amelia0607 Posted October 19, 2015 Posted October 19, 2015 After 35 years of marriage, I have come to the realization that this isn't a m marriage at all. We are two people that have grown children and grandchildren in common and that's it. We live in the same house - him upstairs and me downstairs. We share the bank accounts, investments, bills, etc. We attend church together and go out to eat after church together with my mom. We might run errands together occasionally. I still tend to think that we are a couple when we are not. We do not go out to eat together or to the movies or anything. We do not have any friends. But because I still think of us as a couple, I ask to go out to eat sometimes when we are running errands but he always says no - he has an eating disorder and refuses to eat out. I have decided that I am tired of thinking I am married but not really being married. I am tired of being disappointed. I am tired of being snapped at. I could go on and on and on but I won't. My husband has OCPD and I can no longer live with this. Do I talk to him now and tell him I will be leaving or do I continue to live the facade until things are in order and I'm ready to walk out the door? I know that I need to make copies of financial statements and tax returns. I will also be taking pictures of our home and contents and personal items. I plan to take tomorrow off to do this while he is at work. I will have to find a place to live. Not sure how to go about doing that. I don't want to rent and could possibly buy a house after the assets are split. I also will have to pack and hire movers. After 35 years this will take some time. I am feeling very overwhelmed at the moment and just not real sure where to begin. Any suggestions? Thank you.
whichwayisup Posted October 19, 2015 Posted October 19, 2015 Are you really ready to walk out without trying marriage counseling? To fix things with him or at least give him the chance to reconnect with you? That's a lot of marital history and a life built with someone to just walk out on. I take he's had OCD for many years? Did he ever seek help/counseling meds? 2
mystikmind2005 Posted October 19, 2015 Posted October 19, 2015 why do people let marriages slide to the point where there is just nothing left to salvage? Myself and my ex did the same thing and she moved out last January and we have a 3 year old daughter. First step might be to talk to a therapist? Then a solicitor. Probably too late for this but please watch this movie as well - hope springs
d0nnivain Posted October 19, 2015 Posted October 19, 2015 I agree. Before you throw in towel have you done anything to try to reconnect?
LoveMyCat Posted October 19, 2015 Posted October 19, 2015 If you want to leave the marriage, you may have to rent for a while until things get sorted out. It can take a while. Do you think he will fight a divorce? Maybe he would be happier alone as well. My husband and I both kind of gave in at the same time and I was the one who moved, very quickly. We are in the process of divorce now. He has agreed to pay me a flat amount, a one-time settlement. He can sell the house or keep it, it is up to him. But talk to a lawyer. Many offer a free initial consultation, as mine did. The idea that moving out means you "abandoned" the marriage is not necessarily true anymore and usually does not affect settlements, depending upon where you live. If a situation becomes intolerable, you can leave. Just find out your legal options and do as your lawyer advises. Counseling may or may not help at this point. We did not go that route. We both knew we wanted to be on our own, no other parties involved, no children. Good luck.
kgcolonel Posted October 19, 2015 Posted October 19, 2015 Amelia....my wife and I have been married for 33 years next month. I know exactly what you're saying. Several years ago, I realized the same thing and I began to look at myself as to what can I do, with or without her to build this M. I began to become a husband that I thought (I couldn't really get her to be specific as to where I could improve) would really make a difference. I wanted to be THE Husband that if I were the W, I'd want to be with. It took a few weeks / months but she noticed. Here are some of the things I did: Communicate in her language, not my language. Listen to her wants / needs and put them into action. Be affectionate as she is much more so than I normally. Be spontaneous with her. Compliment her anywhere I could, and tell her I value her strengths. I also read the book Love Languages which explain ways we can reconnect with our SOs. There is also the great book, if I can suggest it, The Proper Care and Feeding of Husbands. She bought this one on her own and it meant the world to me. I knew about the book but would look bad buying it for her as it would have put her on the defensive. If you're serious about trying, don't rule out a good MC for at least 6 mos. Just some thoughts.
Author amelia0607 Posted October 19, 2015 Author Posted October 19, 2015 (edited) Perhaps I didn’t provide enough background. I have been in and out of counseling over the past 35 years trying to learn how to deal with our problems. He has gone maybe 4 or 5 times with me and quits because he just doesn’t see a problem. For the first 15 years there was his alcoholism. Then there was the chewing tobacco. Then he moved into an eating disorder which landed him in the hospital for 1 week due to malnutrition. He had been diagnosed with an eating disorder about 1 year before his collapse but because people with OCPD cannot see that they have a problem, he refused to take the doctor’s and the nutritionist’s advice for counseling. When I threatened to leave, he agreed to counseling and as soon as I went out of town to visit our daughter, he proclaimed himself healed from his eating disorder and just quit counseling. He refused to let me attend a session with him so I doubt that they actually addressed his OCPD but just focused on his eating disorder, whichhe still says he does not have. He went into counseling because I threatened to leave but as soon as I turn my back, he quit with no discussion with me at all. Didn’t even tell me that he had quit. This was about 4 years ago. OCPD people are not OCD (washing hands, counting, etc.). It is an addictive personality type in that they handle their anxiety about life through various addictions. The addictions can range from alcohol to fishing to exercise to collecting. I don’t have a problem with him having hobbies but when he chooses to go duck hunting every single day that his daughter is home for her annual visit then that is a problem. And as soon as hunting season is over, he calls her every other day telling her how much he misses her. She finally told him that he could see her on her next visit home and if choose to hunt instead, then it was his fault that he missed her and she didn’t want to hear it. He moped around for months because she hurt his feelings. They also think that their way is the only way. They can be very harsh in the way they handle certain situations. They are very tight with money to the point that our children thought we didn’t have money for them to buy pencils at school. He has admonished me at least twice a week for the past year about not shutting the garage door when I get home. He works 2 days a week and on those two days when I get home, his dog follows me into the garage. I am busy trying to get my supper fixed,laundry done, etc. and by the time his dog is out of the garage, I forget to go back and close it. His admonishment wouldn’t bother me so much except that on the 5 days he doesn’t work, the garage door is open all day long. Its ok for him to leave it open for 10 – 12 hours 5 days a week but I can’t leave it open for 2 hours twice a week. I point this out to him routinely and he says that he gets mad at himself when he does it but I’ve never once heard him make a smart a*s comment to himself about it. For the entire 35 years of our marriage, he has always had a special truck. This is his play pretty yet he rarely drives it because it will get dirty. You do NOT haul things in this truck and no one else is allowed to drive it – no matter what. If my car won’t start and he’s not home, I have to call my 83 y/o mom to drive about 20 miles one way to come get me. I have never been able to park my vehicle under shelter because his truck and his 4 wheeler and his motorcycle and his mountain bicycle get the garage. We bought a special metal barn to put his stuff in so that I could use the garage but somehow that has never happened. The metal barn is now full of his 2 tractors, riding lawn mower, 3 of his 5 fishing boats and 4 big boxes of duck decoys. He thinks my vehicle doesn’t deserve shelter because I don’t take care of it the way he cares for his special truck. No I have to drive my vehicle to work. The parking lot is surrounded with trees so it does get dirty. I work on a college campus and we do not have separate parking areas from the students so my doors get dinger, my bumper gets smooched, and sometimes my rear wheel wells get beat up so no my vehicle is rarely as nice as either one of his. But what does that have to do with my having to scrape ice and snow in the winter. I see this as being about me and my lack of shelter. He sees it as being about protecting his precious toys. Please understand he is not a bad person and many women would be thrilled to have him in their lives. I can take all of his OCPD issues and live with them. I take meds for the anxiety and depression that I have and they seem to work okay. But I CANNOT take the isolation. We live in the country since he can’t live near neighbors. He gets upset if I go into town more than once per day so I try to limit my trips. Most of my friends have moved on to other friends that are more available to do things or to couple friends that their spouses can get along with. I could even live with the lack of friends if he would spend time with me but he doesn’t. In a typical week, my non-working hours are either spent alone, with my 2 year old grandchild or my 83 y/o mom. I’m not looking for another spouse or to even get into a relationship with anyone. Doubt I could trust them anyway – my problems not theirs. But I do want to have friends. I want to have a life that allows me to be me, whoever that is. I come home from work now and I literally sit in a corner on the couch and try to not do anything at all because if I do, he has to come in and “help” by telling me how to do whatever. I didn’t spill all of this on my initial post because it is hurtful to me to see what I have let my life become. Even if he did go into counseling with me, I wouldn’t trust that he’s taking it seriously. I’ve been in counseling for the past 5 years with a very good counselor that has been helping me to deal with the OCPD and that has helped me to see that if I continue to live like this it is my fault –it will be my choice. I choose not to. Edited October 19, 2015 by a LoveShack.org Moderator add proper spacing, please use spacing and paragraphs
Author amelia0607 Posted October 19, 2015 Author Posted October 19, 2015 If you want to leave the marriage, you may have to rent for a while until things get sorted out. It can take a while. Do you think he will fight a divorce? Maybe he would be happier alone as well. My husband and I both kind of gave in at the same time and I was the one who moved, very quickly. We are in the process of divorce now. He has agreed to pay me a flat amount, a one-time settlement. He can sell the house or keep it, it is up to him. But talk to a lawyer. Many offer a free initial consultation, as mine did. The idea that moving out means you "abandoned" the marriage is not necessarily true anymore and usually does not affect settlements, depending upon where you live. If a situation becomes intolerable, you can leave. Just find out your legal options and do as your lawyer advises. Counseling may or may not help at this point. We did not go that route. We both knew we wanted to be on our own, no other parties involved, no children. Good luck. At first I did not think he would fight and I don't think he will fight a divorce but as I got to thinking about this, nothing with someone that OCPD is easy. They are very firm in their "knowledge" that their way is the correct way. So I do suspect some issues with settlement especially since he is in the middle of trying to settle his father's estate, close out a trust and reopen a new one. Thank you for understanding that i'm pretty much done - just done. 1
Author amelia0607 Posted October 19, 2015 Author Posted October 19, 2015 Are you really ready to walk out without trying marriage counseling? To fix things with him or at least give him the chance to reconnect with you? That's a lot of marital history and a life built with someone to just walk out on. I take he's had OCD for many years? Did he ever seek help/counseling meds? Thank you for your response. I have provided a more detailed account of our marriage, counseling efforts, and OCPD. Please take a look below. Thank you.
Author amelia0607 Posted October 19, 2015 Author Posted October 19, 2015 I agree. Before you throw in towel have you done anything to try to reconnect? Last night when I wrote the initial post, I did not go into great detail about our marriage, counseling attempts, and his OCPD. I have done that below.
Author amelia0607 Posted October 19, 2015 Author Posted October 19, 2015 Amelia....my wife and I have been married for 33 years next month. I know exactly what you're saying. Several years ago, I realized the same thing and I began to look at myself as to what can I do, with or without her to build this M. I began to become a husband that I thought (I couldn't really get her to be specific as to where I could improve) would really make a difference. I wanted to be THE Husband that if I were the W, I'd want to be with. It took a few weeks / months but she noticed. Here are some of the things I did: Communicate in her language, not my language. Listen to her wants / needs and put them into action. Be affectionate as she is much more so than I normally. Be spontaneous with her. Compliment her anywhere I could, and tell her I value her strengths. I also read the book Love Languages which explain ways we can reconnect with our SOs. There is also the great book, if I can suggest it, The Proper Care and Feeding of Husbands. She bought this one on her own and it meant the world to me. I knew about the book but would look bad buying it for her as it would have put her on the defensive. If you're serious about trying, don't rule out a good MC for at least 6 mos. Just some thoughts. Thank you for your thoughts and I am happy that this worked for you. Last night when I wrote the initial post, I did not go into great detail about our marriage, counseling attempts, and his OCPD. I have done that below.
LoveMyCat Posted October 19, 2015 Posted October 19, 2015 At first I did not think he would fight and I don't think he will fight a divorce but as I got to thinking about this, nothing with someone that OCPD is easy. They are very firm in their "knowledge" that their way is the correct way. So I do suspect some issues with settlement especially since he is in the middle of trying to settle his father's estate, close out a trust and reopen a new one. Thank you for understanding that i'm pretty much done - just done. My husband is stubborn and he resisted at first but once he was convinced that he would have to give up a lot more financially if he fought it (community property state) than what I was asking for, he saw sense. He will be slow about it, as he is with all things, but I moved to a small apartment eleven months ago and am happier than I have been in years. If you can move, I recommend it highly. My stress is almost non-existent and even my chronic pain issues improved.
oldshirt Posted October 19, 2015 Posted October 19, 2015 I really think it's immaterial if you give him advanced notice of your intentions or not. Does he even notice or care about your comings and goings? If so he may catch on to what you are doing. If not, he won't even notice so it won't really matter much. If you think he may be prone to get violent or abusive when he finds out you are leaving, that will take a little more delicate approach. Either way I think your first step should be to get an attorney and work with your lawyer and let him/her advise you on which steps to take when. I'm assuming this is your first divorce where as your attorney may have done hundreds so they have a better idea of the flow of things. It sounds like your mind is pretty much made up so I think it will all boil down to this two-step process - -Get an attorney. - Do what your attorney says.
Mrs. John Adams Posted October 19, 2015 Posted October 19, 2015 amelia0607..your story broke my heart. You are in the twilight years of your life where everything should be easier...and here you are ready to just quit. I never heard you say you still love each other..and maybe at this point it is irrelevant....but i am so sorry you have reached the point of cashing in. I hope he does not fight you...I hope you escape unscathed....and i hope you can find solitude and peace. I cant recommend anything for you other than finding a good lawyer and i would certainly confide in my children...they already know how difficult their father is...but they may give you the support you need to carry on with your plan. 1
Author amelia0607 Posted October 20, 2015 Author Posted October 20, 2015 My concerns with moving is that we have a lot of stuff. Him more than me. Anywhere I could move afford to move before a financial settlement is made would be too small for my stuff. I don't want to leave it here for fear he will damage or sell it. I am currently working on taking pictures of all of our stuff. There have been a lot of burglaries around us recently so he did mention taking pictures for property identification purposes so he won't think anything about my doing that. My other concern is safety. The areas that I could afford now are not very safe and I often have my 2 year old granddaughter with me while her parents are working. He could move out and stay with his mom until things are settled but that would be very hard on her and I don't want to do that to her. Also, our farm is not something that I can take physically take care of by myself. It just makes sense for me to be the one to leave. Just got to figure out how/when/where.
Author amelia0607 Posted October 20, 2015 Author Posted October 20, 2015 I really think it's immaterial if you give him advanced notice of your intentions or not. Does he even notice or care about your comings and goings? If so he may catch on to what you are doing. If not, he won't even notice so it won't really matter much. If you think he may be prone to get violent or abusive when he finds out you are leaving, that will take a little more delicate approach. Either way I think your first step should be to get an attorney and work with your lawyer and let him/her advise you on which steps to take when. I'm assuming this is your first divorce where as your attorney may have done hundreds so they have a better idea of the flow of things. It sounds like your mind is pretty much made up so I think it will all boil down to this two-step process - -Get an attorney. - Do what your attorney says. There was a time when neither one of us even bothered to check in with the other one. But during the illnesses of our fathers - first mine, then his - we did get better about that and now we each have an elderly mom to care for so we do try to at least know where the other person is.
Author amelia0607 Posted October 20, 2015 Author Posted October 20, 2015 amelia0607..your story broke my heart. You are in the twilight years of your life where everything should be easier...and here you are ready to just quit. I never heard you say you still love each other..and maybe at this point it is irrelevant....but i am so sorry you have reached the point of cashing in. I hope he does not fight you...I hope you escape unscathed....and i hope you can find solitude and peace. I cant recommend anything for you other than finding a good lawyer and i would certainly confide in my children...they already know how difficult their father is...but they may give you the support you need to carry on with your plan. Thank you for caring. My age and impending retirement scares the crap out of me. We didn't save as we should have because he will inherit a nice amount of money that we were going to use for retirement. Now I will not have access to half of those funds. I will have access to half of our minimal savings and the value of our small farm. Also, until his retirement last year, I hadn't worked full-time in over 15 year so I do not have a retirement plan, a good income, or a permanent job. Last year, I was hired as a college professor but until you earn tenure, you work on a yearly contract basis. Last spring, approx. 20 professors did not have their contracts renewed due to budget constraints. I think I was renewed only because I have taught part-time for many years in an online environment and the school is building an online program. But without tenure my job is not guaranteed and without a doctorate degree, I probably won't get tenure. Doctorate degrees are expensive and due to my age, I don't think I could ever recoup the cost of the program. So in about 4 years I may very well be looking for another job which is hard to do in your late 50s. I do love him but its more like the feelings one would have for a good friend. There is just too much history between us for me to not love him. But it is definitely not the love of a spouse. I am a woman of great faith and for many years, I have stayed because of the vows that I made. But I've come to realize that living a lie is just as bad as breaking my vows. At least this way, I can do it and be done with it and trust in God to walk with me as I move forward.
Mrs. John Adams Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 I am so very sorry.... sometimes you just have to do what is right for you and you seem to have thought this out and planned. Money is always scary and i know striking out on your own has to be frightening. Is it possible that you can ask your children to help you? Could you possibly stay with the parents of your granddaughter for a while and put your things into storage? Will they help you move out?
loveboid Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 Sell some things and put the rest in storage. Once you leave the house he may very well sell your things and say he needed the money for the divorce. Save up some money first. You don't need to run out of the house. Keep being smart. Consult a Certified Divorce Financial Analyst. Try to agree to a settlement. It will save you lawyer fees.
Author amelia0607 Posted October 20, 2015 Author Posted October 20, 2015 I am so very sorry.... sometimes you just have to do what is right for you and you seem to have thought this out and planned. Money is always scary and i know striking out on your own has to be frightening. Is it possible that you can ask your children to help you? Could you possibly stay with the parents of your granddaughter for a while and put your things into storage? Will they help you move out? I have two grown daughters. The one that lives here has always been close to her dad and she will not take sides. Initially, she will understand but at some point she will be difficult to deal with. The other daughter lives 2,000 miles away. Because she caught the brunt of her dad's abuse as a child when I was at work, she will be as supportive as she can be; however, she will be starting fertility treatments in two weeks and I really want to keep her stress level low until we are more sure of the viability of a pregnancy - life threatening complications for her during her last pregnancy - don't know why she's doing this again but that's their decision. Her husband has literally offered me a place to stay any time i want it but I am needed here to care for my mom. The SIL that lives here will not help me move since my daughter will want to stay out of this. The SIL that lives across country would do whatever i asked him to do but unfortunately he's not here. I will figure this out.
Author amelia0607 Posted October 20, 2015 Author Posted October 20, 2015 Sell some things and put the rest in storage. Once you leave the house he may very well sell your things and say he needed the money for the divorce. Save up some money first. You don't need to run out of the house. Keep being smart. Consult a Certified Divorce Financial Analyst. Try to agree to a settlement. It will save you lawyer fees. Thank you for the advice. I have saved up some cash and plan to use that for initial expenses. I am also going to have copies of financial statements, tax returns, etc. and pictures of all of our belongings - just in case. I don't think he will try to "steal" things from me but I also know how people with his mental illness are. Once they get something in their head as being the "right" thing, they will do whatever it takes. So i am trying to be cautious and patient. I have never heard of a Certified Divorce Financial Analyst. Not sure if we have one here. I will have to look into this. Thank you.
Mrs. John Adams Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 I don't envy your road ahead....but i am very impressed with how you have thought it all out. You are right....you will figure it all out.....i have complete confidence in you. I just wish you had another choice. I don't know when the right time will be to tell your husband. But i think the better prepared you are the better off you will be. Best of luck to you...and to your daughter with her fertility process. I hope all goes well.
loveboid Posted October 21, 2015 Posted October 21, 2015 Since he may be obstinate consult a Divorce Mediator. The mediator is neutral and cannot give legal advice, will talk to your husband to smooth things out, will keep everything you both say private from the courtroom and judge. Sometimes a mediator is a retired judge and is experienced in getting people to negotiate. 80-85% of mediations are successful. The rest are due to a high conflict, personality disordered spouse. It's worth a try. Keep preparing.
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