Lil Honey Posted May 17, 2005 Posted May 17, 2005 I'm having one of those times (again) when it is not very easy (or very fun) to be a parent. I'll try to give pertinent info, yet keep this brief. My daughter is 21. She has been with a young man since she was roughly 17. He is a loser, IMHO. He cannot hold down a job. Several of the jobs that he has had haven't lasted because he would "hug" the young women that work with him. Other times he does something just as stupid. He smokes, drinks, plays video games and is on his (fill in the number) gas station job. He went to an unplanned event on Christmas and left my daughter there alone, so I arranged her brother to stay with her without it appearing that he was doing it for her. (If that makes sense.) My daughter just graduated from the university while holding down a decent office job. She has good credit and has purchased a house (in her name only - I made sure of that). She bought new livingroom furniture and within a couple months, her bf threw himself on it and broke it - before it was even paid off. (My ex fixed it for her.) She deserves so much better than what she has allowed herself. I can't make her see that. No one can. Okay . . . let's not get me started on THAT tangent. My post is about this: I was talking to my daughter about him going to school. She told me that the government won't accept a FAFSA form (a financial aid form) without the income tax info from a parent or legal guardian. (In this case, his legal guardian was his grandmother) UNLESS the person is 24 years old, married or has a child. Welp, GOOD GAWD I'd hate to see them get married or have kids. So, he can't get financial aid, even though he lives with my daughter. (I have verified this through the financial aid department of the school that I am attending.) Now, my daughter said that his G'ma "won't" give him the information. I don't know how true that is. I don't know if he tried and she refused or what. In essence, there are millions of young people in this country who don't get along with their families, yet can't improve their lives through a better education, simply because they need someone's income tax info. How "wrong" is THAT? Here comes the part where I get a good-talking to from all of you . . . Do I send a letter to his G'ma explaining that he can't move ahead without the info? Am I putting my nose where it doesn't belong? Does anyone have any suggestions? Thanks a bunch, Lil Hon
Mz. Pixie Posted May 17, 2005 Posted May 17, 2005 Eck- if you're sick of him, you can only imagine what she's gone through. I wouldn't get involved nor would I offer information from him. I know it's painful to see your daughter go through this with this loser. He's a single guy- if he wanted to go to school he could work two jobs, save up and do it.
quankanne Posted May 17, 2005 Posted May 17, 2005 my guess is that because your own child has gone through college, you've prolly had to help with the FAFSAs a time or two. Why not offer to help him/them put together the information, that way you can approach his granny with him for the information. And be sure to pump up how well he can advance with that college degree, the many resources he can tap into with right tools/info. If he's got a savvy adult, especially one who's gone through this before, that could be the key to getting granny to cooperate. Of course, this is assuming he's really interested in going to school?
laRubiaBonita Posted May 17, 2005 Posted May 17, 2005 the WORST thing is to tell her How much you hate him. I think it some inherent kid thing, to do what Irritates their parents the most. so, maybe if you offered to help, even if it a quick note to G'mom, that will only take 10 minutes to compile, she will begin to feel like you accept him better, which may = accepting that your daughter makes good decisions, which could lead to her deciding (on her own) that he is a looser!
Lil Honey Posted May 17, 2005 Posted May 17, 2005 Mz. Pixie: Yep, he's single and he COULD have two jobs . . . if only he could keep ONE for more than six months at a time. Can you imagine his schedule if he was changing TWO jobs every few months? The "poor" guy would be all perplexed! LOL Quankanne: My daughter helped him with something to do with it. I think he did one before. I don't know if that was one time that G'ma gave him the info or what, but apparently (if my understanding is correct), the next time they filled out a form, G'ma wouldn't give them the info. I'm not real sure G'ma would be too excited about me helping and handing over info that I might be privy to. (I was thinking of sending her a note suggesting to let him fill out as much as he could, give it to her, let her do the rest of the form and send a copy of her tax info and she could mail it directly, without him seeing it, IF that is her concern. Or her concern might be that he did something stupid to her and she doesn't want to deal with him anymore.) LaRubiaBonita: Both my daughter and G'ma already know that I am not happy with the situation. I have tried SO HARD to keep my mouth shut and . . . heck . . . some days I'm actually successful at it! I might use your suggestion and talk it (sending a note) over with my daughter. I have to admit, there is a LOT of doubt in my mind that he really is interested in going to school. It seems that he TELLS my daughter that he has plans of doing X, Y, and Z yet there is always some excuse. He wanted to go into the military, but "didn't pass the test". I called the recuitment office and begged them to take him anyway. ROTFLMAO It is my own personal feeling that IF he WANTED to go to school badly enough, he would find a way to do it. *sigh* I'll take any more thoughts and I really appreciate all that each of you has offered.
XNemesisX Posted May 18, 2005 Posted May 18, 2005 I am close to your daughter's age (I'm 22) so I can assure you that she will just have to see what a loser he is on her own. I wish I had listened more to my mom (I have dated a string of "losers") but it always took ME seeing it. Love is blind, I guess? My friends and family never could get it through to me. However, my most recent ex WAS a college graduate so I give him that much. The one before him was a HUGE loser and barely made it into the military even. I ended up breaking up with him, but on my own terms after *I* saw the light so to speak How old is this young man? If he has been working for at least 5 years (I believe) then he can apply for financial aid as an independent and will not need his grandmothers income tax info. Also, if he is over the age of 23 then he does not need anyone's income tax info (he can appy independently and let me tell you, independents get a LOT of financial help - he would have NO excuse for not going to school). Only if his grandmother still claims this guy as a dependent on her taxes, would she need to fill out a FAFSA form for him. If she *does* claim him as a dependent, then really she should most definitely take the time to fill out the FAFSA for him. She is getting tax cuts because of him if she claims him as her dependent! How mean can she be if she does this and is too lazy to give him her income tax info! On another note, it does sound like he may not have the drive to go to school anyway. Here your daughter is, a college graduate already, and it sounds like he hasn't even started yet? I do not see what she sees in him, and I hope for your daughter's sake that she does not stay with this guy. It sounds like if she stayed with him, she would be the one to take care of HIM and be responsible for all the bills, etc because he is too lazy and irresponsible to even hold down a job. I think that eventually she will see him for what he is - a loser. I hope she does not have children with him before she realizes this. I do want to say that you seem like a wonderful mother to even try to help him make something of himself (for your daughter's sake). You must be a really special person to be so patient and compromising.
Lil Honey Posted May 18, 2005 Posted May 18, 2005 XNemesisX: she will just have to see what a loser he is on her own The "School of Hard Knocks". *sigh* How old is this young man? If he has been working for at least 5 years (I believe) then he can apply for financial aid as an independent He is 22 years old as well. I think that he has been working (part-time) since before he graduated from high school. do want to say that you seem like a wonderful mother to even try to help him make something of himself (for your daughter's sake). You must be a really special person to be so patient and compromising. *blushing* I don't know how "wonderful" and "special" I am, but I try to be a good mom. I love both of my kids with all my heart and soul. The "patient" part is all for show. LOL Deep inside I have the need to tap my foot and check my watch (and shake some sense into her ) The "compromising" has been a long time coming. I had to decide to "let her live" her own life. It was that or lose her completely. The compromise is having to stand by and watch her live this way and wait around for the time when she's going to need some emotional support (because she will have broken up with him [yippee] or because she will be working two jobs, have three kids and he will still be sitting on the sofa playing video games . . . ) I have been thinking about emailing the responses here to her, but she will probably just tell me that I'm being "too hard" on him. *shrugging*
Stone Posted May 18, 2005 Posted May 18, 2005 Has he applied for a Student Loan? Maby he should go in the service to get his school paid for
CurlyIam Posted May 18, 2005 Posted May 18, 2005 Why are you doing all those stuff for him? For your daughter? please, STOP doing anything. Stop calling the army, don't write grandma, DON'T do a damn thing. It's his busienss, it's his LIFE. She's over 18 and she HAS to see what a loser he is for herself. If there's anyone who should do anything, it's your daughter who should go visit the granny with some flowers and a box of chocolate. Don't sent her brother anywhere and yes, let her BE ALONE, get dumped, get hurt and maybe when she'll get the message she'll move on. That's what my parents did for me and I am very VERY thankfull to them for it. You're only helping her in delaying the inevitable. Make sure the bastard doesn't secretely want to marry your daughter. We're here for you, hon. The most difficult thing in the world is to let your kids make their own mistakes. Go to her, hug her, tell het that you love her and that you'll always always be there for her and then tell her that she'll never see a dime from you until she comes to her senses. Dime, call, handkerchief... 2 cents from someone who's almost 25 and childless. Curly
blind_otter Posted May 18, 2005 Posted May 18, 2005 I would google the FAFSA info and make sure that statement is correct. I applied for the FAFSA and got a loan and didn't have to give info about my parents - they may have gone behind me and done it anyways, though.
CurlyIam Posted May 18, 2005 Posted May 18, 2005 Originally posted by Stone Has he applied for a Student Loan? Maby he should go in the service to get his school paid for No, no advice, no NOTHING! He's got nothing better to do than research and actually put some effort into doing something for himself. Don't push him into anything, job, school, student loan, because hon, he's already doing his favourite activity: NOTHING! Your daughter has to see that. Have the courage to cut the evil from its' roots. She'll hate you for a while and thank you for the rest of her life afterwards! Lil Honey, at least make a solid prenup and warn your daughter into not getting pregnant. You never know...
moimeme Posted May 18, 2005 Posted May 18, 2005 While there are losers and layabouts, this guy may not be one of them - he wants to go to college, after all. Is it possible he has a learning disorder or even AD/HD? The bad habits, inability to keep a job, and inappropriate behaviour are all pointers that might be worth checking out.
Stone Posted May 18, 2005 Posted May 18, 2005 Originally posted by CurlyIam Lil Honey, at least make a solid prenup and warn your daughter into not getting pregnant. You never know... Good point, I agree just make sure your daughter is on Birth Control
Lil Honey Posted May 18, 2005 Posted May 18, 2005 Wow, thanks "guys" ! Stone:I don't think that he has applied for a student loan and the military won't take him, because he couldn't/wouldn't/didn't pass the test. (I'm curious to know just how hard the test IS. I think there may be a sample one online somewhere, but I haven't looked for it.) Blind Otter: I called to Financial Aid where I am enrolled and I was told that the gov't wants income tax info (from guardians) for persons who are under 24, unmarried and childless. So, what I was told - in THAT regard - is correct. Moimeme: Yes, he has been diagnosed with ADHD. He takes medication for it. I don't know anymore than that. Unfortunately, I'm on the fence about the whole ADHD thing. It is NOT my intention to insult anyone and I'm sure that my ignorance is showing, but I truely think that the "label" is used too much. I feel that some folks use it as an excuse. I mean that I would not be surprised that kids are given labels and medication as a replacement for time and attention. People are different and there are different ways of learning things. However, our schools systems generally only present ONE way of teaching. Further, while I am sympathetic to a person's challenges (though it may not seem like it at this point), I am having trouble understanding how a person can have the attenion span to sit and play video games for hours on end but doesn't have the attention span to hold down a job, abide by rules, or sit in a class room. I do NOT want to be hard on my daughter's boyfriend, but he behaves like he's 12. I would LOVE for her to have someone that has SOME sense of responsibility, who has similar education goals, who can be HER support when SHE needs it. I want her to have a boyfriend who won't go into the grocery store with her and walk up to strangers and tell them that he hits her. I want her to have a boyfriend who will help around the house instead of going to a friend's house to "play vampire" (whatever the Hell THAT means). I want her to have a boyfriend that won't tell a complete stranger (the real estate lady) that he "isn't worried because he has a girlfriend with money." CurlyIam: I really don't DO anything for him. I simply called Financial Aid to be sure I wasn't being handed a line of BS. We do things for my daughter, because . . . well . . . she IS our daughter. Where we come from, family helps family. BUT, I do understand what you are saying. It's kinda an "all or nothing" situation. Go to her, hug her, tell het that you love her and that you'll always always be there for her There are so many times that she will complain about something and - believe it or not - I keep my mouth shut. Then there are other times when I say, "If you didn't like it, you wouldn't put up with it." Or I'll say, "He's YOUR boyfriend." He's got nothing better to do than research and actually put some effort into doing something for himself. I couldn't agree more. warn your daughter into not getting pregnant *shuddering just thinking about her getting PG* She is on birth control. I made sure of that when they started seeing each other when she was 17. Now that she's 21, it's up to her and none of my business. She gets the shots. I would love for her to tell me that she gets the shots AND takes a pill just to be SURE. ROTFLMAO Okay, okay, just kidding . . . um . . . about her doubling up on birth control. But I would be "unsettled" seeing her stuck with his offspring, because "stuck" is what she will be.
laRubiaBonita Posted May 18, 2005 Posted May 18, 2005 Originally posted by Lil Honey I feel that some folks use it as an excuse. I mean that I would not be surprised that kids are given labels and medication as a replacement for time and attention. People are different and there are different ways of learning things. However, our schools systems generally only present ONE way of teaching. off topic, but YES! i think the same thing!
Stone Posted May 18, 2005 Posted May 18, 2005 ADHD- I have ADHD and when on my meds I am just as productive as the next guy.
laRubiaBonita Posted May 18, 2005 Posted May 18, 2005 Originally posted by Stone ADHD- I have ADHD and when on my meds I am just as productive as the next guy. i mean the fact that most teachers teach one way, which leaves other kids,who do not learn from that specific method of teaching, in the dark and/ or feeling stupid.
CurlyIam Posted May 18, 2005 Posted May 18, 2005 I'll tell you what my parents did to help. So I was living with my bf and my parents were always always helping us, financially or not. They were fixing stuff fro us, they were ALWAYS buying stuff like staks of detergent, washing liquids, etc etc. You get the picture, practically the stuff you need to be running a house. My ex was working at a bank, earning some really nice money and buying surround systems, hard disk and other items for himself. I was a student, right? Well image we'd do EVERYTHING 50%. As faras making up for the things my parents were buying, nada. Zero. Not even gratitude. Mom never believed it untill my sister told her. And one day she stopped. I had my monthly allowance and woke up to the real life situation. I mean it was right there, in my face. IT has always been there, but I was blinded. Plus, my parents acted like buffers between the reality and myself. I didn't believe it and didn't get angry untill I felt it on my own skin. And I don't think that there's one mother on the face of this Earth that loves mem ore than my mom loves me. She did it FOR ME. I saw, I understood ... and continued to live with that sucker. But I was aware. Until one day when I was ready to leave. Tough love . It's still love, though...
New_Wife Posted May 18, 2005 Posted May 18, 2005 If there is to be a fall from grace between your daughter and this person, it must happen without your helpful arms there to catch anyone on the way down. With your warm heart and good intentions, you may be accidentally prolonging the inevitable. Like prior posters, I wish I'd listened to my mom earlier in some prior relationships - but since I didn't, I learned a lot about myself and what I can and can't live with in another person - by living with some bozos. The one thing I really admire my mom for, and you sound a bit like her, is that after I realized what the "real deal" was, she refrained from "I told you so"s and would normally recount to me something that had happened to her that was similar and what she took from it. Or have a laugh with me about kissing frogs, etc. I imagine it must've been hard for her not to say "What the hell took you so long????" I would recommend that you step back and let things play out the way they are supposed to without your input. When asked, be noncommittal & offer EMOTIONAL support to your child - but nothing else. She'll thank you later.
RecordProducer Posted May 18, 2005 Posted May 18, 2005 LilHoney, what makes you think that he wants to go to college? I think he is just using it as an excuse to marry your daughter and depend on her financially. I absolutely understand your position as a mother. I am a mother of two myself. This guy has grown up without parents and is basically a loser. Even if he gets the loan, your daughter will be the one to pay it back and he will never graduate. In her case, as she is too young, the more you try to put sense into her mind the more she rejects it. If you can influence her somehow, make her promise that she won't have a child with him at this age and while the situation is so unstable. This guy will probably never be anything but a loser. You can go see his grandmother and talk to her if you want. You might discover some interesting things. How about hiring a prostitute to sleep with him and tape it and then show it to your daughter? Or at least make some young female voice call him (as if a wrong number) and start chatting with him then send him sexy pics and ask him for a date? If he bites it, your daughter might leave him. If I were you, I would want him out of her life.
MWC_LifeBeginsAt40 Posted May 19, 2005 Posted May 19, 2005 I know you try your hardest to bite your tongue when it's so tempting to tell your daughter what a loser he is and that she deserves better. Do you stay silent or do you talk to your daughter to build up her self image? Lord knows he has probably shot it down. For example when the urge strikes to say "You deserver better.." switch the words around to get her thinking..."You are such a wonderful loving person with so much to offer ....you deserve nothing but the best..... you have brains and beauty -watch out world..." etc etc and don't bring the topic of him into the conversation, make it ALL ABOUT HER.
Lil Honey Posted May 19, 2005 Posted May 19, 2005 I'm sorry that I haven't responded sooner. I had a full afternoon of schoolwork yesterday and today (in the middle of the day), my son had a Senior "Parents' Appreciation Tea". I nearly fell over to hear that he even considered going. LOL First of all, I have a question. Is it "ill-mannered" to get a bit off topic on my own thread? I generally just let my words flow and don't pay attention to the guidelines. Anyway . . . I'm getting even MORE off-topic. LOL Thank you all for your replies. Stone: You said exactly what I have been thinking, that peoplewith ADHD can and do lead productive lives. laRubiaBonita: Yep, teachers only teacher one way and kids have to be able to learn from that style. Unfortunately, a lot of it comes down to money and how much it costs to educate each child specifically to his/her needs . . . yet we can spend millions of dollars on stadiums and sports players, etc. Okay. Sorry. Another tangent . . . CurlyIam: Tough love . It's still love, though... . . . and very difficult. New_Wife: When asked, be noncommittal & offer EMOTIONAL support to your child - but nothing else. I keep tryin'. It's hard. Sometimes I slip and open my mouth. I have a lot to learn, too. Even though she is 21, she is still my first child and I'm still learning with her. RecordProducer: How about hiring a prostitute to sleep with him and tape it and then show it to your daughter? You joke about that now . . . or WERE you? LOL But someone else told me that they would flash some money in front of him to pay him to "disappear". The only drawback that I could see to that is that my daughter would eventually find out and hate me. But the idea has crossed my mind. MWC_LifeBeginsAt40: make it ALL ABOUT HER. Excellent point. I have a couple times, but good grief, I get so frustrated that I have to watch what I say, so I make it short. *sigh* You "guys" have helped me de-stress. Thanks a bunch.
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