Intellegence in your partner

[Keenly]

I think its really lame how in 2015 we think about and often do up and leave people because they only check 19 out of 20 boxes. You are never going to find a perfect person. You can only find close.

[Maggie4]

OP, you know your vision of what your wife should be, and sometimes it changes as we age.

You knew from the beginning that she's a barista, you date her anyway. You gotta know yourself and know what you want. If someone says he wants his wife to be well educated, well read, career woman, there is nothing wrong with that. When you have a gathering with colleagues, and all the other wives are lawyers, ceos and professors, and one wife is a barista, would that bother you? her?

No one should be judging another human being, no one questions the value of another. She can have no formal degrees, AND have low IQ, so what?! You just need to do some thinking and be clear with what you're looking for. This is a very personal choice.

[WaitingForBardot]

My girlfriend of several years in college was scary smart. She used to read mathematics and physics journals for entertainment and would then proceed to get into arguments via mail and phone with various researchers. She even got flown out to meet a couple of them and offered positions in their research groups.

 

I also had a couple of relationships where I was the far-smarter one. In no case was the intelligence mismatch the cause of failure of the relationship.

 

As an aside, this topic reminded me of a theory I read in "The Red Queen" that the heights of our human intelligence is just a case of runaway evolution of a sexually-selected trait, similar to peacock feathers. Women like and selectively breed with smarter guys, so guys (and girls) just keep getting smarter, even though there's no longer much of a selective advantage. Besides getting laid anyway... ..lol.. Interesting stuff...

[mystikmind2005]

People who value career and education too highly in a partner is a huge turn off too me.

[Oregon_Dude]

I do think it's cute that she wants you to read to her. Are we thinking Clifford, or Berenstain Bears?

[thecrucible]

I'd want to date someone fairly well-educated and intelligent as I have a degree myself and have a passion for learning. I would like to date someone who has an interest in debating current affairs and likes to read. I'm not expecting a genius, just someone I can have interesting conversations with. I'm more arts than science but as long as the guy appreciate the arts then we're doing well.

 

I believe it's more a vibe and attitude you get from a person. One of my ex boyfriends is an academic (a scientist) and while I dated him I felt like I didn't connect with him completely on an intellectual level (and he is the polar opposite of dumb). It's not something I can put into words but we weren't quite a meeting of minds in the way I wanted it to be.

 

OP, perhaps something is off. If you're looking for the perfect woman who ticks all the boxes, then you're going to have to wait a while. Through my experience in relationships I have learned not to expect everything I wish for. To me a partner has to be intelligent but I have other interests that I can fulfill by myself or with friends outside the relationship. A relationship doesn't have to provide all of your emotional needs.

 

But I sense with you, it's also the fact you're not connecting in terms of life goals and levels of ambition. As you are very highly focused on self-improvement, you seem to yearn for a woman who is the same.

[thecrucible]

By the way OP, have you considered that differences in a relationship can actually be a good thing? The reason I say this is because I dated a guy who in many ways was a male clone of me but it just didn't work out. The right kind of differences keep things interesting.

[Oregon_Dude]

I dated a guy who in many ways was a male clone of me but it just didn't work out.

This definitely gives new meaning to the phrase, "go f*ck yourself".

 

[thecrucible]

This definitely gives new meaning to the phrase, "go f*ck yourself".

 

 

haha I know

 

It's totally a serious point. That experience just opened my eyes to how much my own ego influenced what I found attractive in the opposite sex - what I most value in myself or aspire to be. We had a lot in common and had similar personalities but it was actually too similar because we didn't gel as a couple and we were both neurotic and avoidant so it was like relationship stalemate! I realised I could easily date someone who didn't have quite as much in common with me but had all the key interests and qualities required to really make things work. It gave me a new perspective on things.

 

You could also think about it with the question "do you bring out the best in each other?". I think a guy who has stuff in common but is different in some ways could teach me a lot and it'd be kind of exciting.

 

Anyway I clearly type too much and have gone slightly off topic!

[lilmissjava]

haha I know

You could also think about it with the question "do you bring out the best in each other?". I think a guy who has stuff in common but is different in some ways could teach me a lot and it'd be kind of exciting.

!

 

This is a good point. Would the relationship become boring if you will, if there was nothing more to it than romance and intimacy?

[shet]

It's your call. Stick with the woman who ticks most boxes or drop her and hold out for one who ticks all of them. In my experience they don't exist, but you do you.

[miranda_wilson]

OP, honestly you do sound like you wrote this post to brag. But then again, maybe not. It's just that when ANYONE starts talking about their PhD and how they need to be intellectually challenged, they sound like a perfect a-hole.

 

I'll say this about your situation: some PhDs could be happy with a barista who isn't all that ambitious but is very kind and loving, some could not. It seems like this is a nagging concern for you. And it also seems like you're holding on just because you think no other woman out there can also be loving and mature like she is. Honestly, there are too many people in the world for you to even intimate that other women just won't be as loving and gold-hearted as she is. There are women out there with PhDs, or with just a high level of education, who have hearts of gold and would be wonderful to you. She is not the only one.

 

I think what you're talking about is a pretty big difference. Personally, if I were you, I don't think I could be happy with someone who I viewed as below me intellectually. Even if the person loved me a lot, I'd probably snobbily think that...of course I was able to land someone like him; he's beneath me and therefore sees me as a prize. Sounds really snobby, but it's not her being a barista that makes her beneath you intellectually. It's that you say she isn't very intellectual or well read and that all her references are movies. If she were a barista but highly intellectual and a reader, she wouldn't be beneath you that way. So...I can't see myself being happy in your situation.

 

The past few men I have been serious with have all had advanced degrees. One was in a Master's program when I was seeing him and is in a PhD program now, the next had a Master's degree, the next had a Master's and was/is in law school, and the one I am dating now went to and completed law school. I haven't purposely sought out people with advanced degrees at all, but it's happened that I've gotten together with ones who have those degrees. I think it makes sense. I don't like men who are just "bright"--I like them to be intellectual, excellent writers, analytical, people who reference books, politics, public intellectuals, philosophers, history, schools of thought, etc. If a guy references movies all the time (and never the other things), I am turned off. Back in 2011, I went on a date with a guy who was obsessed with movies and the Oscars. I just couldn't deal with it.

 

I think you really like this woman, but you really could be settling here. I mean, I've felt really good about the recent men I've dated. We weren't compatible in ALL ways, but when it came to intellect, I was not at all unsatisfied. I want to be able to bring the person I'm with to a party and around people and for them to know I have an intellectual person.

 

You ultimately have to respect the person you are dating, and even if you appreciate the woman you are with (and it does seem like you APPRECIATE her), you don't seem to truly respect her. It's somewhat human nature. I'm being pretty blunt in this post saying that I wouldn't respect guys who weren't what I saw as pretty equal to me education and intellect-wise.

Edited November 20, 2015 by miranda_wilson

[MoreAmore]

I don't care about education or career ambition.

 

I couldn't date someone who wasn't intelligent and constantly learning.

 

I am not highly educated, but that doesn't mean I haven't read constantly and am unable to converse on many subjects.

 

I've met highly educated people who are moron or think you only learn as a means to an end (a piece of paper or work.). No, thank you.

[Samhain]

I don't care about education or career ambition.

 

I couldn't date someone who wasn't intelligent or constantly learning.

 

I am not highly educated, but that doesn't mean I haven't read constantly and am unable to converse on many subjects.

 

I've met highly educated people who are moron or think you only learn as a means to an end (a piece of paper or work.). No, thank you.

 

Every person on the planet is constantly learning. Even the people who aren't aware of it at the time.

[MoreAmore]

Every person on the planet is constantly learning. Even the people who aren't aware of it at the time.

 

While that may be true, at some point, the pedantry is simply being quarrelsome. I'm quite sure my meaning is clear.

[todreaminblue]

What I want more is someone who loves me completely for the person that I am and makes me feel it. I want awesome sex and a life of giggles. I want laughs and some bowls of nuggets while playing d and d with our friends.

 

sounds like you have that but still you want the other ball of wax...which is fine......ultimately in most relationships i feel you have a difference in intellectual capabilities...we are not clones witht th esame intellectual emotional and physical capabilities.....but in star wars...kidding....

 

i do wonder what yoda would say...be tolerant you must...broaden your own mind and don't close off to what you have now wishing on what you don't......

 

maybe your now gf provides you with a different perspective a fresher look on staid or narrow views......there's a balance to be had......if you appreciate it and recognise what you do actually have in the relationship you are in...you might leave this one....and go to another one and find you have lost more than you have found...thats a risk you decide to take.....but sometimes ...the grass....may look greener way over there in papers on the wall phd land......only because you forgot to water your lawn and take stock of what felt good beneath your feet in the first place.......its really up to you.....whether the differences are a balance....or a liability...follow your heart.......i wish you well....deb

[Giggle]

So my ex was dumb. Not book smart, not common sense smart... Bothered the crap out of me because he really had little real input on anything. And actually has more college than me. I kept trying to give him credit for handyman intelligence too, but nope.

 

My bf is not book smart at all. Constantly uses the wrong words, no grammar skills and I'm rather amazed that his many badly written texts don't drive me insane. He doesn't use u and r instead of you and are though those do make me nuts. But he is otherwise intelligent. No college. He's a skilled worker.

 

Some people are more interested in other things than a career advancement. For some people it's just a job. You have a passion for your work. She has a passion for music. If it bugs you now, it'll get worse. Just a mismatch.

[LoveRefreshed]

OP, I'm curious if her ambitions and earning potential are only important to you because of what your friends and colleagues might think of you dating a woman without a degree.

 

I think certainly this is a concern for me. I've already thought about it some. I don't have but 4 friends in my current state (only 1 higher degree holder) and most of my friends didn't go to grad school. I do tend to worry about what my friends will think of any girl though, not based on her education, but that they love me. Also, I do worry about social events for work in some regard. I would love to say that in my career, I'll be judged by my science and contributions to the company, but we all know that's not how people work.

 

I do think it's cute that she wants you to read to her. Are we thinking Clifford, or Berenstain Bears?

 

I'm thinking more like Stranger in a Strange Land to start out. Then Dune.

 

OP, honestly you do sound like you wrote this post to brag. But then again, maybe not. It's just that when ANYONE starts talking about their PhD and how they need to be intellectually challenged, they sound like a perfect a-hole.

 

While I'm sure there are people out there like this and is why you're not the first to make this statement, I do not think there's much special in my degree. It's a sign that I was tough enough to put up with solving constant new problems every day for 6 years in a single field. Meh.

 

But I think some people feel insecure and try to shame me for talking openly about my education.

 

On that note, thank you all for the spell check You've all got keen eyes and the best debate skills since Sarah. I'm pretty lazy about spelling. Was my worst grade in elementary school There's a reason why I went into chemistry. And the comments that someone mentioned this thread died when an 'inferior woman' blah blah, please get over that. This thread has nothing to do with that and I harbor none of those attitudes.

 

 

 

I guess one thing I 'conveniently' left out was that my last relationship with an educated woman was incredibly emotionally abusive, she had no filter, angry, and unable to handle stressful situations.

 

I started seeing this new girl on the thought I'd be moving away. I didn't expect to like her so much. She possesses things in a partner that I never knew I wanted or that I never have seen before. Things like communication. She is very open and direct with her feelings and needs. She listens to me and takes consideration and care with my emotions. I feel incredibly comfortable, very quickly.

 

I guess I can be a bit of a commitment-phobe and I am always looking for reasons to push people away. So, I am going to take the advice of our intelligent advocates who mention that it might never be an issue. I'm going to just go with it. I'm not missing anything when I hang out with her. I love seeing her. She has passion in topics I care about, she listens to me go on about science sometimes with a smile on her face.

 

Thanks for the advice. And the hospitality and the hostility.

[lilmissjava]

So aggressive. :/ Honestly, in my entire post, that's the most significant thing and the most useful thing to point out?

 

All I asked for was for people's inputs on if they've had primarily successful or unsuccessful relationships in my situation.

 

I didn't say I was the best thing since sliced bread and that I'm above all others. I asked if a difference in education was a problem. The bitterness in this place is reaching record highs.

 

It is only a problem if you make it a problem.

[LoveRefreshed]

It is only a problem if you make it a problem.

 

Seems to be the consensus from most, and that is why I've decided to let go and keep going with it.

 

I have broken up with every girl I've dated. I hate it and hate hurting people. So I don't want to hurt someone after a year when I should have stopped it a lot sooner. So I get worried.

[BlueIris]

On that note, thank you all for the spell check You've all got keen eyes and the best debate skills since Sarah.

:laugh:

 

... So, I am going to take the advice of our intelligent advocates who mention that it might never be an issue. I'm going to just go with it. I'm not missing anything when I hang out with her. I love seeing her. She has passion in topics I care about, she listens to me go on about science sometimes with a smile on her face.

 

Thanks for the advice. And the hospitality and the hostility.

 

I was just teasing you- because I have gotten a tad snooty about my education once or twice. (understatement)

 

You seem like a good guy who has found a good partner who makes you happy.

[Gosh]

Hello!

 

I could be in your gf's place.

People say im smart, but im a drop out. I didnt like the content of my studies and where i live, its impossible to change what you are studying. If you choose medicine, you have to stick with it, or you just drop out. Im currently interested in a "Phd" Holder *divine music playing" and for a bit i was intimidated by his knowledge. He is smart and book smart. Thing is, hey, im smart too.

 

Also, i realized that i am surrounded by immature people. Im not saying i dont have issues, but i have solved most of the basics. While you were off getting your degree she was off finding peace with herself, cause the character you described is not easy to find and there is a reason to it, it needs work If shes anything like me she might find that being a good person and honest and all of the characteristics you say you cant find anywhere else, is more important than knowledge. You can always read up.

 

Bottom line is what other posters already told you. Weigh it out, if her paycheck is more important to you, than the giggles , then dump her.

 

I don't have but 4 friends in my current state (only 1 higher degree holder) and most of my friends didn't go to grad school.

 

With all do respect, why havent you dumped your friends ? You know what i mean.

 

Cheers!

[GoodOnPaper]

Yes, your situation can work. I am a science PhD academic married to a queen of pop culture. I always envisioned myself with a PhD partner, but the ones I knew all wanted "opposites-attract" relationships, so I kind of ended up with one myself by default.

 

My wife is not an intellectual but she loves learning and loves the academic environment -- she has always held office staff positions at universities -- and that helps our compatibility a lot. Her emotional intelligence eclipses mine way more than I out book-smart her, so there is plenty to learn in such a relationship.

[VeveCakes]

Some people do not define themselves by education or career. My best friend and I talk about this a lot because she holds a lot of weight on her masters degree and her job. I myself work a good job but it's not super intellectually stimulating. I don't define myself in it. I could have easily been a PHD and had some fancy respected career but my real passion is riding horses, and I work a good job that allows me to enjoy my passion.

 

I wouldn't throw away a great relationship because of some degree snobbery.

[MightyPen]

I tried to search this topic, but I didn't turn up topics that asked this, but I'm sure there are some. Please forgive me, but I'm also looking not for what you're looking for in a potential partner/what your attracted to, but more about how important it is that your partner be smart or the same level of education as you are.

 

 

I've met an awesomely nice and loving woman, and I'm completely infatuated with her. The last three months have been amazing after some dubious initial situations and differences. She's kind and warm hearted, she's an amazing singer, and she's into nerdy things that I'm into (D&D, board games, doctor who) and we both blaze like no other. She's passionate about music and participates in a community choir. I find her beautiful and we have amazing sex, and we giggle and have a good time. In terms of political views and sociological values, we're very similar (pro choice, pro gay marriage, etc..).

 

 

The things I worry about are all related to a drastic difference in our level of education. I'm a PhD who loves to talk about crazy ideas from all sorts of things in a very scientific way she'd be more pop-culture (i.e. what does it take to travel to another solar system, the implications on life time, travel speeds, time relativity, etc.. but she would be more like 'well in star wars..') She hasn't read many books and doesn't think critically about things like I do. We're on completely different levels.

 

Her career ambitions are modest at best, right now she works as a barista making only 9 bucks an hour and while my career could pay for a family, it's more like her complacency in her life situation that I wonder if I can tolerate. I want her to live to her potential as she's smart and super friendly, she just doesn't possess necessary credentials (no BS or BA degree, for example) and has no interest in school (don't blame her). I just wish she would aspire to manage the store instead of make the coffee, or something like that. Something that would let her make more than 18k a year. She is into Mary Kay sales, but I don't really know what that would amount to, even if she focused full time on it.

 

I don't know what it takes to have a great relationship and marriage (meh, not saying I want that tomorrow with her, just that at my age, my goal is to get married so any partner that isn't marriage material is a waste of time) and right now, this gap doesn't bother me in the slightest. What I want more is someone who loves me completely for the person that I am and makes me feel it. I want awesome sex and a life of giggles. I want laughs and some bowls of nuggets while playing d and d with our friends.

 

So what do you guys think? Does it work?

 

I haven't read all the responses, but when I saw your post, I felt compelled to respond.

 

I am married and struggle with this same issue. I am just more book smart/intellectually curious/philosophical than my wife. Just as your girlfriend is not dumb, neither is my wife. She's certainly smarter than your average bear, but there's still what I perceive to be a pretty significant gap. And she is pretty career-focused and driven, which does help a bit, whereas your GF doesn't seem to have much (any?) career focus.

 

These issues won't resolve themselves over time - you can't count on changing a person's basic wiring. It can be a HUGE issue in a relationship.

 

I could type about this for days, but I won't. If you'd like to talk more, I'd welcome a PM.