Dating a Narcissist??

[Smitten and Bitten]

She said I abandoned her in her time of need.

 

Of course she said that. Because she knows that...

 

<-------this is what perhaps plays on me the most…..

 

and she knows that you will make excuses for her behaviour...

 

because I know she was going through a lot.

 

and she counts on you to, sooner or later...

 

And I let my frustrations come out, in terms of yelling at her.

 

 

She said I hurt her, but again, no mention of apologizing from her about how she made me feel.

 

The "I can do no wrong" mentality.

 

I realized I shouldn't have yelled and said F-you.

 

And she will push you to the breaking point, and you'll let your frustrations out, she will count on you feeling guilty so you'll make excuses for her mental and emotional abuse of you, then she'll push you to the breaking point, and you'll let your frustrations out...Just imagine a large, psychotic wheel that will never stop turning for as long as you are involved with her.

[losangelena]

As far as I know, she wasn't diagnosed with anything but then again she wasn't really analyzed either (lack of health care).

 

I can oily go by what I saw, and what I saw was her definitely having the "high and mighty" attitude, the most I have ever seen in anyone. She would say people couldn't understand her,and then eventually said that to me. She would say things like she had a very dark side which she could control, boasted the "Scorpio" thing, and generally saw herself above everyone else, that most did not approach "her level".

 

She also had this idea that she was called to "something great in life", and I know we can all feel that, but she took it to the excessive level. Yes she was very much above average intelligence, one reason I thought she was for me. She said things like she "couldn't lie", couldn't hide her feelings".

 

I can't ever remember her apologizing for anything, she couldn't see herself as immature in some ways, kind of talked down to me at times as well, feeling "frustrated she had to explain".

 

So the question becomes….

 

Did I really leave too soon, or should I have just continued to be there all along and give her space.

 

That is what I struggle with.

 

 

 

OP, I can tell you, unequivocally, even without knowing your entire story, that no, you did not leave too soon.

 

I know someone just like her. A (kinda longish, I'm sorry) story:

 

Back when I had just turned 24 (I'm 35 now) this guy came into my life. It never blossomed into full-fledged romance, but I fell for him, hard. He was cool and enigmatic; extremely intelligent and charismatic; and not to mention handsome and sexy. At the time he'd just turned 31. Our relationship turned into a creative collaboration—he wanted to make a movie, and I wrote a screenplay for him. He told me stories of his failed attempt to get a movie off the ground in South Africa (he's from Canada, FWIW), and I was dismayed to hear how those around him had turned on him and abandoned his project.

 

Fast forward to a year later. Our movie, set in New Zealand, was in shambles. We had spent months building it—found producers, actors, locations, got financing, etc. Everything seemed to be humming along.

 

But then people started to question him. Legitimate questions, too. Instead of seeing them as legitimate though, he began to get paranoid. He accused people of not trusting him, of doubting his leadership, of having ulterior motives, of not understanding him and his intentions. He would call me (I was back in the States for a bit) and complain that things weren't "fun" anymore. He would write incredibly cruel and backhanded emails and blog posts about these "dissenters," and they would step down from the project before he had chance to jettison them.

 

Eventually, the night before I was set to go back to NZ, he pulled the plug on the project. When I got there, I stayed with him, and we decided to try and remount the project, using only his specially-approved people (re: those who didn't stand up to him). After a couple of days, he began accusing me of not being fully on board, and getting paranoid when I wanted to make plans to hang out with one of these "questionable people" who I'd become friends with. To him, my loyalty was in question.

 

To speed up a very long story, he kicked me out of his apartment after I disagreed with him in front of some of the actors. He berated me for not providing a "united front" and that we needed to be a team. I left, spent a few days with friends, and caught up with all those people who had been deemed unloyal to the cause. i started to see a pattern, that all of these perfectly nice, well-intentioned people had become the victims of this guy's paranoia. On my last day in Auckland, before going to the airport, he and I met up, and he proceeded to tell me that he was a victim, and that he refused to take any responsibility for what happened.

 

In short, he ticks all the things I bolded above.

He thinks very highly of himself, and less of those who are not deemed "on his level"

He often boasted of his "dark side"

He's extremely intelligent; scarily so. To the point where arguing with his is daunting because he will run circles around you

He definitely thinks he's called to "something great," specifically he wants to make a movie, and goes to the most far-flung places in the world to try and do just that.

 

He's also grandiose, paranoid and manipulative. But it's so hard to see at first, because he's charming and outgoing and good-looking and friendly.

 

But the point of me telling you this is: that in my 11 years of knowing him, he HASN'T CHANGED.

 

I refused to work with him again after the NZ project, because I understood that HE was the common denominator in all his failed projects. He blames everyone else, yet he is the underminer. And until he was ready to face that fact, he was never going to change. And he still hasn't.

 

We're still somewhat connected through social media, and yes, over a decade later, he's still up to his shenanigans. Every couple of years, a new project crops up—he's gone to China, he's gone to Germany, most recently it was in Vancouver. There's be a script, and photos of some actors, but there's never any actual MOVIE. Because once he has to involve other people, things start to break down. Because he is grandiose and paranoid. Because he doesn't accept blame or responsibility. Because he doesn't realize that he's the problem.

 

It's sad, really. Sad when someone's 31; downright dismal when they're 42.

 

Anyway. I'm sorry for the novel, but this is just a very longwinded way to say waiting for this woman to change is a waste of your time. Maybe you're not ready to accept that, and you're going to keep trying. I'm so glad I had my moment of realization when I did, and that I only spent two years unhealthily attached to this person, and not a decade.

 

I felt EVERYTHING you're feeling. He needs me; with my help he'll be better; I need to give him more time. Nope. And you don't either.

 

It's so, so hard. But you HAVE to let this woman go.

[Guyouthere]

OP, I can tell you, unequivocally, even without knowing your entire story, that no, you did not leave too soon.

 

I know someone just like her. A (kinda longish, I'm sorry) story:

 

Back when I had just turned 24 (I'm 35 now) this guy came into my life. It never blossomed into full-fledged romance, but I fell for him, hard. He was cool and enigmatic; extremely intelligent and charismatic; and not to mention handsome and sexy. At the time he'd just turned 31. Our relationship turned into a creative collaboration—he wanted to make a movie, and I wrote a screenplay for him. He told me stories of his failed attempt to get a movie off the ground in South Africa (he's from Canada, FWIW), and I was dismayed to hear how those around him had turned on him and abandoned his project.

 

Fast forward to a year later. Our movie, set in New Zealand, was in shambles. We had spent months building it—found producers, actors, locations, got financing, etc. Everything seemed to be humming along.

 

But then people started to question him. Legitimate questions, too. Instead of seeing them as legitimate though, he began to get paranoid. He accused people of not trusting him, of doubting his leadership, of having ulterior motives, of not understanding him and his intentions. He would call me (I was back in the States for a bit) and complain that things weren't "fun" anymore. He would write incredibly cruel and backhanded emails and blog posts about these "dissenters," and they would step down from the project before he had chance to jettison them.

 

Eventually, the night before I was set to go back to NZ, he pulled the plug on the project. When I got there, I stayed with him, and we decided to try and remount the project, using only his specially-approved people (re: those who didn't stand up to him). After a couple of days, he began accusing me of not being fully on board, and getting paranoid when I wanted to make plans to hang out with one of these "questionable people" who I'd become friends with. To him, my loyalty was in question.

 

To speed up a very long story, he kicked me out of his apartment after I disagreed with him in front of some of the actors. He berated me for not providing a "united front" and that we needed to be a team. I left, spent a few days with friends, and caught up with all those people who had been deemed unloyal to the cause. i started to see a pattern, that all of these perfectly nice, well-intentioned people had become the victims of this guy's paranoia. On my last day in Auckland, before going to the airport, he and I met up, and he proceeded to tell me that he was a victim, and that he refused to take any responsibility for what happened.

 

In short, he ticks all the things I bolded above.

He thinks very highly of himself, and less of those who are not deemed "on his level"

He often boasted of his "dark side"

He's extremely intelligent; scarily so. To the point where arguing with his is daunting because he will run circles around you

He definitely thinks he's called to "something great," specifically he wants to make a movie, and goes to the most far-flung places in the world to try and do just that.

 

He's also grandiose, paranoid and manipulative. But it's so hard to see at first, because he's charming and outgoing and good-looking and friendly.

 

But the point of me telling you this is: that in my 11 years of knowing him, he HASN'T CHANGED.

 

I refused to work with him again after the NZ project, because I understood that HE was the common denominator in all his failed projects. He blames everyone else, yet he is the underminer. And until he was ready to face that fact, he was never going to change. And he still hasn't.

 

We're still somewhat connected through social media, and yes, over a decade later, he's still up to his shenanigans. Every couple of years, a new project crops up—he's gone to China, he's gone to Germany, most recently it was in Vancouver. There's be a script, and photos of some actors, but there's never any actual MOVIE. Because once he has to involve other people, things start to break down. Because he is grandiose and paranoid. Because he doesn't accept blame or responsibility. Because he doesn't realize that he's the problem.

 

It's sad, really. Sad when someone's 31; downright dismal when they're 42.

 

Anyway. I'm sorry for the novel, but this is just a very longwinded way to say waiting for this woman to change is a waste of your time. Maybe you're not ready to accept that, and you're going to keep trying. I'm so glad I had my moment of realization when I did, and that I only spent two years unhealthily attached to this person, and not a decade.

 

I felt EVERYTHING you're feeling. He needs me; with my help he'll be better; I need to give him more time. Nope. And you don't either.

 

It's so, so hard. But you HAVE to let this woman go.

 

Thank you, I learned a lot from reading what you wrote, and let me offer you a big hug…. I'm sorry you went through that all. I believe after 24 years despite her having a new life now, everything we take for granted, she will remain with her basic personality, as it is now formed.

 

Questioned the loyalty….

 

That was EXACTLY one of the things she cited as wanting to break us off, that I "questioned her love" for me.

 

And why wouldn't I? I had actually given her a ring, we were engaged,she refused to wear it because she didn't want "slack" from others about it, that she had a guy who loved her. Yet I started to see things and look back that made me question it, like her ways of avoiding other guys, always saying that "they aren't my type", rather than "I want to be with you only". She just never got to that point. I began questioning my own feelings about it all and her.

[Guyouthere]

There are so many theories about what causes a predisposition for this type of flawed thinking - IMO like most psychological disorders it is a defense mechanism gone wrong - stuck in an endless feedback loop.

 

I believe one of the most common causes is impoverished self-esteem, occurring at a young age. The loss of a strong father figure in their lives, or one who is emotionally absent. These fathers are usually condescending, critical, and do not empower their children at a young age.

 

Subsequently, as they grow older these children overcompensate for their lack of self-esteem, carrying with them some traits from their fathers such as the emotional distancing, while inflating their false sense of self worth. Sadly, individuals with narcissistic personality disorder really never find their true selves. In therapy, it is extremely difficult because these individuals are grossly defensive - which is why they rarely repond to outpatient intervention. Everything they do they can rationalize and blame someone else.

 

<-----I found the above on another post on LS.

 

It rings a bell too because I know her dad abused her, sad, but reality. I can see how this all works now.

 

The fact she specifically told me that she "puts up a wall" when hurt too. Evidently I now have a large fort in front of me. Her lack of ability to forgive I believe fuels her own ideas.

[losangelena]

There are so many theories about what causes a predisposition for this type of flawed thinking - IMO like most psychological disorders it is a defense mechanism gone wrong - stuck in an endless feedback loop.

 

I believe one of the most common causes is impoverished self-esteem, occurring at a young age. The loss of a strong father figure in their lives, or one who is emotionally absent. These fathers are usually condescending, critical, and do not empower their children at a young age.

 

Subsequently, as they grow older these children overcompensate for their lack of self-esteem, carrying with them some traits from their fathers such as the emotional distancing, while inflating their false sense of self worth. Sadly, individuals with narcissistic personality disorder really never find their true selves. In therapy, it is extremely difficult because these individuals are grossly defensive - which is why they rarely repond to outpatient intervention. Everything they do they can rationalize and blame someone else.

 

<-----I found the above on another post on LS.

 

It rings a bell too because I know her dad abused her, sad, but reality. I can see how this all works now.

 

The fact she specifically told me that she "puts up a wall" when hurt too. Evidently I now have a large fort in front of me. Her lack of ability to forgive I believe fuels her own ideas.

 

OK, that's great and everything, and we could talk about her psychological issues all day.

 

But the real question is, why are YOU not able/willing to let go?

 

In every bad relationship, there are two people.

 

Yes, with the man I described above, he was grandiose and paranoid and probably does suffer from NPD, and did have a rough family life growing up, but we stayed unhealthily attached for two years because as his codependent partner, I refused to let go. I didn't even let go after the NZ debacle. It took almost another full year before I detached myself.

 

So yes, we can hypothesize all the live long day why this woman has ended up where she is, but the real issue here is whether or not you're willing to completely let go (and I'd say, posting at length about her here is a sign that you have yet to let go). If she won't change—and we've pretty much established that she won't—then YOU are going to have to change.

 

You may not be READY to—I spent many months knowing that our relationship was toxic, but still didn't move on—but eventually you're going to have to accept your roll in half of this. I have a feeling that time is still on the horizon, but hopefully you'll get there.

[Guyouthere]

Its the intensity of it all. Strong emotions, everything from the experience of a hostage rescue, to me making a trip to the UK to be with her, us talking constantly, day and night.

 

We almost got married too, in fact gave her a ring. I cared enough about her to support her with some money too, which I didn't even have.

 

I think if she sends it all back, as she says she will, I will be able to forget it all faster.

 

I was telling mom I found some info in my notes that now shows she very likely kept me deceived at least for a week prior to her own schedule of events.

 

Knowing that does help me realize I wasn't out of line when I came out and "betrayed her trust", because in reality, I subconsciously sensed something was not right, and took "action", by saying that.

 

I was married for 15 years to an excessive cheater and liar, and this girl knew it, knows I'm Intelligent, and she truly was an expert and manipulating me in ways.

 

I do wrestle with the fact there was something on her end that was real, mixed into it all.

 

I'm just torn right now.

[Smitten and Bitten]

Its the intensity of it all. Strong emotions, everything from the experience of a hostage rescue, to me making a trip to the UK to be with her, us talking constantly, day and night.

 

We almost got married too, in fact gave her a ring. I cared enough about her to support her with some money too, which I didn't even have.

 

I think if she sends it all back, as she says she will, I will be able to forget it all faster.

 

You can't depend upon her to do anything, and you shouldn't deal with the situation based upon what she does or doesn't do. If she thinks keeping those things gives her any sort of control over you she's going to keep them. If she thinks she has something to gain by returning them, she'll return them.

 

I was telling mom I found some info in my notes that now shows she very likely kept me deceived at least for a week prior to her own schedule of events.

 

Knowing that does help me realize I wasn't out of line when I came out and "betrayed her trust", because in reality, I subconsciously sensed something was not right, and took "action", by saying that.

 

I was married for 15 years to an excessive cheater and liar, and this girl knew it, knows I'm Intelligent, and she truly was an expert and manipulating me in ways.

 

I do wrestle with the fact there was something on her end that was real, mixed into it all.

 

I'm just torn right now.

 

If you marry her, you'll be shredded, mangled and emptied. Then she'll be able to share the attention-getting narrative of how she has to endure being married to a broken man. If you're having trouble thinking of yourself in this horrible situation, think about the lives the kids you hopefully will never have with her would experience.

[Guyouthere]

She claims "its definitely over".

 

There was an argument like this a while back, not as "serious", but back then, she was quick to jump at the "Ill pay you back, thank you for all, etc.". We made up after that one, which in reality was a misunderstanding, she thought I had accused her of wanting sex with a guy, which I didn't.

 

This one was/is different.

 

This time she claimed/is claiming to break up with me, but at the "start" of this round, she said "I'l l never forget what you did for me",

 

BUT, this time, she didn't make mention of sending anything back, UNTIL now, after our last argument, where she says "I hurt her bad" with words.

 

So I don't know what she will do.

 

I do know she doesn't have the ability to pay me back now, BUT, sending the ring wouldn't be much money, AND, even though she doesn't have the actual money to send, she does have her own jelwery which she said she would sell to "send me something".

 

So far, nothing.

 

So maybe she is playing me along, thinking in her mind,,, if I

still have his ring and things, perhaps he will still be around for me, as much as she has now proclaimed me free of that.

 

So yes, Im already kind of seeing it as a form of control.

 

Right now she is occupied with the new guy, the one she hid from me of course.

 

Maybe she is just pissed and won't send anything? Then if she doesn't, it would show that she was never honest to begin with concerning this matter either.

 

Unfortunately I have to keep the channel open to some degree just to wait for the "payback".

 

Im sure she knows this, but does she care… I dunno.

 

I just want it back. Tired of games.

[Smitten and Bitten]

She claims "its definitely over".

 

There was an argument like this a while back, not as "serious", but back then, she was quick to jump at the "Ill pay you back, thank you for all, etc.". We made up after that one, which in reality was a misunderstanding, she thought I had accused her of wanting sex with a guy, which I didn't.

 

This one was/is different.

 

This time she claimed/is claiming to break up with me, but at the "start" of this round, she said "I'l l never forget what you did for me",

 

BUT, this time, she didn't make mention of sending anything back, UNTIL now, after our last argument, where she says "I hurt her bad" with words.

 

So I don't know what she will do.

 

Try not to waste any more mental and emotional energy trying to guess what she may or may not do, or why she does or does not do anything.

 

I do know she doesn't have the ability to pay me back now, BUT, sending the ring wouldn't be much money, AND, even though she doesn't have the actual money to send, she does have her own jelwery which she said she would sell to "send me something".

 

So far, nothing.

 

When and if you receive anything from her, you can bet there will be strings, nay, insidiously sticky barbed-wire spiderwebs, attached.

 

So maybe she is playing me along, thinking in her mind,,, if I

still have his ring and things, perhaps he will still be around for me, as much as she has now proclaimed me free of that.

 

So yes, Im already kind of seeing it as a form of control.

 

Right now she is occupied with the new guy, the one she hid from me of course.

 

Then this is your chance. While she's preoccupied with the new guy, cut all contact and grieve your loss. She might even be using him just to get to you, so be prepared for that possibility.

 

Maybe she is just pissed and won't send anything? Then if she doesn't, it would show that she was never honest to begin with concerning this matter either.

 

Trying to guess her motivations is going down the rabbit hole--don't go there. It's self-destructive. There's only one thing you need to remember: Her decisions will be based on what she thinks she can get out of them. There is no "why" to figure out.

 

Unfortunately I have to keep the channel open to some degree just to wait for the "payback".

 

No, you don't have to do that. She wants you to "have" to do that. She's counting on it.

 

Im sure she knows this, but does she care… I dunno.

 

I'm sure she cares a lot about what she can get out of it.

 

I just want it back. Tired of games.

 

Few things are as tiring as dealing with her type of behavior, and no amount of money is worth having to deal with it.

[Guyouthere]

Going over her last message or two in my head…. its helping me realize what I was dealing with,….

 

Her last message was basically all about her. The fact she claims we were broken up before she "talked" with the guy.

(This justifying her not doing wrong, as she specifically said… "I did no wrong because,.,,).

 

The rest of it all was her plans, what she wants in life, what she is now doing, etc.

 

Also thrown in was how I "never understood her" after all.

 

Then the "I'll send you the money and things, would rather starve than keep it".

 

I do feel guilty for saying "**** you" earlier in the night, perhaps that was too harsh?

 

I think she got pissed that I attacked her large ego. I remember her telling me before that her last boyfriend, the abuser, had also told her the same thing.

 

No apologies on her part, in her eyes I did all wrong,hurt her with my words, messed up, and really all I did to save and also give her a new life was/is worth little nothing.

 

She has no ability to forgive, as much as she claims to be "above others in a lot of ways".

 

Why can't I simply enjoy a normal woman in my life? Why the hell do I get this? Are there any left? It is discouraging. The one I accidently ran into before this one was after money and material things, felt I needed to take her to buy a lawn chair.

 

That one had plenty of money of her own, yet felt she needed it from me as well.

 

Overall Im discouraged, just feel I am meant to be alone with all of these events I have experienced. It is sad.

Edited September 22, 2015 by Guyouthere

[Guyouthere]

A super good read here,,, this one really explains a lot….

 

 

Narcissistic Personality Traits Discussed

[Smitten and Bitten]

Going over her last message or two in my head…. its helping me realize what I was dealing with,….

 

Her last message was basically all about her. The fact she claims we were broken up before she "talked" with the guy.

(This justifying her not doing wrong, as she specifically said… "I did no wrong because,.,,).

 

The rest of it all was her plans, what she wants in life, what she is now doing, etc.

 

Also thrown in was how I "never understood her" after all.

 

Then the "I'll send you the money and things, would rather starve than keep it".

 

It's encouraging that you're not reading it to try to understand her behavior, but, as you said, "to realize what you're dealing with". Just watch that you don't slip back into analyzing her behavior.

 

I do feel guilty for saying "**** you" earlier in the night, perhaps that was too harsh?

 

It's not a question of being "too harsh"; You reacted as any normal person would under the same provocation. The guilt will pass.

 

I think she got pissed that I attacked her large ego. I remember her telling me before that her last boyfriend, the abuser, had also told her the same thing.

 

No apologies on her part, in her eyes I did all wrong,hurt her with my words, messed up, and really all I did to save and also give her a new life was/is worth little nothing.

 

Careful! Don't slip back into trying to analyze her behavior!

 

She has no ability to forgive,

 

Yup.

 

as much as she claims to be "above others in a lot of ways".

 

What she claims is irrelevant.

 

Why can't I simply enjoy a normal woman in my life? Why the hell do I get this? Are there any left?

 

It is discouraging. The one I accidently ran into before this one was after money and material things, felt I needed to take her to buy a lawn chair.

 

That one had plenty of money of her own, yet felt she needed it from me as well.

 

Overall Im discouraged, just feel I am meant to be alone with all of these events I have experienced. It is sad.

 

You're still in the thick of it. It's a terrible place to be. You're asking the same questions that, I'm betting, anyone who's endured that kind of relationship asks themselves. I did, over and over and over.

 

When my marriage fell apart I was lucky enough to have a friend who listened to me talk. For hours and hours and hours over several months he listened to me talk. I also kept a diary; As time went on and my thinking cleared, reading it helped me realize once and for all that there was nothing about the marriage that was worth saving.

[NewLeaf512]

Hi Guy, I missed your earlier post where you described her behavior. I don't think you've misapplied the term "narcissist" at all; I was married to one for 15 years and what you described sounds textbook. Here's my advice: Run. Run fast and run far. Run as if the very Hounds of Hell are pursuing you. Then run some more. Then, once you're far enough away to see her for what she is, thank whatever Gods you believe in that you didn't marry her.

 

 

I agree 100%. They steal your soul, you become an extension of them and can completely lose yourself in the process never to be found again. It's nearly impossible to treat a narcissist.

[Guyouthere]

I was just reading some online resources about this topic….. reminded me of how she was always so "high and mighty", and even spoke about others as "humans".

 

You know what I sensed….

 

That as much as she said she was committed to us, she wasn't. And when I tried to get her to explain, it was "I am controlling and pushy".

 

So yes she wanted an us, UNTIL that same feeling came up… of yes, I just don't feel something is right.

 

So I came out with the "I want to date others" to test her, which I did. Yes that was the reason, but also because for me, I needed to see that there was something truly genuine there.

 

The way I see and feel it, she would not have become so mad and such if she had legitimate feelings.

 

After all, it isn't wrong for me to want to feel her commitment, if there as one.

 

I just felt that perhaps too that she was just with me UNTIL someone else came along that was more suited for her (in her eyes).

 

And sure enough, the guy she found looks exactly like the ex she is not over.

 

Yes, it was and is right for me to feel tense about it all.

[Smitten and Bitten]

I agree 100%. They steal your soul, you become an extension of them and can completely lose yourself in the process never to be found again. It's nearly impossible to treat a narcissist.

 

You're only lost if you don't leave.

[casey.lives]

Don't use such strong "medical" labels, it make it sound permissible.

[Guyouthere]

Don't use such strong "medical" labels, it make it sound permissible.

 

elaborate please,,,,

[Siquijor]

It's nearly impossible to treat a narcissist.

 

 

Yup. There's more chance of turning a lion into a vegan than getting a narcissist to change.

[Toodaloo]

Would you? No

can you? Yes

does it work? No

Can she change? No

Should I bother? No

All women tend to exhibit traits of it…. but when it too much "too much"? Eh?

 

See above in bold.

 

I don't think this is a "female" problem.

 

I think its across the sexes.

 

Why are you bothering to even dissect all of this? Just walk away. It is THAT simple.

[Toodaloo]

elaborate please,,,,

 

Casey is pointing out that you are treating this like something that can be treated like a broken leg.

 

The behaviour you are describing is NOT typical to women or men its typical to people who are anti social and not pleasant to be around.

 

Instead of trying to make it acceptable how about accepting that there are people in this world that are just not very nice people and your responsibility is not to "save" them but to look after yourself and teach them that they are not going to get very far in life behaving that way by simply not accepting their poor behavior and WALKING AWAY.

 

It really is that simple. Its not complicated at all.

[salparadise]

I think this narcissism/codependent dynamic all boils down to self-acceptance and belief in your own worthiness. You have to learn to view the N's non-reciprocal self-absorbsion as uninteresting... quit feeding them ribeye and hoping they will share breadcrumbs in appreciation. Being content with breadcrumbs, or incensed when they even renege on that is the codependent way. A healthy person will pass on a bad deal the same way you cull a bad apple from a box of good ones... you don't spend much energy contemplating the bad one... you just focus on picking a good one.

[Fuerza]

I've had a relationship with a man that has NPD for almost 5 years. If you think she has it: run for the hills. They will NEVER be happy and there will always be something to blame you for. My ex had small signs the first year we were together, complain that I had to wear dresses, I was the one that had to do arrange everything from him, he always said that he wanted to go into politics and be the new Che Guevara. Heck he even used my disease by saying he wanted to replace a politician who's wife had the same disease as mine. Obviously he never got into politics. And oh, when he got his master's he couldn't stop saying how he finally was in the 1% of people that has a master's degree.

 

This year the signs got worse and worse for some reason, when applying for jobs I was the one that had to look for jobs for him because he "didn't have any time to search for a job". When he got declined for the job he would get mad, blame immigrants for taking jobs and discriminating white people and how he was such a good candidate for all these jobs. I couldn't believe how he acted, sure it's normal to be bummed if you get declined but the way he reacted and got mad was just not normal. There was always something that I had to change, how I was in bed, my "agression", my clothing etc. Every little feedback/criticism I gave him, he would get super mad for literally no reason instead of saying "I'll do better next time". He also had zero capacity of being emphatic, he once gave me a bracelet that he actually bought for his ex. It was lying around in his drawers and he told me I could have it. Couldn't believe it when he said that. I could write a book about everything, because there is too much to mention about him urgh.

 

You're seeing the signs NOW, so RUN. I saw the signs but never thought it could be something like NPD and unfortunately wasted 5 years of my time with him.

 

Even now that I've broken up with him he still asks me why I broke up with him. I've given him the list of reasons tons of times and he STILL does not get it. They never will!

[Guyouthere]

In my case, I believe it is the fact I was there for her through it all, we are talking about a major life change, saving her life, giving her a new life in a new place, new opportunity. I invested a a lot in this, her, us, emotionally and financially. It was intense, and even last night once again had nightmares of it all, the "am I really right in what I did?".

 

Part of me says yes, part of me says we made it that far,,,,, I dunno.

 

I am torn still. The fact I yelled at her too bothers me, because I know it is wrong.

 

On the other hand, I can look back and see that she cared little about my end of things…. but I do also know that excessive stress can also cause people to be "weird". She would tell me she "couldn't be herself" right now because of all of the stress.

 

Im not looking to make excuses for her,,, just stating reality as it happened.

 

She has goals, I don't see anything wrong with that, she is now being exposed to a new life and she is grasping opportunity… but to what expense?

 

She always said she didn't get along with normal people her age, always got along better with those who are older.

 

She is 24.

 

I just cared a lot…. maybe too much.,.. I'm just that way. I didn't seek to heal her, just be a companion and have her as mine.

 

If she can't really change, there is no loss for me.

 

If she does, than I did lose something really good.

 

I think the only way to know this all is to have time pass. Right now she is still holding on to my things…. interesting too because I know her exboyfriend kept hers.

Edited September 23, 2015 by Guyouthere

[Guyouthere]

I've had a relationship with a man that has NPD for almost 5 years. If you think she has it: run for the hills. They will NEVER be happy and there will always be something to blame you for. My ex had small signs the first year we were together, complain that I had to wear dresses, I was the one that had to do arrange everything from him, he always said that he wanted to go into politics and be the new Che Guevara. Heck he even used my disease by saying he wanted to replace a politician who's wife had the same disease as mine. Obviously he never got into politics. And oh, when he got his master's he couldn't stop saying how he finally was in the 1% of people that has a master's degree.

 

This year the signs got worse and worse for some reason, when applying for jobs I was the one that had to look for jobs for him because he "didn't have any time to search for a job". When he got declined for the job he would get mad, blame immigrants for taking jobs and discriminating white people and how he was such a good candidate for all these jobs. I couldn't believe how he acted, sure it's normal to be bummed if you get declined but the way he reacted and got mad was just not normal. There was always something that I had to change, how I was in bed, my "agression", my clothing etc. Every little feedback/criticism I gave him, he would get super mad for literally no reason instead of saying "I'll do better next time". He also had zero capacity of being emphatic, he once gave me a bracelet that he actually bought for his ex. It was lying around in his drawers and he told me I could have it. Couldn't believe it when he said that. I could write a book about everything, because there is too much to mention about him urgh.

 

You're seeing the signs NOW, so RUN. I saw the signs but never thought it could be something like NPD and unfortunately wasted 5 years of my time with him.

 

Even now that I've broken up with him he still asks me why I broke up with him. I've given him the list of reasons tons of times and he STILL does not get it. They never will!

 

Mine never apologized for anything.

Said no one understood her.

Was a loner.

High functional level, intelligent and ambitious.

Said she "went into high work gear" when she felt "unpleasant"

Sometimes spoke to me as I was a child (when I made a mistake).

Couldn't take criticism if I gave her any.

Came across as cold at times.

Said too that she wanted to work with bipolar people/those abused because of her ex and exposure to it (evidently her dad and ex had it).

Mom and sisters were loving, she raised her sisters.

Made a comment last argument we had that "now I would spread lies", in reality she knows no one here.

Overall didn't do anything for me.

Saw commitment as codependency and not true love.

Said I didn't know what true love is.

I caught her hiding a guy, innocent or not, she once again tried to justify that we were broken up for a week prior (in reality this was not final).

Said she wasn't attracted to me physically (I took that only because I knew she was still not over her ex). No, I wouldn't accept that forever. She said "potential was there". I do know I could have done better, but I didn't feel love from her to "really get into it".

Prided herself as not being able to lie or hide her feelings.

Seemed paranoid at times, always said guys were looking at her, and the girl friends she went out with were jealous of her.

Said she was a healer.

Said she was "called to something special and had special gifts".

She did realize she has issues.

Evidently is either a liar and doesnt want to return the ring I gave her, or is waiting until she sorts herself out to see if she "still wants an us".

She has the all around belief/attitude "I am above everyones level", saying she "already passed lower levels of thinking".

She said she "has a high standard for guys".

 

Only thing I can see I did wrong here was be emotional and act immaturely a few times when dealing with all of this, but perhaps you can see why I was driven nuts…..

So maybe me acting as I did was more of a "reaction" than who I am.

Edited September 23, 2015 by Guyouthere

[losangelena]

Mine never apologized for anything.

Said no one understood her.

Was a loner.

High functional level, intelligent and ambitious.

Said she "went into high work gear" when she felt "unpleasant"

Sometimes spoke to me as I was a child (when I made a mistake).

Couldn't take criticism if I gave her any.

Came across as cold at times.

Said too that she wanted to work with bipolar people/those abused because of her ex and exposure to it (evidently her dad and ex had it).

Mom and sisters were loving, she raised her sisters.

Made a comment last argument we had that "now I would spread lies", in reality she knows no one here.

Overall didn't do anything for me.

Saw commitment as codependency and not true love.

Said I didn't know what true love is.

I caught her hiding a guy, innocent or not, she once again tried to justify that we were broken up for a week prior (in reality this was not final).

Said she wasn't attracted to me physically (I took that only because I knew she was still not over her ex). No, I wouldn't accept that forever. She said "potential was there". I do know I could have done better, but I didn't feel love from her to "really get into it".

Prided herself as not being able to lie or hide her feelings.

Seemed paranoid at times, always said guys were looking at her, and the girl friends she went out with were jealous of her.

Said she was a healer.

Said she was "called to something special and had special gifts".

She did realize she has issues.

Evidently is either a liar and doesnt want to return the ring I gave her, or is waiting until she sorts herself out to see if she "still wants an us".

She has the all around belief/attitude "I am above everyones level", saying she "already passed lower levels of thinking".

She said she "has a high standard for guys".

 

Only thing I can see I did wrong here was be emotional and act immaturely a few times when dealing with all of this, but perhaps you can see why I was driven nuts…..

So maybe me acting as I did was more of a "reaction" than who I am.

 

 

Why do you want to be with her again?

 

Let me reiterate, from my story:

 

But the point of me telling you this is: that in my 11 years of knowing him, he HASN'T CHANGED.

 

 

People like this DON'T CHANGE. If I had been aware of web forums like this when I was going through my bad relationship, I would have probably been making posts like yours. But I didn't and I only had my friends to pester about it and eventually they grew tired of it.

 

The only one you're trying to convince yourself here. None of us see anything here for you other than to take what you've learned from this and move on. You're exhausting yourself and wasting time by analyzing and re-analyzing what's happened and what she's done. You cannot get water from a stone, or closure about this situation.