Do most OWs have the expectation that one day they will be Mrs MM?

[Mount]

Or, let us say in another way again, although it had been repeated again and again, OW should be focus what MM does, not what MM says, not what MM texts, not what MM emails...etc.

 

Is that simple enough. But again I still see so many OWs post here with very descriptive paragraph about what their MMs said, texted... . For my perspective, words without following immediate result to back-up, it just means nothing, zilch.

 

of course - i didn't mean to generalize at all. just kind of an interesting pattern i see around me.

 

many different marriages & many different affairs are out there... i guess i wanted to say that MMs can change their view on M & A as the time goes on and can indeed leave, no matter what they say in the beginning. things and feelings change, just like in every relationship.

[lemondrop21]

I only ever believed there was a 10% chance or so that I would be Mrs. MM someday. Even in the full affair fog, I was still able to read up a lot on infidelity and to conclude that this was a typical affair that more than likely would not go anywhere.

 

Did I end up wanting to be Mrs. MM? Part of me did, but part of me was terrified at the thought. He has three kids (I have none) and this would be challenging for me. I also think he's too much of a "people person" for my comfort and I would never be able to trust him because of how we started as an affair.

[dubliner]

Make sense. Or let us put it in another way, using analogy, a grand result is not built from no-where, it is being built upon layers of small foundation, in this case, it is MM's EACH promise turning to true result everytime.

 

I never understood how OWs here can expect MMs will give them or turn empty words into a solid grand result - a.k.a leaving wife/marriage for them (OWs), despite in their relationship with MMs, MM hardly keeps small promise each time.

 

I think OW needs to reflect that, whether MM follows his promise, including small things and big things, whether they are being executed each time. That is clear reality check rather than jumping onto the topic "why MM cannot leave wife....etc".

 

Yep, this was CM, he let me down on the small things. Let me down again and again and I made excuses for him when I didn't believe his.

 

Foolishly I did think that one day we would be together, not that he ever promised this, he implied it, said things we were doing in business were for 'our' future and constantly said he was working on bringing an end to his relationship in the 'least damaging' way possible. Asked me to wait for him.

But his actions and words didn't match up, he wasn't driving, he's a conflict avoidant passenger.

[Got it]

of course - i didn't mean to generalize at all. just kind of an interesting pattern i see around me.

 

many different marriages & many different affairs are out there... i guess i wanted to say that MMs can change their view on M & A as the time goes on and can indeed leave, no matter what they say in the beginning. things and feelings change, just like in every relationship.

 

Yes but I also would caution others not to expect it to change. One needs to stay in the present and see it for what it is at that time. I think, like you and others have indicated, there are steps everyday that can be shown that the person follows through with what they have to say.

 

But, for anyone married, to make the jump to divorce, regardless of everything up to that point is a leap off a cliff that even the bravest will waffle and many will stay put. You can't prep for it, you can't steel yourself for the emotions, and you can't know how you will handle things until you are in it.

 

I say this as someone who went through a very easy, amicable, no kids, limited financial entanglements, divorce. It is still hard.

 

So yes, ignore the words, watch the actions, and go from there.

[minimariah]

^^ great post, Got it! i agree with everything.

[Grapesofwrath]

I did not entertain that fantasy. In the beginning, my xMM told me he was not interested in finding a way out of his marriage and that he was happy at home. I participated in the A because I thought it would be fun and easy, it felt good to be adored, sexually we were very in synch, and the situation would not require me to be truly intimate and committed. I was, and perhaps still am, wrestling with intimacy issues stemming my past. I figured this relationship would not force me to deal with that aspect of myself. That proved to be partly true, though I did learn a lot about myself from the experience.

 

Overtime, I learned that I just could not get comfortable with the deception, sneaking, and duplicity. I lost respect for the xMM because he did not share my discomfort with those things. Seeing the way he has lied to and betrayed his wife over the years of their marriage, without feeling a twinge of remorse, quickly taught me that I would not want to be married to him. Honestly, I don't know how I would ever learn to trust him.

[norudder]

Not an expectation but eventually there was a hoping. We both started out saying this is just for fun filling gaps etc and of course it grew into more with all the time and emotions invested. I didn't plan to divorce at the start but did after doing hard evaluation of myself & marriage. He didn't/isn't planning to divorce even though its what he now "wants" its not what he wants badly enough to make reality. He may end up divorced anyway since his wife always reminds him shes gone when youngest is 18.Their M will likely wither away as someone else said their path would've been w/o a dday. But he won't initiate, can't be the bad guy, another cowardly conflict avoidant passenger. And he was also so comfortable with the deceit and duplicity that even if he were now single I don't know if I could get past getting another chance 1.by "default" through his inaction to pursue me and 2.a. his tolerance for compartmentalizing for his selfish desires. 2.b.his flirty nature which drew me in would also probably mean a lot of me second guessing who he's really "just friends" with. To him cheating is only cheating when its physical and his view on monogamy is "love the one you're with". Its weird how all his opinions come from song lyrics. Little originality. Convenient. Guess it depends who he's with that day?. His ethics are situational. That said I do wonder if he would be different after a divorce. I am. As got it said, it is hell. I cant imagine not doing some introspection and changes. But I guess not everyone learns their lessons. Maybe that's another thread for this or another board.

[still_an_Angel]

Not for me, our relationship works now partly helped along by the fact that we do not live together, we have separate lives and both have no plans of being "together" like being married together. I am very independent and he is so used to looking after his W. I don't think the domestic dynamic that he has with his W at home will work with me.

 

 

I think even if he is free I would still prefer that we live separate lives. The closest that we could probably "live" together would be next-door neighbours.

[m4p]

Great thread Elaine, got me thinking...

 

Do most OWs have the expectation that one day they will be Mrs MM?

I guess it boils down to 2 things: Expectations right from the start, and Expectations that evolved along the way.

 

My A started from a casual PA (almost like FWB intentions) that became a full blown EA+PA. Suddenly it was no longer just about sex but about each other. Went on for 2 years until Dday.

 

What I did not expect was how much I slowly started to want to be a part of his life, to the extent of entertaining the notion of being Mrs. MM.

 

Is that why they stay in sometimes what seems to me very unhappy relationships with a MM?

I don't think most people stay with things just because of an expected goal/ending. (if so, we will all be very accomplished people). It is exactly the lack of boundaries and discipline that we are found in such situations, along with a million other factors. Some people stay because they think MMs will leave, some stay because the "good" outweighs the "bad, some stay because they love..... etc....

 

If a MM said straight off that divorce was out of the question would most not even consider a relationship with him, or would the opportunity to change his mind mean he was still worth having a relationship with?

If xMM told the "me" right at the start of the A, I would have scoffed and said "why are you telling me that? I would never have wanted you to divorce". Well, it all went downhill from here.....

 

Is the thought of eventually replacing his wife, high on the agenda in the minds of the OW?

 

I very much try not to think of his wife, it was an unspoken thing between us.

 

Or are most OWs, although they may have a moan and a rant sometimes, in reality pretty happy to play second fiddle, pretty happy he goes back to his wife?

 

Everybody has their limits. Sometimes it takes a breaking point/catalyst to wake up and see this whole ridiculous situation for what it is. Having said that, there are also long term As.. sometimes it works, most times it ends up with us people coming to LS all heartbroken and confused.

[cocorico]

 

Do most OWs have the expectation that one day they will be Mrs MM?

Is that why they stay in sometimes what seems to me very unhappy relationships with a MM?

If a MM said straight off that divorce was out of the question would most not even consider a relationship with him, or would the opportunity to change his mind mean he was still worth having a relationship with?

Is the thought of eventually replacing his wife, high on the agenda in the minds of the OW?

Or are most OWs, although they may have a moan and a rant sometimes, in reality pretty happy to play second fiddle, pretty happy he goes back to his wife?

 

Not in my case. I had a full and happy life, he was simply part-time "extras". If I'd wanted to remarry, I'd had numerous opportunities, and that simply wasn't where I was at.

 

Nor he. I made sure of that in the beginning. He told me splitting from his W wasn't on the cards - they had only recently gotten back together (about a year or two back) after a split which he had relished, but she had gone to pieces and the kids had been left traumatised. His duty was to keep things together for the kids, at least until they were old enough to leave home. It also helped that it was LDR, so we saw each other when we scheduled it, and each interaction was very much the product of active choice on both our parts.

 

But, over time, things changed. My kids grew. His kids grew. Our circumstances changed. And our R grew and deepened. And over the years, we came to realise that not only could we be together, but we both wanted to be together. And at that point we made plans and put them into action. But that hadn't been the intention from the outset.

[SolG]

No I never want to be married again. Technically I still am anyway

 

Frankly, for the first couple of years of the A there wasn't a practical thought between us. We were so high on limerance it wasn't funny. We were working directly together; 12+ hour days and lots of business travel. We were together more than apart and it was bliss.

 

At about the 18 month mark was the first time he mentioned that he wanted to be openly with me and that he would work towards it. Limerent me just accepted that as now given! We talked about it from time to time, but I really just took on faith. At about the 3.5 year mark I discovered that my faith was misplaced. The rest is all here on LS.

 

We've reached a place where we are now brutally honest with each other. About everything. He's not leaving his W. And I don't want or need a traditional R with him; but I do need one that's open and honest. We're still working through what that means.