SwordofFlame Posted December 11, 2015 Posted December 11, 2015 So you are saying that the league i belong in is with old, obese, or uneducated men who i have nothing in common with. sorry but i'm not willing to be with someone i have zero attraction to or compatibility with. i'd rather just be alone. Nothing wrong with that. There's a lot of single men that also have the same problem.
losangelena Posted December 11, 2015 Posted December 11, 2015 Ok, so let's work with the positives. Nice shape. Good!! Capitalize on that and work off the stomach. Body type means A LOT to guys. You need to maximize what you have that's good. Guys like long hair too. Is it pretty and thick? Maximize that. No joke, there is a reason why all Victoria's secret models pretty much have the same haircut--it has been deemed the most attractive to men. So maybe take that into you hair place and trim it up like that with a few highlights near face to bring out your eyes. I think if you can make bangs (long bangs) work you should try (as long as they are not stringy). Megan Fox and Liv Tyler have done this well. I'm going to look up and give you some more reference celebrities for hair/bangs and working with the proportions of your face to make it look as ideal as possibly. Also learn about contouring for makeup---plenty of videos on youtube. You may want to experiment with glasses and with contacts to see where you get more attention from guys. A lot of guys don't mind glasses though. Also you want to express your personality through your look. As you described it maybe this is why you are getting gamers--your description sounds like a girl gamer. You should figure out what looks-wise would give you more of an artistic look. I can help you with some ideas. Bottom line this guy for whatever reason doesn't think you are quite the same league as him unfortunately. It doesn't matter what you believe or even what we think objectively. As a combination of things he doesn't feel you are what he wants to date (it could be a league thing and it could be that he really didn't have dating intentions and/or that he did not feel a connection with your personality). Getting excited over someone for the reasons you stated above as you've described it, sounds like you are operating from a scarcity mentality, ie which comes off as desperate and gets you lowering your standards and clinging. You can think you are concealing these things but most people feel an element or two and bow out. Work on this--it is as much a problem as anything to do with looks is. Look around and see girls that are really not that pretty but DO maximize. You will start to notice and it will give you ideas of things you can do for yourself. Versace, you know you are my homegirl, but I just don't agree with a lot of this. Go to the gym, grow you hair out nice and long, learn how to contour? Meh, I can't really get behind that. My thick ole booty, a pixie cut and minimal makeup snagged plenty of dudes when I was dating. I do think it's good to maximize what you've got, but it's got to be a look that's true to yourself and not necessarily one that conforms to what men supposedly want. I'll say it again—I bet that OP needs only minimal improvement to her looks and a greater adjustment in what she thinks about herself. Because right now it seems like she thinks she's not worthy of the kind of relationship that she wants (correct me if I'm wrong, OP). No amount of primping and maximizing will change that mindset. You live in L.A., I'm sure you've met any number of women whose quest for beauty is driven solely BECAUSE they believe that they're not worthy of love unless they look a certain way. Again, I call BS. That's a never-ending trap to fall into. A stomach can always be flatter, an eyebrow can always be more sculpted, a hair-do can always have more extensions. Nope. Value needs to come from an internal source, not external validation. I'm not saying OP needs to go around like a meek, frumpy church mouse, but I'm sure her looks are probably fine. It's her perception of what her looks mean that has to change. 2
Author mavis_6 Posted December 11, 2015 Author Posted December 11, 2015 Versace, you know you are my homegirl, but I just don't agree with a lot of this. Go to the gym, grow you hair out nice and long, learn how to contour? Meh, I can't really get behind that. My thick ole booty, a pixie cut and minimal makeup snagged plenty of dudes when I was dating. I do think it's good to maximize what you've got, but it's got to be a look that's true to yourself and not necessarily one that conforms to what men supposedly want. I'll say it again—I bet that OP needs only minimal improvement to her looks and a greater adjustment in what she thinks about herself. Because right now it seems like she thinks she's not worthy of the kind of relationship that she wants (correct me if I'm wrong, OP). No amount of primping and maximizing will change that mindset. You live in L.A., I'm sure you've met any number of women whose quest for beauty is driven solely BECAUSE they believe that they're not worthy of love unless they look a certain way. Again, I call BS. That's a never-ending trap to fall into. A stomach can always be flatter, an eyebrow can always be more sculpted, a hair-do can always have more extensions. Nope. Value needs to come from an internal source, not external validation. I'm not saying OP needs to go around like a meek, frumpy church mouse, but I'm sure her looks are probably fine. It's her perception of what her looks mean that has to change. Thank you so much. I feel like you're the only person still in this conversation who actually understands me and thinks the same way I do.
Author mavis_6 Posted December 11, 2015 Author Posted December 11, 2015 Nothing wrong with that. There's a lot of single men that also have the same problem. I'm guessing you may be one of them, as you seem to be getting a kick out of my frustration. 1
Author mavis_6 Posted December 11, 2015 Author Posted December 11, 2015 I'm guessing you may be one of them, as you seem to be getting a kick out of my frustration. @Sword of flame - You're liking all the comments in which I'm clearly upset, telling me the guys I like are too good for me, and I can tell you're really enjoying this. I bet you have similar issues, and are probably the kind of person who bullied kids like me in middle school.
SwordofFlame Posted December 11, 2015 Posted December 11, 2015 @Sword of flame - You're liking all the comments in which I'm clearly upset, telling me the guys I like are too good for me, and I can tell you're really enjoying this. I bet you have similar issues, and are probably the kind of person who bullied kids like me in middle school. Hah no. The only way we're similar is that we both refuse to settle.
Author mavis_6 Posted December 11, 2015 Author Posted December 11, 2015 Hah no. The only way we're similar is that we both refuse to settle. of course. because i'm sure in every other way you're way better than me. i know you'll love that comment
Versacehottie Posted December 11, 2015 Posted December 11, 2015 So you are saying that the league i belong in is with old, obese, or uneducated men who i have nothing in common with. sorry but i'm not willing to be with someone i have zero attraction to or compatibility with. i'd rather just be alone. No I don't think you "belong" there. I think you are getting guys that you believe are less worthy than you think you deserve (on some levels) because you overestimate what you deserve as other people might see it. Other people can see that, see you on those terms and that's why those guys try. And only those guys. Just like you said your date in the original post was average thus you felt you were the same level to go for each other. That is why the guys in this group are trying and "only" this group--because they see you as similar in level. Why do you think your friends are saying to give these guys a chance? Because they also see things this way. I see now you've posted your picture. You are cute! I can't see so well closer but as I've said all along--your need to work on the internal components of confidence and self-esteem and maximize the outside components to get closer to the results you want. I still think it's stupid that you are bothered by "undesirables" asking you out. Your worth is not determined by who decides to like you. If you had the personal strength and confidence AND desirable options as well, you would not see it as such. Sick of trying to make the point though. You don't get it and that's part of the problem. Ok, pretty sure we are all going to get in trouble now for being off-topic. Does it count if OP took us toward other subjects as an element of discussing her OP?? Anyway, I have high hopes for you mavis. You sound frustrated but not bitter...yet. Just make sure you channel your energy into things that will be helpful and productive for you. Good luck
Gaeta Posted December 11, 2015 Posted December 11, 2015 Mavis, you're a cutie. So a drunk you met in a bar bailed after a date, so what? I stopped counting how many men bailed after 1-2-3 dates. Just go 'meh' and move to next. I only have one suggestion. Stop meeting men in bars. It's really the bottom of the barrel. 4
losangelena Posted December 11, 2015 Posted December 11, 2015 Girl, I wish that photo got bigger, but you are cute, what are you talking about??? I certainly don't see an unappealing bridge troll. You need a swift kick in the rear about your looks! Red hair and everything—c'mon, your brain is the only thing standing in the way of you and a few good men. Oh, lordy. You've got great raw materials! 5
Versacehottie Posted December 11, 2015 Posted December 11, 2015 Versace, you know you are my homegirl, but I just don't agree with a lot of this. Go to the gym, grow you hair out nice and long, learn how to contour? Meh, I can't really get behind that. My thick ole booty, a pixie cut and minimal makeup snagged plenty of dudes when I was dating. I do think it's good to maximize what you've got, but it's got to be a look that's true to yourself and not necessarily one that conforms to what men supposedly want. I'll say it again—I bet that OP needs only minimal improvement to her looks and a greater adjustment in what she thinks about herself. Because right now it seems like she thinks she's not worthy of the kind of relationship that she wants (correct me if I'm wrong, OP). No amount of primping and maximizing will change that mindset. You live in L.A., I'm sure you've met any number of women whose quest for beauty is driven solely BECAUSE they believe that they're not worthy of love unless they look a certain way. Again, I call BS. That's a never-ending trap to fall into. A stomach can always be flatter, an eyebrow can always be more sculpted, a hair-do can always have more extensions. Nope. Value needs to come from an internal source, not external validation. I'm not saying OP needs to go around like a meek, frumpy church mouse, but I'm sure her looks are probably fine. It's her perception of what her looks mean that has to change. Yes we mostly see eye to eye! I said she should work with the things that were already in her corner (shape/hair as it is already) and maximize those. Let's not sugarcoat it or avoid reality, she will have an easier time getting in the door with guys if she looks her best. Even she said in an early post, in the way she described herself. My point is that she should capitalize and maximize. I've also said this in terms of "when" she decides to do it (more often not just when she is going out). I think she's very cute now that there's a pic but honestly 100% honestly I think everyone should maximize and do their best. I never said anything is wrong with mavis in terms of her looks. I think she is getting hung up on that part and defensive about it--when the biggest part to change is her internal stuff. She doesn't 'need' to change anything about her looks, but will it help--probably yes just like it would for anyone including a model. We both would be on the same page I believe to say that all the looks improvement in the world will not help if the internal is not there. I know more of those people than I care to admit. I know some very beautiful people who are total duds!!! I know you have some of the best comprehension skills on this forum so I'm sure you saw the part where I gave my reason why (i don't think it was this post but another): that feeling better about herself would translate in her confidence and attitude--which I said needed work and have been harping on pretty much the whole time. She could change nothing about her looks and just work on the inside and have better results. She could change only her looks and have better results probably (though not at all my recommendation because those would be results on initial attention only and not lasting). OR what I think she should do is work on both for maximum results. Part of what I recommended in "looks" category is actually marketing. She gets nerdy gamer guys but wants artistic guys. I've seen nerdy game guys with good looking girls as I have seen artistic guys with good looking girls--but the girls look different. Right now, I think she gets gamers because she looks more like a gamer herself--not an artistic person herself. That is to get her what she wants in a partner (an artistic guy) AND to express herself as an artistic person. So that part of looks was more "marketing", who she IS accurately. I think it's a positive cycle of where looking and feeling better on the outside, gives more confidence and self-respect which in turn they keep affecting each other positively and your self-esteem grows. OP can work on the inner first and like herself enough not to describe herself the way she did but more than likely she will be inspired through working on the inner to present herself her best, express who she is (not drab) and describe herself in more caring terms. Just guessing. The only thing I said that could have been interpreted (i think) to "conform" is about the hair, which really wasn't to bow down to men. --It was because she already said she has good hair that was to give her confidence that she already HAS the things people want in the way they want it. In fact, it was one of the few things she described positively about herself so trying to build on that. The part about the bangs is to mitigate the stuff she described poorly about herself (forehead). Ultimately I'm a realist who loves self-improvement of ALL sorts. To be more appealing to guys in general and solve her problem of only getting attention from ones she is not interested in--she needs to get more interest--a bigger volume of people taking a look at her, thus looks ARE going to play a role; same as confidence and assertiveness are going to play a role. First to admit that if she doesn't work on the internal stuff, it will be initial interest only, maybe 1-2 dates, because she won't be able to sustain it due to the other stuff. My belief in that applies to people of any looks.
truth_seeker Posted December 12, 2015 Posted December 12, 2015 thanks for the like on that comment, and confirming that i'm unattractive and get what i deserve. i honestly think i'm pretty realistic about what my league is. unfortunately i don't have a pic of me and this guy together to see if you agree. if he's not attracted to me that's fair though, i'm not attracted to all guys i believe are in my own league, just some. if he and you think he's above me, well you're entitled to that opinion. Mavis: I see you posted a pic of yourself. From what I see you look pretty good. You carry your weight well. Some women who are 5'6, 140, have bit much around the abdomen and a--. These women do not carry the extra weight well. I like glasses but some men might not. Some suggestions: 1) Lose the glasses, get contacts 2) Put your hair up 3) Show a little more cleavage I am making these suggestions again based on you wanting to attract good-looking men, not fat, ugly men.
Author mavis_6 Posted December 12, 2015 Author Posted December 12, 2015 No I don't think you "belong" there. I think you are getting guys that you believe are less worthy than you think you deserve (on some levels) because you overestimate what you deserve as other people might see it. Other people can see that, see you on those terms and that's why those guys try. And only those guys. Just like you said your date in the original post was average thus you felt you were the same level to go for each other. That is why the guys in this group are trying and "only" this group--because they see you as similar in level. Why do you think your friends are saying to give these guys a chance? Because they also see things this way. I see now you've posted your picture. You are cute! I can't see so well closer but as I've said all along--your need to work on the internal components of confidence and self-esteem and maximize the outside components to get closer to the results you want. I still think it's stupid that you are bothered by "undesirables" asking you out. Your worth is not determined by who decides to like you. If you had the personal strength and confidence AND desirable options as well, you would not see it as such. Sick of trying to make the point though. You don't get it and that's part of the problem. Ok, pretty sure we are all going to get in trouble now for being off-topic. Does it count if OP took us toward other subjects as an element of discussing her OP?? Anyway, I have high hopes for you mavis. You sound frustrated but not bitter...yet. Just make sure you channel your energy into things that will be helpful and productive for you. Good luck i think i do get your point, and i mostly agree with it. no, i do not agree that i am on the same level as those guys i described, but obviously they and other people see it that way. keep in mind though, as i mentioned, that friends will suggest i date men whom they themselves would never date. this also says to me that they see themselves as being in a league above me (IMO, some of them are, but some aren't). and you also made the point that if i had other, more desirable options, i would not be so bothered by these guys. the part that bothers me is these type of guys are ALL i seem to get. most people on here seem to think that i am overestimating my attractiveness, but i honestly think i'm pretty realistic about it. i agree more with @losangelena who said it is more of a confidence problem. perhaps these men see me as having low confidence, so they figure i'll be desperate enough to date them (tbh, they are most often low-confidence, desperate seeming types themselves). either that or they are aiming out of their league (as others are accusing me of doing). i don't know what's in their heads. despite what people think or say, i still see myself as average and these guys as below-average. but not everyone will share that opinion. all i know is that it's been a long, frustrating, road, and i hope the tide changes soon.
Versacehottie Posted December 12, 2015 Posted December 12, 2015 yes, mavis. you need to embrace your looks: *LOVE your face shape, it's gorgeous. *like you believe it is a good feature of yours so do I: your hair is very pretty. *don't think your forehead is too big. The bangs I suggested might still look good to show that you are artistic. 1
Gaeta Posted December 12, 2015 Posted December 12, 2015 I like glasses but some men might not. Some suggestions: 1) Lose the glasses, get contacts 2) Put your hair up 3) Show a little more cleavage I am making these suggestions again based on you wanting to attract good-looking men, not fat, ugly men. 1) Glasses are in. Every where you look you see people with those hipster black frame glasses. 2) She is young with beautiful hair, she has to show them off, hair down. She can put her hair up with she's 75 3) I agree with playing with fitted clothes and cleavage.
Author mavis_6 Posted December 12, 2015 Author Posted December 12, 2015 Mavis: I see you posted a pic of yourself. From what I see you look pretty good. You carry your weight well. Some women who are 5'6, 140, have bit much around the abdomen and a--. These women do not carry the extra weight well. I like glasses but some men might not. Some suggestions: 1) Lose the glasses, get contacts 2) Put your hair up 3) Show a little more cleavage I am making these suggestions again based on you wanting to attract good-looking men, not fat, ugly men. again, i know you are trying to help, but i find this comment a bit ridiculous. for one thing, i know lots of men love big a**es. and you're telling me to put my hair up, another person says keep it long (i don't look good with it up btw, but thank you for thinking i could pull that off . you agree with me that i'm not fat (like i said, i think i have a pretty realistic perception about it). and the cleavage thing? haha, yep, i'm sure that would help me get men who want a ONS, but that's not what i'm after. thanks anyway :/ oh ps. i agree about the contacts, but i have extremely dry eyes so i can't wear them 1
Redfisher Posted December 12, 2015 Posted December 12, 2015 These guys could be messaging 100's of chicks so you may get a lot...How many good looking guys do you message?
Gaeta Posted December 12, 2015 Posted December 12, 2015 and the cleavage thing? haha, yep, i'm sure that would help me get men who want a ONS, but that's not what i'm after. thanks anyway :/ oh ps. i agree about the contacts, but i have extremely dry eyes so i can't wear them YES cleavage. Not as in slvt cleavage but as in feminine cleavage. And cleavage attracts ONS?? C'mon. This is not 1935. Men are used to seeing boobs everywhere and all day long. It's not a pair of showcased boobs that's gonna make them think you're easy.
Author mavis_6 Posted December 12, 2015 Author Posted December 12, 2015 yes, mavis. you need to embrace your looks: *LOVE your face shape, it's gorgeous. *like you believe it is a good feature of yours so do I: your hair is very pretty. *don't think your forehead is too big. The bangs I suggested might still look good to show that you are artistic. thank you for the compliments. i have to be honest and tell you this is a "good" pic - as in, a lot better than i normally look. i had done up my hair and makeup for a halloween party. plus the thumbnail is small so you can't really see my less attractive features (nose, teeth and chin). however it seems most people on here think the overall package looks ok, and i'm glad that now ppl can at least agree that i'm average! i do see merit in your suggestion to do myself up more regularly; not just for events and parties. 2
Versacehottie Posted December 12, 2015 Posted December 12, 2015 i think i do get your point, and i mostly agree with it. no, i do not agree that i am on the same level as those guys i described, but obviously they and other people see it that way. keep in mind though, as i mentioned, that friends will suggest i date men whom they themselves would never date. this also says to me that they see themselves as being in a league above me (IMO, some of them are, but some aren't). and you also made the point that if i had other, more desirable options, i would not be so bothered by these guys. the part that bothers me is these type of guys are ALL i seem to get. most people on here seem to think that i am overestimating my attractiveness, but i honestly think i'm pretty realistic about it. i agree more with @losangelena who said it is more of a confidence problem. perhaps these men see me as having low confidence, so they figure i'll be desperate enough to date them (tbh, they are most often low-confidence, desperate seeming types themselves). either that or they are aiming out of their league (as others are accusing me of doing). i don't know what's in their heads. despite what people think or say, i still see myself as average and these guys as below-average. but not everyone will share that opinion. all i know is that it's been a long, frustrating, road, and i hope the tide changes soon. What I bolded. Bingo. Half the equation. I'll speak for myself when I have used the word "attractiveness" in terms of you overestimating it, I mean ALL the components of why people are attracted to one another (looks, personality, confidence, self-respect, attitude) "and you also made the point that if i had other, more desirable options, i would not be so bothered by these guys. the part that bothers me is these type of guys are ALL i seem to get". Yes precisely. And you are letting it color your confidence and self-respect. And turning it around on those guys is not cool; essentially it should be a non-issue. You don't have to lower your standards. i would never say to do that but just ignore or be gracious about the attention even though you are still lacking attention from the ones you want. That is how you act from a place of PLENTITUDE vs one of SCARCITY which will help you. 1
Author mavis_6 Posted December 12, 2015 Author Posted December 12, 2015 These guys could be messaging 100's of chicks so you may get a lot...How many good looking guys do you message? i almost never message the so-called "good-looking" guys - i always try to stay in the average range, yet i still mostly get ignored. i've even messaged a couple guys without a pic; they expressed interest, then stopped talking to me once they saw my pics. the sad truth is that a lot of men are shallow, especially in OLD.
Tread Carefully Posted December 12, 2015 Posted December 12, 2015 People are attracted to happy people. If you walk around with a smile on your face like you know/have/are the biggest, best secret in the whole world...people are going to notice you. All kinds of people! And a lot of them are going to be super curious about that secret... 2
katiegrl Posted December 12, 2015 Posted December 12, 2015 mavis.... just wanted to chime in real quick to say you are absolutely adorable....are you kidding me? Work on the self-esteem girl... because IMO you are above-average!
Author mavis_6 Posted December 12, 2015 Author Posted December 12, 2015 Girl, I wish that photo got bigger, but you are cute, what are you talking about??? I certainly don't see an unappealing bridge troll. You need a swift kick in the rear about your looks! Red hair and everything—c'mon, your brain is the only thing standing in the way of you and a few good men. Oh, lordy. You've got great raw materials! again, thank you for being my favorite commenter! you've really helped me out today
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