She didn't offer to split the bill. Should i disregard her?

[katiegrl]

Do you have evidence to back up this claim? Or any studies of appropriate sample sizes? I've asked out close to two-hundred women (not counting OLD) and I prefer women who pay for alternating dates.

 

 

***I wish I had a good answer for this one. I have no trouble talking about the money situation in the relationship phase, but it's tough during those early dates. I've said goodbye to a few women after 3-5 dates of them never glancing at their purse (or in one case, not bringing one)***.

 

You and I have had this convo before ... and I think your *expectation* that a women offer to pay by AT LEAST the 5th date is totally fair!

 

Hell I think it's quite lenient actually ...speaking personally, I am offering to pay or even initiating the 3rd or 4th date!

 

After 2-3 dates we both know we're clicking and there is chemistry so I have NO problem doing so, in fact I want to!

 

What I cannot wrap my brain around is a man rejecting a woman (a woman he otherwise likes and is attracted to) ..... for the *sole* reason she did not offer to pay on the FIRST date.

 

That just sound ludicrous to me ...but whatever floats their boat I guess.

 

Certainly no great loss for her IMO.

[Shining One]

What I cannot wrap my brain around is a man rejecting a woman (a woman he otherwise likes and is attracted to) ..... for the *sole* reason she did not offer to pay on the FIRST date.

I agree with this and would expand on it. Far too many men and women are extremely judgmental on that first date and will automatically drop someone based on some ludicrous conclusions they are drawing in their heads.

• She didn't offer to pay on the first date, therefore she is a gold-digger and will drain my all of my money.
  
• He accepted my fake offer to contribute to the first date. He's clearly cheap and will be a terrible provider for the kids I plan to have someday.
  

I can honestly spend all night writing the things I've heard/read.

[xxoo]

So much overthinking. You both enjoyed the date. Dinner was a good idea. She had a good idea! And you both had a good time. Why look for problems?

[katiegrl]

I agree with this and would expand on it. Far too many men and women are extremely judgmental on that first date and will automatically drop someone based on some ludicrous conclusions they are drawing in their heads.

• She didn't offer to pay on the first date, therefore she is a gold-digger and will drain my all of my money.
  
• He accepted my fake offer to contribute to the first date. He's clearly cheap and will be a terrible provider for the kids I plan to have someday.
  

I can honestly spend all night writing the things I've heard/read.

 

Wait ...wha? A man's not supposed to accept a woman's offer to pay..... what is he thinking???

 

LOL...just kidding!!!!!!!!!

 

I 100% agree with your entire post! :bunny:

[S_A]

Ok guys. Go on a date to a nice place and let your pretty lady shuffle through her purse to look for her portion of the bill. Sexy image right there. I hope you don't let her pay her half of the bill on Valentine's day.

[Zapbasket]

To the bigger question about who should pay for dates, how about dealing in this manner with all the fuzzy areas highlighted in this thread:

 

[First Date, Bill Arrives]

 

Woman: "I'm going to let you pay for this one, but I want you to know that I don't expect a guy to pay for all the dates, all the time."

 

This seems like the most straightforward way to avoid the pitfalls of the woman not opening her purse when the bill arrives on the first date; or of the man suggesting a split or waiting for her to open her purse; or him paying but feeling as OP did, that maybe she feels entitled to him paying for everything.

 

What do you think?

[Shining One]

Woman: "I'm going to let you pay for this one, but I want you to know that I don't expect a guy to pay for all the dates, all the time."

 

This seems like the most straightforward way to avoid the pitfalls of the woman not opening her purse when the bill arrives on the first date; or of the man suggesting a split or waiting for her to open her purse; or him paying but feeling as OP did, that maybe she feels entitled to him paying for everything.

 

What do you think?

This seems rather vague and non-committal to me. A straightforward approach would be:

Woman: "The next one is on me."

[Leigh 87]

This seems rather vague and non-committal to me. A straightforward approach would be:

Woman: "The next one is on me."

 

Nah.

 

I prefer to spoil my men in other ways.

 

I don't want to pay for dates 50% of the time. Nothing romantic about that....

 

Why go out if it's totally a 50/50 split?

 

I swear chilvry is dead. Sad.

[DrReplyInRhymes]

Ok **** it, this is how I see this should go down:

 

 

---

She gently smacks her lips as the sweet aroma of the alfredo sauce dances across her nostrils. As the odor fades and the taste lingers, she glances up, immediately in awe of the man before her. It was only the first date, but the butterflies felt as if they had anticipated this very moment, and with a fiery passion, explosively sent warmth from her chest to her thighs.

 

Out of the corner of her eye, she noticed the waiter had began his purposeful stride to their table. In one hand was his cell phone, furiously swiping to the right. In a fleeting moment, she quickly matched the swiping action to an activity she's done herself so many times. In fact, it landed her on this very date! Tinder: the death of dating.

 

In his other hand, however, was the bill. Her eyes darted from the dashing man to her purse stashed between the booth and her jacket. As the waiter drew closer, slowing his swiping, she reached for her purse with an expectation to pay at least her fair share. She did have the $25 chicken alfredo after all, and her conSCIENCE wouldn't allow for her to just try and get a free dinner from this gentleman.

 

Without hesitation, his arm stopped hers. The grasp was curiously surreal; it was soft enough to feel tender, yet strong enough to tease her instinctual and innate thirst for safety. The butterflies picked up in intensity, and he coo'ed, "No, I appreciate the reach, but I've got this."

-----

 

Right?

Edited November 14, 2015 by DrReplyInRhymes

[Zapbasket]

This seems rather vague and non-committal to me. A straightforward approach would be:

Woman: "The next one is on me."

 

I thought about that, too--and have used this exact phrase in the past--but I was trying to account for a guy who is more of a "traditionalist" and might be unnerved by my offer to pay, or might have something particular in mind for a second date, etc. The line I proposed, I thought, would leave things more open-ended but would assure the guy from the get-go that the woman is not out for "free meals." Also, for me, if the guy wants to pay for the first few dates, I have no problem letting him, knowing that if we continue dating I will reciprocate and then some.

 

When I've been asked on a first date and decide by the end of the date that I don't want there to be a second one, I always offer and sometimes even insist on splitting, so in that instance I wouldn't use such a line.

[Zapbasket]

Nah.

 

I prefer to spoil my men in other ways.

 

I don't want to pay for dates 50% of the time. Nothing romantic about that....

 

Why go out if it's totally a 50/50 split?

 

I swear chilvry is dead. Sad.

 

I agree.

 

[10 character max]

[Shining One]

I don't want to pay for dates 50% of the time. Nothing romantic about that....

What percentage would be considered romantic? Which committee determines that percentage?

Why go out if it's totally a 50/50 split?

When two incomes are contributing, the dates can get fancier. If a woman I'm dating pays for the second date (as my girlfriend did), the third date will be considerably better than if I had paid for the second date too.

I swear chilvry is dead. Sad.

The term chivalry will eventually change as it has before.

[dads new boyfriend]

Ive dealt with guys like this. What happens if she doesnt want sex? I hope this girl figures out what 'movie' means before she has to deal with some jackass who doesnt want to tane no for an answer.

I must have missed this comment before and i'm surprised that nobody has called you out on it. I'm sorry if you've had bad experiences with guys in the past but it's unfair to assume that i'm a potential rapist just because i thought about inviting a girl that i'm dating to my house. If she doesn't want sex .... then we wouldn't have sex. It's so sad that you have such a negative view of men.

 

It also doesn't immediately make her a princess. Did her attitude about anything else suggest that might be the case?

You're right, and no it didn't. I know now that i'm overreacting.

 

 

But in a world where a woman pulling out her wallet is often taken as a sign of disinterest,

To be honest that possibility never entered my head until I made this thread.

 

That would be like me saying, "hmm I need a user name, let me pick the first thing that comes into my mind".

 

Got it: How does "Itakeitintheass" sound?

That username was already taken.

 

Maybe I'm missing something, but was she holding a gun to his head when she *suggested* dinner instead of drinks?

 

If he had such an issue with paying, why did he AGREE to dinner in the first place? Did it not occur to him that he might be expected to pay....since HE was the one to ask her out?

 

He asked her out, all she did was suggest dinner ....he willingly agreed ...., and now he's in a twist because she didn't offer to pay.

 

There is something wrong with this picture. He did not have to agree, he could have declined and stuck with his original plan to have drinks.

 

NOTHING wrong with that, in fact IMO having drinks and maybe a couple of apps is more appropriate for a first date anyway.

 

OP, instead of blaming HER for not offering to pay, blame YOURSELF for not having more of a backbone and sticking with your original plan.

 

If she started **insisting** on dinner or got her panties in a twist because you wanted to stick to original plan .... then THAT is a red flag and could indicate she's a princess.. At which point, you might have simply cancelled the date altogether ... and nexted her.

I rung her the night before the date to confirm that it was still on and she mentioned that she would be in a rush getting home from work, cooking and then getting ready so asked me if i wanted to go out for a meal with her instead. She would have thought i was a a** if i had said no and insisted on just going for drinks. I didn't mind going for dinner but as she asked me obviously i shouldn't be expected to pay the full amount. It's bizarre how some people can't understand that.

 

Then pay the bill with a smile on your face and next time bring flowers.

 

 

(kids today.)

I hope you're not serious.

 

Why should she offer to split the bill?

Why should I be expected to pay?

Oh yeah I remember, it's because I have a willy.

[Maxtor]

WHY does the guy need to pay the bill, is she a prostitute? Isnt she also enjoying his company?

 

If she is a prostitute, then yes, pay for her.

[Redfisher]

Nah.

 

I prefer to spoil my men in other ways..

 

Guys are simple really, If they do nice things and and follow through on what you ask them to do...You give them sex and toss in a few BJ,s... Simple positive reinforcement. Of course this is a little further down the line then the first date...

[testmeasure]

I wouldn't feel good knowing my mates get treated by generous men while I have to always pay my own way

 

The millionaire next door isn't going to pay for your date. He has what he had because he saved what he did.

 

 

So feel free to keep looking for Donald Trump.

[salparadise]

WHY does the guy need to pay the bill, is she a prostitute?

 

You're not far off with this comment. It's the same economic equation... reproductive capacity is valuable. Women have it, men don't. So men pay a womb fee to get their swimmers in the game, and their genes into the next generation.

 

Otherwise, women aren't good for much. They can clean house but don't do any productive work, they aren't very smart, and they still need to be fed. But they do make nice decorations.

[FeelingFireworks]

I read the story below and thought it didn't seem entirely out of place to simply share on this thread (I hope it will be seen as a bit of light relief!):

 

 

Man demands £3.50 coffee money back after Tinder date goes wrong | Metro News

 

 

Made me LOL and despair at the same time. The lady handled it with far more grace than I certainly would have.

[katiegrl]

I must have missed this comment before and i'm surprised that nobody has called you out on it. I'm sorry if you've had bad experiences with guys in the past but it's unfair to assume that i'm a potential rapist just because i thought about inviting a girl that i'm dating to my house. If she doesn't want sex .... then we wouldn't have sex. It's so sad that you have such a negative view of men.

 

 

You're right, and no it didn't. I know now that i'm overreacting.

 

 

To be honest that possibility never entered my head until I made this thread.

 

 

That username was already taken.

 

 

I rung her the night before the date to confirm that it was still on and she mentioned that she would be in a rush getting home from work, cooking and then getting ready so asked me if i wanted to go out for a meal with her instead. She would have thought i was a a** if i had said no and insisted on just going for drinks. I didn't mind going for dinner but as she asked me obviously i shouldn't be expected to pay the full amount.

 

 

*** It's bizarre how some people can't understand that. ***

 

.

 

I think it's equally bizarre how YOU can't understand what we've been saying either...so we're even.

 

And dude, you didn't have to have a full-on dinner. LIKE I SAID (which you obviously missed), sharing a couple apps would have been fun too.... in fact, I personally prefer sharing apps to a formal sit-down. And I know many other women who feel the same -- it was a first date!

 

More casual ....and a lot less expensive.

 

I wish you luck in your dating adventures....

Edited November 14, 2015 by katiegrl

[Redfisher]

You're not far off with this comment. It's the same economic equation... reproductive capacity is valuable. Women have it, men don't. So men pay a womb fee to get their swimmers in the game, and their genes into the next generation.

 

Otherwise, women aren't good for much. They can clean house but don't do any productive work, they aren't very smart, and they still need to be fed. But they do make nice decorations.

 

I like you...

[hotpotato]

I must have missed this comment before and i'm surprised that nobody has called you out on it. I'm sorry if you've had bad experiences with guys in the past but it's unfair to assume that i'm a potential rapist just because i thought about inviting a girl that i'm dating to my house. If she doesn't want sex .... then we wouldn't have sex. It's so sad that you have such a negative view of men.

 

 

You're right, and no it didn't. I know now that i'm overreacting.

 

 

To be honest that possibility never entered my head until I made this thread.

 

 

That username was already taken.

 

 

I rung her the night before the date to confirm that it was still on and she mentioned that she would be in a rush getting home from work, cooking and then getting ready so asked me if i wanted to go out for a meal with her instead. She would have thought i was a a** if i had said no and insisted on just going for drinks. I didn't mind going for dinner but as she asked me obviously i shouldn't be expected to pay the full amount. It's bizarre how some people can't understand that.

 

 

I hope you're not serious.

 

 

Why should I be expected to pay?

Oh yeah I remember, it's because I have a willy.

 

Two words:Bill Cosby. In real life many if not most men view being alone with them as consenting to sex. If anything happens, people will ask

 

"Why did you go back to his place/your place/wherever in private if you didnt want sex?"

Just see-Bill Cosby fiasco for proof.

 

You may be nice, but i wouldnt expect a woman to gamble like that. If you had a daughter, would you want her to take that chance,

[Leigh 87]

What percentage would be considered romantic? Which committee determines that percentage?When two incomes are contributing, the dates can get fancier. If a woman I'm dating pays for the second date (as my girlfriend did), the third date will be considerably better than if I had paid for the second date too.The term chivalry will eventually change as it has before.

 

 

 

Well great for your girlfriend... I am sure she is oh so happy having to pay half the time.

 

 

Personally, I LOVE that my boyfriend takes me out and treats me and pampers and spoils me. I feel great about it and absolutely love it

 

 

There is nothing sweeter to me than a romantic date out, that my boyfriend treats me to.

 

 

I am not sure what the difference is? Your girlfriend and you feel happier with having to go halve in all your dates? Where as I feel happier being spoilt?

 

 

By the way. I pay the phone bill for my boyfriend and I and I got him the brand new latest model phone; HE pays rent usually when he has a job but due to being laid off recently, we BOTH intend to go halve now.

 

 

I also spoil him equally for his birthday so it, overall, our expenditure on one another evens out!

 

 

I just prefer to go about my dating life in a way that is different to you, yet makes me happier.

[Leigh 87]

It comes down to what makes one happy! I feel happy when I get treated to a date. I feel unhappy when I have dated guys that were wanting to go halves on most romantic expeditions. And then other women feel happier if they can contribute 50/50 for every date and outing. Each to their own! Live and let live. No need to call people a princess due to their own preferences!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And remember, they MAY CONGTRIBUTE EQUALLY despite their traditional values regarding men paying!

[katiegrl]

Two words:Bill Cosby. In real life many if not most men view being alone with them as consenting to sex. If anything happens, people will ask

 

"Why did you go back to his place/your place/wherever in private if you didnt want sex?"

Just see-Bill Cosby fiasco for proof.

 

You may be nice, but i wouldnt expect a woman to gamble like that. If you had a daughter, would you want her to take that chance,

 

^^Absolutely ...great points.

 

OP ...jmo, but it might behoove you to open your *mind* and at least try to understand what women experience in their dating experiences.

 

Yah, men have it tough but so do women. It's just as confusing and frustrating for us as it is for you.

 

We are not mind readers either, and often times (most times) don't know how men will react to what we do or say ...OR even what their motivations are for taking us out!!

 

I am out of the game now (thank god) , but I remember ... and from what I read on LS and hear from my friends ...it's gotten a lot more confusing and frustrating in the last few years...for both genders.

 

Stop judging! Become less rigid in your thinking .... more ooen-minded. More patient. More understanding. Less uptight, more relaxed.

 

Same for women! We are in this craziness together, so can't everyone just try to get along? We are not enemies ...which lately I am beginning to think that's how men and women feel.

 

It's so disheartening!

 

You had one friggin date for chrissakes. Let it go! If you like her, give her the benefit of the doubt and go play badminton with her. Relax, have fun, enjoy!

 

Keep it inexpensive and expect to pay. Don't be bitter about it .. it's just what many women have become conditioned to expect for the first few, so why fight it?

 

Social conditioning is very powerful, you won't win that battle! You will just become bitter and angry (as so many men have become), which is counter-productive...and frankly, sad.

 

But hey ... maybe she will surprise you and offer to pay herself!

 

Think positive!

 

G'luck and wish you the best.

[katiegrl]

Well great for your girlfriend... I am sure she is oh so happy having to pay half the time.

 

 

Personally, I LOVE that my boyfriend takes me out and treats me and pampers and spoils me. I feel great about it and absolutely love it

 

 

There is nothing sweeter to me than a romantic date out, that my boyfriend treats me to.

 

 

I am not sure what the difference is? Your girlfriend and you feel happier with having to go halve in all your dates? Where as I feel happier being spoilt?

 

 

By the way. I pay the phone bill for my boyfriend and I and I got him the brand new latest model phone; HE pays rent usually when he has a job but due to being laid off recently, we BOTH intend to go halve now.

 

 

I also spoil him equally for his birthday so it, overall, our expenditure on one another evens out!

 

 

I just prefer to go about my dating life in a way that is different to you, yet makes me happier.

 

Leigh makes great points. When her man takes her out and treats ...she feels special!

 

And when a woman feels special, she gives back in oh so many other wonderful ways, that make her man feel special!

 

Again, social conditioning, and basic biology! Ying and yang, Mars/Venus.

 

Don't fight it ...embrace the differences!

 

We all want to feel special in our relationships. Learn what makes your SO happy and feeling special, and almost guarantee you will have loving, caring mutually-rewarding relationship!

 

That's what I have with my fiance... not without our fair share of trials and tribulations lol, but we're there now.

 

Rant over....:bunny: