Zippy2000 Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 Any excuse to break up with someone and for not drinking at his level is a priceless and such a lame one. Thats like saying you would not date super model Elle MacPherson because she doesnt drink. Thnink about that one for a sec.
kendahke Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 (edited) Thanks everyone for the insight. I agree with everything that was said for the most part, and I usually would just try to walk away and move on, but but nothing. Walk away and move on. This is nothing but a bunch of misery and disappointment waiting on you and clearly, he respects you enough to not bring that into your life. I really like this guy more than I have liked anyone in so long and everything else is there---it's just this one issue and it seems somewhat superficial. Stop lying to yourself. Drinking to excess IS. NOT. superficial. He is an alcoholic and he's scouting out his enabler who will let him drink as he sees fit. You are not that woman, no matter how nice he is, how great the sex was, blah blah blah... You can't be that hard up for a man that you will put your neck in this yoke to get gored with sores from pulling his dead weight. Surely, you have a better consideration for yourself than this? And the way I left his place made it more awkward, and I don't know what is going on now, if he's going to contact me, if I should contact him. His head is wrapped around drinking, not you. That is his lover, his mistress, his woman. IMO, you should not contact him. What good will it do? He already knows how you feel. I am so upset and just want to talk to him about it, but don't want to say 'can we talk', obviously that will send him running. Any suggestions (besides forget about him)? When he brought this up he was still saying that he really likes me and loves being with me and everything was perfect! So, it's bugging me to no end why having 2 drinks instead of 4 is reason to break up. BECAUSE HE'S BEEN DOWN THIS ROAD BEFORE IN HIS PAST AND KNOWS A RELATIONSHIP WITH A WOMAN WHO DOES NOT DRINK LIKE HE DOES WILL. NOT. WORK. What you're not getting is that this isn't about you. It's about his lust for alcohol eclipses you and whatever good you may bring to the situation. It is stronger than what you bring to the table. Here's the thing: if he was all about you, he'd stop drinking altogether because the thought of losing you was far worse than the thought of him not having another drink. It's clear from what you're writing that you have no experience with relationships with alcoholics. Neither did I, but I knew that I didn't want to become a drunk's enabler; nor did I want to live my life walking on eggshells in fear of this being the day that he was "3 sheets to the wind". Just to clarify, he's not out partying all the time, not much actually, if he happens to be out he has a few drinks, and I have fewer. If I am able to get past his previous doings, why can't he be ok with me not drinking as much as him. Non sequitur. Apples and oranges. One has nothing to do with the other, as badly as you want to conflate them. His present is what is in your face, not his past. You keep wanting to pin this on his wild past and it has nothing to do with that or you accepting that. You have to accept him drinking to excess at any given moment. And he doesn't have to go out partying to be a drunk. The guy I was seeing earlier this year, one would think he looked like a guy who had his stuff together; he was neat, clean, etc.: except for the day I went over there and he was a sloppy, dirty, drunk mess. It was like meeting a completely different man than the one I'd just spent 2 months getting to know. He had a co-worker take him to the liquor store to buy his VO and coke and would come home and drink for 2-4 days straight--til he had to go check into the dry-out ward at the county hospital, then spend a week on the psyche ward there, too. Are you saying you're down for going through this, too? I can appreciate you being upset and confused by this turn around and are in a state of denial--I was too when it happened to me. I really wanted things to work out with the guy I was seeing, too. However, as I said earlier, he's pushed you out of the way of the bullet and by doing that, he's done you an immense favor. This is a whole lot of pain, disappointment and sadness that is totally avoidable if you'd let go of your need to be with him. There are other men out there who are not this messed up. You need to put yourself out there for them to find you. This is a man you really don't know anything about, especially when it comes to the frequency and true amount of liquor he consumes. You've been dealing with his representative up until this point: we all do when we're first meeting someone new. Everyone is on their best behavior in the beginning. However, the representative has been dismissed. The real him is here now; and the real him drinks a lot--most likely way more than he's shown you over the course of 6 dates. The 'honeymoon' phase is over for him because his need for alcohol is back at the fore, hence him dropping you off. Edited October 20, 2015 by kendahke 1
kassy Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 Differences in the amounts people drink is insignificant to some and really important to others. Often they don't realize it's important until they spend time with someone who drinks significantly less than themselves. It appears to me (the lower drinking person) that sometimes people feel they can't kick back and relax or party without feeling some pressure to drink less. It may be a genuine reason for incompatibility. But as has been said it just doesn't matter. He has told you he's not into the relationship anymore... You really don't need to hear more than that. Time to move on
katiegrl Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 Any excuse to break up with someone and for not drinking at his level is a priceless and such a lame one. Thats like saying you would not date super model Elle MacPherson because she doesnt drink. Thnink about that one for a sec. He did not break up with her because of drinking. That was just an easy excuse. Obviously he did not want to tell her the REAL reason, so he tells her that. Yes it's lame but it was just an excuse. Bottom line OP, after six dates he does not want a relationship with you. It could be anything! It does not matter. It is over. Best to just accept that and move on....
No_Go Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 Trust me, he is not lying to you. I had an alcoholic ex, and after we broke up, he wrote me an e-mail to explain how he couldn't stand me being around him while drinking (i do not drink at all) For alcoholic people... drinking is like religion. I am grossly familiar with their behaviors from this ex and others. So do yourself a favor and move forward. FYI: the alcoholism of my ex made him incapable of holding a job and taking care of himself, costed me ~$7000 for 6 months relationship because I though I can change him by taking care of him... I have been dating this guy about a month. We click on every level, enjoy the same things, have a ridiculous physical connection. We see each other a few times a week and things have been great, he has been a lot more consistent then most guys I have dated in recent years in terms of texting, making plans. Treats me really well. When we are together he can't keep his hands off of me and is super affectionate all of the time. Biggest spark I ever had with anyone from a first kiss. We didn't have sex until about the 6th date. He has told me a lot of his sexual history that worried me a little (he is straight, but was into swinging, and has also been with men, but this was all a long time ago and said it's not something he's into now), but I liked him enough that I didnt lose interest. We just spent most of the weekend together, things were going great, and then out of nowhere while we are cuddling he says he doesn't know if we should see each other anymore because our lifestyles are so different (i.e he'll drink a lot and I won't have more than 2 drinks, I didn't want to drink last night because I had work early today, etc...). I am 38 and he is 41, this seems incredibly childish to end things because I am not a big drinker. And then after we talked about it, we were still cuddling and I asked if he wanted me to leave and he said no. And we ended up having sex again. I was so upset about the conversation I didn't want to stay over and left. I don't know what to do, I genuinely like this guy and see something there, and he sure made it seem like he did (I've been pretty laid back and let him do most of the pursuing, in terms of texting, dates, everything). He's known all along I am responsible about work, and I'm not a heavy drinker, so why did he wait until now and keep misleading me? He wasn't getting sex out of it til very recently, and when I brought up his past and said I was ok with it, why is he not ok with my not wanting to drink a lot (I still go out but just drink slowly, and don't have too many drinks), he said it makes us different. I am crushed right now, what do I say to him?? This just seems so dumb and in the back of my mind I wonder if it's not really about that, but more about his sexual lifestyle. 1
No_Go Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 I really don't think it is an excuse - alcoholism is a very serious psychiatric condition, and the guy probably is well familiar with the effect on him and his non-alcoholic partners from past relationships (as kendashke also pointed out), so he wants to spare the disappointment for both parties by terminating the things fast. He did not break up with her because of drinking. That was just an easy excuse. Obviously he did not want to tell her the REAL reason, so he tells her that. Yes it's lame but it was just an excuse. Bottom line OP, after six dates he does not want a relationship with you. It could be anything! It does not matter. It is over. Best to just accept that and move on.... 1
SwordofFlame Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 I'm not an alcoholic, but I am a pretty regular drinker myself. I don't date women who don't drink. However, I find no problem at all with my date not keeping up with me and only having one or two drinks.
StBreton Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 I do participate, it's not like I don't drink. Yes, I do like that he is being honest with me and has been about everything (obviously;) That's been one of the attributes I have appreciated most. He has treated me well, and this is why I am completely blindsided by this. He couldn't have made seem any more like he was crazy about me. But timing wise, he knew I wasn't a big drinker at the beginning, so I really wish he would have ended it sooner (like before we had sex). But what made this so difficult was when and how he brought it up. Definitely a bit on the callous side OP ...sorry he did it that way and you got your feelings hurt. It's my understanding that guys are more apt than gals to plow ahead with a relationship (though 6 dates doesn't quite qualify as one) or dating and not think too far ahead ...in hopes to close the deal (sex). You'd be surprised how guys talk about flipping in and out of these mini-relationships where they get sex ...that's why a lot of woman wait ...because being intimate like that ...for a lot of woman ...builds a connection that makes our oxytocin levels go up and we start feeling attached. Sorry it didn't work out but this guy is done ...whatever the reason. Maybe wait a little longer to get attached next time so you don't get your feelings hurt. (OP there are those on the forum here who disagree with waiting for sex ...it's not a carrot and it's not a manipulative move as some have put forth ... But your experience is why some wait ...they don't like the up/down in/out emotions of getting involved so quickly and then it ends ...so they protect their heart ...it's not wrong that you started to develop a connection with this person because of the intimacy involved)
katiegrl Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 (edited) I really don't think it is an excuse - alcoholism is a very serious psychiatric condition, and the guy probably is well familiar with the effect on him and his non-alcoholic partners from past relationships (as kendashke also pointed out), so he wants to spare the disappointment for both parties by terminating the things fast. Fair enough, but OP said he did not drink *that* much; he was a social drinker. Plus, he had to have known she wasn't a drinker from date one. Why continue dating her if her not drinking bothered him so much? With heavy drinkers once they find out their date is NOT a drinker (date one or two), they don't go out with them again. He did continue dating her! Six dates and then suddenly her not drinking that much bothers him to the point he does not wish to date her anymore? Something isn't jiving. Edited October 20, 2015 by katiegrl 1
No_Go Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 From my personal experience people that are just social drinkers do not start showing their "heavy drinking" side so early on in a dating situation. Plus sadly, most alcoholics will define themselves as "social drinkers" - i.e. will not accept/admit they have a problem (e.g. my ex will define himself as social drinker - after we start leaving together I discovered his minimum for a night is 12-pack or 2 bottles of wine + he has been in jail for drinking problem + he has been treated for it for 12 years... And still, he'd say - I just drink socially ) Regarding why he kept dating her: I think it boils down to the "ridiculous physical attraction" that she mentioned. I.e. he has been very attracted to her and wanted to have sex with her badly... Then he got ambivalent after realizing that she is into him and wants a relationship, not casual sex only. I could be wrong of course, just guessing from what the OP wrote here Fair enough, but OP said he did not drink *that* much; he was a social drinker. Plus, he had to have known she wasn't a drinker from date one. Why continue dating her if her not drinking bothered him so much? With heavy drinkers once they find out their date is NOT a drinker (date one or two), they don't go out with them again. He did continue dating her! Six dates and then suddenly her not drinking that much bothers him to the point he does not wish to date her anymore? Something isn't jiving. 1
katiegrl Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 (edited) TheFrom my personal experience people that are just social drinkers do not start showing their "heavy drinking" side so early on in a dating situation. Plus sadly, most alcoholics will define themselves as "social drinkers" - i.e. will not accept/admit they have a problem (e.g. my ex will define himself as social drinker - after we start leaving together I discovered his minimum for a night is 12-pack or 2 bottles of wine + he has been in jail for drinking problem + he has been treated for it for 12 years... And still, he'd say - I just drink socially ) Regarding why he kept dating her: I think it boils down to the "ridiculous physical attraction" that she mentioned. I.e. he has been very attracted to her and wanted to have sex with her badly... Then he got ambivalent after realizing that she is into him and wants a relationship, not casual sex only. I could be wrong of course, just guessing from what the OP wrote here He may not have *shown* her he is a heavy drinker, but he still *knew* he was (is) a heavy drinker (if that in fact is the case). So again why continue to date her knowing full well she does not share his love of drinking? Because he felt ridiculous physical attraction? And after six dates, what, he suddenly stopped feeling that same attraction? So her not drinking bothers him? BINGO! THAT is why he stopped dating her! He no longer felt the attraction/chemistry....and realized he does not want a relationship with her ....it happens. JMO. Edited October 20, 2015 by katiegrl
Redhead14 Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 I have been dating this guy about a month. We click on every level, enjoy the same things, have a ridiculous physical connection. We see each other a few times a week and things have been great, he has been a lot more consistent then most guys I have dated in recent years in terms of texting, making plans. Treats me really well. When we are together he can't keep his hands off of me and is super affectionate all of the time. Biggest spark I ever had with anyone from a first kiss. We didn't have sex until about the 6th date. He has told me a lot of his sexual history that worried me a little (he is straight, but was into swinging, and has also been with men, but this was all a long time ago and said it's not something he's into now), but I liked him enough that I didnt lose interest. We just spent most of the weekend together, things were going great, and then out of nowhere while we are cuddling he says he doesn't know if we should see each other anymore because our lifestyles are so different (i.e he'll drink a lot and I won't have more than 2 drinks, I didn't want to drink last night because I had work early today, etc...). I am 38 and he is 41, this seems incredibly childish to end things because I am not a big drinker. And then after we talked about it, we were still cuddling and I asked if he wanted me to leave and he said no. And we ended up having sex again. I was so upset about the conversation I didn't want to stay over and left. I don't know what to do, I genuinely like this guy and see something there, and he sure made it seem like he did (I've been pretty laid back and let him do most of the pursuing, in terms of texting, dates, everything). He's known all along I am responsible about work, and I'm not a heavy drinker, so why did he wait until now and keep misleading me? He wasn't getting sex out of it til very recently, and when I brought up his past and said I was ok with it, why is he not ok with my not wanting to drink a lot (I still go out but just drink slowly, and don't have too many drinks), he said it makes us different. I am crushed right now, what do I say to him?? This just seems so dumb and in the back of my mind I wonder if it's not really about that, but more about his sexual lifestyle. This guy has likely dated or been in relationships with women who don't drink like he does and found that they wouldn't tolerate periods of drunkeness and situations where they felt embarrassed by him. And, if he drinks that much, can you picture yourself down the road with him being drunk and you having to be the designated driver all the time? Or, you're finished drinking and partying and want to go home, but he doesn't? He's been in this situation before and gave you a heads up. He didn't mislead you. It's only been a month and he's been observing that you don't drink to the extent that he does and raised the flag on himself. He's done you a favor. It's not like he's been dating you for 6 months. 2
kendahke Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 (edited) Fair enough, but OP said he did not drink *that* much; he was a social drinker. OP also has only been on 6 dates with him--which means that they were in the "on best behavior" phase of a new relationship. They were both dealing with each other's representatives. The real him has just now surfaced. He wants someone who drinks like he does, probably because he doesn't feel indicted by their lack of interest in drinking. The honeymoon phase is over. The real him probably drinks far more than the representative who's on best behavior for lo these past 6 dates does. The dude I dealt with didn't drink at all on our first dates. We met in January of this year. In April he had his binge. Not once before April did he allude to drinking, nor did he order alcohol when we went out to eat. I thought he was a teetotaler, which I don't mind because I rarely drink. Never in a million years did I suspect that he had this level of a drinking problem until it fell out in experience at my feet. He even lost his job over this stunt. But seriously---who cares if it was for drinking or for lack of interest? He said he's no longer interested and that's all OP needs to know. She's no longer wanted. Why try to force a relationship with someone who, for whatever reason, doesn't want you? Edited October 20, 2015 by kendahke 1
kendahke Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 This guy has likely dated or been in relationships with women who don't drink like he does and found that they wouldn't tolerate periods of drunkeness and situations where they felt embarrassed by him. And, if he drinks that much, can you picture yourself down the road with him being drunk and you having to be the designated driver all the time? Or, you're finished drinking and partying and want to go home, but he doesn't? He's been in this situation before and gave you a heads up. He didn't mislead you. It's only been a month and he's been observing that you don't drink to the extent that he does and raised the flag on himself. He's done you a favor. It's not like he's been dating you for 6 months. ^^^^well said.
candie13 Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 girl... you mean a 41 years old men think you are weird because you do not drink when you have work early in the morning... he basically gives you the stupidest reason in the world to not go out with you and then he tries to sleep with you... after he told you he's been with men, but he's not that much into men nowadays... and you're actually considering him for a RS? And you're 38? Ok, let me spell it out for you: this guy is a party animal who had no intention of settling down. That is what he meant with the your non drinking thingy. Girl, this type of men won't stick around unless there is something in it for him - aka sex. And that will be non-commitmental sex. IF you want to stick around him, you'd better be at the same speed as he is. And even if you are... he will need variety. You're 38. What do you seek in a man? I mean, if you want to have some fun, cool, but I'd ask him to use 3 condoms, not one, given his sexual past. 1
No_Go Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 Well maybe he just reached his goal in the some way (had sex with a very attractive woman?), but has no interest in pursuing LTR with her. In any case it all boils down to what you said: he "realized he does not want a relationship with her" - and this is all that matters The He may not have *shown* her he is a heavy drinker, but he still *knew* he was (is) a heavy drinker (if that in fact is the case). So again why continue to date her knowing full well she does not share his love of drinking? Because he felt ridiculous physical attraction? And after six dates, what, he suddenly stopped feeling that same attraction? So her not drinking bothers him? BINGO! THAT is why he stopped dating her! He no longer felt the attraction/chemistry....and realized he does not want a relationship with her ....it happens. JMO. 1
suds00 Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 while excessive drinking his a problem his sexual past should concern you I think 1
Lois_Griffin Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 I don't have a problem with his drinking, he doesn't have a drinking problem (I went out with someone for a while that did, this is nothing close to it). I have never said anything to him about nor would I. I enjoy going out or staying in and having drinks, I don't care how much he has, so if he is concerned I would say something, I want him to know it's not an issue. People only let you see what they WANT you to see. I started dating a guy and for the first 2 or 3 months we got along great. We'd have a blast - have drinks and turn on the karaoke machine on a Saturday night, staying up til the wee hours, etc. etc. I'd cook for him or he'd make dinner for me, etc. etc. Sometimes we'd have beer or whatever. We didn't talk on the phone every day but we'd reach out to each other via text or email. BUT, on the rare occasions I'd decide to give him a call on a random Tuesday or Thursday night, a lot of the time his speech would be a bit slurred. He'd laugh and tell me I was crazy and I was wrong, but I wasn't. So it took me about 3 months or so to start seeing the cracks in the façade. I eventually realized I was dealing with a FULL BLOWN alcoholic who for the most part, had hidden it very well from me for 3 months. I dumped his ass before the 5 month mark. Just because you don't SEE this guy over-indulging every time you're with him, doesn't mean he DOESN'T. He just lets you see what he wants you to see. 1
Author bulldog9 Posted October 21, 2015 Author Posted October 21, 2015 Thanks everyone for your responses, I'm torn because while I realize what I have said about him might give a bad impression, he really is a great guy, and I usually would just move on and not look back when something like this happens, but I am really just feeling it with him, and I think it's worth at least tying to talk to him. Just to clarify, while he may be more than social drinker as some people on here have suggested, I've never actually seen him have more than about 3-5 drinks, which isn't all that extreme. When this conversation happened it was after we spent day walking around, at park, stopping off for a glass of wine, then watching Netflix and getting carryout cuddling on his couch. A very normal, g-rated kind of day/night, but extremely affectionate and what seemed sincere. Sex oddly didn't even happen to long after the conversation, this was not a booty call type of situation. And he wanted me to stay over and I got up and left because I didn't want him to see me upset all night. When he did bring this up, in the middle of cuddling, he was a bit stoned and had had a few drinks. Yes, he has a wild past but his whole demeanor is just so different from the impression he gives off from his 'stories'. While all that stuff did distract me and initially make me think he might be too much for me, he never truly gave that impression and was never pressuring and we always had real discussions, had real dates, he treated me really well. It's been an extremely intimate relationship. Even just a few hours before this went down, we were discussing the future and what we wanted, and he absolutely did not seem interested in hookups, and does want a normal relationship, and I don't think he ever knew how into him I was, as I did play it kind of laid back throughout the past few weeks. When he brought up this lifestyle difference, he did say he likes me a lot and doesn't want to stop dating me, but just wonders how this would all go if our lifestyles are so different (which again, he implied drinking/partying, but I still feel like he was referring to his sexual past, which even though it was only a few years ago, is the past). I do not think he is an alcoholic (I have dated 1 or 2 and he definitely is different), I don't think being involved with him would be crazy in terms of his drinking habits, it's not that extreme. I just feel so upset about how we left things (are we done with each other? are we thinking it over and taking a break? are things resolved? )...I left in the middle of the night because I felt super sick from being upset and then didn't want him to see my cry, and the whole thing just felt awkward since we had what I thought was a break-up talk, but then had sex and were asleep cuddling, until I got up and left. I think we all get those impulses about people, one from our brain, and one from our heart. But despite everything he has told me (and again, he has been super upfront about everything, good and bad!), both my brain and heart tell me there is something there, and this is hurting me more than breakups I have had in longer relationships, so I feel like we should at least talk. (I'm just not sure how to suggest doing that, because saying we need to talk/can we talk is last thing a guy wants to hear).
Redhead14 Posted October 21, 2015 Posted October 21, 2015 I really don't think it is an excuse - alcoholism is a very serious psychiatric condition, and the guy probably is well familiar with the effect on him and his non-alcoholic partners from past relationships (as kendashke also pointed out), so he wants to spare the disappointment for both parties by terminating the things fast. Alcoholism is not a psychiatric condition. Alcohol use is the result of an underlying psychiatric issue. So if he is an alcoholic, it's because he has some other kind of problem and he uses alcohol to mask that. So the problem is actually two-pronged. If he is going to be able to have a relationship, he will have to address that underlying issue as well as be able to stop drinking. And, it is apparent that he is no where near being able to accept he has a problem that needs to be worked on and do that, so he is sparing her. This man is not a bad guy. He's being honest at least. He's not wearing blinders and drawing her into a co-dependent relationship.
Author bulldog9 Posted October 21, 2015 Author Posted October 21, 2015 This happened early into Monday morning and it's Weds morning now. Not yet (we don't usually talk every day though, usually like every other day). I've been swamped with work and I remember him mentioning going to events Mon and Tues night, so I don't know if he's been busy, or is ignoring me, or if we are 'thinking this over' (as was mentioned when I left).
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