Death of passion

[deepinthewoods]

So, I'm 38, have been with my girlfriend for 4 years. We had a great honeymoon phase for the first year or so, after that things dropped off quickly. Due to stressful circumstances (going to court with my ex for custody issues around my then 5 year old son) and not great living situation, sex and passion pretty much disappeared.

 

Then we got pregnant (yes we managed to have sex once in a while). We were really kind of at a breaking point with it all and were considering separating until we found out. Then we had to decide if we were going through with it, which we did and we have an amazing 15 month old daughter.

 

That is all great, parenting life is amazing and challenging, but our relationship is going nowhere. We have fought endlessly about sex for the past 3 years, and neither of us can discuss it anymore. It is a stalemate. Her position is that she does not feel like sex so isn't going to have it. The situation has been changing so at various times the reasons were, life sucks, pregnant, post-baby,work stress, now 3 years later we are still nowhere. Once or twice a month, which is pretty standard for the past three years. I am like a once or twice a week kind of guy (would be down with every day though too). I've given up initiating because hundreds of rejections later, it is too painful to go there anymore.

 

Now I am drifting, I don't feel passion any more, I can't plan anything with her, I can't see our future together. We were house hunting six months ago, but I was so depressed and frustrated, I told her that I can't think about buying a house with her when I feel this way. I feel like I've put everything I have into this, and it's been a black hole, it all goes in but nothing comes out. I think about cheating and have met a girl that I like, we have internet chats, but nothing too intimate. I won't cheat, but I think about it a lot. We've talked about having an open relationship, and she has not ruled it out, but I think we both know she is too jealous. I've told her about this other girl and she is now mad and hurt, further adding to the obstacles to sex.

 

We had seen a counsellor two years ago, and I went back to talk to her yesterday. She asked me to rate my motivation to keep the relationship alive. I told her 5/10, but today, it's like I can't even find it. We haven't spoken about the session, I've been a bit raw and distant about it and she has been busy with work.

 

So anyways, what do you guys think? Is it all just situational? Is it time to move on, or will things get better? I've felt like this for 3/4 of the relationship, and though she believes that things will change, when do I have to accept that this is the way it is, and is it good enough? I don't want to live like this! Do I just deal and hope for better things? How long do I give it?

 

I feel like if there was more substance, sex wouldn't be the deal breaker, but I feel like she has no interest in closeness with me. No caresses, flirts, kisses, hugs. I initiate every bit of intimacy and she pulls away at least half of the time.

 

I'm dying, just dying. And we've talked it out a million times. Now, just drifting... I think at this point she might be more interested than I am, I've lost my will to make it work. I asked her a while ago to not make me give up, and at some point, I did. I really don't want to have two kids from two different relationships, the first time was just terrible, and where do I go from here?

 

Maybe I am an insensitive jerk?? She just had a baby, is back working, life's been tough so it's all understandable? I just don't know what we actually have anymore...

 

Any perspectives will be helpful (especially guys in similar situation, or new mom's experiences), thanks for reading and any input you might have!!

[Noproblem]

The answer is easy

 

If you are dying, just end it.

 

The execution is hard though.

 

You need to buy your life again.. Sell those things that make you sad, and miserable. Give them for free if you have to.

 

How many years you have to live?

 

30, 20, probably 5 or less, if any with this state of despair!

 

You have to end it for your sake

not just for sex and and other reasons

 

For you...

 

But you do have a daughter to consider, so you have to end it in a civil way!

 

Next time wear condoms all the time.

[Sunshine2016]

So, I'm 38, have been with my girlfriend for 4 years. We had a great honeymoon phase for the first year or so, after that things dropped off quickly. Due to stressful circumstances (going to court with my ex for custody issues around my then 5 year old son) and not great living situation, sex and passion pretty much disappeared.

 

Then we got pregnant (yes we managed to have sex once in a while). We were really kind of at a breaking point with it all and were considering separating until we found out. Then we had to decide if we were going through with it, which we did and we have an amazing 15 month old daughter.

 

That is all great, parenting life is amazing and challenging, but our relationship is going nowhere. We have fought endlessly about sex for the past 3 years, and neither of us can discuss it anymore. It is a stalemate. Her position is that she does not feel like sex so isn't going to have it. The situation has been changing so at various times the reasons were, life sucks, pregnant, post-baby,work stress, now 3 years later we are still nowhere. Once or twice a month, which is pretty standard for the past three years. I am like a once or twice a week kind of guy (would be down with every day though too). I've given up initiating because hundreds of rejections later, it is too painful to go there anymore.

 

Now I am drifting, I don't feel passion any more, I can't plan anything with her, I can't see our future together. We were house hunting six months ago, but I was so depressed and frustrated, I told her that I can't think about buying a house with her when I feel this way. I feel like I've put everything I have into this, and it's been a black hole, it all goes in but nothing comes out. I think about cheating and have met a girl that I like, we have internet chats, but nothing too intimate. I won't cheat, but I think about it a lot. We've talked about having an open relationship, and she has not ruled it out, but I think we both know she is too jealous. I've told her about this other girl and she is now mad and hurt, further adding to the obstacles to sex.

 

We had seen a counsellor two years ago, and I went back to talk to her yesterday. She asked me to rate my motivation to keep the relationship alive. I told her 5/10, but today, it's like I can't even find it. We haven't spoken about the session, I've been a bit raw and distant about it and she has been busy with work.

 

So anyways, what do you guys think? Is it all just situational? Is it time to move on, or will things get better? I've felt like this for 3/4 of the relationship, and though she believes that things will change, when do I have to accept that this is the way it is, and is it good enough? I don't want to live like this! Do I just deal and hope for better things? How long do I give it?

 

I feel like if there was more substance, sex wouldn't be the deal breaker, but I feel like she has no interest in closeness with me. No caresses, flirts, kisses, hugs. I initiate every bit of intimacy and she pulls away at least half of the time.

 

I'm dying, just dying. And we've talked it out a million times. Now, just drifting... I think at this point she might be more interested than I am, I've lost my will to make it work. I asked her a while ago to not make me give up, and at some point, I did. I really don't want to have two kids from two different relationships, the first time was just terrible, and where do I go from here?

 

Maybe I am an insensitive jerk?? She just had a baby, is back working, life's been tough so it's all understandable? I just don't know what we actually have anymore...

 

Any perspectives will be helpful (especially guys in similar situation, or new mom's experiences), thanks for reading and any input you might have!!

 

 

Could she be suffering from post-natal depression?

[RocketQueen]

Hi,

Your post really hit a nerve with me, I have been in this situation before (me being in the position of your partner). I can only talk of my own situation obviously, but I know any time for me that life gets hard and I feel depressed or down for any reason it's my sex drive that takes the hit and I put up a wall and am pretty hard to reach.

 

My most recent relationship ended because of this issue, when the intimacy dropped off my ex also backed away and was less supportive (understandably, he was hurt and didn't understand, nor did i). Any issues we had just snowballed and everything just seemed to get worse.

 

I loved him dearly and nearly 12 months on from the split I still love him and know the part I played in the relationship ending.

 

I do think that your partner may be suffering from depression and there's nothing like having a baby to make you feel unattractive.

 

Me and my ex had plenty of conversations about it and I think we both just felt pressured, overwhelmed and confused. It's a delicate situation but he always told me he loved me and I thought we would just work through it but he just told me he was leaving one day.

 

I understood his reasons but don't feel like we ever had a REAL discussion about it. Even now he still can't truly let go but feel he needs to give the fact that he's left some time to see if it's right for him.

 

Incidentally I went to the Drs when he left as I wasn't coping, he agreed I was depressed but he suggested trying different birth control, it took a while but I am now feeling normal and have a healthy sex drive. Oh the irony.

 

I am not saying to stay at all costs, if you can never see yourself being happy with her again then it might be time to call it a day but many factors can affect a ladies sex drive and it is very rarely lack of attraction for their partner.

 

Good luck

[Meli22]

I have been in a similar situation as you. Except it was me who wasn't getting any sort of affection anymore, and my ex boyfriend knew he wasn't giving me any, because he didn't have any motivation to, but couldn't explain why.

 

The whole situation was a mess. I was hurting that he didn't want me anymore, he became insane insecure because he thought id be looking elsewhere because he wasn't giving me any love (crazy right), and whenever I brought the issue up to try and work things out he'd turn the waterworks on and id then feel really guilty. So there was a huge elephant in the room. Our relationship was so boring. He wanted to watch tv all day whereas I wanted to do other things too. It's no wonder our spark died, and it frustrated me that he complained about it so much yet refused to do anything about it.

 

I left because my self esteem hit rock bottom and I was so tired of feeling ugly and miserable, and tired of him not being sure. I must add there were other reasons behind me leaving too, it wasn't so cut and dry; my ex was controlling and I felt like I was walking on eggshells permanently so that motivated me to get out too.

 

Anyway, there's my story. So I totally understand how horrible it can be. I can't say what you should do, but make sure you are totally sure. I'm guessing you have had endless conversations about this to no avail, but there is a child involved so I don't need to tell you to be careful. Passion does tend to face in a relationship, and it takes work to keep that spark up.

[ExpatInItaly]

Could she be suffering from post-natal depression?

 

I was just wondering the same thing. Would she be open to consulting her doctor on her own about this?

 

Beyond that, I'd say the relationship is already over. If you really want to give it another chance, you need to cut contact with the other woman you've been talking to. An open relationship will be a disaster in this context, I feel, because it's not happening for the right reasons and you don't' have a solid enough relationship to withstand it. Your girlfriend shouldn't need to share you; you just need to let her go.

[deepinthewoods]

Thanks all for the replies.

 

With regards to the post-natal depression, I do think this is part of it, though maybe not so much depression as just breast feeding and hormones stifling her sex drive. Apparently when mother's breastfeed, there is a release of oxytocin which causes a satiation effect in the woman's need for intimacy. Quite common apparently.

 

My thing is, it had already nose-dived before the pregnancy (due to stress and general unhappiness), so how do we tell if it is just the post-natal stuff, or is there lingering residual stuff from before? Now, because it has been such an issue, there are all kinds of walls up due to both of us being hurt through this process. So even if and when there is no post-natal stuff, and no residual stuff, we have a terrible dynamic surrounding it. It feels like it has gone way too far and we don't know how to get back.

 

It's apparently up to me to be patient to wait and find out, but three years... Man it feels like a long time to be unsatisfied and to be asked to be patient at this point. I never thought I could live like this, I used to be going crazy after a week of no sex. That standard is way out the window now (also quite common after baby, apparently), but geez, you gotta get back on track somehow.

 

If she doesn't show a willingness to move on this somehow, I don't know what will happen. I am growing more distant by the day and I care less and less about the outcome. I know she wants to be with me, but she seems to have no ability to do the work that it takes to maintain a relationship. Due to our many conversations, she seems to know the severity of the issue, but would rather have me walk than feel like she is being forced to have sex. Which I get, but why does she feel like she is being forced? Isn't there supposed to be some kind of impulse to please your partner, to make things work, to show how much you are into each other? If it's not there, it's not there I guess, which hurts me as well, because I feel like she doesn't love me enough to make it work. But then I'm the one is walking away and leaving her to be a single mom, and I look like the jerk in it all. Plus I've already got a kid from a failed relationship... Sheesh...

 

RocketQueen, thanks for your story. I feel like it is similar, and that at some point I am going to be that guy, telling her I'm moving out. It's not dramatic or anything, but emotionally I am already checking out, and though I know it will suck, I've already done a lot of the processing of extracting myself. It just feels so crazy that this is where we are at.

 

PS we were using condoms every time, though maybe not as soon as we should have. It was a big surprise!

[deepinthewoods]

But all that said, I do love her dearly, and had been quite certain that she was the perfect woman for me when we were first together. We get along well, see eye to eye on lots of things, share similar interests. It's all mostly ok, except the sex and intimacy!! It's driving me crazy!!!

[Meli22]

Deepinthewoods, what does she say when you guys talk about this? Has she told you it's her low sex drive that's making her be this way?

[deepinthewoods]

Deepinthewoods, what does she say when you guys talk about this? Has she told you it's her low sex drive that's making her be this way?

 

Well, I think she is naturally an aloof lover, I've felt this a lot, even when our sex life was good. She hadn't been in a relationship for much longer than a year before we got together, which I'll admit was a bit of a red flag, but whatever. Knowing her family history as well as her personal history, I think she has a hard time with love. It's the combination of being aloof and non-sexual that is tough. But she normally has a high sex drive, she just hasn't been in a good physical or mental state for the past three years, and I don't know what else I can do to help. I help tons with baby, do most of the cooking, lots of cleaning, etc. I used to be super into her, and loving, affectionate, passionate, but it is gone and she's never been that way with me, so there it is, there is nothing happening.

[DontBreakEven]

I've been in this situation ... in your partner's shoes. We were engaged and he called the wedding off. The difference with my partner was that he did not communicate the issues to me at all until the day he broke up with me .. and but that point it was too late, he had made up his mind. So my advice would be to communicated fully, and make sure she realizes the gravity of the situation. Which it sounds like you are. Good for you. I didn't realize the gravity of my situation ... I sure thought he would NEVER leave me ... I was very mistaken.

 

As for me, about 6 months after he left me, I started exploring my sexuality, and realized my lack of sex drive came from the fact that I was in denial about being a lesbian. I always had an excuse why I didn't want to have sex - but really, I just wasn't that into it. Go figure.

Edited November 24, 2015 by DontBreakEven

[deepinthewoods]

Don'tBreakEven, blessing in disguise I guess then?

 

I don't think she is a lesbian, I half-jokingly suggest it sometimes, and her brother is gay, but yea I do wonder if there is underlying things going on. She complains about not being satisfied sexually, and this stems from me having a bout of PE due to extreme stress I was under during the early stages of our relationship. I never had problems pleasing my previous partners (maybe they weren't as in touch with their own sexuality?), but I have to say, I have learned a lot about pleasing a woman since, basically in the interest of pleasing her, and my PE has gone away. I've been studying tantra and had bought books for us a couple of years ago, but she hardly even opened them. I can't even figure out how to have sex in the first place, much less better sex. She has told me that she feels like she's had too many boyfriends in the past (I have no idea what that means), and likes to party, but now, being all domesticated, life is relatively boring. Maybe sex isn't that exciting when you are not drunk and/or high, post-party or whatever...? I don't know, she thinks it will come back, but I hope it's not too little, too late...

[Meli22]

Op it sounds like it could be as simple as a low sex drive. It's pretty common. There may not be any underlying reasons. Maybe "older settled life" has caused that passion and drive to leave her, I've seen it happen. That's not to say you have to put up with it. I know how frustrating it can be because I feel I have a good drive and my ex would often turn me down.

 

Whether it will pass or not l can't say, but I echo others in effective communication is key.

[deepinthewoods]

Thanks Meli. I think we've kind of communicated this thing to death. I don't know what more to say, I've told her that I am leaving, that I am emotionally disengaging, that I don't care about the outcome anymore, and there is still nothing she can do. It just isn't there. She loves me and doesn't want me to leave, she says she is scared of having to let me go to be with other people, and doesn't want to let go of our life together.

 

I don't know, I read about people going through this for like 15 years and I think maybe I am just being a wimp? I just need to hold out for a little longer? But is that weeks, months, or years???

 

It's definitely low sex drive (though this isn't normal for her), we don't have tons of other issues really. We have our standing arguments I guess, but they tend to go in the same circles and we both know where they go, so mostly aren't doing that much. Though maybe it's just because I am so disengaged...

 

I had the thought that it's not that she needs to let me go to be free, but that I need to let her go to be free from the obligations of relationship. It's not that I need to have sex with other people, I just need to have a sex life. With somebody!!

 

It's just a really terrible experience, and it seems completely up to me to decide whether to stick with it or not. I guess I might just ask her what she thinks my chances are of being fulfilled in this, if she has any kind of motivation to work towards something. She knows that we are nearing the end, and we've discussed having some kind of plan or decision by new years, but man, nothing is happening. It is a slow withering death.

 

Well, I guess it's kind of a sob story, thanks for reading. I'll update if there is any positive progress, just to liven things up in here. Cheers.

[Meli22]

Thanks Meli. I think we've kind of communicated this thing to death. I don't know what more to say, I've told her that I am leaving, that I am emotionally disengaging, that I don't care about the outcome anymore, and there is still nothing she can do. It just isn't there. She loves me and doesn't want me to leave, she says she is scared of having to let me go to be with other people, and doesn't want to let go of our life together.

 

I don't know, I read about people going through this for like 15 years and I think maybe I am just being a wimp? I just need to hold out for a little longer? But is that weeks, months, or years???

 

It's definitely low sex drive (though this isn't normal for her), we don't have tons of other issues really. We have our standing arguments I guess, but they tend to go in the same circles and we both know where they go, so mostly aren't doing that much. Though maybe it's just because I am so disengaged...

 

I had the thought that it's not that she needs to let me go to be free, but that I need to let her go to be free from the obligations of relationship. It's not that I need to have sex with other people, I just need to have a sex life. With somebody!!

 

It's just a really terrible experience, and it seems completely up to me to decide whether to stick with it or not. I guess I might just ask her what she thinks my chances are of being fulfilled in this, if she has any kind of motivation to work towards something. She knows that we are nearing the end, and we've discussed having some kind of plan or decision by new years, but man, nothing is happening. It is a slow withering death.

 

Well, I guess it's kind of a sob story, thanks for reading. I'll update if there is any positive progress, just to liven things up in here. Cheers.

 

I feel for you and, no you're not being a wimp. Sometimes a sex life isn't that important to some people but it doesn't mean you have to put up with it.

 

I hope she manages to get her spark back soon. Best wishes! Keep us updated.

[deepinthewoods]

So, I have an unhappy update. And a question. And almost a new topic.

 

Basically, for the past 6 months I've had a secret friendship online with an attractive younger woman. It doesn't sound good already...

 

I had hung out with her a few times and we shared nice, but simple and brief, connections. We chatted once in a while online, and shared music, nothing too deep or emotional, but I found myself getting drawn to her more and thinking about her. I was confident that I could keep it at a friend level, but it got to the point where I felt I had to say something to my partner because well, she asked me because she was suspicious, and I was beginning to feel guilty about it. I told her everything and she was understandably upset. I stopped chatting with the other lady and refocused on my partner.

 

Unfortunately, we were still having our problems with intimacy, and with no movement there, after a while I began chatting online again, intending to keep it at a friend level. For some reason, I felt that I wanted to open up to her, to let her know where our friendship was, but not on facebook where my gf could see it (she had read our previous interactions, which had mostly been mundane). I had run into her recently and we had a couple minute chat, and I could tell that she wanted to hang out, so I felt that I needed to acknowledge that I enjoyed our connection, while setting boundaries on it. I emailed her and told her the truth about how my gf and I were having problems, and we'd considered having an open relationship but hadn't agreed on it, and how I enjoyed our connection. Nothing too over the top or pursuant. She emailed me back expressing how much she liked me, which I wasn't quite expecting because we hadn't actually communicated in that way, and that she would be open to more, if it was in a transparent way. As it happens, my gf happened to be sitting beside me when one of her messages popped up (karma?) and she grilled me again about our communications. I told her that I had emailed her and of course she wanted to read it.

 

So, now it's pretty much over, she is moving out, but we have remained pretty peaceful, and willing to work together again at a future date. We have a kid together, so we'll have to keep connected anyways.

 

I guess I wasn't planning to cheat physically, but I know it was probably emotional cheating, and I try to justify it to myself by way of the negative headspace I've been in because of our lack of intimacy. What do you guys think, is this cheating and is it justifiable? What would you do if you were my girlfriend?

 

I've communicated that I have never wanted to leave or cheat, only looking for something, a connection, that was non-existent in our relationship. I feel like I had communicated to her what was going on with me personally, and that my heart was leaving and I was feeling open to other women. I did keep it a secret for a while, but I also wasn't sure when would be a good time to mention it. When does a friendship turn into something else? When do you define it?

 

I know it was a breach of trust, which is no small thing, but is it worth moving out over, when we have a kid to raise? I don't know, if you can't get what you need in a relationship, but you are not allowed to get it elsewhere, it's a tough spot to be in. But I wasn't really so far out of the bounds of loyalty, was I, given the circumstances? As I said before, I do really love her, despite the suffering I've felt, and it breaks my heart that our family will be divided.

 

Ouch...

[Meli22]

I'd leave if I was your girlfriend on the basis of you complaining about the lack of passion, and then pursuing some kind of online relationship AND talking about the relationship to another woman.

 

Im guessing you want other opinions to help ease your own guilt rather than you wanting another chance from your girlfriend. Let's face it this relationship seemed like it was going to fail anyway. However it seems both of you are at fault in this case. She denied you intimacy, so you (sort of) sought it out elsewhere. It happens a lot.