourself. Yeah, I need to keep reminding myself that it totally depends on the guy. I've dated guys who were totally fine with my personality. In retrospect the ones who were hardest on me for being shy were guys who were recovering introverts or who were self-loathing about their own introversion. One ex really got it into my head that there was something seriously wrong with me, that I was "pathologically" shy (I mentioned him above). We've stayed friends but I'm considering cutting him off in the new year. He didn't realize how much his emotional abuse contributed to my anxiety and reserve in his presence. Guys who were more accepting of me, I quickly relaxed around.
Author tuxedo cat Posted January 1, 2016 Author Posted January 1, 2016 (edited) Some folks seem to think women can do no wrong when it comes to the dating game. If OP were male I think she'd be getting a very different type of advice right now, instead of all these replies telling her not to change herself or make no adjustments. No one is saying OP needs to "wear the pants" or be bouncing off the walls. The fact is, her shyness is causing problems in her interactions with men, and she needs to make adjustments, open up a little. I don't want to be dating someone who brings no energy or personality to the interaction, and expects the man to bear the full burden of entertaining all the time. That sh*t is boring. Like I said, I've been on dates with girls who were like that, and I had little desire to see them again. You're not even reading my responses. I said that I'm not like that. []Another strong possibility is these women simply weren't interested in you. That's how I act - somewhat shut down - when I'm not interested in a guy. Edited January 1, 2016 by a LoveShack.org Moderator Merge and redact inappropriate language 2
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