OM/OW? Or had an Affair? You are bad relationship material

July 29, 2015

I've read many stories and perspectives from OM and OW and the MM/MW they are having an EA or PA with. I also read of ones who haven't crossed the boundaries yet, but are thinking about it, and how miserable it makes them. Yet they can't help themselves (they say) to leave. It doesn't make much difference really. In the end it comes down to the same bad behaviors.

All of these OM/OW are really bad relationship material. Once they crossed the boundaries of having an affair with a MM/MW, they have lost their dignity, integrity. They tell lies, and are so comfortable with it that they believe their own lies at some point. Also they are good at hiding truths, so they can have their way. These OM/OW have been hurt bad in their pasts. In return when they do find a single person who they can stat a normal relationship with, they will bring all these old (unresolved) bagages with them to their new relationships, causing many drama's and screwed dynamics between the couple. These new relationships are doomed from the start. What's your take on it?

They say once a cheater, always a cheater. But does this logic apply to OM/OW's too? Now OM/OW who have or had an affair with a MM/MW, are not technically cheating, as they have no one to cheat on. But they do knowingly choose the path of deceit and betrayal with this MM/MW. To me, this is a cycle. If you allow to cross boundaries for your own selfish pleasures. You no longer will be good long term relationship material period, as you cannot be trusted. Not saying you can't be, but the odds are against you...your future relationships will fail eventually. Or you will have to manipulate and lie and deceive the other person to stay in relationship with you. What do you think of this?

I think all these men and women are bad relationship material. If your relationships fails, it's your own fault, you can only blame yourselves. If you are a OW/OM who never had an affair before, but are thinking of being in one. Think really carefully before acting upon it. Your future is at stake here! If you want a happy life, first learn to know what boundaries are. What is wrong and right. And choose wisely. Develop a good inner moral compass, so you can avoid these situations. Let me hear your thoughts. Thanks.

Edited July 29, 2015 by Truthstar

July 29, 2015

I agree. However I have to make a subtle distinction. If I was single, met a woman but she was married or in a relationship (and I don't know her husband)... then I think 100% of the responsibility is on her. I'm not breaking any marriage vows, just going home with a willing lady. But otherwise I agree completely.

July 29, 2015

I agree. However I have to make a subtle distinction. If I was single, met a woman but she was married or in a relationship (and I don't know her husband)... then I think 100% of the responsibility is on her. I'm not breaking any marriage vows, just going home with a willing lady. But otherwise I agree completely.

If you think the onus is on the married person, that the responsibility lies with the married person, then you don't agree with what the OP is saying. S/he is saying whomever gets involved with a married person is not relationship material, period.

I disagree with that blanket statement.

July 30, 2015

That is a mighty broad brush you paint with.

Look, I agree that serial cheaters have some major issues. But once a cheater, always a cheater? No.

People have the ability to change if they want to and work hard at it. A lot of issues that may have led them to stray in their marriage can be fixed.

To say that all of their future relationships are doomed and that they don't make good relationship material is bullpucky.

Do they have to recognize the things inside them that led them to this behavior? Yes. Do they need to get help to understand it and fix it? Yes.

Learning from mistakes, growing and changing are things all humans do. Sometimes we don't learn the first time or the second and we end up repeating the mistakes. Change is possible.

Your broad sweeping generalization is like saying if you were a sex driven drunken party girl at 20 then you shouldn't have kids because you'll be a horrible grandparent.

Good grief.

July 30, 2015

I agree. However I have to make a subtle distinction. If I was single, met a woman but she was married or in a relationship (and I don't know her husband)... then I think 100% of the responsibility is on her. I'm not breaking any marriage vows, just going home with a willing lady. But otherwise I agree completely.

Why does this hypocrisy not surprise me.....

OP, we have a rants section. Is this really a discussion?

Edited August 5, 2015 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Edited for tangentially topical content

July 30, 2015

I've been a OW and that doesn't change my ability and/or desire to be with one person...

I'm a one-man-woman...period. If things ain't working out with us, I end it.

I'm not a fan of "open" RLs, "polyamorous" stuff and all that jazz either.

Maybe I was comfortable in being a OW cuz in some religions men can have more than one "wife"...yes, I said "wife". And, no, I'm not talking about those weirdo cults where the one guy has a ton of "wives" - all of which he probably had sex with when they were minors, there's abuse/brainwashing, etc. So, he can sit on a throne over a harem of females who are at his beck and call - while he files for welfare and/or public assistance to pay for all of it, cuz yep, he is not a "man"...just a jerk.

Going back to the "religion" thing. In some religions/cultures a man is allowed to have more than one "wife" and the term "wife" is emphasized cuz he just can't pick up some woman and do her on the side in the shadows. For one, he must seek his current wife's approval...for two, he must be able to afford it (for example, if he buys a dress for one wife, the next wife gets one too), and he must treat each wife with dignity and respect (again, no mistress he sees in dark alleys, he carries each wife in public and they have equal, respectful status as his main squeezes).

Now, while these religions allow the more than one wifey thing, it more was used in war times where husbands were killed and wives left alone - especially with kids, needed a man to step up and take care of them, especially with the shortage of available men for them to remarry them and their "baggage". Also, let's say a wife is infertile...well, instead of divorcing her and/or her remaining perpetually single cuz she can't start a family, dude just gets a 2nd wife that they pick.

Women may stub their nose and be like "I'd never be with a dude who had/wanted more than one wife, but when I see the amount of women who tolerate cheating and/or become the OW, making the other woman a "wife" sounds like a better option to me.

And yes, like every one said - you can't paint things with a broad brush. My last FWB was married, and while I was the OW, I never saw anyone else while with him...but he sure did, and told me like just before he decided to divorce his wife and then went on his little "expedition" to sleep around cuz he didn't wanna be tied down to anyone.

Was he a low character jerk/cheater? I can't say, cuz in a FWB, it is implied that you aren't exclusive and while I only knew his side of the story, sounds like he was getting "starved" sexually and emotionally his abusive ex...

But still, I think him wanting to spread his wings by jumping from bed to bed was low character and immature....

July 30, 2015

And, another measure of my "fidelity" despite being a OW?

I, for almost a year now, haven't kissed, dated and/or sexed another man because I have feelings for a dude and been holding on to wasted hope...and trust me, I've had opportunities to get my "itch" scratched...

Now, if that isn't a sign of someone who has fidelity even as a OW, then what is?

Boy, I sure am a Lunchable Kaboodle - 'Now that's just messed/mixed up!!!'

July 30, 2015

It would depend on how much they changed since their ow/om days.

July 30, 2015

I wouldn't say they are bad relationship material. But it would be accurate for me to say they are bad relationship material for ME. I personally don't want to be with anyone who participated in an affair in any way.

Just my preference.

July 30, 2015

I wouldn't say they are bad relationship material. But it would be accurate for me to say they are bad relationship material for ME. I personally don't want to be with anyone who participated in an affair in any way.

Just my preference.

Agreed. I won't judge all OW/OM or state that they are incapable of being honest or loyal, but they are (or at least were) capable of helping another to be incredibly dishonest and disloyal, for their own personal gain. That's enough for me.

Any man that had been involved in the ongoing deceit of another person for purely selfish reasons is not someone I would consider dating. The pain that is caused by such actions is horrendous as we all know, and it's just not something I can get behind.

Definite deal breaker for me.

July 30, 2015

And, another measure of my "fidelity" despite being a OW?

I, for almost a year now, haven't kissed, dated and/or sexed another man because I have feelings for a dude and been holding on to wasted hope...and trust me, I've had opportunities to get my "itch" scratched...

Now, if that isn't a sign of someone who has fidelity even as a OW, then what is?

Boy, I sure am a Lunchable Kaboodle - 'Now that's just messed/mixed up!!!'

It's not all about fidelity. For me personally, I just find someone who has been involved in that kind of betrayal over an extended period of time too morally objectionable to stomach in a relationship.

I find it impossible to respect that sort of choice, and find it even harder to respect the mindset and decision making that allows it to occur in the first place...and again and again. I couldn't date someone who had participated in this, and not simply out of fear that they would betray me - but because I would find it difficult to respect them enough to want to be with them at all.

July 30, 2015

I wouldn't say they are bad relationship material. But it would be accurate for me to say they are bad relationship material for ME. I personally don't want to be with anyone who participated in an affair in any way.

Just my preference.

What if this person had never cheated on anyone? Never even kissed another person while in a relationship.

What if a married person lied to them? Deceived them into having what was technically an affair ... for quite some time. When the OM/OW finds out the truth, let's say they are emotionally committed at that point and have a hard time ending it. But, eventually he/she ends it.

Remains single - regretful and distrusting - until meeting you. Wonderful you.

Would you give them a chance?

July 30, 2015

Finish your plate before you get a second helping.

Dutchman 1

July 30, 2015

Okay, you are welcome to your opinion. In the meantime my husband and I will continue on in our blissfully unaware bad relationship due to two people who are apparently bad long term relationship material.

La de da . . .

July 30, 2015

What if this person had never cheated on anyone? Never even kissed another person while in a relationship.

What if a married person lied to them? Deceived them into having what was technically an affair ... for quite some time. When the OM/OW finds out the truth, let's say they are emotionally committed at that point and have a hard time ending it. But, eventually he/she ends it.

Remains single - regretful and distrusting - until meeting you. Wonderful you.

Would you give them a chance?

That's a pretty convoluted set of circumstances. In all honesty, my answer would be "maybe". It depends. Did they continue the relationship after knowing it was an affair? Or did they end it immediately?

Define "eventually" in your scenario. Because how you define it would make all the difference in the world.

ETA: I'm not saying this person in your hypothetical scenario isn't deserving of a mate. I'm just very, very picky about who I choose to be with. I make my own rules that I'm comfortable with and live by them, regardless of how other people think about it.

Edited July 30, 2015 by toolforgrowth

July 30, 2015

What if this person had never cheated on anyone? Never even kissed another person while in a relationship.

What if a married person lied to them? Deceived them into having what was technically an affair ... for quite some time. When the OM/OW finds out the truth, let's say they are emotionally committed at that point and have a hard time ending it. But, eventually he/she ends it.

Remains single - regretful and distrusting - until meeting you. Wonderful you.

Would you give them a chance?

The woman my friends husband had a 3 year affair with was like this. She had no clue he was married with children. By the time she found out she was completely in love with him. She tried on many occasions to break it off and he reeled her back in each and every time.

My friend read all of their emails and was devastated however she grew to respect the other woman. Between them they supported each other to end the affair. My friend is still married to the man. The affair has been over for over a year now but the marriage is still in trouble.

So OP I think your opinions are troubling. I think they are very judgemental and harsh.

But that is my opinion.

July 30, 2015

That's a pretty convoluted set of circumstances. In all honesty, my answer would be "maybe". It depends. Did they continue the relationship after knowing it was an affair? Or did they end it immediately?

Define "eventually" in your scenario. Because how you define it would make all the difference in the world.

ETA: I'm not saying this person in your hypothetical scenario isn't deserving of a mate. I'm just very, very picky about who I choose to be with. I make my own rules that I'm comfortable with and live by them, regardless of how other people think about it.

I know somebody this happened to. I believe it happens more than we know.

Eventually means several months - perhaps a year - of being dismayed they had been deceived, trying to end it several times and being drawn back in by the WS. One day, after all of the turmoil, the OM/OW gets fed up and ends it permanently.

What do you think? Is this person forever a cheater? Or would you give them a chance because they are not really a cheater at all?

I respect your right to your opinion and to live your life as you please.

July 30, 2015

Affairs start for so many reasons and have so many different ways about them.

Another friend, her partner (not married but been together since Noah built the ark) had bit of a break down. A woman who knew them both and knew they were together pursued him relentlessly, showered him with affection etc. He was having a rough time of it, lost sight of what he already had and ran off for the oh so long period of 24 hours... he ran home, tail between his legs and they have been much happier ever since.

That affair had absolutely nothing to do with sex. It had everything to do with stress and not being able to cope with life and wanting to run away... As soon as communication was back up and a 3 week holiday in a hot country the issues were resolved. That was over 5 years ago... Never a sniff or hint of wanting to go else where again. He continues to work hard in their relationship and is very happy to do so.

While I am sure there is the same basic story behind each affair people do have differing reasons and situations.

There are men I could easily have an affair with but I don't because of my morals regardless of the condition of their relationship... I had a "fling" with a separated man. The divorce is going through, he was not living with his wife, but at the time he was still married does that make me a wicked witch? Does that make me an affair partner?

July 30, 2015

There are many things, IMO, that make someone bad relationship material. I would not date an alcoholic. Even if they are recovering, they tend to replace their addiction to alcohol with another addictive thing. I would not date a man who seriously contemplated murder. That shows a real lack or moral fiber and self-control. I would not date a man who expected to tell his wife what she could and could not say. That reeks of insecurity and bullying. Dating a someone who had been an OM? I'd have to agree with Woggle. It would depend on their view of their actions and how much change there had been.

July 30, 2015

It would depend on how much they changed since their ow/om days.

I think this makes a lot of sense.

It could be because the hurt is fresh, but how many times have ow and om made comments in tat section about how the knew the person was married, and while they don't agree with affairs, they just couldn't help themselves. They paint the mm or mw as someone who perused them, seduced them, was so relentless that they just had to give in and get into an affair with them.

If someone has that much of a lack of control over their actions and are blaming the other person for their own choices, then they are not someone I could trust, as they have no accountability. They blame others for their actions and don't have much strength or character. If all it takes it a bit of pressure to abandoned their moral stance, how can they be trusted?

If the person's attitude was that they had been in an affair, had made a mistake and that they accepted responsibility for the choices they made and had learned to make better ones , that could be a different story.

In the end, it suppose it really doesn't matter. A person has the right to set their own relationship standards,and if they don't want to get involved with someone who doesn't meet them, that is their choice.

July 30, 2015

That's a pretty convoluted set of circumstances. In all honesty, my answer would be "maybe". It depends. Did they continue the relationship after knowing it was an affair? Or did they end it immediately?

Define "eventually" in your scenario. Because how you define it would make all the difference in the world.

ETA: I'm not saying this person in your hypothetical scenario isn't deserving of a mate. I'm just very, very picky about who I choose to be with. I make my own rules that I'm comfortable with and live by them, regardless of how other people think about it.

I know somebody this happened to. I believe it happens more than we know.

Eventually means several months - perhaps a year - of being dismayed they had been deceived, trying to end it several times and being drawn back in by the WS. One day, after all of the turmoil, the OM/OW gets fed up and ends it permanently.

What do you think? Is this person forever a cheater? Or would you give them a chance because they are not really a cheater at all?

I respect your right to your opinion and to live your life as you please.

Once they continue the relationship after discovering their partner is married, they become a willing participant in the affair. No, I would not date that person. If they immediately ended it upon discovery, then yes I would.

July 30, 2015

What if the husband/wife was perpetrating a fraud and by the time the fraud was revealed, there were kids and commingled finances and emotions involved?

-I mean, I've heard stories where let's say a spouse was homosexual. He/she says he/she knew he/she was gay all the time but got married anyways and cannot deny who they are anymore.

-I've also heard of the endless "bait and switch" stories, where a woman will act like she's ok with sex and all that then years into the marriage she reveals she was molested/abused and "sorry", husband is SOL and he's stuck.

Should their SO sit there and suffer just cuz they don't wanna break up the family when a bomb has been dropped on them? If the couple can sit down and just work out an agreement where they live their separate lives - yet remain civil cuz of the kids - instead of splitting up the household into two separate houses, then would that be a bad thing?

July 30, 2015

It's not all about fidelity. For me personally, I just find someone who has been involved in that kind of betrayal over an extended period of time too morally objectionable to stomach in a relationship.

I find it impossible to respect that sort of choice, and find it even harder to respect the mindset and decision making that allows it to occur in the first place...and again and again. I couldn't date someone who had participated in this, and not simply out of fear that they would betray me - but because I would find it difficult to respect them enough to want to be with them at all.

I hear ya...

But, IMO, it is one thing to like lie and betray someone - another is where some people think that "what someone doesn't know won't hurt them". I think the key is "intent". Some people justify the cheating cuz they think they are keeping the family together instead of breaking it up. So, they may see themselves as doing their SO a favor instead of hurting them with the truth ...not sure if that makes any sense.

July 30, 2015

What if the husband/wife was perpetrating a fraud and by the time the fraud was revealed, there were kids and commingled finances and emotions involved?

-I mean, I've heard stories where let's say a spouse was homosexual. He/she says he/she knew he/she was gay all the time but got married anyways and cannot deny who they are anymore.

-I've also heard of the endless "bait and switch" stories, where a woman will act like she's ok with sex and all that then years into the marriage she reveals she was molested/abused and "sorry", husband is SOL and he's stuck.

Should their SO sit there and suffer just cuz they don't wanna break up the family when a bomb has been dropped on them? If the couple can sit down and just work out an agreement where they live their separate lives - yet remain civil cuz of the kids - instead of splitting up the household into two separate houses, then would that be a bad thing?

I'm not judging people who make those decisions. The question was, "are people who cheat bad relationship material?". Intent for cheating wasn't part of the original question.

I'm only speaking for me. For me, intent is irrelevant. It's the fact that it happened. And my answer is no, I would not become involved with a person who participated in an affair. I don't care what the circumstances were.

I'll be friends with them, sure. But romantically involved? Never.

Again, I'm only speaking for myself here; what I look for in a partner and what are deal breakers for me. Other people are welcome to have their own opinions.

July 30, 2015

-I mean, I've heard stories where let's say a spouse was homosexual. He/she says he/she knew he/she was gay all the time but got married anyways and cannot deny who they are anymore.

Then they can divorce and find happiness ethically

-I've also heard of the endless "bait and switch" stories, where a woman will act like she's ok with sex and all that then years into the marriage she reveals she was molested/abused and "sorry", husband is SOL and he's stuck.

Then he can divorce and find happiness ethically

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