Observations about Women

[elaine567]

[mrldii]

Elaine, I think it's too easy to categorize my perception of women as fantastical. I'm a mature adult, with life experiences. As I stated earlier, I have believed and still do believe that women have a greater aptitude towards goodness than men.

 

 

Nahhhh...it's because I am a feminist that I refuse to believe women are better than men.

[carhill]

Yep, and we're still observing. Taking it all in. Reading this thread is helpful.

[SycamoreCircle]

That's not fair, Elaine. You always rely on the June Cleaver, 1950's image. It's a crutch for you. Let go of your bias and dig a little deeper.

[mrldii]

 

 

*gigglesnort*

[SycamoreCircle]

Nahhhh...it's because I am a feminist that I refuse to believe women are better than men.

I'm not sure I understand your meaning, but I don't see "goodness" and "better" as interchangeable terms.

[SycamoreCircle]

*gigglesnort*

Likewise, I'm trying to have an earnest discussion about my feelings, my observations. Let's resist turning this into a kids-at-recess discussion. It only shows up your lack of position.

[elaine567]

That's not fair, Elaine. You always rely on the June Cleaver, 1950's image. It's a crutch for you. Let go of your bias and dig a little deeper.

 

I thought you loved women who adore little kittens, they are so soft and furry.

[SycamoreCircle]

I thought you loved women who adore little kittens, they are so soft and furry.

Let's make this about ideas and not who I am and who you are...

[mrldii]

I'm not sure I understand your meaning, but I don't see "goodness" and "better" as interchangeable terms.

 

Oh. My bad. I didn't realize you saw being instilled with an excessive amount of "goodness" as a bad thing.

 

I should have been able to figure it out though, since you believe only women should be the keepers and purveyors of it.

[SycamoreCircle]

There is obviously anger spilling from people. I'm sorry to cause you anger. I don't want to sling mud. If you see no merit in my argument, if it's not worth disputing on a theoretical level, then I'm sorry I wasted your time.

[SycamoreCircle]

I think it's also valuable to consider that that short film is televised propaganda. When has television ever been a true reflection of how an age lives? My family isn't constructed like Good Times, Who's The Boss, The Simpsons, Everybody Loves Raymond or The Kardashians.

 

Propaganda is constructed to influence. So, it begs the question: why try to influence something which purportedly already exists?

[SallyU]

Yup. Was bound to happen. Trying to assign the difficulty of human relationships to a gender based discussion isn't going to help you find what you seek.

 

 

Good luck to you. I hope you find a path to a happy and healthy relationship!

 

 

 

 

<snipped> I don't want to sling mud. If you see no merit in my argument, if it's not worth disputing on a theoretical level, then I'm sorry I wasted your time.

[elaine567]

Observations about Men

When I was younger, I had the false impression that men who were "difficult" or "tainted" were that way because women had hurt them or done them wrong. Part of it was my upbringing and the influence of media including books, films and music. And even at 39, it's a hard thing to get past. Men are the handsome sex. Let's make that even more offensive. Men are more powerful.

 

But the fact of the matter is this just isn't true. Men can be outright fncked up a--holes without any maligning from a woman. Maybe it goes back to parenting, which in turn goes back to a woman. That's a can of worms I won't open at present.

 

The point of this thread though is not to dwell on this point, but instead ponder how as a woman we successfully reconcile that what is so strong, so muscly, so honourable and powerful can dually be a heartless, conniving, manipulative destroyer.

 

Perhaps one of the reasons I'm putting this in such harsh, blanket terms is because my father, whom I've spoken of numerous times on this forum, is the epitome of goodness. In many ways, having him as my man exemplar did not prepare me for the realities of life.

Hmmm!

>>>>>>>>>>>

[BlueIris]

Elaine, You might still see men that way but you’ll be happier and find more peace in examining and letting go of your thoughts, preconceptions and wishes. Seeing and appreciating men as they are, in their many variations, will feel much better because it’s real. We cause our own suffering when we impose our beliefs and wishes on other people.

 

BTW, I am educated AND love kittens- way off the derangement chart.

[SoleMate]

Sycamore, can you give you top 2 or 3 observations of "bottomless malice" and "bottomless destructiveness" that you have seen from women?

 

Also, can you spell out your standard for women's behavior and where you feel it should differ from men's behavior, if at all?

 

And yes, I intend to ask followup questions. :-)

[mrldii]

Elaine, You might still see men that way but you’ll be happier and find more peace in examining and letting go of your thoughts, preconceptions and wishes. Seeing and appreciating men as they are, in their many variations, will feel much better because it’s real. We cause our own suffering when we impose our beliefs and wishes on other people.

 

...

 

 

This is excellent advice!!!

 

People of both genders should read the post that you commented on (Elaine's post) and - if need be, change the gender from the masculine to the feminine - and heed your wise words.

 

 

[Michelle ma Belle]

I merely copied Sycamore's OP and changed the gender.

 

My thoughts exactly. This could easily have been written by any woman which just goes to show you that this isn't a gender issue so much as it is a human issue.

[writergal]

Sycamore, thoughts are not facts. These thoughts you have about women are merely your projections about your ex-girlfriend, because you still cling to the bitterness and sadness from that traumatic breakup. Also, when your thoughts are created from an insecure place, those thoughts can create the lies you believe -- about women or men. So again, thoughts are not facts.

 

Once you see that, you will realize that your thoughts create your perception...your reality. Not women themselves.

[Michelle ma Belle]

OP, does this mean you have never been with a woman that even came close to resembling the warmth and kindness of your mother?

[SycamoreCircle]

White Southerners lynching black people is narrowed to a discussion of white privilege, yet Africans enslaved Africans.

 

I'm not saying that my focus is the only focus that can exist. I'm saying try to discuss within the confines that I have laid out. We can all tidily walk out of here saying this is about both genders.

[carhill]

OP, one method of letting go is akin to how one lets go of any valued relationship. You grieve it, accept it and move on. In this case, instead of an interpersonal relationship, it is the psychological tenets which were ingrained in you. Think of those tenets, those messages, those emotional memories, as being valid and in your past and accept their death, grieve it, accept it and move on.

 

Fortunately, or maybe unfortunately, I got a chance to get a glimpse into the 'dark side' while caregiving due to psychosis and it was pretty ugly in there. I'm certain my charge would have been, if sane, mortified by the behaviors shown, but it was what it was.

 

The past is the past. Sure, learn from it. Accept it, grieve the loves lost and forgone, and look forward.

[Keats]

Hormones make a human.

 

Hormones make a gender.

 

And hormones force a personality.

 

On top of that add upbringing and life experices that would shape and motivate a persons character.

 

And then media and politics aka religion and culture, all the same thing really, which always is defining the false image and expectations of either gender so when we are faced with something other than our beliefs, we are in intellectual shock.

 

Women are in prison too btw.

 

I always asked myself why men are almost always responsible for violence and rape. I found understanding in reading about hormones. Men as women have a plenty of them.

 

I think it's a good when you meet someone who breaks your expectations apart. Even if that person is a negative experience.

 

Ultimately you are right though, women and children always would go in the boat first. Physical attributes dictate the day. But maybe it should end at that.

[TouchedByViolet]

I think a lot of women develop an entitlement and get away with bad behavior because it works for them (men and the judicial system let it work). Finding a quality chick is rare.

 

Society cares less about men than women.

Edited August 9, 2015 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[BronzeAgeJaeger217]

When I was younger, I had the false impression that women who were "difficult" or "tainted" were that way because men had hurt them or done them wrong. Part of it was my upbringing and the influence of media including books, films and music. And even at 39, it's a hard thing to get past. Women are the fairer sex. Let's make that even more offensive. Women are weaker.

 

But the fact of the matter is this just isn't true. Women can be outright fncked up a--holes without any maligning from a man. Maybe it goes back to parenting, which in turn goes back to a man. That's a can of worms I won't open at present.

 

The point of this thread though is not to dwell on this point, but instead ponder how as a man we successfully reconcile that what is so genteel, so prettified, so mannered and nurturing can dually be a heartless, conniving, manipulative destroyer.

 

Perhaps one of the reasons I'm putting this in such harsh, blanket terms is because my mother, whom I've spoken of numerous times on this forum, is the epitome of goodness. In many ways, having her as my woman exemplar did not prepare me for the realities of life.

Well eggs are more valuable than spern