highseas Posted July 21, 2015 Posted July 21, 2015 Hi folks I've been reading threads from this and other forums and am learning, but I'd like for guys and girls to please shed some light on my current situation because I'm very puzzled. The girl is 25 and I'm about 10 years older and we met through a mutual friend/colleague. The first few individual meetings at a work place were kind of about business but we began talking a lot more about personal interests and other things right after the first meeting. I noticed some connection and invited her over to my place for dinner just before she had to go overseas for a month-long trip. I think we hit it off; time flew by quickly and we shared two bottles of wine that night. In fact she stayed the night. But don't get the wrong idea it was all talking and drinking. We touched on relationships and sex. She just freshly came out of a relationship and said she isn't looking for something serious. She was touchy feely with me and I returned the favor (a bit less than her) but because it was really the first time we were together alone in a private area and it wasn't quite like a traditional date, and because she was going to be away in a few days, I didn't push it further. The next day after she left, and hours later I texted her saying I enjoyed our time together and that I wanted to see her again before she left (time was tight). She agreed to meet the day before she left for an overseas trip (to an underdeveloped area where there's no internet connection). We spent the whole day and much of the night talking, having lunch, and later dinner, and sharing some wine. Then she was gone and I had already developed some feelings for her for when she came back in a month. No communication for a whole month (due to the underdeveloped area where she was headed; just believe me it's not her excuse). A day or two before she came back I sent her a text asking about her trip and saying that I thought of her. I was waiting anxiously, but she came through: she texted me almost right after she came back and recharged her phone and I invited her over for dinner (she asked if I would cook for her before she took off). We met again and spent the whole afternoon and night together, first taking long walks, then back to my place. However, her trip went extremely badly and she was so preoccupied by telling me about her negative experiences (I did ask her to tell me about all about the trip). I tried changing topics a few times and she would come back to the negatives. I listened patiently but lost track of what I wanted to do: to tell her that I like her and to cuddle or hold her, etc. I gave her some gifts, including a small non-expensive (high-pressure) jewelry. She was very happy and asked to try it on right away. We hugged. We talked about relationships and sex briefly, but the topics were dominated by her negative experiences again. She had creeps trying to touch her on the trip and stalking her and invading her personal space. All of this stuff made me even less willing to initiate physical touching and contact. She still touched me lightly a number of times, but noticeably less so than before, and she also did not drink more than one bottle of wine with me and would not drink more which I felt was kind of a refusal to get relaxed with me (?) especially compared with what we once had before. I have not kissed her (much less go beyond that). Another factor is that she had to take another trip right away, though this time domestically. The next day I sent a short text saying I had a nice time but got no reply. Then I waited another day and asked to go to lunch with her in the last minute and she responded saying she already had plans but had a nice dinner the other night (a short text though). So I said no problem, have a nice trip. Since then, I haven't texted her for close to a week (nor has she contacted me). This is a short trip and she is coming back in a few days. I'm wondering if I should initiate contact texting with her to see how her trip is so far (it's a legitimate trip planned well in advance; I know so). I also wanted to ask her out for a proper dinner date when she comes back. Please advise me how best to proceed? Somehow she seemed to go from responding to me in the middle of the night right after she came back to not being very responsive without a bit of nudging from me. We have only had three face-to-face (but one-on-one) meetings in the past two months, but each of them lasted between 6 to 10 hours. My take on this situation is kind of torn: on the one hand I fear that I might come on too strong with my dinner invitation and (small) jewelry gift and perhaps awkward nervousness. On the other hand, on an opposite end, I fear that she might think that I'm a wuss and too sheepish to move beyond talking. She has even said before that she doesn't like prudes. I feel that I'm getting mixed signals: that she doesn't want a serious relationship but likes sex but she also got negative experiences from guys treating her like a piece of meat. She would tell me that she doesn't like guys glued to TVs and sports games (which I am clearly not and she even complimented me on that), but when I asked what kind of guys she likes she would say she's not looking seriously for a relationship, still recovering from the recent breakup (they almost got married; so serious stuff). We're both mature adults (I think) and I'm wondering if I should just man up and let her know what I feel and leave it up to her to respond. What's your take? I'm so confused. I've grown to like her so much but feel that she seems to be getting cooler (or perhaps just too preoccupied with her trips and logistics). And her late rejection of my last-minute request for lunch before her second trip: was she just busy or feeling disrespected that I gave such short notice rather than feeling uninterested in me? Maybe she is just too busy (I know that she's busy in between these two big trips). When she comes back this time, though, there should be plenty of time to develop things further if possible. If I man up and tell her should I do it in person rather than in a text? Should I give her time? How much time? I would like to be her boyfriend and treat her right, but if she really isn't ready, I would at least like to be her friend with benefits, and hopefully turn her into a GF over time. Thank you for your time and patience and for sharing your thoughts.
maysj18 Posted July 21, 2015 Posted July 21, 2015 It sounds like you all have a good connection and I see nothing negative in terms of that. She eawsily could be drained from her bad trip- I mean, even a good international trip is exhausting. She's probably jet lagged on top of it all. What happened overseas? What was the reason for her trip? If she was going for humanitarian purposes, she probably encountered some things out of her control that bothered her. While she used you as a sounding board, she likely just wants some time to chill out and relax. It's a nerve-wracking experience when you first start seeing someone, so that's likely why she's been a bit reserved since she got back. I'd just play it cool and text her a day or so after she gets back to ask about her trip. Who knows, she may text you first
Amalyn Posted July 21, 2015 Posted July 21, 2015 I have not kissed her (much less go beyond that). Another factor is that she had to take another trip right away, though this time domestically. The next day I sent a short text saying I had a nice time but got no reply. Then I waited another day and asked to go to lunch with her in the last minute and she responded saying she already had plans but had a nice dinner the other night (a short text though). So I said no problem, have a nice trip. Since then, I haven't texted her for close to a week (nor has she contacted me). The way she declined your lunch offer to me sounds as if she might have been politely ending things. She didn't say she couldn't but would love to get together another time. It also says a lot that she has not contacted you since you decided not to contact her. I would not sit around and wait for her. Keep your options open. She may very well come around. 1
Author highseas Posted July 21, 2015 Author Posted July 21, 2015 Thanks for the replies so far. Maysj18: I hope you're right that she was just exhausted. Yes indeed she was exhausted and troubled by her trip and got preoccupied with the negatives when we talked (instead of talking about fun things as I had hoped). Amalyn: her reply to my lunch request was what made me pessimistic. On second thought though, I essentially texted her in late morning asking if she would be able to have lunch (though we live close to one another). So it was really last-minute. And she was leaving town in a couple of days at that time too (the second time). Should I text her and signal interest in her trip, and in her? Or would that merely make me look needy? Other thoughts are welcome!
smackie9 Posted July 21, 2015 Posted July 21, 2015 Seems to me she is planning on being busy for the next few years....keep your options open, date other people. 1
preraph Posted July 21, 2015 Posted July 21, 2015 I know you meant well, but I think the gift was premature. Gifting too soon can be a mine field. You haven't even kissed her. I think it's past the point in time you need to kiss her since she's been touchy with you. If she will agree, take her on a real official date-type date, dinner, movie, and kiss her as you drop her off at her place. Don't even take her back to yours as you seem to be having confusion when you do these all-nighters. If she avoids the kiss, then she has probably decided she's not going that route with you. If she accepts the kiss and reciprocates warmly and not just politely, then take her out again next time you can, and this time get more cuddly in the movie theatre or on the park bench, whatever. Once you know she's reciprocating, then you can eventually ask her back to your place. Good luck. And by the way, this lady has a big world view, which tends to make relationships sometimes seem less of a big deal. 1
xcupid Posted July 22, 2015 Posted July 22, 2015 I can see why you're confused. You're getting mixed signals. Sometimes she's hot. Sometimes she's cold. My guess is that she's lukewarm to the idea of getting to know you. She might be busy and/or she might even be pulling back because she's still healing from her previous breakup. If you don't initiate then what you're trying to establish with her could very well die. Expecting her to have lunch with you last minute was, in my opinion, presumptuous. Nice idea. Didn't work. She hardly knows you, she's busy, and she isn't your girlfriend. I don't think that ruined anything but I wouldn't try it again. Give her advance notice. Don't worry about the gift thing. It's done. But don't do it again in the early stages. It's a nice thought but too much, too soon. You're in the early stages of getting to know each other. As long as she's receptive to going out with you that's all you can go on that this might turn into something more. " I'm wondering if I should initiate contact texting with her to see how her trip is so far (it's a legitimate trip planned well in advance; I know so). I also wanted to ask her out for a proper dinner date when she comes back." "Should I text her and signal interest in her trip, and in her? Or would that merely make me look needy?" What you're planning to do (that is, see how her trip is) sounds fine. Right now you will have to initiate. If she accepts your invitation to a proper dinner then she's interested. If she cancels or starts repeated postponements then she's probably not interested unless she's doing that for legitimate reasons. If she doesn't offer an alternative if she is busy when you suggest, she might not be interested. Ask her if she's interested in doing it another time and see what she says. I think she knows you're interested in her. Why else would you contact her and ask her out? I don't think you should reveal your deepest feelings to her at this stage. That could be scary and off putting to her. "She's just freshly came out of a relationship and said she isn't looking for something serious." She has repeated this to you a couple of times now (or at least you've mentioned it twice now). Take her at her word. She's not emotionally ready to be involved in a relationship. (If you can't accept that then it's time to move on and invest your time with someone else.) Take it step by step. Tell her you'd like to take her out and have fun together. That's it. Keep it light and casual. See how she responds to that idea and then take it from there. If you push her for anything more than something casual at this stage I think you'll lose her. "I feel that I'm getting mixed signals: that she doesn't want a serious relationship but likes sex but she also got negative experiences from guys treating her like a piece of meat." Doesn't mean she wants to have sex with you. I'd be inclined to let her lead in that department. She's no dummy, she knows what you want. "I would like to be her boyfriend and treat her right, but if she really isn't ready, I would at least like to be her friend with benefits, and hopefully turn her into a GF over time." I didn't like the FWB idea at all. It sounds sleazy and negates everything you're trying to do, especially "treat her right." That should not even be a consideration in my opinion. If she has any class at all she'd reject that idea (and you) in a heart beat. Texting shouldn't be used for serious conversations. Good luck and let us know what transpires. 1
Author highseas Posted July 22, 2015 Author Posted July 22, 2015 Thanks, xcupid, preraph and others, for your perspectives! I agree that expecting her to have lunch last-minute now looks presumptuous. But that gives me hope also that maybe she just wasn't pleased with the last-minute thing rather than not being interested in me necessarily. I didn't mean to come across as crass that I would like her to be a FWB if GF doesn't work. I do care about her a lot and think of her highly. I said FWB as a second option only because if she really isn't emotionally available, at least I would like to have a physical relationship and maybe "wait in the wings" for her to become emotionally available. She is going to be back in one week, though I will now be going on a trip myself, for about two weeks, so I will basically come back one week after she is back. This is what I am planning to do now considering my thoughts and all of your advice. Given the above timeline and interactions so far please let me know if you have further thoughts: Tonight, after dinner time when I expect her to have quiet time and not too busy, I'm going to send her a text out of the blue asking her how she is and how the trip is so far (for her it's kind of midway in her trip). However, I also want it to be a meaningful text that would be fun and would prompt a reply. How best should I go about it? Again, I don't want the text to come across as a boring, run of the mill how are you kind of a message that she doesn't need to respond to. In the message what kind of themes should I touch on? Should I go with a short and light message (definitely with a question or two for her)? What would make it a well-phrased question inviting a reply? The fact is, I'm so into her that I'm just dying to communicate with her. I've been holding off somewhat just to give her some space. But I definitely want to stay in the picture, in a good way. So any help or advice is appreciated! I'm going to text her tonight and hopefully get a shortish conversation going. Hoping she would at least ask me a question or two back (at this point I'm really just hoping for even a fairly prompt reply, like within 20 minutes or at most a few hours). IF I don't hear back from her tonight after texting her to ask about her and her trip, should I still text her and invite her out to dinner the week after next (after my own trip)? Or would her response or non-response after tonight be it: a make-or-break situation?
Author highseas Posted July 22, 2015 Author Posted July 22, 2015 Any other perspectives, folks? I think I will try to initiate text contact tonight, after mutual silence for six days. Inputs regarding how to approach my text to her and how to spark her interest in responding would be especially useful. Other comments interpreting my situation would also be good! Thanks!
RoseVille Posted July 22, 2015 Posted July 22, 2015 Don't wait for her. At best, you'll be FWB that transitions into her being ready for a relationship - with someone else. It won't be you. You'd be the transition guy, but THE guy. She knows you like her. My thoughts are she's at best lukewarm about you. 1
smackie9 Posted July 22, 2015 Posted July 22, 2015 How to spark her interest: "I just won 20 million in the lottery!"
RoseVille Posted July 22, 2015 Posted July 22, 2015 Don't wait for her. At best, you'll be FWB that transitions into her being ready for a relationship - with someone else. It won't be you. You'd be the transition guy, not THE guy. She knows you like her. My thoughts are she's at best lukewarm about you. Corrected my iPhone typo.
Author highseas Posted July 22, 2015 Author Posted July 22, 2015 Thanks for your frank opinions. I don't have a good feeling about texting her and sparking her interest, but at this stage I feel there isn't much to lose...She did say, at the end of the night, that we will definitely hang out again before her latest trip. I don't know how much stock to put into that when she said that mainly in response to me saying that I enjoy spending time with her. In regard to the "I won 20 million!" comment. Pretty funny but also kind of sad. While I have nowhere near 20 million, I do have a well paid professional job, a nice big house, and a car, and she knows it too (having been to my place and given me compliments on these). If none of this sweetens the personality package, then it just makes me feel even worse about my lack of charisma...
smackie9 Posted July 23, 2015 Posted July 23, 2015 You can't expect every girl you like, to feel the same way.... 2
mrldii Posted July 23, 2015 Posted July 23, 2015 You can't expect every girl you like, to feel the same way.... ^^^This. And, while I was reading it (as a woman) and putting myself in her shoes, I was rather uncomfortable with how *I'd* just returned from an overseas trip where - as a woman - I was treated uncomfortably by men (after just ending a relationship with a man where I presumably was not treated well) and you appeared (by your own writing) to be half-heartedly listening to my tale of woe (which was heavy on my mind) and couldn't wait to get to the snuggling, hugging, kissy-facing, and leading-up-to-sexing-*relationshippy* time. Just how I read it... Anyhoo, good luck to you, OP. Something tells me you'll have a more definitive take on the prospects after your next [forced?] contact with her.
Author highseas Posted July 23, 2015 Author Posted July 23, 2015 I did muster enough courage to text her tonight. I crafted a message and clicked "send". She responded within 2 minutes, which surprised and pleased me, but then I followed up with a rather weak text (kind of mindless; asking if she had fun when she already said she's having fun; but I was trying to ask if she's having fun doing X, or doing something else) and haven't heard back since then (granted, it's less than 15 minutes). She said she is busy and happy on the trip and is doing well. I wasn't hoping for a long conversation, but at least a little bit of back-and-forth. At least she responded, and fast; I would feel much worse if I were still waiting right now. But overall I don't feel very good about the whole vibe. True, final test, will be, when she comes back next week, I will send her an invite to go out to dinner with me, and I'm going to let her pick a day that works for her. Any dodging will be the true end of this situation.
Author highseas Posted July 23, 2015 Author Posted July 23, 2015 mrldii: I was paying attention to her tales; I could recount all the details to you. But yes, I privately wished we could talk about happier, positive things and "us". And I was just hoping for at least some cuddling and kissing and nothing more (at least for that time). She also said she had an awesome trip in texts so I was shocked and frozen when we did meet and the details came out (and that's why I limited almost all physical contact that night; making no move at all). What I was trying to say was that all the negativity affected our interactions.
RoseVille Posted July 23, 2015 Posted July 23, 2015 At this super early stage, a woman who is interested in you romantically won't spend your time together ranting and venting about her negative experiences. You're in the friend-zone. She'll "use" you to make herself feel better. Be warned.
mrldii Posted July 23, 2015 Posted July 23, 2015 ...all the negativity affected our interactions. Yup...it sure did. "She" is part of "our interactions", right? It reads as though she was more negatively affected and your "private" wishes were perhaps more obvious than she was comfortable with...at the time. And, given what she'd just gone through, according to what she kept returning to, to tell you about, despite your best efforts to move the conversation to other, more enjoyable (for you) topics. Anyway, that's MY take on it...and you did ask us for our takes on it. Again and still, best of luck to you, OP. 1
nouedis Posted July 23, 2015 Posted July 23, 2015 If she texts you first then there's definitely something there!
RoseVille Posted July 23, 2015 Posted July 23, 2015 Yup...it sure did. "She" is part of "our interactions", right? It reads as though she was more negatively affected and your "private" wishes were perhaps more obvious than she was comfortable with...at the time. And, given what she'd just gone through, according to what she kept returning to, to tell you about, despite your best efforts to move the conversation to other, more enjoyable (for you) topics. Anyway, that's MY take on it...and you did ask us for our takes on it. Again and still, best of luck to you, OP. You know, this is a great point in any relationship dynamic.
vagabonder Posted July 23, 2015 Posted July 23, 2015 I agree with mrlddi. I had the same initial thought as her. I've dated a guy before that acted like he wanted to listen when I was having a hard day, but it was painfully obvious he would rather me move on and talk about more pleasant things. Now you are texting her asking if she is "having fun" repeatedly so she is getting the subtle message that you like her best when she is happy. If you want to save this, you need to be okay that she has tough days and wants to talk about them. And find a way to demonstrate that to her.
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