Women shouldn't initiate?

[Redhead14]

I have found that to be true as well....from the men I know as well as my brothers.

 

Times, they are a changing, that's for sure. Roles are not as clearly defined anymore, and more and more men are expecting from women exactly what the men are giving to the women.

 

I also agree that a man doing the initiating in no way guarantees he is into her or even sincere.

 

In fact to the contrary, a man who expects no initiating from the woman early on may NOT be that invested in her, otherwise he would feel somewhat hurt and confused that she does not care enough to initiate. And as a result, they will pull back. Got that little gem from one of my brothers.

 

One of my other brothers is a huge player, and prefers calling all the shots (doing all the initiating) precisely because it does allow him to call all the shots, and see a particular woman only when it suits him...

 

only when it suits him -- If a woman is saavy enough, she knows the difference. She doesn't make herself available to suit his schedule. These guys are usually doing it at the last minute. If she's accepting these terms, she's just making herself too available. But, even if a player is scheduling proper dates, there are other signs she'll be watching for. They tip their hand one way or another. If she's paying attention, she'll see it

[Lois_Griffin]

My theory about this is simple, ladies want to be the one who rejects the guy and not vice versa, hence the reason they never approach, approaching has a stupidly high failure rate so its just not worth the risk to them.

 

I am sure this will get some fairly interesting responses.

The honest reason for why I've never had to approach a man in my entire life is because they were always more than happy to approach me.

[katiegrl]

only when it suits him -- If a woman is saavy enough, she knows the difference. She doesn't make herself available to suit his schedule. These guys are usually doing it at the last minute. If she's accepting these terms, she's just making herself too available. But, even if a player is scheduling proper dates, there are other signs she'll be watching for. They tip their hand one way or another. If she's paying attention, she'll see it

 

Oh I agree, I was only explaining what goes on in the minds of some men with respect to initiating, and how they feel about and their MO.

[BluEyeL]

only when it suits him -- If a woman is saavy enough, she knows the difference. She doesn't make herself available to suit his schedule. These guys are usually doing it at the last minute. If she's accepting these terms, she's just making herself too available. But, even if a player is scheduling proper dates, there are other signs she'll be watching for. They tip their hand one way or another. If she's paying attention, she'll see it

 

Completely agree. It's not all into the initiating or not initiating. It's the entire picture. People always tell you who they are if you listen instead of having selective hearing because he's hot.

 

I never overtly initiated very early on, but I gave enough hints. As soon as things started moving, I'd come one step closer every time he made progress. I know it's not the only style, but it worked for me perfectly. I didn't like online dating but I was very successful with it acting this way. I wouldn't ask a man out at the first or second date, but I'd view his profile and I'd flirt on the date of going well. It worked and I would do it all over again the same way.

[Redhead14]

Completely agree. It's not all into the initiating or not initiating. It's the entire picture. People always tell you who they are if you listen instead of having selective hearing because he's hot.

 

I never overtly initiated very early on, but I gave enough hints. As soon as things started moving, I'd come one step closer every time he made progress. I know it's not the only style, but it worked for me perfectly. I didn't like online dating but I was very successful with it acting this way. I wouldn't ask a man out at the first or second date, but I'd view his profile and I'd flirt on the date of going well. It worked and I would do it all over again the same way.

 

I never overtly initiated very early on, but I gave enough hints -- That is about being "fully" receptive.

[Popsicle]

It works best when you have have two people who do whatever they feel (which has been common in my past) and aren't hung up with issues that prevent this. The minute you insert a person or both persons who are burdened with issues, there will be difficulties and roadblocks and the interactions won't be easy and successful,nor pleasurable anymore.

[katiegrl]

I never overtly initiated very early on, but I gave enough hints -- That is about being "fully" receptive.

 

Again from one of my brothers (the non player).....many don't get *hints*....they *get* direct.

 

That's true on this board too...men sayin they are bad at picking up hints or signals.....don't know how to interpret because that's not how they operate. Men are naturally more direct.

 

So that's a real problem in dating, isn't it. Women think they are being receptive by "hinting" ..... but men (some not all) not picking up the hint and expecting that if she cares, she be more direct, like him, and actually initiate.

 

So many threads discussing this, yah it's a real problem.

Edited July 15, 2015 by katiegrl

[Redhead14]

What's wrong with a woman reciprocating early? I love it when a woman reciprocates on the second date.What does fully receptive mean?

 

Fully receptive means giving clear, not mixed signals to a man that tells him you are open to his advances, thus taking whatever hesitancy he may have away about making advances. You are properly flirtatious, not overtly sexual, but enticing. And, not playing games. A woman who is fully receptive, knows exactly what she wants in a man, and is willing to give the right man the opportunity to show her what he has to offer. If he does things the way she needs them to be done, i.e. meeting her extreme early dating needs -- handsome, tall, buff, whatever and intiating, she'll be fully engaged in allowing the pursuit to happen.

 

If she's playing games or hard to get or anything less than showing a man she's really interested, she often doesn't know what she wants really. She's just winging it. If she's sending mixed signals, one step forward, two steps back she's not being receptive, she's in "active/reactive" mode because of a perceived flag or realizing she doesn't know what she wants with a particular man.

 

Fully receptive is accepting the dates(s), accepting his calls (not letting them go to voicemail and waiting to call him back for two hours). If she interested enough, she should answer the call or call him back asap. Leave as little room for doubt as possible.

 

Really, being fully receptive comes naturally if you are attracted enough to a man. It doesn't require a lot of thinking or analyzing. It just happens. It's when the woman starts analyzing from the get go, that causes confusion for the man and the woman. She needs to be herself and relaxed and enjoying the moment (assuming she is, of course

[Keenly]

Again from one of my brothers (the non player).....many don't get *hints*....they *get* direct.

 

That's true on this board too...men sayin they are bad at picking up hints or signals.....don't know how to interpret because that's not how they operate. Men are naturally more direct.

 

So that's a real problem in dating, isn't it. Women think they are being receptive by "hinting" ..... but men (some not all) not picking up the hint and expecting that if she cares, she be more direct, like him, and actually initiate.

 

So many threads discussing this, yah it's a real problem.

Nailed it.

 

Hints are not really initiating. That's trying to have to both ways, remaining passive while trying to say you initiated.

 

Be obvious. Be direct. Don't drop a hint. Drop a bomb instead. When both sides know exactly where the other stands, good times will follow.

 

 

Don't hint at interest. Show it. Don't hint at a date. Ask. Don't hint at sex. Rip his clothes off.

[katiegrl]

There was a thread started just the other day by a guy who was dating a woman, and he was doing all the initiating.

 

He acknowledged she was (is) always very receptive, answered all his calls, responded to texts quickly, she was always very happy and enthusiastic about spending time with him......BUT because she never initiated, he was NOT sure how she felt about him!

 

Men need more these days than a woman simply bring receptive. They don't know how to interpret her behavior, what it means.

 

It's on this board, and the men I know in real life have confirmed this to be true as well.

 

RH, I know you are older and many of your posts come from the perspective of how things were many years ago. I can respect that.

 

However, men have evolved to wanting more, to needing more, to expecting more!

 

It's all over! There is no denying that at this point.

[katiegrl]

Nailed it.

 

Hints are not really initiating. That's trying to have to both ways, remaining passive while trying to say you initiated.

 

Be obvious. Be direct. Don't drop a hint. Drop a bomb instead. When both sides know exactly where the other stands, good times will follow.

 

 

Don't hint at interest. Show it. Don't hint at a date. Ask. Don't hint at sex. Rip his clothes off.

 

^^Straight from the horse's mouth. And Keenly is not the only man to express this. Again it's all over!

 

It's a balance....and when balanced correctly, it works beautifully.

Edited July 15, 2015 by katiegrl

[Shining One]

Fully receptive means giving clear, not mixed signals to a man that tells him you are open to his advances, thus taking whatever hesitancy he may have away about making advances.

A good way for a woman to do this is plan and execute the second date. There is no ambiguity there.

A woman who is fully receptive, knows exactly what she wants in a man, and is willing to give the right man the opportunity to show her what he has to offer.

Isn't dating about both people showing what each other has to offer? Man shows on first date, woman shows on second.

If she's playing games or hard to get or anything less than showing a man she's really interested, she often doesn't know what she wants really. She's just winging it. If she's sending mixed signals, one step forward, two steps back she's not being receptive, she's in "active/reactive" mode because of a perceived flag or realizing she doesn't know what she wants with a particular man.

This makes sense. Definitely something to watch out for.

Fully receptive is accepting the dates(s), accepting his calls (not letting them go to voicemail and waiting to call him back for two hours).

I have to disagree with this. I've met plenty of women in my life who are happy to go out on "dates" and talk to me on the phone, but never want things to go further. These women just wanted a male friend who would spend money on them.

[BluEyeL]

I dunno how it "should" be but I don't understand the "he's initiating all the time". How many "times" do we mean? I'm talking about first and second dates . I initiated messages for example. And after the second date or so I was the one to reach out first sometimes.

[katiegrl]

I dunno how it "should" be but I don't understand the "he's initiating all the time". How many "times" do we mean? I'm talking about first and second dates . I initiated messages for example. And after the second date or so I was the one to reach out first sometimes.

 

That's perfect Blu. . And I am the same.

 

RH stated earlier the man should do all the initiating until the relationship has "legs."

 

I assume that means until she is *sure* how he feels about her.

 

Well what about the guy? Does he not have the right to the same? Why should he take all the risks? He needs to feel sure too...and he needs more than a woman **hinting** to feel that surety.....as so many men have attested to.

 

Times have changed! Men have evolved. I see this as a good thing!

Edited July 15, 2015 by katiegrl

[Gaeta]

I let a man initiate our first 3 dates. I was always happy to hear from him and always accepted his date invitation, I still came across as being uninterested in him. He needed a big green light from me, a green light like initiating a date, calling, initiating text, saying I was looking forward to see him, and I failed at that. Luckily instead of assuming I was luckywarm about him and move to next he spoke to me and now we're having the best of time.

 

I hate this freaking 1800 mentality to make a man initiate for so many dates to check his interest. Yes you let him initiate but you got to do some initiating too!! If you have to give a man space for him to get back to you then he is just ain't interested enough in you!

[Gaeta]

Nailed it.

 

Hints are not really initiating. That's trying to have to both ways, remaining passive while trying to say you initiated.

 

Be obvious. Be direct. Don't drop a hint. Drop a bomb instead. When both sides know exactly where the other stands, good times will follow.

 

 

Don't hint at interest. Show it. Don't hint at a date. Ask. Don't hint at sex. Rip his clothes off.

 

Two thumbs up!!

[katiegrl]

I let a man initiate our first 3 dates. I was always happy to hear from him and always accepted his date invitation, I still came across as being uninterested in him.

 

 

***He needed a big green light from me, a green light like initiating a date, calling, initiating text, saying I was looking forward to see him, and I failed at that. Luckily instead of assuming I was luckywarm about him and move to next he spoke to me and now we're having the best of time. ****

 

I hate this freaking 1800 mentality to make a man initiate for so many dates to check his interest. Yes you let him initiate but you got to do some initiating too!! If you have to give a man space for him to get back to you then he is just ain't interested enough in you!

 

Absolutely, and as I said in an earlier post, the guy doing all the initiating does not even always mean he is interested. Oh, interested in sex, sure, but it's certainly NO guarantee that he is interested in the woman or having a relationship with her.

 

Just read some of these threads from women!

 

He called/texted all the time, wanted to spend lots of time with me, planned many dates...and now suddenly nothing! Or hardly nothing. What's happening? Why has he pulled back?

 

Answer: He was never all that interested in the first place, that's why.

 

Hey Gaeta, happy to hear you have met someone and it's going well......fabulous!!!!

[writergal]

I don't think it matters who initiates. I think what really matters is that both people want the same things. I've initiated plenty of times and been asked out, yet I'm still single. I don't trust online dating either.

 

There is something to be said about courting and romancing a person, because I think technology has altered the way people court someone they like. Texting someone is not the same as calling them, or sending them cute notes. It's altered the way people date and pursue each other which I don't like at all. Online dating forces you to be vulnerable with complete strangers which is so backwards. You have to put all your cards on the table so that someone will see your cards and initiate contact. What happened to the good ole days, when you met face to face and started off that way? It's more natural.

[Redhead14]

Again from one of my brothers (the non player).....many don't get *hints*....they *get* direct.

 

That's true on this board too...men sayin they are bad at picking up hints or signals.....don't know how to interpret because that's not how they operate. Men are naturally more direct.

 

So that's a real problem in dating, isn't it. Women think they are being receptive by "hinting" ..... but men (some not all) not picking up the hint and expecting that if she cares, she be more direct, like him, and actually initiate.

 

So many threads discussing this, yah it's a real problem.

 

It's not about the hints -- if a guy can't read the hints and he is really really interested, he will ask her. It's about his confidence level too. Hey, I'm not sure about what you're hints are about, you but I'm all in. If shes' not being direct, he will be direct because they are naturally more direct. If a guy doesn't have confidence and she's not being clear, he will get the clarity he needs by observing her actions not hints. He takes the leap and err on the side that she's interested enough, if she accepts dates, and responds to his communication. If she's not doing those things, she's not interested enough. He won't rely on the "hints" if they aren't clear to him. The fact that she is hinting at all says take the leap. There are other ways and things to look for besides "hints", get past the hinting.

 

And, if he can't read her hints, she's probably not doing it right anyway. She's the clueless one, not him. If her hinting is spot on, there's no doubt. The guy knows it.

 

And, some guys are just clueless and/or lack confidence, that's their problem. A woman can't morph her style or personality to match each different kind of guy. Either they get it or they don't. The guys that really are interested in her and initiate are the guys who either get her, perhaps too subtle cues, because, well just because, or just really want to try.

 

A woman can and should initiate if she wants to. But she needs to give the reins back to him because that pre-empts his natural pursuit instincts. If she's doing all the work, he doesn't have to do anything and he feels like he's not part of the process. It needs to be somewhat balanced.

[Rejected Rosebud]

Women who do not initiate are Borderline ,

Darn, I don't initiate does that mean I have a personality disorder??:( Now I'm bummed.

 

Eternal Sunshine I think that if you have it in you to initiate go ahead and do it, a person needs to do what we can to get what we really want out of life!! stepping out of our comfort zone is good too, but if we are really terrified of doing it that is ok, that is where we shyer girls really do have an advantage over the shy guys because since it's traditional for guys to approach we can probably find partners without doing it. For them it's harder. Anyway you totally should do it. If the guy dislikes it than who needs him anyway??

[fitnessfan365]

As men, we're basically expected to handle the dates and initiating sex.

 

So the one area a woman can take more of an active interest is by initiating communication between dates. She'll reach out to keep the emotional connection strong (feminine energy), and he'll take action by planning the next date (masculine energy). I mean if you have a guy that's being consistent with dates and taking the lead in the bedroom, the least a woman can do in return is send text messages to him between dates.

[katiegrl]

It's not about the hints -- if a guy can't read the hints and he is really really interested, he will ask her. It's about his confidence level too. Hey, I'm not sure about what you're hints are about, you but I'm all in. If shes' not being direct, he will be direct because they are naturally more direct. If a guy doesn't have confidence and she's not being clear, he will get the clarity he needs by observing her actions not hints. He takes the leap and err on the side that she's interested enough, if she accepts dates, and responds to his communication. If she's not doing those things, she's not interested enough. He won't rely on the "hints" if they aren't clear to him. The fact that she is hinting at all says take the leap. There are other ways and things to look for besides "hints", get past the hinting.

 

And, if he can't read her hints, she's probably not doing it right anyway. She's the clueless one, not him. If her hinting is spot on, there's no doubt. The guy knows it.

 

And, some guys are just clueless and/or lack confidence, that's their problem. A woman can't morph her style or personality to match each different kind of guy. Either they get it or they don't. The guys that really are interested in her and initiate are the guys who either get her, perhaps too subtle cues, because, well just because, or just really want to try.

 

A woman can and should initiate if she wants to.

 

 

***But she needs to give the reins back to him because that pre-empts his natural pursuit instincts. If she's doing all the work, he doesn't have to do anything and he feels like he's not part of the process. ***

 

**It needs to be somewhat balanced.

 

Oh for God's sake, NO ONE said or even suggested the woman should do ALL the work....where the hell did THAT come from?

 

And as so many men have attested to, on this board and off, accomplished, confident young men, they don't want *hints" they want DIRECT. They respond to DIRECT.

 

If you don't wish to acknowledge this RH, that's your prerogative...but it might behoove you to start listening to the young men posting on this forum.

 

I agree it should be balanced.... a 50/50 exchange of interest...with both initiating and both responding. This should be natural...and when it's right...it will be.

[Dreamworld]

I really like meeting people so I tend to initiate interaction most of the time regardless of romantic interest or gender. I just reach out first. Ask for their number, want to get a coffee? Etc. I just start off being friendly. It just so happens that from those interactions I have had things go in a romantic direction. But I think once I realize we are heading in that direction I start to leave the ball in his court so he can pursue me. But to tell you the truth in some way or other I think I initiated most of the time! And I dont mind continuing to do so because I got to date a lot of cool guys in that way.

 

Oh yeah I get rejected a ton of times too but a little rejection doesnt miff me too much. Their loss! (Or so I tell myself )

Edited July 15, 2015 by Dreamworld

[BluEyeL]

How direct? "Wanna f*ck?" ?LOL

[preraph]

I think I disagree with this. If you let the man take a lead and you are just being receptive, you are allowing the man to have all the power. For cheaters for example this is really convenient. They call you and text you when it's suitable for them since you never initiate contact.

 

I also think that coming across as passive doesn't look that good. All confident woman I know are not afraid to initiate contact. The only thing is that a man has to be receptive and enthusiastic when you initiate. Obviously you shouldnt text him multiple times if he is not responding. One of good ways to test a man in early dating stages is how responsive he is to your random contact.

 

I just see not initiating advice often on LS... Agree or disagree?

 

I agree with you. If you are a confident person, why hide that? Now, it is true that for some men, they want to be the pursuer because that's instinctual, but there's a whole lot of middle ground here. When I talk about making initial contact, I'm not talking about going up to a man and propositioning them. I'm talking about seeing someone interesting and casually just saying hi and asking them about whatever it is you find interesting about them, whether it's their hobby, their job, their clothes, their haircut, their music.

 

Making initial contact is just meeting someone. It doesn't take the power from the man to then be proactive in pursuing you. But I don't advise just going full bore after a guy in a provocative way because in my experience, the ones who you'll end up with are guys too weak to take the lead OR too uninterested to do anything but have sex with you.