Redhead14 Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 I'm not sure I agree without more information. What part don't you agree with and what kind of information do you need?
katiegrl Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 (edited) If this guy's esteem is really so damaged, this really isn't about looks at all. He will have said what he said to any woman who shows interest in him. He doesn't deserve anyone, let alone a beautiful woman. When a man says "I don't know why you want a guy like me" or "you can do better", it really implies that there is something wrong with her for wanting him. It's a rejection of sorts and, yet, he will date her because down deep, since he thinks there is something wrong with her, he deserves her. A woman who continues in this kind of a relationship, often actually has an issue of her own. It's a co-dependent relationship essentially. She isn't sure that he's that down on himself yet though. He may be experiencing a period of situational depression, etc. Since she does like him enough, she can just continue to observe. If the bolstering is necessary all the time, she should move on. That's an interesting spin Red ....and one I never personally thought of. But then again, Jasmine said he did not have this issue with his ex wife (who was average looking) ...but who knows, you could be right. Edited October 1, 2015 by katiegrl 1
Redhead14 Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 That's an interesting spin Red ....and one I never personally thought of. But then again, Jasmine said he did not have this issue with his ex wife ...but who knows, you could be right? We may never know what issues he's had with his ex-wife. But, if his esteem issues were carried into adulthood, it would have been at least a contributing factor. All I am doing is picking up on a commonly used sabotaging statement by people who have very low self-esteem and pointing out common reasons for that. It cannot be stated categorically that this is case with this man, but she has a heads up about what to look for. Since there isn't enough about his history, she should be objectively observing. 1
BlueIris Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 He sounds like a shallow man overly concerned about people’s physical appearance- yours, his, and probably others’ as well. I don’t get the feeling that he has low self-esteem so much as that he is superficial and might not even understand that or how some people connect at emotional and intellectual levels.
Redhead14 Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 He sounds like a shallow man overly concerned about people’s physical appearance- yours, his, and probably others’ as well. I don’t get the feeling that he has low self-esteem so much as that he is superficial and might not even understand that or how some people connect at emotional and intellectual levels. superficial and might not even understand that or how some people connect at emotional and intellectual levels -- that is almost the definition of low esteem essentially.
autumnnight Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 If you end up having to become his self-esteem boost, it could be a problem, but if he seems over it and confident again, maybe not. And don't worry about the slams to you, your age, or your rating. most of the men who dissed you are bitter about women in general. 3
SSM3 Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 Can this relationship work? As far as looks go I'm about a 9, he's about a 4. Talk about having a high opinion of yourself! 1
katiegrl Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 Talk about having a high opinion of yourself! What's wrong with having a high opinion of yourself? What would you prefer, someone with a low opinion of themselves? And everything that goes along with it -- low self-esteem, insecurity? Can't win around here I swear. It's been said on this board, have confidence! Then someone posts who DOES have confidence and you slam her for THAT. Damned if you do and damned if you don't. 1
SSM3 Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 What's wrong with having a high opinion of yourself? All of it sounds wrong......(I'm a 9 and he's a 4)....
katiegrl Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 (edited) All of it sounds wrong......(I'm a 9 and he's a 4).... Yeah, I thought that at first too ..... but then I read on and changed my opinion. Could she have worded that better? Yes! But in context, I think it's relevant to give us a clearer picture of the disparity in their looks. And hey, if you're a 9, you're a 9, why lie about it? Lol But again, sure she might have worded that better so as to avoid all the attacks, including mine earlier! Edited October 1, 2015 by katiegrl 3
carhill Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 Based on the title, it's simply a meeting of the minds, or not. However, throwing this in: "On the last date he asked me why I was with him and he told me I can do better." I'm smelling pre-emptive rejection by someone who lacks confidence in themselves as an equitable partner. From that perception, if irreconcilable, I'd suggest moving on. 3
Author JasmineJones Posted October 1, 2015 Author Posted October 1, 2015 If this guy's esteem is really so damaged, this really isn't about looks at all. He will have said what he said to any woman who shows interest in him. He doesn't deserve anyone, let alone a beautiful woman. When a man says "I don't know why you want a guy like me" or "you can do better", it really implies that there is something wrong with her for wanting him. It's a rejection of sorts and, yet, he will date her because down deep, since he thinks there is something wrong with her, he deserves her. A woman who continues in this kind of a relationship, often actually has an issue of her own. It's a co-dependent relationship essentially. She isn't sure that he's that down on himself yet though. He may be experiencing a period of situational depression, etc. Since she does like him enough, she can just continue to observe. If the bolstering is necessary all the time, she should move on. oh my God. This is frightening.
Author JasmineJones Posted October 1, 2015 Author Posted October 1, 2015 We may never know what issues he's had with his ex-wife. But, if his esteem issues were carried into adulthood, it would have been at least a contributing factor. All I am doing is picking up on a commonly used sabotaging statement by people who have very low self-esteem and pointing out common reasons for that. It cannot be stated categorically that this is case with this man, but she has a heads up about what to look for. Since there isn't enough about his history, she should be objectively observing. I think I'm going to ask him why he and his ex divorced. Is that very intrusive of me or is it fair to ask?
Author JasmineJones Posted October 1, 2015 Author Posted October 1, 2015 Talk about having a high opinion of yourself! I have a fairly realistic opinion of myself. I regard myself as a terrible driver, an average cook, a reasonably good dancer, a very loyal friend, a below average singer etc etc. 3
No_Go Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 She is good looking, but won't make me turn around so to speak...I find her lips too thin, eyebrows almost missing, too broad shoulders, not very prominent eyes, and lack of "charisma" (her man has stronger "presence" in my opinion). That's why I say average/above average (5-7?). It is all about what you're used to accept as beautiful. I think it is big time culturally conditioned too. I won't be surprised if in my eyes you look better than the above woman Really? I saw one where she didn't look her best but in the majority of photos she is gorgeous. Much more attractive than many posters here who claim themselves or who others assure them are rated much higher. She was known as gorgeous in the UK even before Dennis. People are harsher in some circumstances than others. If I shared a photo of myself and called myself a 3 or 4 where I would rate myself, people would disagree but if she's a 5 or 6, I really am more a 2.
Author JasmineJones Posted October 1, 2015 Author Posted October 1, 2015 Yeah, I thought that at first too ..... but then I read on and changed my opinion. Could she have worded that better? Yes! But in context, I think it's relevant to give us a clearer picture of the disparity in their looks. And hey, if you're a 9, you're a 9, why lie about it? Lol But again, sure she might have worded that better so as to avoid all the attacks, including mine earlier! I'm pretty sure I said in the original post that I was being brutally honest rather than diplomatic and coy (which people so often expect from women). If I'd danced around the issue it wouldn't have helped clarify the situation me and my guy are in really. He's suddenly been really confident and quite sure of himself since yesterday and that's so attractive. 1
carhill Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 I think I'm going to ask him why he and his ex divorced. Is that very intrusive of me or is it fair to ask? Heh, women my age ask that kind of stuff on the first couple dates. I got hit with it when I was dating while separated. If it's helpful to you, ask. Accept what the response is. Don't turn it into an inquisition. The work is getting to know each other. That's what dating is all about. 2
No_Go Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 Not too intrusive if it is in the right conversational context ... But keep in mind, he may not tell you the whole truth. I think I'm going to ask him why he and his ex divorced. Is that very intrusive of me or is it fair to ask? 1
Redhead14 Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 oh my God. This is frightening. Don't be frightened. Observe for yourself what's going on with him. Listen for other sabotaging statements. Like I said, he could be experiencing a bout of situational depression, a temporary thing. He may use other sabotaging statements along the way, like "I don't have anything to offer you" (since this guy isn't financially strapped, it would be that he understands he can't be there for you emotionally)" or "I'm not good enough for you". These are basically caveats. "I want to spend time with you, but you will leave me at some point, but don't say I didn't warn you". He may do "pull aways" as well. He'll come on strong for a bit, and then back off and come back again. You'll feel like the two of you are doing a little dance. Just sit back and observe how he makes you feel over time. But don't allow yourself to get too invested too soon, that's all. 1
Versacehottie Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 I would say that a relationship based on whether you are compatible looks-wise, is probably doomed to failure. No matter whether you're a 3 or a 9, or he's a 9 or a 3. If that's how you're judging compatibility, you're doing it wrong. I usually agree with you. But her guy is the one who is judging compatibility based on looks and saying he comes up short, not the other way around. She is just stating the issue he has for us so we can advise her. Your thought is right on but it doesn't apply in this particular situation to the OP. 3
Redhead14 Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 I think I'm going to ask him why he and his ex divorced. Is that very intrusive of me or is it fair to ask? No, it is way too soon for that kind of thing. Just sit back and be objective for yourself. This is simply a point of being educated so that if the kinds of things that I've mentioned start happening, you'll understand that it's time to move on instead of wondering or trying to fix it or thinking you're doing anything wrong. 1
katiegrl Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 Assigning numbers is not something I'd do offline. But on here nobody knows me or him or what we look like so I am just being brutally honest. I am an ex fashion model, now in my 30s. I don't think looking a certain way makes me a better person or a worse person. But again being brutally honest it has sometimes had an impact on my relationships, sometimes in a good way, sometimes in a bad way. On behalf of Jasmine, I wanted to re-post the above again for emphasis. And yes, being attractive can be both a positive and negative in our relationships...as clearly is the case here, unfortunately. 1
Versacehottie Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 If this guy's esteem is really so damaged, this really isn't about looks at all. He will have said what he said to any woman who shows interest in him. He doesn't deserve anyone, let alone a beautiful woman. When a man says "I don't know why you want a guy like me" or "you can do better", it really implies that there is something wrong with her for wanting him. It's a rejection of sorts and, yet, he will date her because down deep, since he thinks there is something wrong with her, he deserves her. A woman who continues in this kind of a relationship, often actually has an issue of her own. It's a co-dependent relationship essentially. Yes, guys that inherent believe that something is wrong with a girl that is beautiful liking anyone other than another model guy, actor or insanely rich guy shows their belief system and is lame. I don't agree that it's a rejection but it can be a red (or yellow) flag. Keep your eyes open about that. A year ago I wanted to introduce my girlfriend who is a model to one of my guy friends (both had recently had breakups) and she is exactly his type looks wise. I was telling my other guy friend who is very close with the guy and showed him her photo. He agreed yeah that's his type---and then proceeded to say "what's wrong with her?", meaning why would she date a "regular" guy. Seriously it was the lamest thing my friend ever said. The guy I was trying to set her up with is actually very good looking, great personality and ambitious. She is down to earth and cool in spite of looking like an untouchable beauty. The presumption that she must have personality defects in order to want to date someone who was not rich, famous or also modeling was dumb and disturbing. Some people think like that though. In the end, they each got back with their ex's so the setup never happened. Funny enough, her ex/now reunited bf is a regular guy who is good looking about exactly the same level as the guy I was wanting to set her up with. His ex/now reunited gf is a "model"--not the real ones like my friend but fringes of modeling and obviously does not make her living at it--but the point is she is also very pretty. 3
Redhead14 Posted October 1, 2015 Posted October 1, 2015 Yes, guys that inherent believe that something is wrong with a girl that is beautiful liking anyone other than another model guy, actor or insanely rich guy shows their belief system and is lame. I don't agree that it's a rejection but it can be a red (or yellow) flag. Keep your eyes open about that. A year ago I wanted to introduce my girlfriend who is a model to one of my guy friends (both had recently had breakups) and she is exactly his type looks wise. I was telling my other guy friend who is very close with the guy and showed him her photo. He agreed yeah that's his type---and then proceeded to say "what's wrong with her?", meaning why would she date a "regular" guy. Seriously it was the lamest thing my friend ever said. The guy I was trying to set her up with is actually very good looking, great personality and ambitious. She is down to earth and cool in spite of looking like an untouchable beauty. The presumption that she must have personality defects in order to want to date someone who was not rich, famous or also modeling was dumb and disturbing. Some people think like that though. In the end, they each got back with their ex's so the setup never happened. Funny enough, her ex/now reunited bf is a regular guy who is good looking about exactly the same level as the guy I was wanting to set her up with. His ex/now reunited gf is a "model"--not the real ones like my friend but fringes of modeling and obviously does not make her living at it--but the point is she is also very pretty. I don't agree that it's a rejection -- Oh, it is and she felt it and mentioned it. That is the catalyst for this thread, not the looks thing. He is criticizing/questioning her judgement. 1
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