He asked me not to wear makeup?

[katiegrl]

Brilliant and thoughtful response.

 

The only thing I'd like to add is that sometimes the tone and how that preference is expressed can make all the difference.

 

It's one thing when your guy catches you without makeup and reminds you how beautiful you look without it and it's another thing when a guy is giving you detailed instructions along with a lecture about women and their reliance on makeup. One makes a woman feel safe and secure while the other feels much more critical.

 

And enjoys being criticized?

 

I agree ...it's the tone and the way the preference is expressed.

 

IMO, he asked gently and sensitively... she bolded what he said in her first post.

 

And again, he did not demand she wear no makeup.

 

He told her he would *prefer* she wear *LESS than she normally prefers*.

 

Absolutely nothing wrong with that! IMO.

 

You want honesty in a man, or a man who keeps his preferencrs to himself for fear of being deemed a controller and potential abuser?

 

I PREFER honesty myself, but to each his own.

[No Limit]

Maybe he's married and doesn't want any make-up to betray him to his wife?

[MoreAmore]

I prefer my partner to be honest with what he thinks. I don't care very much about looks, so I would be willing to adjust somewhat based on preferences. I actually would like knowing I was doing what pleased my partner. Afterall, who is it for if not for the only person actually worth impressing?

 

I've had guys tell me they prefer my hair long, or that they prefer no makeup... It didn't turn in to crazy controlling.

[Redhead14]

So this is a guy things are developing with. Everything has been great. Then tonight I was joking something about looking nice, and he texts me, "Makeup doesn't make you look worse, but I would ask you to wear less of it than you prefer...I mean, I know it's shallow of me to ask something like that, but it honestly would mean something to me."

I'm thinking...Are you kidding me? He goes on to say, "moderate amounts of mascara, eye liner, foundation and powder don't bother me, it's just when women have a lot on, they don't look as good and it kinda looks fake. I'm not telling you not to wear makeup, I'm just saying...subtle makeup is better if people wear it. I liked you with no makeup."

 

On one hand I want to say this is sweet, on the other hand..I want to say this is what the beginning of controlling looks like.

 

It's SUMMER. The part I find hilarious about his comment about what defines moderate makeup--I've worn bbcream (GUYS: this means tinted moisturizer that is not as thick as foundation), eyeliner, mascara and maybe eye shadow around him. That's it. I haven't been painted like a geisha.

 

He has seen me without makeup. And it makes me VERY VERY SELF CONSCOUS. I had pretty bad acne as a teen, and I have scars. Scars I'm CONVINCED everyone sees. So makeup camoflouges those.

The last guy I dated, I found out he was complaining I DIDN'T WEAR MAKEUP ENOUGH!

 

I find it all so hypocritical, because men LIE and say they prefer women with no makeup, but then they find out what NO MAKEUP really looks like, and they most definitely DO prefer makeup.

 

Maybe I'm just trying to get some insight--do his words sound like a clueless guy who got himself in the hot seat, or the beginning of controlling behavior?

 

Well, what harm is there if you at least wear less make up? If you like him enough, you might at least compromise. And, he's seen you without makeup. He still likes you apparently. And being self-conscious about it is not an attractive trait to a man. A man doesn't want a woman who can't be herself all the time with him.

 

This is an esteem issue for you, not a control issue for him. Unless he starts criticizing other things about you, I'd say, it's just a preference for him.

[central]

I think it's perfectly fine to ask for things, as long as you don't demand them or expect them. Many women have asked me to change something - if it wasn't something really important to me, then why not? It's worth a try and maybe it will be an improvement. I have sometimes asked someone I'm dated if they'd be willing to change something and see how it goes. That's reasonable - they decide if they will or not. If they're irrationally offended by a simple request, they're welcome to dump me.

[Gaeta]

There is such a double standard over this.

 

Women can tell their boyfriends to dress better or to cut their beard, but a man cannot tell his girlfriend he thinks she wears to much make up.

[Michelle ma Belle]

I still think there is a time and place to express one's preferences.

 

I mean, YES honesty has it's merits in every relationship for both men and women BUT if you're still at the very early stages of dating someone and they're already trying to change you before they've even had a chance to really get to know you, that does NOT sit well with me.

 

I had a somewhat similar situation happen to me with a guy I was dating. He was very alpha male. Initially, I thought I found that to be an attractive quality until he pretty much started dictating how things were going to go and how I was going to look. One tiny example was his love of red and how he likes his women to wear red nail polish and red lipstick and they had to always have perfectly manicured hands and feet.

 

Um okay.

 

Well, the "perfectly" manicured hands and feet wasn't a problem since I tend to have them done on a regular basis anyway. HIS obsession with red was a bit odd and as much as I like red and wear it, it's not necessarily my go-to color especially as a lipstick.

 

Normally I could have and would have been fine with all of it but being TOLD this is how it needs to be seriously irked me. Like it was some kind of deal breaker for him.

 

I realized at that moment that his attraction to me was conditional. And who the hell wants to be with someone who does that?

 

There were other demands he made as well and that was the last time I ever let a man set those kinds of conditions on me however big or small. You either like/love me for who I am or you don't.

 

NEXT!

[Gaeta]

They all did this at the "getting to know you" stage? Before they'd asked you to be their woman?

 

It was at the beginning and they were right, I do look better without make up. I have big brown melancholic eyes you can't put color on those cause you look like a drag queen.

 

Most men are ok with lipstick and mascara, it's the eye liner and fondation they don't like because most of the time it's not done properly. (even though women wearing it think it's done properly).

 

My friend was told by her boyfriend he didn't like her eyeliner. She was so offended she saw nothing wrong with her eyeliner. She asked me and her adult daughter about it and we both said her eyeliner looks awful. It's like a big black crayola line around the eyes.

[katiegrl]

I still think there is a time and place to express one's preferences.

 

I mean, YES honesty has it's merits in every relationship for both men and women BUT if you're still at the very early stages of dating someone and they're already trying to change you before they've even had a chance to really get to know you, that does NOT sit well with me.

 

I had a somewhat similar situation happen to me with a guy I was dating. He was very alpha male. Initially, I thought I found that to be an attractive quality until he pretty much started dictating how things were going to go and how I was going to look. One tiny example was his love of red and how he likes his women to wear red nail polish and red lipstick and they had to always have perfectly manicured hands and feet.

 

Um okay.

 

Well, the "perfectly" manicured hands and feet wasn't a problem since I tend to have them done on a regular basis anyway. HIS obsession with red was a bit odd and as much as I like red and wear it, it's not necessarily my go-to color especially as a lipstick.

 

Normally I could have and would have been fine with all of it but being TOLD this is how it needs to be seriously irked me. Like it was some kind of deal breaker for him.

 

I realized at that moment that his attraction to me was conditional. And who the hell wants to be with someone who does that?

 

There were other demands he made as well and that was the last time I ever let a man set those kinds of conditions on me however big or small. You either like/love me for who I am or you don't.

 

NEXT!

 

Michelle, I agree with you and if my boyfriend starting *demanding* I change something about about myself ...or else ...I would be outta there!

 

But OP's guy did not do that. He did not demand she do anything.

 

He gently and sensitively *asked* that she wear LESS makeup than she normally prefers. To him she wears too much ...which may very well be true. His preference is that she wear LESS. Hardly a demand ..."or else."

 

Imo, women are very rarely able to be objective about anything relating to their looks. It is a sensitive subject, and they often get insulted and defensive in response to even the slightest criticism ...such as this.

 

Even though if it were me, I would have taken it as *compliment* ....as clearly he thinks she's beautiful natural, with less or even no makeup!

 

I agree with Redhead ...it's a self-esteem issue for her ....NOT a controlling issue for him.

[xcupid]

I would say that if he INSISTS you wear less makeup then he's being controlling.

 

 

If he's indicating a PREFERENCE that you wear less makeup then it's up to you whether you do or not.

 

 

Part of the decision depends on how you feel about wearing less makeup because of being self-conscious and whether you want to do it to please him because you know he prefers that.

 

 

Ultimately, though, the decision is yours and if it starts causing a problem in the relationship then that would be a red flag.

[smackie9]

There is such a double standard over this.

 

Women can tell their boyfriends to dress better or to cut their beard, but a man cannot tell his girlfriend he thinks she wears to much make up.

 

Because men need our help! didn't you know that? lol

[Michelle ma Belle]

Listen, I get it, I really do but I think it's important to play devil's advocate here just a bit more...

 

I have no idea how long the OP and this guy have been dating and although it may be fine to "gently" ask your date to adjust their look to align with their your own preferences I do NOT think it's appropriate to do it so early in the relationship. Give the girl a chance for heaven's sake. He must have liked her enough just the way she was otherwise why would he have even pursued her in the first place?

 

What I take great offense with more than anything is HOW he approached the subject. I especially do not think it should have been done over text right before the next date! It's one thing to have a heartfelt conversation face-to-face about whatever you want with your partner and it's another to randomly blurt it out over text of all places.

 

NOT cool.

[autumnnight]

I'm torn. On one hand, in an actual/established relationship, I think expressing the preferences are fine. My ex was not the least bit picky about my makeup/hair, but I always asked him what he thought before I made a drastic change. (Not because he expected it). And I have had a man I was actually steadily with comment on how pretty I look without makeup and how I don't need is (love IS blind lol).

 

However, a man who feels the need not only to comment, but to go to such lengths of description and such...that makes that weird alarm go off in my head, as if he has REALLY specific ideas of exactly how I "should" do it. That is murkier ground.

 

And if he demanded it? It wouldn't even matter if he was right about the makeup, demanding that I do it would be a big NEXT.

 

If I were in this situation, I wouldn't alter what I wanted to wear, and if he keeps harping, you know you have an issue. If you do have some big worry you look like a "clown," as mentioned in one tactless post, then go to a department store or one of your friends who really looks great and ask for their take.

[kendahke]

 

A couple of years ago, I cut my long hair to a stylish bob (to my chin).

.

 

Dude is not her boyfriend:

So this is a guy things are developing with.

[Gaeta]

Listen, I get it, I really do but I think it's important to play devil's advocate here just a bit more...

 

I have no idea how long the OP and this guy have been dating and although it may be fine to "gently" ask your date to adjust their look to align with their your own preferences I do NOT think it's appropriate to do it so early in the relationship. Give the girl a chance for heaven's sake. He must have liked her enough just the way she was otherwise why would he have even pursued her in the first place?

 

What I take great offense with more than anything is HOW he approached the subject. I especially do not think it should have been done over text right before the next date! It's one thing to have a heartfelt conversation face-to-face about whatever you want with your partner and it's another to randomly blurt it out over text of all places.

 

NOT cool.

 

I remember having a thread on here about having a ONE date with a man that I found to my licking but my only hung up was his teeth needed a good professional cleaning (visible plaque).

 

Everybody on here suggested I TELL HIM. Yep!! all of you punched in and advice me to tell him I liked him and mentioned his teeth and this after ONE DATE.

 

About OP's bf blurting it out over text, well what do you want, it's how the new generation does things.

 

OP how long you've been seeing this guy?

[vc1990]

OP has known this guy as a friend for awhile, and there's always been feelings, and recently the feelings were just discovered to be MUTUAL. So I'm not sure why we waited so long. So he's seen me in a variety of different looks--post 5k covered in sweat, at lunch with no makeup, at night with full makeup, light makeup, etc etc etc.

 

 

I chewed him out royal after posting this last night. I woke up to about 8 texts today. Telling me he'd re-read his texts and he's so sorry it came out and across the way it did. "I don't ever want to tell you what to do, I just want to see yourself as beautiful as you are. With or without makeup, I like you the same. And what I said was pretty dumb because I don't EVER want you to feel like you have to look a certain way for me. I'm sorry I said what I did, and for how I said it."

 

He and I have, when we were friends, had discussions about womens styles and makeup before, and I was already aware of his low/no makeup preference. But I still feel MY FACE is MY FACE.

 

My response to this is I will continue to wear whatever the hell makeup I want. This is my face, my appearance, and my first impression to make on people. If he needs someone different, he can go find someone different. I'm not going to change for some man.

 

I believe I wear makeup correctly--at 24, I've had a lot of practice. And I DO NOT feel pretty without makeup. I just don't. I'll go weeks without wearing it, but it means I am actively aware at that time my market value is lower because I definitely DO not look as nice. My acne scars are out in full view.

[katiegrl]

I remember having a thread on here about having a ONE date with a man that I found to my licking but my only hung up was his teeth needed a good professional cleaning (visible plaque).

 

--

 

***Everybody on here suggested I TELL HIM. Yep!! all of you punched in and advice me to tell him I liked him and mentioned his teeth and this after ONE DATE.***

 

---

 

About OP's bf blurting it out over text, well what do you want, it's how the new generation does things.

 

OP how long you've been seeing this guy?

 

Quote in asterisk --- in my world that's called hypocrisy.

 

And I agree about the text. What difference does it make how they are communicating. What's important is that they're communicating!

 

I think I need a break from this board...

[BlueIris]

So this is a guy things are developing with. Everything has been great. Then tonight I was joking something about looking nice, and he texts me, "Makeup doesn't make you look worse, but I would ask you to wear less of it than you prefer...I mean, I know it's shallow of me to ask something like that, but it honestly would mean something to me."

I'm thinking...Are you kidding me? He goes on to say, "moderate amounts of mascara, eye liner, foundation and powder don't bother me, it's just when women have a lot on, they don't look as good and it kinda looks fake. I'm not telling you not to wear makeup, I'm just saying...subtle makeup is better if people wear it. I liked you with no makeup."

 

On one hand I want to say this is sweet, on the other hand..I want to say this is what the beginning of controlling looks like.

 

It's SUMMER. The part I find hilarious about his comment about what defines moderate makeup--I've worn bbcream (GUYS: this means tinted moisturizer that is not as thick as foundation), eyeliner, mascara and maybe eye shadow around him. That's it. I haven't been painted like a geisha.

 

He has seen me without makeup. And it makes me VERY VERY SELF CONSCOUS. I had pretty bad acne as a teen, and I have scars. Scars I'm CONVINCED everyone sees. So makeup camoflouges those.

The last guy I dated, I found out he was complaining I DIDN'T WEAR MAKEUP ENOUGH!

 

I find it all so hypocritical, because men LIE and say they prefer women with no makeup, but then they find out what NO MAKEUP really looks like, and they most definitely DO prefer makeup.

 

Maybe I'm just trying to get some insight--do his words sound like a clueless guy who got himself in the hot seat, or the beginning of controlling behavior?

 

I wouldn’t continue dating someone who was critiquing my appearance and offering advice to change how I present myself so early in the relationship. I would find it very odd since it had never happened in my 40 years of dating and relationships. It doesn’t necessarily mean that he’s a full-blown controller, though. He might just be a nit-picker or someone far more concerned about appearance than I am.

[katiegrl]

OP has known this guy as a friend for awhile, and there's always been feelings, and recently the feelings were just discovered to be MUTUAL. So I'm not sure why we waited so long. So he's seen me in a variety of different looks--post 5k covered in sweat, at lunch with no makeup, at night with full makeup, light makeup, etc etc etc.

 

 

I chewed him out royal after posting this last night. I woke up to about 8 texts today. Telling me he'd re-read his texts and he's so sorry it came out and across the way it did. "I don't ever want to tell you what to do, I just want to see yourself as beautiful as you are. With or without makeup, I like you the same. And what I said was pretty dumb because I don't EVER want you to feel like you have to look a certain way for me. I'm sorry I said what I did, and for how I said it."

 

He and I have, when we were friends, had discussions about womens styles and makeup before, and I was already aware of his low/no makeup preference. But I still feel MY FACE is MY FACE.

 

My response to this is I will continue to wear whatever the hell makeup I want. This is my face, my appearance, and my first impression to make on people. If he needs someone different, he can go find someone different. I'm not going to change for some man.

 

I believe I wear makeup correctly--at 24, I've had a lot of practice. And I DO NOT feel pretty without makeup. I just don't. I'll go weeks without wearing it, but it means I am actively aware at that time my market value is lower because I definitely DO not look as nice. My acne scars are out in full view.

 

>>>"I am not going to change for **some** man."

 

*Some* man? Great attitude! I am sure he would be thrilled to know that's how you view him.

 

Ugh.

 

Good luck.

[vc1990]

>>>"I am not going to change for **some** man."

 

*Some* man? Great attitude! I am sure he would be thrilled to know that's how you view him.

 

Ugh.

 

Good luck.

 

You're right, I should word that differently. Correction everyone: ANY man. If they were asking me to not wear clothes with giant holes in them, that would be one thing. But makeup, and making myself look attractive, is another entirely.

[PegNosePete]

If he needs someone different, he can go find someone different. I'm not going to change for some man.

He has quite clearly told you that he doesn't want you to change. You quoted him above saying precisely this.

You're getting all upset and defensive fover nothing.

You're the one with the problem here, not him.

He simply expressed a preference and your own insecurities came flooding out, taking the form of a wall of defensive anger and hurt.

[autumnnight]

I think this - like everything else rational in the world - is about balance. An extreme either way is probably not sound thinking or advice.

[katiegrl]

You're right, I should word that differently. Correction everyone: ANY man. If they were asking me to not wear clothes with giant holes in them, that would be one thing. But makeup, and making myself look attractive, is another entirely.

 

vc, for the record, I do agree, if you don't want to tone down the makeup, then don't. Totally your choice.

 

I just don't think it was wrong for him to ask, that's all. And as such, did not deserve your wrath.

 

But good luck...hope it all works out.

[Gaeta]

OP has known this guy as a friend for awhile, and there's always been feelings, and recently the feelings were just discovered to be MUTUAL. So I'm not sure why we waited so long. So he's seen me in a variety of different looks--post 5k covered in sweat, at lunch with no makeup, at night with full makeup, light makeup, etc etc etc.

 

Expectation toward a friend are different than expectation toward a girlfriend that is why he did not bring it up earlier.

 

 

I chewed him out royal after posting this last night. I woke up to about 8 texts today. Telling me he'd re-read his texts and he's so sorry it came out and across the way it did. "I don't ever want to tell you what to do, I just want to see yourself as beautiful as you are. With or without makeup, I like you the same. And what I said was pretty dumb because I don't EVER want you to feel like you have to look a certain way for me. I'm sorry I said what I did, and for how I said it."

 

You got these texted because 'you chewed him out royally' the night before. You made him feel bad for expressing a preference instead of having a conversation about it. Rest assured in the future he will not come forward with his likes and dislikes and this in every facet of your relationship including intimacy.

 

My response to this is I will continue to wear whatever the hell makeup I want. This is my face, my appearance, and my first impression to make on people. If he needs someone different, he can go find someone different. I'm not going to change for some man.

 

I think that is even sadder. Not because you don't want to tone down your make up, it's your prerogative. It's sad that you addressed him with such aggressiveness. You could have simply said 'I know you prefer the natural look but because of my scars I feel my best with a bit of make up on. There was no need for you to go ape-shyt on him. Once again don't expect him to come to you with something else in the future.

[vc1990]

You got these texted because 'you chewed him out royally'.

 

 

I guess I'm kind of aggressively overstating the way I told him. The long and short of it is: I told I wear the makeup because of my scars, I don't feel pretty without it, and I should be allowed to wear whatever makeup I want. That was it.