BlackOpsZombieGirl Posted July 25, 2015 Posted July 25, 2015 Gaeta - not to derail the thread but I was always willing to buy a lady dinner on a first date if I was truly interested in her and I could pick the restaurant/cuisine. But I like food. And I like sharing company over food. And good conversation. Did I mention I like food? Haven't any of the women you've dated ever buy YOU dinner on a first date? Or has even one of them ever paid their OWN way on a dinner date? With either one of the above scenarios, if there's no chem felt between you and the date goes south, at least you would've still enjoyed their company and good food without having spent any money. .
Maleficent Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 On the contrary, Wizer, as I mentioned in the letter, OLD is different. OLD attracts a certain type. Women who are undateable IRL on account of their flakiness and generally off-putting personalities or appearance. I wish I was wrong, but speak from experience. If women are on OLD because they are undateable in real life, isn't it the same for men? So if you are on OLD sites, you are undateable. So it makes that women flake on you, isn't it? (Isn't faulty logic fun?) 4
SycamoreCircle Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 i dont get why everybody pissing in the op's cheerios. hes got legitimate beef. i guess flaking is ok now...and youre not allowed to express any irritation over it. this is like the final nail in the coffin for men...women get to flake and cheat...but YOU cant say a word. im gonna go arrange to meet a girl for coffee and not even show up, just to be a d!ck. then when she writes a letter like this you can give her your support. ive been flaked on about 10 times thru OLD. i just sat there feeling horrible. its beyond me how anyone can behave this way. i had a meetup planned awhile back with girl who was not that attractive. i thought about cancelling but i went anyway. it never even occured to me to just NOT EVEN SHOW UP. i could not do someone like that and it not bother me. some people are capable of zero empathy whatsoever. like what is going thru their mind? not that poor guy sitting in a coffee shop feeling stupid. i dont care if it is OLD. flaking is just plain ugly cruel and rude. dont give me that "youre a nice guy so you can get laid argument". it doesnt hold water. some of us actually live by the golden rule as a principle. i make plans, I SHOW UP. but the more people i encounter who live in a narcissistic manner, the more im filled with frustration and anger.Flaking is not O.K, but getting bent out of shape over one's own misaligned expectations is not O.K. either. See OLD for what it really is: a convenience that like fast-food offers the possibility of high caloric intake, maximized artificial flavor, low cost, distracted employees and botched orders. 1
Leigh 87 Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 (edited) Allow me to clarify: I never had any intention of sending it. If I contacted her again at all, I would have used a lot more "colorful" language. As for the conversation about whether dinner is a good first date, that's a red herring. I've done all kinds of first meetings. Several girls I dated actually suggested we go to dinner for a first meeting, and it went well and led to further dates. Would have made no difference what the first date was. This girl would have flaked regardless. That's what women on OLD do. It's part of their personality. That's what makes them undateable. The fact that she was 29 should have been a red flag as well. In my experience, most women that age who don't have a bf are single for a reason. Have a look at my profile pics. Can you please highlight what I lack in looks please ? Seriously. No normal person would pick me to be too plain to date. I am a slim woman too. I am 29 and single for one year now. I don't appreciate your assessment that I mustn't be attractive enough or have a nice enough personality to find love. For your information, I am single by CHOICE. There are men who want to date me...... except I don't feel any chemistry or sparks. My good friend and my own mother were giddy with excitement over their partners so I don't personally feel like settling for a relationship just because men regularly ask me for one . Yes most people are online because they aren't desirable enough to get a partner. However, some women like me simply have bad luck. The nice guys we fall for just aren't that into us and the men who want us we feel lukewarm about. Edited July 26, 2015 by Leigh 87
Phoe Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 i dont get why everybody pissing in the op's cheerios. hes got legitimate beef. i guess flaking is ok now...and youre not allowed to express any irritation over it. this is like the final nail in the coffin for men...women get to flake and cheat...but YOU cant say a word. im gonna go arrange to meet a girl for coffee and not even show up, just to be a d!ck. then when she writes a letter like this you can give her your support. ive been flaked on about 10 times thru OLD. i just sat there feeling horrible. its beyond me how anyone can behave this way. i had a meetup planned awhile back with girl who was not that attractive. i thought about cancelling but i went anyway. it never even occured to me to just NOT EVEN SHOW UP. i could not do someone like that and it not bother me. some people are capable of zero empathy whatsoever. like what is going thru their mind? not that poor guy sitting in a coffee shop feeling stupid. i dont care if it is OLD. flaking is just plain ugly cruel and rude. dont give me that "youre a nice guy so you can get laid argument". it doesnt hold water. some of us actually live by the golden rule as a principle. i make plans, I SHOW UP. but the more people i encounter who live in a narcissistic manner, the more im filled with frustration and anger. I still have yet to see anyone say "So what if she flaked, that's her right!" Everyone has said that flaking is wrong, disrespectful. And it's his right to be less than thrilled with the fact that she flaked. But to say "every single woman on OLD is like this, they're all crap, all because of Ashleigh!" is just not reasonable at all. Is Ashleigh THAT important that she is now the mold for every other woman on the planet? 1
Leigh 87 Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 I do online dating. And I don't have an off putting appearance or personality! !!!!! I also think it's totally disgusting to flake. Who talks earnestly for days and plans to meet and agrees to a time and the just doesn't turn up ?????? Certainly NOT me. Again, I've been asked out in real life without OLD however not by men I feel attracted to. And while I don't need a hot or even a cute guy, I prefer remaining single to dating a guy I'm totally in different and lukewarm about. ....... And the good guys are mostly taken so how in earth are women like me supposed to just run in to the love of our lives in real life ?????? The very few decent guys left won't necessarily approach us girls in public.... 1
katiegrl Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 (edited) I do online dating. And I don't have an off putting appearance or personality! !!!!! I also think it's totally disgusting to flake. Who talks earnestly for days and plans to meet and agrees to a time and the just doesn't turn up ?????? Certainly NOT me. Again, I've been asked out in real life without OLD however not by men I feel attracted to. And while I don't need a hot or even a cute guy, I prefer remaining single to dating a guy I'm totally in different and lukewarm about. ....... And the good guys are mostly taken so how in earth are women like me supposed to just run in to the love of our lives in real life ?????? The very few decent guys left won't necessarily approach us girls in public.... Leigh, with respect, you don't need to defend yourself or your looks, or how attractive and desirable you are, etc. The OP made a general statement, take it with a grain of salt. He is a frustrated young man who is tired of being rejected and flaked on ... THAT is where his comment came from - his frustration -- there is absolutely no need for you to take it so *personally*. No one else did. Edited July 26, 2015 by katiegrl 3
Gaeta Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 not all, just the majority. most attractive women who have to resort to OLD must have something wrong with them or theyre seeking exta attention and validation. People use online because it's convenient. It has nothing to do with having something 'wrong'. There is nothing 'wrong' with my looks or my personality but I don't have the life style to go out and about to meet men. I get home late on week days and got responsibilities waiting for me. I know several happy couples that have met online and there is nothing wrong with them. It just takes perseverance and if you take every rejection personally then you won't survive. 7
Phoe Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 not all, just the majority. most attractive women who have to resort to OLD must have something wrong with them or theyre seeking exta attention and validation. then there are some who are a bit more sincere. but these types, seriously ....as much attention as they get in real life, they must be able to find somebody worth investing in. i was venting about the lack of morals people have, particularly these types of women. ashleigh is the epitome of this. OLD with will give an already self absorbed woman 1000% more attention....furthering their narcissism. I agree wholeheartedly on the assessment of those women who DO use OLD for that kind of purpose. And I know without a doubt that they can be found easily on an OLD site. But there are sincere women out there. When I did OLD, it was with sincere intentions of finding someone, and that's the way it worked. No bullcrap, no flaking on anyone, just an honest interest in getting to know those who were interested in getting to know me. A certain simplicity to that mindset, you know? I didn't have to think so hard about it. Sometimes people take my desire to view things simply and interpret it as naivete, but if it saves me frustration at the way others behave, isn't it worth it?
katiegrl Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 not all, just the majority. most attractive women who have to resort to OLD must have something wrong with them or theyre seeking exta attention and validation. then there are some who are a bit more sincere. but these types, seriously ....as much attention as they get in real life, they must be able to find somebody worth investing in. i was venting about the lack of morals people have, particularly these types of women. ashleigh is the epitome of this. OLD with will give an already self absorbed woman 1000% more attention....furthering their narcissism. You are making some pretty strong assumptions there big fella ..... there are many reasons why both women AND men seek love on-line ....other than they are losers who can't find a man/woman in real life, have something wrong with them or are attention whores. I am sorry you personally are having such a tough time, but there are many men, including on this board, who have quite a lot of success dating women they met on line, fitness fan and barcode come to mind right off the top of my head...but there are many others as well.
Leigh 87 Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 Leigh, with respect, you don't need to defend yourself or your looks, or how attractive and desirable you are, etc. The OP made a general statement, take it with a grain of salt. He is a frustrated young man who is tired of being rejected and flaked on ... THAT is where his comment came from - his frustration -- there is absolutely no need for you to take it so *personally*. No one else did. Well most men I come across online are frankly, too undesirable to find a sweet normal girl. However, I don't assume ALL men online are in desirable. Just most of them. So I do agree with the OPS stance. I am just speaking on behalf of single women who use of line and who are also slim and attractive like me and also have nice enough personalities.
Gaeta Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 I want to add it's well documented that I met MANY men for first coffee, or for 2-3 dates. 100 + Some I was interested in them off the bat others my interest was mild. I have never EVER once faded away or stood up someone. E-V-E-R. People that have integrity off line don't stop having integrity once online. 2
katiegrl Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 (edited) Well most men I come across online are frankly, too undesirable to find a sweet normal girl. However, I don't assume ALL men online are in desirable. Just most of them. So I do agree with the OPS stance. ***I am just speaking on behalf of single women who use of line and who are also slim and attractive like me and also have nice enough personalities*****. Quote in asterisk, not to derail, but it is good to see you feeling so positive about yourself today! Sure beats other days, when you are so down about yourself, you think no attractive man would ever want a girl "like you" because you are not attractive enough or whatever. Hope those positive feelings continue! :) Okay, back to topic of thread. Edited July 26, 2015 by katiegrl
BlackOpsZombieGirl Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 not all, just the majority. most attractive men who have to resort to OLD must have something wrong with them or theyre seeking exta attention and validation. then there are some men who are a bit more sincere. but these types, seriously ....as much attention as they get in real life, they must be able to find somebody worth investing in. i was venting about the lack of morals people have, particularly these types of men. "Brad" is the epitome of this. OLD with will give an already self absorbed man 1000% more attention....furthering their narcissism. As you can see, I've flipped your entire post over to reflect upon the attractive, vain and narcissistic MEN that frequent OLD (I've seen them on there, so trust me, they ARE on there) and have been known to 'flake' on many women and standing them up whilst they're sitting at home guzzling down beers in front of their computer and getting their ego pumped up by reading all of the messages in their inbox. Sounds kind of ridiculous that I'm placing ALL attractive men who use OLD in one basket, doesn't it? Alternatively, you (and the disgruntled, frustrated, resentful and bitter OP) shouldn't generalize ALL attractive women who use OLD. There are sincere, mature and respectful attractive people out there...and there are insincere, immature and disrespectful attractive people out there as well. It's just a numbers game and yes, a lot of us DO get sick and tired of encountering the latter type of people on OLD. It's just the WAY IT IS. Those who do NOT have a thick enough skin and the maturity to deal with the odds that are mostly stacked against all of us in the online dating game would be better off taking a break from it and pursuing people IRL or just bowing out of OLD altogether. OP, I'm sure it felt sort of good to type that 'open letter' to 'Ashleigh' just to get your frustration out of your system (...hope to God you NEVER sent it). And now that you have gotten it out of your system, dust yourself off, get back up on the saddle and trot on down to the next OLD profile. Either that, or place your horse in the stable and take a stroll to the town fair or the local saloon and try your luck there. In the meantime, STOP lumping all attractive women in the same corral, okay? Because if you do, that bad attitude is gonna show through to the next woman you meet. . 1
mortensorchid Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 I'm sorry. I know how hard that is to have your hopes perked up even just a little bit and have them dashed. Happened to me more times that I care to think about anymore. You'll be ok. Move on. 1
Phoe Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 oh please.... look, if you dont believe me on how imbalanced online dating is(and all dating), and that the majority of women there are cruel, selfish, and insane, go make a profile posing as an average man. send out a thousand messages a day....and get very few back...try to get a date...try to get some girl to show up...get flaked on. or you can make a profile with a pic of an average girl and watch the inbox fill up with 500 messages within 1 day. dont believe me? TRY IT. hell post the results here. 90% of the men on OLD are there because they cant find anything. its filled with lonely men. some of them are total creeps and deviants. the top 10% youre describing have no need for OLD except for getting laid, but if they know what theyre doing they can accomplish that in real life. theyre the ones women will reply to on OLD, theyre the ones youll show up on a date for. womens actions have created these kinds of monsters and ****ed the game up. you think im generalzing and being stupid but im telling you how it is. you cant understand because youre not a man. I personally see that yes, OLD is a very imperfect and imbalanced thing, and indeed there are some terrible people on it. I don't doubt that if I made a profile of your average guy, that I would find some less than favorable results. That I'd have to put in quite a good amount of effort to get anything back. Because, yes, it is a very skewed setup. But I just so happened to make a profile of an average girl - me. I did not get 500 messages! I got about 8 on the first day. And I responded to them, and I chatted with those that responded back. And when I got asked on a date, I went. And I KNOW, that that is far simpler than what an average man's experience would be. That getting asked out at all would be a major feat. There are sincere and genuine people floating around out there on OLD. And yes, there are some ridiculous people in the mix too. VERY ridiculous. 6
Arieswoman Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 oberkeat, please stop getting all bent out of shape over this. Viewing profiles, sending messages, picking a place, setting up a time, making a reservation is all time consuming. Nobody likes having their time wasted with flakey behavior, and if it happened to you several times, you'd be understandably annoyed. Yes, and we all get this ^^^ but you can't control anyone else's behavior, only your own. Look at it this way - OLD is a microcosm of society. so you'll get flakes the same as anywhere else. In my GP's/Doctor's surgery there is a notice up saying how many missed appointments there were in the last quarter and how much it cost the taxpayer. In my business there is a charge for a broken appointment if 24 hours notice of cancellation isn't given. In 15 years I've only had to enforce it once. In OLD you are making a contractual agreement which is pretty much impossible to enforce - and would you want to if you could? Think about it. When I did OLD I made coffee dates for 10.00.am on a Sat in town on a day when I'd already arranged to meet friends for lunch at noon. So if the guy flaked it didn't matter, as I could have a look around the shops then meet my friends later. Also, the more flakes you meet the better, because the odds of meeting someone genuine increase proportionally to the flakers ! It's a numbers game, so just keep at it. Good luck x
Eggplant Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 She was rude. Good for you for putting yourself out there. I guess dealing with rude people is just part of life for everybody. 1
guest569 Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 (edited) or you can make a profile with a pic of an average girl and watch the inbox fill up with 500 messages within 1 day. dont believe me? TRY IT. hell post the results here. Well, I am an average looking girl (woman, rather) who has been using online dating on and off for quite some time. I've never gotten anything close to 500 messages ever, let alone in one day. My ex is am average looking man who had met about 10 other women before deciding on me. He was spoilt for choice. I'm not really sure where you got this idea that men are hard done by but its bs. Men flake and treat women like garbage all the time, so stop making this a sexist rant because its not fair on all the women like me who are struggling to even get a date. No its not because we are fat, old and lazy. First men i chatted to online for quite a while, one vanished and the other finally admitted he was married. "Go figure..." Edited July 26, 2015 by smiley1
Natalie8 Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 oh please.... look, if you dont believe me on how imbalanced online dating is(and all dating), and that the majority of women there are cruel, selfish, and insane, go make a profile posing as an average man. send out a thousand messages a day....and get very few back...try to get a date...try to get some girl to show up...get flaked on. or you can make a profile with a pic of an average girl and watch the inbox fill up with 500 messages within 1 day. dont believe me? TRY IT. hell post the results here. 90% of the men on OLD are there because they cant find anything. its filled with lonely men. some of them are total creeps and deviants. the top 10% youre describing have no need for OLD except for getting laid, but if they know what theyre doing they can accomplish that in real life. theyre the ones women will reply to on OLD, theyre the ones youll show up on a date for. womens actions have created these kinds of monsters and ****ed the game up. you think im generalzing and being stupid but im telling you how it is. you cant understand because youre not a man. No way! What dating site are you talking about? Because i use a popular one- match- and despite of being attractive i only get about 20 messages a day. 500 messages on the first day for an average girl is a massive exageration! Yes, it is a numbers game and yes, not all your messages get responses.and yes, there are creeps on both sides. I got flaked on by a guy just the other day. I turned up for dates where the guy was 10 cm shorter, 30 kg heavier and 10 years older than he claimed to be online. ( i walked out). Anyway, there are many normal caring ladies who use OLD too, and besides, if you truly believe that all women on OLD are unhinged or egoistic then why are you on it? It is not for everyone, but i know plenty of average looking guys who met their other half on OLD so it does work
LookAtThisPOst Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 I did not get 500 messages! I got about 8 on the first day. 8 is still a lot to receive in one day. I'm lucky if I get one response...hmmmm...per month at the very MOST. 500 messages on the first day for an average girl is a massive exageration! Of course its an exaggeration. A lot of posters do that here to emphasis a point. That's like saying, "I'm not driving a million miles to the post office just get something delivered!" Even though the discussion about attempting to send a package to a post office that's an hour drive away. So let's stay on point here...even a handful per day, is a lot. 1
Art_Critic Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 She was probably either just killing time or a she was a guy...
Gaeta Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 oh please.... or you can make a profile with a pic of an average girl and watch the inbox fill up with 500 messages within 1 day. dont believe me? TRY IT. hell post the results here. Total non sense. Where do you get these ridiculous belief? A good looking woman will get 500 VIEWS a day but never 500 messages. A good looking girl will get maybe 40-50 messages on a first day. Out of that 80% of it will be total crap!! men wanting to hook up, married men, couples, and such. The woman is left with 2-3 good prospects she can reply to. Then after she replied to them surprises started coming in like OH on his profile it says mechanic but he's not working or he put down your city but in fact he's in the US. How does that make online more advantage to women? More messages means nothing, it just means more crap to discard. 90% of the men on OLD are there because they cant find anything. its filled with lonely men. some of them are total creeps and deviants. the top 10% youre describing have no need for OLD except for getting laid, but if they know what theyre doing they can accomplish that in real life. theyre the ones women will reply to on OLD, theyre the ones youll show up on a date for. womens actions have created these kinds of monsters and ****ed the game up. you think im generalzing and being stupid but im telling you how it is. you cant understand because youre not a man. Absolutely that very first day when a woman gets online she gets bombarded by the creeps like I have explained above. Then the following days the more interesting men are starting to message. I met my share of players and had many disappointments but I know it's part of the game. Men I meet are on there for the same reasons I am, we don't have the life style to go out and meet. We're not at an age where we have a huge circle of friends. Our life revolves around work and family and frankly we're too damn tired to start heading to parachutes courses at 8 pm on week days. I am not a man but I have been online for close to 4 years so you can't fill me with that none sense of yours. I have a brother who found his wife online also friends and colleagues that met their spouse online they are now married and parents.
Author oberkeat Posted July 26, 2015 Author Posted July 26, 2015 (edited) No way! What dating site are you talking about? Because i use a popular one- match- and despite of being attractive i only get about 20 messages a day. 500 messages on the first day for an average girl is a massive exageration! Yes, it is a numbers game and yes, not all your messages get responses.and yes, there are creeps on both sides. I got flaked on by a guy just the other day. I turned up for dates where the guy was 10 cm shorter, 30 kg heavier and 10 years older than he claimed to be online. ( i walked out). Anyway, there are many normal caring ladies who use OLD too, and besides, if you truly believe that all women on OLD are unhinged or egoistic then why are you on it? It is not for everyone, but i know plenty of average looking guys who met their other half on OLD so it does work Only 20 messages per day? 20 messages in one day is still a huge amount, certainly compared to what men receive. Guys would be lucky to get 20 messages in an entire year. OLD is heavily tilted against men because of the huge male to female ratio. Women get so many messages from so many suitors that they basically get to take their pick and play the numbers, dating several men in the same week, trying them on and off like shoes at the shoe store, and generally treating men like garbage. There was another thread this week about a woman complaining about having to decide between two nice guys who were competing for her attention. How terrible for her. But that isn't the point. The point is that almost without exception the women I've encountered on OLD have been undesirable and undateable which has led me to the conclusion that these are the only types of women OLD appeals to in my area. Maybe in other states it's different, but not here. I have not encountered high quality women on these sites. Most were flakes and egomaniacs like Ashleigh. Some were overweight. Some had emotional problems. Some had no personality. Ashleigh was just the latest one with some tragic flaw and the last straw as far as I'm concerned. As I said, OLD is not a good way to meet quality women where I live, and I'll never go back to it. If I find a nice single woman IRL, great, but if not, I guess it wasn't meant to be. Edited July 26, 2015 by oberkeat
Art_Critic Posted July 26, 2015 Posted July 26, 2015 I am not a man but I have been online for close to 4 years so you can't fill me with that none sense of yours. I have a brother who found his wife online also friends and colleagues that met their spouse online they are now married and parents. I found my wife on match.. been married almost 8 years (if I did my math right).... Back then it wasn't unusual for a woman to get 20-50 emails a day.. I also created a fake account to check out the competition and as a woman with no pic I was getting up to 10 emails a day.. I also found most of those were from married men or just from guys sending the same templated email to every girl. (back then match allowed you to read the emails without paying and had to pay to reply). I also found that there are many prostitutes online.. that is where they get some of their business nowadays, I also found many women just killing time and many many fake accounts as well as many college kids or the like create fake accounts for studies and such.. As a guy you have to wade thru the trash to only email the the people seriously looking for someone. The OP found a girl either not serious about finding someone or emailed someone who was not who she said she was...
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