Am I wrong with this?

[ZA Dater]

You are who you are but how are you with your friends? Do you have fun? Do you laugh? Do you make jokes? Because coming across as logical, cold, and rational doesn't sound too exciting to a woman.

 

 

She wants a man who is fun to be with, who she can laugh with, and who can make her feel good about herself when she is with him.

 

 

So...do fun things. Do things that get you both talking and laughing.

 

Logical and rational is unfortunately me, I do laugh, I don't make jokes and to be honest I try to be as light hearted as I can, exciting I suppose is subjective but I am prepared to accept the problem is I am just too boring and not interesting enough, maybe I need to read more GQ, perhaps watch BS on the E channel to make myself more relevant to what society thinks a guy should be.

 

The first problem is I pretty much meet nobody I like.

[Qboro90]

Then tell me what do people want and I will try and change to that, even if its not something I enjoy or like? Even when I tried to be what I am not that didn't make much difference either.

 

 

Logical, cold, rational, that is me, I weigh up the odds, look at the possibility and then I make a decision.

 

 

People say, get out of your comfort zone, fine enough and do what exactly?

 

 

How, what and why?

 

 

Trust me, this isn't a nice nor a comfortable place to be and I suppose I could throw up my hands and shout the often repeated "its not fair" line but that isn't me, I rather sit and stew and hold everything in.

 

 

Or I sit and work on projects which I hope I can finish and do well in the hope maybe besides then turning out well, someone may find those accomplishments impressive enough.

 

We've literally been telling you "how, what and why to do things" throughout this entire thread…..we get it, you see yourself as having a lot to offer and want to have your date see and acknowledge that to you. I get the impression that you include a little "brag book" when you're on your dates and when you don't get the reaction you hope for or expect then you lose interest in the woman and say she's not interested in me…when in fact you are just coming to all of these conclusion in your own head based off what you THINK these women see in you……is it safe to say that So far everything you've done,thought, or assumed has been incorrect when it comes to women/dating/interacting? You being a logical person then should see that the logical thing to do is change things that you're doing…Change the questions you ask them, change the way you meet (talk on the phone a few times first, have a list of things written down that you know will get the girl talking and that way you have a cheat sheet basically to go through on the phone where its less stressful instead of making it up as you go on the fly at the 1st dinner date).

 

Take them on a date where its more interactive and less "1 on 1". Even I prefer doing that and Ive always been very good at engaging my dates (salesman career so its simple for me to converse with strangers/people I'm trying to learn more about). By going on dates where you are not the prime entertainment it takes the pressure off you to impress…. Go to a show, comedy, theatre, etc……Go to a baseball game, if you live near water there is always something going on whether its an air show, or some kind of concert. These are things you haven't done yet I'm sure so mix it up a bit.

 

If you're doing the online dating thing then only click on/choose/reply to women who you are 1. attracted to at least a little bit and 2. see something in their profile that interests you. It sounds like you have accepted requests from anyone who was paired with you and ran with it. I don't like women who are bodybuilders, therefore i don't say yes to dates with women who are body builders lol. Also you can edit YOUR profile to attract women.

 

think of it like fishing….you wouldn't put the bait on the hook that YOU want to eat….you bait the hook with what the fish wants to eat. So you mentioned that you completed an entire novel and that you've driven abc super cars……I have no idea whats in your profile but if any of that is there you might want to change it around a bit. Generalize more instead of being so specific with who you are. That limits the women who will find you worth getting to know. They might be compatible with you as well but based off what you're projecting as your persona they just move along to the next guy. "Reserved and quite frankly a bit shy. Prefers reading/writing books as opposed to going out to a bar/nightclub"….Thats it….Soooo many women will be able to relate to that and you'll be swimming in matches.

 

This is all off the top of my head as well and you couldve came up with this a long time ago on your own if you would just be willing to do things differently. I know you don't want to "conform to societies standards". Neither do "hipsters" yet they're all exactly alike somehow, isn't that ironic. Adapting to serve your own interests is not conforming, its being smart and well rounded. You can be a anti society shut in all you want once you have a girl to be shut in with you lol. Until then just realize that women don't want to see that deep into you while reading your profile or on a first date. Hold off on expressing your views on topics like that until you get to know them better.

 

If you think you have no confidence and self deprecate then imagine what these girls you go out with must think about themselves. You have the chance every time you take a girl out to be her hero/knight in shining armor…..you show up thinking you're the Joker.

[elaine567]

The first problem is I pretty much meet nobody I like.

 

Well, you have to change your profile to attract those you potentially will like.

 

BUT if you are giving off the attitude that you are just not into them right away, no-one is going to accept a second date.

YOU have to be more accepting of people and give them a chance to shine.

People are not rejecting you due to your looks, as they would never have agreed to go out with you in the first place, I guess they are rejecting you on your self proclaimed cold, logical, serious personality and the fact you are not open to trying to make things work, or even just to have a bit of fun along the way.

 

Few people, can show themselves off in their best light, on the first date personality wise, nerves can intrude, but friendliness goes a long way.

If you are not coming across as essentially friendly with those people "you do not like", then why would anyone want to repeat the process?

Stop judging people on first impressions and start listening to them.

Most have interesting stories to tell, if you give them a chance.

 

This cold hearted, rational business approach to dating has led you nowhere, time to shake it up a bit, give your logical brain a rest and see where that takes you.

[ZA Dater]

Well, you have to change your profile to attract those you potentially will like.

 

BUT if you are giving off the attitude that you are just not into them right away, no-one is going to accept a second date.

YOU have to be more accepting of people and give them a chance to shine.

People are not rejecting you due to your looks, as they would never have agreed to go out with you in the first place, I guess they are rejecting you on your self proclaimed cold, logical, serious personality and the fact you are not open to trying to make things work, or even just to have a bit of fun along the way.

 

Few people, can show themselves off in their best light, on the first date personality wise, nerves can intrude, but friendliness goes a long way.

If you are not coming across as essentially friendly with those people "you do not like", then why would anyone want to repeat the process?

Stop judging people on first impressions and start listening to them.

Most have interesting stories to tell, if you give them a chance.

 

This cold hearted, rational business approach to dating has led you nowhere, time to shake it up a bit, give your logical brain a rest and see where that takes you.

 

Firstly, I always enjoy your posts, mainly because I can see the logic in the advice you give.

 

I am being friendly and the last one I liked, I cant think of any other way of not being into her, I sent her an e mail telling her I liked her, sent her a gift to say thanks and again I mentioned I would like to take her out.

 

What more am I supposed to do?

 

Should they not also give me the same chance I give them?

[ZA Dater]

We've literally been telling you "how, what and why to do things" throughout this entire thread…..we get it, you see yourself as having a lot to offer and want to have your date see and acknowledge that to you. I get the impression that you include a little "brag book" when you're on your dates and when you don't get the reaction you hope for or expect then you lose interest in the woman and say she's not interested in me…when in fact you are just coming to all of these conclusion in your own head based off what you THINK these women see in you……is it safe to say that So far everything you've done,thought, or assumed has been incorrect when it comes to women/dating/interacting? You being a logical person then should see that the logical thing to do is change things that you're doing…Change the questions you ask them, change the way you meet (talk on the phone a few times first, have a list of things written down that you know will get the girl talking and that way you have a cheat sheet basically to go through on the phone where its less stressful instead of making it up as you go on the fly at the 1st dinner date).

 

Take them on a date where its more interactive and less "1 on 1". Even I prefer doing that and Ive always been very good at engaging my dates (salesman career so its simple for me to converse with strangers/people I'm trying to learn more about). By going on dates where you are not the prime entertainment it takes the pressure off you to impress…. Go to a show, comedy, theatre, etc……Go to a baseball game, if you live near water there is always something going on whether its an air show, or some kind of concert. These are things you haven't done yet I'm sure so mix it up a bit.

 

If you're doing the online dating thing then only click on/choose/reply to women who you are 1. attracted to at least a little bit and 2. see something in their profile that interests you. It sounds like you have accepted requests from anyone who was paired with you and ran with it. I don't like women who are bodybuilders, therefore i don't say yes to dates with women who are body builders lol. Also you can edit YOUR profile to attract women.

 

think of it like fishing….you wouldn't put the bait on the hook that YOU want to eat….you bait the hook with what the fish wants to eat. So you mentioned that you completed an entire novel and that you've driven abc super cars……I have no idea whats in your profile but if any of that is there you might want to change it around a bit. Generalize more instead of being so specific with who you are. That limits the women who will find you worth getting to know. They might be compatible with you as well but based off what you're projecting as your persona they just move along to the next guy. "Reserved and quite frankly a bit shy. Prefers reading/writing books as opposed to going out to a bar/nightclub"….Thats it….Soooo many women will be able to relate to that and you'll be swimming in matches.

 

This is all off the top of my head as well and you couldve came up with this a long time ago on your own if you would just be willing to do things differently. I know you don't want to "conform to societies standards". Neither do "hipsters" yet they're all exactly alike somehow, isn't that ironic. Adapting to serve your own interests is not conforming, its being smart and well rounded. You can be a anti society shut in all you want once you have a girl to be shut in with you lol. Until then just realize that women don't want to see that deep into you while reading your profile or on a first date. Hold off on expressing your views on topics like that until you get to know them better.

 

If you think you have no confidence and self deprecate then imagine what these girls you go out with must think about themselves. You have the chance every time you take a girl out to be her hero/knight in shining armor…..you show up thinking you're the Joker.

 

I agree logic does say a change is needed and I would like to effect a change, one being I am off OLD, here in SA it doesn't work you find the same people on every site and each being less attractive than the last, in short there is nothing exceptional at all, perhaps I am a snob but in the SA context OLD is like admitting you had a date with a tranny, its taboo.

 

Inter active dates are a good idea BUT I'd like to be sure I actually want to spend time with the person before I do that.

 

Its extremely hard to explain but I am either attracted to someone or I am not, they speak poorly, instant turn off, poor general knowledge, instant turn off and yes I do rank people against others I have met simply because that is the benchmark, its pointless to regress instead of progress. Yes I look at potential but the most attractive thing to me is someone who is smart and looks good, not to mention conveys confidence.

 

There are three people I can think of who I would have no issues having an interactive date with, none would have an inter active date with me, not matter how hard I tried or how nice I was.

 

Its not that I don't try, I do, its not that I am unfriendly, I do be friendly but my experience does show no matter how hard I try for it not to. It shows in hugs and that sort of thing.

 

As I sit here now, as sad as it may seem I would give anything for one fantastic date with someone I really likes and who ticked all my boxes.

I nearly had that but.

[joseb]

Firstly, I always enjoy your posts, mainly because I can see the logic in the advice you give.

 

I am being friendly and the last one I liked, I cant think of any other way of not being into her, I sent her an e mail telling her I liked her, sent her a gift to say thanks and again I mentioned I would like to take her out.

 

What more am I supposed to do?

 

Should they not also give me the same chance I give them?

 

I think elaine was suggesting that maybe you were giving off a cold "I'm not into you" vibe pretty early to most girls, not later to the one or two you decided you liked.

 

Perhaps they sense this, and they become less interested, and so starts a negative feedback loop where neither of you like the other.

[elaine567]

Firstly, I always enjoy your posts, mainly because I can see the logic in the advice you give.

 

I am being friendly and the last one I liked, I cant think of any other way of not being into her, I sent her an e mail telling her I liked her, sent her a gift to say thanks and again I mentioned I would like to take her out.

 

What more am I supposed to do?

 

Should they not also give me the same chance I give them?

 

Yes, but people do that everyday: they reach out for people who are just not into them, or who are too busy to date or are not over their ex, or who are too scared to put their heart on the line again... etc. etc. and everyday they get rejections in much the same way you did.

They simply move on to the next one.

 

BUT you are stuck, because she was special, she was the needle in the haystack, she got you and she was just perfect.. only she didn't feel the same.

Unrequited love.

 

Use your logical brain, knock her off that pedestal.

[casey.lives]

listen.. there is someone for everyone. fun is a matter of perspective

[ZA Dater]

Yes, but people do that everyday: they reach out for people who are just not into them, or who are too busy to date or are not over their ex, or who are too scared to put their heart on the line again... etc. etc. and everyday they get rejections in much the same way you did.

They simply move on to the next one.

 

BUT you are stuck, because she was special, she was the needle in the haystack, she got you and she was just perfect.. only she didn't feel the same.

Unrequited love.

 

Use your logical brain, knock her off that pedestal.

 

Well after that I'd rather not reach out to anyone, so totally shattered is my confidence.

[ZA Dater]

I think elaine was suggesting that maybe you were giving off a cold "I'm not into you" vibe pretty early to most girls, not later to the one or two you decided you liked.

 

Perhaps they sense this, and they become less interested, and so starts a negative feedback loop where neither of you like the other.

 

Which is correct because 99.9% of them I am not into, not going to lead someone along that has a multitude of things I don't like and ticks none of the boxes at all.

 

Much the same way I cannot take somebody to a black tie dinner who speaks poorly, presents poorly and has extremely limited knowledge.

[ZA Dater]

BUT you are stuck, because she was special, she was the needle in the haystack, she got you and she was just perfect.. only she didn't feel the same.

 

Use your logical brain, knock her off that pedestal.

 

You tell me where I can find that combination again and I would happily knock her of the pedestal.

 

Fact is most of the ones who have the attributes I like are all with fantastic boyfriends, this one isn't and cannot find a boyfriend.

 

Must be that needle in a haystack.

 

As I said before, friends would be enough for me.

[elaine567]

Well after that I'd rather not reach out to anyone, so totally shattered is my confidence.

 

Well, you have to start doing things to build it up.

YOU are not poor, not unemployed, not unintelligent, not in prison, not being abused, not in a refugee camp, not in fear of your life... Are you?

So start taking steps to improve your self esteem and confidence.

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/hide-and-seek/201205/building-confidence-and-self-esteem

 

Self help is everywhere online, but also take some courses, something, anything to get out and meet real people.

Not dates necessarily, just get yourself out of always socialising with folks 10-15 years older and being treated as their slightly socially awkward son who needs help.

Be a person in your own right.

[ZA Dater]

Well, you have to start doing things to build it up.

YOU are not poor, not unemployed, not unintelligent, not in prison, not being abused, not in a refugee camp, not in fear of your life... Are you?

So start taking steps to improve your self esteem and confidence.

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/hide-and-seek/201205/building-confidence-and-self-esteem

 

Self help is everywhere online, but also take some courses, something, anything to get out and meet real people.

Not dates necessarily, just get yourself out of always socialising with folks 10-15 years older and being treated as their slightly socially awkward son who needs help.

Be a person in your own right.

 

Confidence I say is a by product of the experiences one has had, good positive experiences instil confidence. Bad experiences simply remove that confidence.

 

I have nothing in common with the average 31yo, absolutely nothing at all, hence it was amazing to find a 24yo who I had plenty in common with. One of the issues with going out is this, its either a club or a bar, ok I so I tried either, I get dressed nicely, look good in my eyes. I go out, sit at the bar, drink water, look around me and all I see are paired up people.

 

Yes, somewhere down there is the chubby misfit that nobody wants to talk to, I don't want that so I just end up leaving, going home and simply feeling worse about myself than I did before.

 

I'd rather sit at home, work on something, think of something that way I don't need to feel like a complete looser when I look around and see everyone appears to have what I cannot find.

 

Inherently the thing that wakes me up at night is the fact what I do doesn't ever seem to be "good enough", its just never enough, no matter how I plan it, how I think it through the reality is never as good, well barring "miss special" where the reality was better than the idea.

 

The thing is I only but wish the best for people, even those who rejected me, no hard feelings on my side because I know I am the one who did something wrong, has no experience, clearly has no idea what he is doing.

 

I am my own harshest critic.

 

As someone said "be the bait the females you like want", thought about that and honestly I don't know what they want, I'd have thought a guy who hasn't been around, doesn't drink, is a good guy, would be considered a catch, but clearly not.

 

Because one gets absolutely zero critique its impossible to improve, so you are essentially stuck.

 

I take a very realistic view with people interpret as negative.

[elaine567]

Because one gets absolutely zero critique its impossible to improve, so you are essentially stuck.

.

 

I think you need a dating coach.

[ZA Dater]

I think you need a dating coach.

 

Good luck finding one of those in South Africa.

 

Why should one need to be coached though?

 

I will say it again, is it not enough to simply be oneself? Apparently not.

[elaine567]

Rates and Contact Details - Lu-Anne Dating Coach

[elaine567]

Good luck finding one of those in South Africa.

 

Why should one need to be coached though?

 

I will say it again, is it not enough to simply be oneself? Apparently not.

 

YOU can still be yourself but you need to learn how to attract women and to keep them interested in you and learn how not to turn them off.

As you say you have had zero critique, a dating coach will give you that critique and give you ways to improve your prospects too.

No dating coach is going to turn you into some stud who uses and abuses women nightly, as that is not who you are, but you need to learn how to use what you have to your advantage.

[elaine567]

Relationship Coaches in South Africa

[joseb]

Good luck finding one of those in South Africa.

 

Why should one need to be coached though?

 

I will say it again, is it not enough to simply be oneself? Apparently not.

 

Why would a kid need a tennis coach? Surely if they just play the way they know best and they have the talent it will be enough?

[ZA Dater]

YOU can still be yourself but you need to learn how to attract women and to keep them interested in you and learn how not to turn them off.

As you say you have had zero critique, a dating coach will give you that critique and give you ways to improve your prospects too.

No dating coach is going to turn you into some stud who uses and abuses women nightly, as that is not who you are, but you need to learn how to use what you have to your advantage.

 

Well when I have been out it seems really easy to attract someone all you need are some or all of the following

: dashing good looks

: smart clothing

: be able to make as much noise as possible while talking utter crap

: a fat wallet helps

: drinking most definitely helps

: charm, well that helps too.

: the ability to be like everyone else, think like then say the same things, talk about the same things.

 

Mostly it all boils down to this reality

 

"I am going to go out with the one my friends will be envious of, the one who can buy the most expensive things, take me to the most expensive places and the one who all my friends like and will be jealous of"

 

Honesty, integrity, loyalty, oh no those aren't needed at all, its all about "what he can offer me"

 

Yes, there is a healthy degree of cynic in the above but for the most part its true.

 

What is love, well some will tell you they love the person and I will maintain 95% love what the person does for them/can do for them/ can buy then, rather than the actual person themselves.

 

(I must have had a lot of cynical food at lunch)

 

It doesn't matter what I do, how many coaches I see I will ALWAYS come up second best and merely have the choice of the " well she is chubby and ugly and well nobody really wants her", (I have had dates with those types)

 

Life is not about settling for average, its about striving for exceptional for those moments where you feel a thrill, you smile and you just feel alive.

 

Will you always get exceptional, not always but that doesn't mean you need to settle for average. Personally I'd rather have nothing than settle for something I don't find exceptional in some way.

 

Unfortunately some people are not gifted at dating, they don't appeal to people for whatever reason and I guess I am just one of those. In order to actually attract someone I would need to be someone I am not and I am not prepared to do that, especially if the best I can do is something I just find average.

[ZA Dater]

Why would a kid need a tennis coach? Surely if they just play the way they know best and they have the talent it will be enough?

 

I'd say there is a fundamental difference between dating and a game of tennis but I may well be wrong.

 

If a kid plays tennis and they cant ever hit the ball perhaps its an indication its time to move onto another sport?

[joseb]

I'd say there is a fundamental difference between dating and a game of tennis but I may well be wrong.

 

If a kid plays tennis and they cant ever hit the ball perhaps its an indication its time to move onto another sport?

 

Of course they are different, but there are also similarities

 

And if the only other sport around is rugby and the kid really doesn't want to switch to that cause he likes tennis, what's wrong with having a coach get him to a level where he can at least enjoy it more?

 

However if the kid Isn't willing to try then the best coach in the world won't make any difference.

Edited July 13, 2015 by joseb

[ZA Dater]

Of course they are different, but there are also similarities

 

And if the only other sport around is rugby and the kid really doesn't want to switch to that cause he likes tennis, what's wrong with having a coach get him to a level where he can at least enjoy it more?

 

However if the kid Isn't willing to try then the best coach in the world won't make any difference.

 

The kid can then be happy with the fact tennis wasn't for him, provided he actually made an attempt at it and tried.

[elaine567]

Life is not about settling for average, its about striving for exceptional for those moments where you feel a thrill, you smile and you just feel alive.

 

 

And isn't striving for the exceptional not worth enlisting the help of others, others, who know what they are doing.

YOU say yourself, you haven't a clue.

 

Djokovich, number one in the world has a tennis coach, Boris Becker.

Maybe he shouldn't bother?

Maybe he should just be himself...

 

YOU want critique and help?

A dating coach will provide critique and help or is that cosy little rut just a bit too comfortable?

[ZA Dater]

And isn't striving for the exceptional not worth enlisting the help of others, others, who know what they are doing.

YOU say yourself, you haven't a clue.

 

Djokovich, number one in the world has a tennis coach, Boris Becker.

Maybe he shouldn't bother?

Maybe he should just be himself...

 

YOU want critique and help?

A dating coach will provide critique and help or is that cosy little rut just a bit too comfortable?

 

I'd rather give the equivalent money to a homeless person than fund a dating coach.

 

How to feel like a complete looser at life, pay a dating coach. (Didn't actually know there were any in SA), if for one moment I did consider this I'd want to see their resume of their exceptional partners before they start preaching to me.

 

There is an interesting saying 'if you don't know what you are missing, you wont miss it"

Edited July 13, 2015 by ZA Dater