LookAtThisPOst Posted December 19, 2015 Posted December 19, 2015 Dude. That sounds sick. Maybe he is just genuinely nice, romantic person and you are making him empty. OP, my impression is the guy is really good company. Give him a chance and let him express himself. You feelings (according to my impression) are caused because of fear of being romantic, heart giving because this is something that os not common for our generation. Judging from your description, you like that, but you are afraid to admit it. Just... don't think! let things happen! You can't loose anything! What's sad is, there are a lot of women that think the way the OP does, doesn't make it easy on the men. It's what keeps them and the men that try to date them, perpetually single.
oberkeat Posted December 20, 2015 Posted December 20, 2015 By all means, run from this horrible person! Can you possibly see yourself spending the rest of your life with a guy like THAT?! He should be sterilized! Run for your life! The guy is nice, treats you like a queen, is chivalrous, and compliments you. Drop him like a bad habit and find someone who treats you like you want to be treated...like sh it. Lol, When I posted a thread pointing out this exact phenomenon, folks told me I was making it up, bitter or womanbashing I’ve noticed a number of threads recently where girls are totally turned off by guys who are treating them right and demonstrating interest. At the same time, these women are wishing they had a man who actually showed less interest, less availability, less affection. It’s a sad phenomenon, and I struggle to understand it. It seems like the cardinal rule of dating for men is this: never ever indicate to a woman you're interested in that you actually *like* her. A man would have to be crazy to tell a woman he loves her in this day and age. A lot of women out there seem to only like men who act disinterested or who treat them like garbage, disposable. They would much prefer a man who demonstrates aloofness, unavailability, even disrespect. It sends a terrible message to young men out there. The fact is we've seen this pattern repeatedly on these forums: nice guy demonstrates interest = woman gets bored and wishes for a bad boy. Nice guys with nice guy behavior simply do not create or maintain excitement for most women. A man must become an aloof jerk or bad boy to have any hope of being successful with girls these days. 1
One_Made_of_Silver Posted December 20, 2015 Posted December 20, 2015 Introduce him to one of your well adjusted, healthy minded, emotionally enlightened girlfriends. He sounds like a great guy. Not all men or women are the same and are looking for the same things in life. It is his choice whether or not he wants to be non-confrontational or edgy. He doesn't sound overly anything...you sound overly sensitive to kindness from a man. That is your issue, not his. Most healthy women wouldn't even consider a man who wasn't kind. He isn't for you. You obviously aren't looking for a healthy relationship, but someone whom to play out your childhood dramas with. Please don't waste his time with your game playing. This guy will be fine. There is a lot to be said for someone who doesn't conform to the standards set forth by immature girls. G A little harsh, but true.
LookAtThisPOst Posted December 20, 2015 Posted December 20, 2015 The fact is we've seen this pattern repeatedly on these forums: nice guy demonstrates interest = woman gets bored and wishes for a bad boy. Nice guys with nice guy behavior simply do not create or maintain excitement for most women. A man must become an aloof jerk or bad boy to have any hope of being successful with girls these days. Kind of makes you feel like you're in a Twilight Zone episode where the people that are around you of which are demonstrating inappropriate or immoral behavior is now deemed appropriate to them and YOU become the odd man out. I have an IT guy friend that's dealing with incompetencies at work that shrug off their idiocy as if it were normal. Things like gluing the caps lock down on their keyboards to prevent other people from using their computer...even though co-workers do have a right to their system. Or idiots that don't hold themselves accountable for busting radio equipment. He goes to their superiors about their behavior, but even THEIR bosses won't do a thing about it.
Hopeful30 Posted December 20, 2015 Posted December 20, 2015 Never apologize for how you feel. Especially when it comes to romance. I'm 27 myself (your generation) and I'm very traditional and old school, and yet this isn't a common thing for people my age. Everyone has different tastes and desires. All are valid.
Winterina Posted December 20, 2015 Posted December 20, 2015 Beware of people pleasers and people that avoid confrontation. With such guys you will never know what is really in their hearts and minds and they will never be able to protect you from people and situations. They will behave so that everyone they meet MUST like them because they will bend over backwards to leave that impression on people. You will never be the only one that they treat that way and you will never feel special. When it comes to you or other people they will please other people because they know they will be able to apologize later to you and make it alright... Guys like that are wimps and you don't need that in your life.
Popsicle Posted December 20, 2015 Posted December 20, 2015 As long as he's sincere and not doing the same thing to every other woman (i.e. player or desperate), I'd take this ANY DAY over a prick. 1
Winterina Posted December 20, 2015 Posted December 20, 2015 ...in addition to what i said above... People who tell you there is something off with you are the people that were never involved with someone like that and do not know what an a-hole can be hidden behind those nice words and learned gestures. His basic instincts are not protective. You have some intuition about it so listen to it... if you really thought he was that nice, you would not be posting here. But your inner voice is telling you something and you are trying to reason yourself out of it and dismiss it.
Leucine Posted December 20, 2015 Posted December 20, 2015 (edited) ...in addition to what i said above... People who tell you there is something off with you are the people that were never involved with someone like that and do not know what an a-hole can be hidden behind those nice words and learned gestures. His basic instincts are not protective. You have some intuition about it so listen to it... if you really thought he was that nice, you would not be posting here. But your inner voice is telling you something and you are trying to reason yourself out of it and dismiss it. So you're generalising everyone with a certain character trait based on one bad apple that you happened to stumble across? I would be absolutely delighted if I didn't have to play games and could just be the sweetest person ever to someone that I like, instead of acting indifferent which is a learned gesture to me, as my instincts are very caring and protective. But unfortunately, due to the reasons underlined in this thread, it just doesn't work. It scares potential mates away instead and turns the nice guys into ass-holes when they've been repeatedly turned down and realise that's what they have to do to get their way. Edited December 20, 2015 by Leucine 1
oberkeat Posted December 20, 2015 Posted December 20, 2015 So you're generalising everyone with a certain character trait based on one bad apple that you happened to stumble across? I would be absolutely delighted if I didn't have to play games and could just be the sweetest person ever to someone that I like, instead of acting indifferent which is a learned gesture to me, as my instincts are very caring and protective. But unfortunately, due to the reasons underlined in this thread, it just doesn't work. It scares potential mates away instead and turns the nice guys into ass-holes when they've been repeatedly turned down and realise that's what they have to do to get their way. That's pretty much the end result. The nice guy dies of rejection and transforms into a jerk/bad boy variation that so many women prefer.
Winterina Posted December 20, 2015 Posted December 20, 2015 So you're generalising everyone with a certain character trait based on one bad apple that you happened to stumble across? I would be absolutely delighted if I didn't have to play games and could just be the sweetest person ever to someone that I like, instead of acting indifferent which is a learned gesture to me, as my instincts are very caring and protective. But unfortunately, due to the reasons underlined in this thread, it just doesn't work. It scares potential mates away instead and turns the nice guys into ass-holes when they've been repeatedly turned down and realise that's what they have to do to get their way. Nope. Not generalising. It is just how it is. You cannot be nice to everyone and be protective at the same time. Those traits (confrontation and niceness to everyone) are just not compatible. No guys, you do not have to be jerks because women will run away from you. Yes, you do need to be nice. BUT if it comes to things like expressing what you need and what you think to your partner, or protecting your relationship and the feelings of your partner, definitely do confront people. Do not feel the overwhelming need to be nice to everyone and be a mediator in the situation. You are bound to hurt some feelings and push your girl away. Women appreciate men who can protect them and be straightforward and honest with them (and that is a trait that nice non-confrontational guys do not have - they will always just confirm everything you say and keep their opinions to themselves, they will never stand up for you to others). That is the ideal guy to have a kid or two with... and not a wimp who will try sucking up to everyone so that he can look like a nice guy to the world.
Wewon Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Nope. Not generalising. It is just how it is. You cannot be nice to everyone and be protective at the same time. Those traits (confrontation and niceness to everyone) are just not compatible. No guys, you do not have to be jerks because women will run away from you. Yes, you do need to be nice. BUT if it comes to things like expressing what you need and what you think to your partner, or protecting your relationship and the feelings of your partner, definitely do confront people. Do not feel the overwhelming need to be nice to everyone and be a mediator in the situation. You are bound to hurt some feelings and push your girl away. Women appreciate men who can protect them and be straightforward and honest with them (and that is a trait that nice non-confrontational guys do not have - they will always just confirm everything you say and keep their opinions to themselves, they will never stand up for you to others). That is the ideal guy to have a kid or two with... and not a wimp who will try sucking up to everyone so that he can look like a nice guy to the world. You had a bad experience. There is nothing written in the OP to support the conclusions that you're drawing. The OP is uncomfortable with far more than the guy being nice in a weird way, she's uncomfortable with the general conduct of a date. If this guy were truly supplicating that would be one thing, but the OP is uncomfortable with anything more than being treated like a "pal". 2
Els Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Many of the things you mentioned - paying for dates, picking you up, etc - don't strike me as 'excessively nice', and I'm fine with them personally. I would be wary about someone showering me with a dozen compliments a minute, but that has more to do with the fact that people who compliment THAT much tend to be rather fake. Genuine compliments aren't usually handed out at such an excessive rate. It's possible that the two of you just aren't compatible, in which case just part ways and move on. But I think you should also reexamine why you feel so uncomfortable when a guy is being nice to you. Were your previous relationships with men who treated you poorly? How is your self-esteem? I'm only a few years older than you, so I don't think it's necessarily an age thing.
Leucine Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Nope. Not generalising. It is just how it is. You cannot be nice to everyone and be protective at the same time. Those traits (confrontation and niceness to everyone) are just not compatible. No guys, you do not have to be jerks because women will run away from you. Yes, you do need to be nice. BUT if it comes to things like expressing what you need and what you think to your partner, or protecting your relationship and the feelings of your partner, definitely do confront people. Do not feel the overwhelming need to be nice to everyone and be a mediator in the situation. You are bound to hurt some feelings and push your girl away. Women appreciate men who can protect them and be straightforward and honest with them (and that is a trait that nice non-confrontational guys do not have - they will always just confirm everything you say and keep their opinions to themselves, they will never stand up for you to others). That is the ideal guy to have a kid or two with... and not a wimp who will try sucking up to everyone so that he can look like a nice guy to the world. Again, you're making generalisations based on ONE person that you happened to meet. It's good for you because you evidently don't even want to keep your mind open to the possibility that guys who are both nice and protective do exist. I've had this discussion with several women in the past who feel the same way, and it's a real shame. Standing your own ground while still being nice to other people is possible, and it's called emotional maturity. I am not a "people pleaser" and I do not confirm everything that you say (I'm not doing that right now, am I?) however I would love to have the opportunity to be nice to the one special lady in my life without her turning me down. I'm sick and tired of playing the indifference game, not contacting her when she's on my mind because that might seem "clingy" or "desperate", constantly having to walk the tightrope where being too "soft" will kill your sex life and being too tough will kill your relationship. But by all means, do keep giving abusive guys chance after chance and wondering where all the good guys with their heart in the right place are.
Winterina Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Again, you're making generalisations based on ONE person that you happened to meet. It's good for you because you evidently don't even want to keep your mind open to the possibility that guys who are both nice and protective do exist. I've had this discussion with several women in the past who feel the same way, and it's a real shame. Standing your own ground while still being nice to other people is possible, and it's called emotional maturity. I am not a "people pleaser" and I do not confirm everything that you say (I'm not doing that right now, am I?) however I would love to have the opportunity to be nice to the one special lady in my life without her turning me down. I'm sick and tired of playing the indifference game, not contacting her when she's on my mind because that might seem "clingy" or "desperate", constantly having to walk the tightrope where being too "soft" will kill your sex life and being too tough will kill your relationship. But by all means, do keep giving abusive guys chance after chance and wondering where all the good guys with their heart in the right place are. Oh wow, I am shocked at the amount of 1. assumptions ("based on ONE person"... "do keep giving abusive guys a chance after chance" - on the basis of what do you get my entire life history I wonder??? I never had anyone abusive, my comment was on a vast experience and observing other people, etc) and 2. projection (you are telling me I am extrapolating something from one experience, but DO look at yourself). Now, that is NOT called emotional maturity that you pride yourself in. I am sorry you are sick and tired of women who don't appreciate you, but you apparently have many of the issues do deal with yourself so maybe they sense that. One and the most obvious one is that you think you need to play some game to get women to like you. Not so. That way you will just seem like a people pleaser (trying to read what she wants and thinks and then acting accordingly), a weak character who cannot politely and effectively express what he is all about without fearing he will be dumped. It is a long way for you to emotional maturity but do work on it now that someone kindly pointed out some things you were not aware of. Good luck.
Leucine Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Oh wow, I am shocked at the amount of 1. assumptions ("based on ONE person"... "do keep giving abusive guys a chance after chance" - on the basis of what do you get my entire life history I wonder??? I never had anyone abusive, my comment was on a vast experience and observing other people, etc) and 2. projection (you are telling me I am extrapolating something from one experience, but DO look at yourself). Now, that is NOT called emotional maturity that you pride yourself in. I am sorry you are sick and tired of women who don't appreciate you, but you apparently have many of the issues do deal with yourself so maybe they sense that. One and the most obvious one is that you think you need to play some game to get women to like you. Not so. That way you will just seem like a people pleaser (trying to read what she wants and thinks and then acting accordingly), a weak character who cannot politely and effectively express what he is all about without fearing he will be dumped. It is a long way for you to emotional maturity but do work on it now that someone kindly pointed out some things you were not aware of. Good luck. Your inability to put yourself in someone else's shoes is glaring. You're a woman and you don't need to play games because as long as you're at least remotely attractive, you can pick the man you want. It's not so for men because we're at the other end of the stick, but I wouldn't expect you to be able to understand that and it's not worth continuing this argument over.
apefu Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Your inability to put yourself in someone else's shoes is glaring. You're a woman and you don't need to play games because as long as you're at least remotely attractive, you can pick the man you want. It's not so for men because we're at the other end of the stick, but I wouldn't expect you to be able to understand that and it's not worth continuing this argument over. can't trust a word these girls say. these girls have no idea what they want. a girl makes all these rules and then everything goes out the door
Blanco Posted December 22, 2015 Posted December 22, 2015 Your inability to put yourself in someone else's shoes is glaring. You're a woman and you don't need to play games because as long as you're at least remotely attractive, you can pick the man you want. It's not so for men because we're at the other end of the stick, but I wouldn't expect you to be able to understand that and it's not worth continuing this argument over. I'm a guy and tend to agree with her. I've always considered myself a "nice" guy, but when I dig a bit deeper, a lot of my actions have been attempts to gain adoration or attention from other people. I think my heart is often in the right place, but there's a fine line between doing what you believe is the right thing and doing the "right thing" predominantly so that someone will be interested in you.
apefu Posted December 22, 2015 Posted December 22, 2015 I'm a guy and tend to agree with her. I've always considered myself a "nice" guy, but when I dig a bit deeper, a lot of my actions have been attempts to gain adoration or attention from other people. I think my heart is often in the right place, but there's a fine line between doing what you believe is the right thing and doing the "right thing" predominantly so that someone will be interested in you. once a girl sees this she assumes all guys are just nice expecting sex as a payback. a guy who is genuinely nice without quotes is assumed to be nice with quotes and perception is more important that reality in this fast paced dating environment.
preraph Posted December 22, 2015 Posted December 22, 2015 Some people like being on a pedestal (*a lot of men*) and some don't. I like someone thinking I'm the greatest thing since sliced ham, but I ONLY like it if THEY'RE the coolest thing since motorcycle jackets. It's all very subjective. If it doesn't feel right, tough to fight it. But if it keeps happening, maybe take a look inward in case you need some tweaking.
Leucine Posted December 22, 2015 Posted December 22, 2015 I'm a guy and tend to agree with her. I've always considered myself a "nice" guy, but when I dig a bit deeper, a lot of my actions have been attempts to gain adoration or attention from other people. I think my heart is often in the right place, but there's a fine line between doing what you believe is the right thing and doing the "right thing" predominantly so that someone will be interested in you. It's not that I don't agree with this in principle. Humans do hardly anything for purely altruistic purposes without any intention of gaining attention or adoration. That doesn't mean genuinely nice people can't exist, the ones that will strive to enrich both their own and the other person's lives with their interactions, unless you want to see it that way. My main problem with her statements was the bit about confrontation, because it's oh-so mature to throw tantrums when things aren't going your way, right? In fact, that's precisely the immature fake nice guy behaviour, going bat**** crazy over rejection and making a complete U turn on the woman, and yet she argues that's exactly how real men have to be, confrontational. I'm getting the picture that she doesn't know any real men who can stand their ground without behaving like angsty teenagers, and given her expectations, that may not change.
Recommended Posts