Haydn Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 Maybe some here should get rid of all the tables in the house? Or get a `nest` of tables from the local Ikea. (Three tables!) 3
xxoo Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 This. What I often experience with pretty women is that they believe all they need to do is turn for a relationship and that's it. Because they are pretty, feminine and have a vagina that's the trump card. No effort needs to be made on their side. It boils my blood. I have no problems getting dates but by the third or fourth I simply next the vast majority of girls because their dating efforts are so damn lazy. I put all the money, organisation, thought and romanticism into the dates, trying to create a nice experience for us, whereas they turn up wearing a bit of lip gloss and the mistaken belief that the offer of sex is equal to what I put in. It's at that point I'll tell them to F off, the most recent one being a couple weeks ago. Sorry luv, what more do you have to offer me other than your inflated ego and vagina? Ever heard of 'cost-benefit' analysis? It's a cold way to approach dating today but the diabolical nature of the modern western woman makes it worthwhile; if you feel she ain't pulling things her end then just walk. It's why the vast majority of today's women no longer interest me. It's a sad state of affairs. What exactly do you expect them to do? Do you not enjoy the pleasure of their company? Their conversation? The connection? The laughs? The truth is, those are the most enticing things a man can bring to the table, too. When the real attraction and connection is there, money and fancy dates are completely unnecessary. Probably the issue is an inability to connect and enjoy the simple pleasure of a person's company. People are too focused on what is in it for me, rather than true bonding. 2
hudson701 Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 What exactly do you expect them to do? Do you not enjoy the pleasure of their company? Their conversation? The connection? The laughs? Basic, human decency and respect. To offer to buy me a drink by a second or third date if she is late or just being kind, instead of the parasitic behaviours I experience all the time. To initiate conversation during the week instead of being expected to be chased chased chased. To show affection and flirt back. These are not difficult nor expensive things to do; it goes a long way in making me feel good. On the rare occasions I experience this it really does soften me up and melt me inside, helping me to connect much much easier. But as I said, the bratty, entitled English 'strong independent' SATC gurrrlls I meet in London have this mental checklist and expectation before they can even think about being intimate and warm. It's beginning to make me really bitter and consider the MGTOW route, I'm finally starting to understand this 'checking out' of society/dating mentality and totally focusing on yourself. Women have it much easier in the dating world. That's a fact. But at the moment this position is being abused and it's only going to get worse. They only relent when there is the slim possibility of bagging that top 10% alpha man that every girl wants. I've just finished two dates these past couple weeks and spent roughly $150-200 in total on dinner and drinks. London ain't cheap. Yeah it's nice at the time, but I've heard nothing in between, her interest seems luke warm at best so it's that time again to NEXT her. Now from her point of view: spent zero, had two nice dates, minimal effort, let him chase and if he doesn't come back.... Well, it doesn't matter!! I'm a slim, pretty, 24 year old so there's another cock just waiting around the corner! See what I mean? Women have it so much easier, they simply take the best option when it is presented to them, whilst in meantime enjoying 'filler' dates and putting absolutely minimal effort in to build a connection. After all, they bring the looks and pussy right? It's that entitlement. It really is slowly destroying me inside. I really am starting to convince myself to just quit women for good. The Golden vagina simply isn't worth it; I'd rather go to a music festival with the boys any day.
xxoo Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 Basic, human decency and respect. To offer to buy me a drink by a second or third date if she is late or just being kind, instead of the parasitic behaviours I experience all the time. To initiate conversation during the week instead of being expected to be chased chased chased. To show affection and flirt back. These are not difficult nor expensive things to do; it goes a long way in making me feel good. On the rare occasions I experience this it really does soften me up and melt me inside, helping me to connect much much easier. But as I said, the bratty, entitled English 'strong independent' SATC gurrrlls I meet in London have this mental checklist and expectation before they can even think about being intimate and warm. It's beginning to make me really bitter and consider the MGTOW route, I'm finally starting to understand this 'checking out' of society/dating mentality and totally focusing on yourself. Women have it much easier in the dating world. That's a fact. But at the moment this position is being abused and it's only going to get worse. They only relent when there is the slim possibility of bagging that top 10% alpha man that every girl wants. I've just finished two dates these past couple weeks and spent roughly $150-200 in total on dinner and drinks. London ain't cheap. Yeah it's nice at the time, but I've heard nothing in between, her interest seems luke warm at best so it's that time again to NEXT her. Now from her point of view: spent zero, had two nice dates, minimal effort, let him chase and if he doesn't come back.... Well, it doesn't matter!! I'm a slim, pretty, 24 year old so there's another cock just waiting around the corner! See what I mean? Women have it so much easier, they simply take the best option when it is presented to them, whilst in meantime enjoying 'filler' dates and putting absolutely minimal effort in to build a connection. After all, they bring the looks and pussy right? It's that entitlement. It really is slowly destroying me inside. I really am starting to convince myself to just quit women for good. The Golden vagina simply isn't worth it; I'd rather go to a music festival with the boys any day. It sounds like you have very little interest in the women you date beyond Golden Vagina. And they don't have much interest in you beyond an expensive dinner. Why not go to the music festival and see if you connect with another music fan? And then have a date visiting some old record shops and grabbing a coffee (or the equivalent in the UK...haggis?). Date someone where there is interest beyond her looks.
hudson701 Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 It sounds like you have very little interest in the women you date beyond Golden Vagina. And they don't have much interest in you beyond an expensive dinner. Why not go to the music festival and see if you connect with another music fan? And then have a date visiting some old record shops and grabbing a coffee (or the equivalent in the UK...haggis?). Date someone where there is interest beyond her looks. Nowhere in your response do you suggest what a woman should be bringing to the table. Again, as per the theme of this thread, it's what I SHOULD be doing or what I'm doing wrong already. What is it with you women? Why are you so fabulously solipsistic and utterly devoid of empathy when it comes to the male position?
xxoo Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 Nowhere in your response do you suggest what a woman should be bringing to the table. Again, as per the theme of this thread, it's what I SHOULD be doing or what I'm doing wrong already. What is it with you women? Why are you so fabulously solipsistic and utterly devoid of empathy when it comes to the male position? Sure I did: she brings a shared interest in music, and a desire to spend time getting to know you without the lure of expensive dinners. She brings genuine interest in you. And you bring the same. 3
Maleficent Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 Basic, human decency and respect. To offer to buy me a drink by a second or third date if she is late or just being kind, instead of the parasitic behaviours I experience all the time. To initiate conversation during the week instead of being expected to be chased chased chased. To show affection and flirt back. These are not difficult nor expensive things to do; it goes a long way in making me feel good. On the rare occasions I experience this it really does soften me up and melt me inside, helping me to connect much much easier. But as I said, the bratty, entitled English 'strong independent' SATC gurrrlls I meet in London have this mental checklist and expectation before they can even think about being intimate and warm. It's beginning to make me really bitter and consider the MGTOW route, I'm finally starting to understand this 'checking out' of society/dating mentality and totally focusing on yourself. Women have it much easier in the dating world. That's a fact. But at the moment this position is being abused and it's only going to get worse. They only relent when there is the slim possibility of bagging that top 10% alpha man that every girl wants. I've just finished two dates these past couple weeks and spent roughly $150-200 in total on dinner and drinks. London ain't cheap. Yeah it's nice at the time, but I've heard nothing in between, her interest seems luke warm at best so it's that time again to NEXT her. Now from her point of view: spent zero, had two nice dates, minimal effort, let him chase and if he doesn't come back.... Well, it doesn't matter!! I'm a slim, pretty, 24 year old so there's another cock just waiting around the corner! See what I mean? Women have it so much easier, they simply take the best option when it is presented to them, whilst in meantime enjoying 'filler' dates and putting absolutely minimal effort in to build a connection. After all, they bring the looks and pussy right? It's that entitlement. It really is slowly destroying me inside. I really am starting to convince myself to just quit women for good. The Golden vagina simply isn't worth it; I'd rather go to a music festival with the boys any day. I'm curious. Other than the fact you've paid for the dates, what did YOU have to bring to the table? Generally, women don't like to give sex in exchange for money/gifts/restaurant dates. So if all you do is pay for stuff and expect interest in return, well, I'd say you're doing it wrong... 1
Maleficent Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 Nowhere in your response do you suggest what a woman should be bringing to the table. Again, as per the theme of this thread, it's what I SHOULD be doing or what I'm doing wrong already. What is it with you women? Why are you so fabulously solipsistic and utterly devoid of empathy when it comes to the male position? Basically, it looks like you are saying «I'm going to pay for the date and you're going to sleep with me» And you're wondering why it's not working out... 3
Maleficent Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 the bratty, entitled English 'strong independent' SATC gurrrlls I meet in London have this mental checklist and expectation before they can even think about being intimate and warm. It's beginning to make me really bitter and consider the MGTOW route, I'm finally starting to understand this 'checking out' of society/dating mentality and totally focusing on yourself. Women have it much easier in the dating world. That's a fact. But at the moment this position is being abused and it's only going to get worse. They only relent when there is the slim possibility of bagging that top 10% alpha man that every girl wants. I've just finished two dates these past couple weeks and spent roughly $150-200 in total on dinner and drinks. London ain't cheap. Yeah it's nice at the time, but I've heard nothing in between, her interest seems luke warm at best so it's that time again to NEXT her. Now from her point of view: spent zero, had two nice dates, minimal effort, let him chase and if he doesn't come back.... Well, it doesn't matter!! I'm a slim, pretty, 24 year old so there's another cock just waiting around the corner! See what I mean? Women have it so much easier, they simply take the best option when it is presented to them, whilst in meantime enjoying 'filler' dates and putting absolutely minimal effort in to build a connection. After all, they bring the looks and pussy right? It's that entitlement. It really is slowly destroying me inside. I really am starting to convince myself to just quit women for good. The Golden vagina simply isn't worth it; I'd rather go to a music festival with the boys any day. I've just re-read this post. It amazes me how negative your attitude is. If you are going into dates with those beliefs - I assure you we have a sixth sense to recognize this attitude. you may think you're careful and not saying these things, but most of us know all the different ways these beliefs appear in a man. This may have a lot more to do with their lukewarm attitude towards you than the entitlement you believe they have. Also, I hope you appreciate the irony of complaining of women's entitlement when you are the one complaining women aren't returning your attentions after you've spent so much money on dates... 4
toolforgrowth Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 I've just re-read this post. It amazes me how negative your attitude is. If you are going into dates with those beliefs - I assure you we have a sixth sense to recognize this attitude. you may think you're careful and not saying these things, but most of us know all the different ways these beliefs appear in a man. This may have a lot more to do with their lukewarm attitude towards you than the entitlement you believe they have. Also, I hope you appreciate the irony of complaining of women's entitlement when you are the one complaining women aren't returning your attentions after you've spent so much money on dates... This is why I'm a believer in men and women sharing the costs of dating equally (if possible). Men need to stop spending their money on women and suggest something free or expect her to pay her own way. He's not expecting sex. He's saying that the majority of women he's met behave entitled because they have a vagina, not because he wants to get into it. I've taken women out on dates with no intention of trying to sleep with them afterward. It's the mentality of "I have the vagina, do therefore it's your job to woo me and pay for me". Not all women behave that way, of course. But a number of them do, large enough to be a deterrent to dating. Cost-benefit analysis. Why spend time and money if there is no return? You equating return on investment as sex. I say that is a false equivalency. It's not always about sex. Sometimes it's about genuine interest by the woman. She may agree to go out, and enjoy a meal or an activity at our expense, but it may never go farther than that. Farther may be another date, friendship, a relationship, etc. Again, it doesn't have to be sex. For men, dating is literally gambling. We are gambling money that a woman MAY be interested in us. I saved so much money when I stopped dating. It was a huge eye opener. I don't get the impression he hates women. I perceive him to be dissatisfied with the current dating paradigm, and I fully agree with him. Dating is not egalitarian and a financial expense. For some, the cost is too high under that paradigm. 1
hudson701 Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 Wow three posts dedicated to me, I must have touched a nerve. So tell me then, in the supposed equality of the dating world, where women 'want it all' yet still expect men to act like men, be chivalrous, gentlemanly etc what should my attitude be like? You must believe I'm a complete moron or something if you think I believe x + y + z from a man's input = sex. If you look at my post history you see I am heavily red pill and that I am firm believer in that 'true desire cannot be negotiated'. That's why I eject after a few dates if I feel she has no desire for me. However, it's takes a few dates to figure out whether you are compatible or not, and it is during that initial period that men in general have to invest far more to get the female's attention. Because if he doesn't appear gentlemanly, resourceful and generous with his money/time he will be seen as cheap/tight. From a girl's perspective, all she has to do is screen him out during this initial period, there is no investment or effort whatsoever. THATS my gripe. Put it this way- imagine a date being set up where the girl asks me to meet at a a place, organises a nice date, is generous with money etc only for me to say 'meh'. Then she does it a couple hundred more times over the span of a few years. In fact just writing this is just so farcical because it would never happen. A woman simply and wholly cannot empathise with the male disposition and the troubles we can go to to facilitate your world. Women who fall in love and meet 'the one' think it just happens by magic, that the stars were aligned etc or some other horse****. They have no idea the investment, money, work and time/effort a man has put into his game to seduce the woman at that point. It's so frustrating.
Maleficent Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 Hudson, I cannot speak for all women and I find the idea of one person spending 150$ on the first, even second or third date utterly ridiculous. Personally I wouldn't have expwnsive first dates, but if I was to spend money on a date and he was just meh, I'd let it go. You can't give with expectations of what you'll get in return. If you can't do that, don't give. The simple solution is to either go on cheap/free dates or stop expecting anything in return. No one owes you anything even if you spend money on them. Keep the expensive dates for the third/fourth date. 2
Phoe Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 I'd like to see some opinions on what many of the men would like the women they date to bring to the table. It surely varies from man to man, and while "having a vagina" is obviously a consideration, I imagine the vast majority of men DO have other things they desire from a girlfriend or wife. I'd like to hear a variety of answers on this 2
lollipopspot Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 Hudson, I cannot speak for all women and I find the idea of one person spending 150$ on the first, even second or third date utterly ridiculous. I do too. No one has spent money like that on me, nor would I want them too - I'd find it very uncomfortable. In fact, I like a "no money" "date" - a walk in the park. Or a "low money" date - a coffeeshop. I don't care about money spent, I want to get to know the person. But I'm not a high maintenance person. I think this poster might like higher maintenance ladies, and perhaps if someone is looking for a certain type of lady, that's a cost - after all, if she's that high maintenance to expect (according to him) a $150 date, then she also had to put a lot of money and effort into her appearance to be asked on it and to go on it. He sees the end product, not all the work that had to go into it.
Maleficent Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 I do too. No one has spent money like that on me, nor would I want them too - I'd find it very uncomfortable. In fact, I like a "no money" "date" - a walk in the park. Or a "low money" date - a coffeeshop. I don't care about money spent, I want to get to know the person. But I'm not a high maintenance person. I think this poster might like higher maintenance ladies, and perhaps if someone is looking for a certain type of lady, that's a cost - after all, if she's that high maintenance to expect (according to him) a $150 date, then she also had to put a lot of money and effort into her appearance to be asked on it and to go on it. He sees the end product, not all the work that had to go into it. To be honnest, I'm not a fan of the whole "I put time and money into my look, be appreciative!" mentality ridiculous too lol 3
lollipopspot Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 To be honnest, I'm not a fan of the whole "I put time and money into my look, be appreciative!" mentality ridiculous too lol I agree - but he seems to be seeking out those ladies. Who else wants a $150 date? (Unless they don't actually want or expect it). 1
elaine567 Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 I think this poster might like higher maintenance ladies, and perhaps if someone is looking for a certain type of lady, that's a cost - after all, if she's that high maintenance to expect (according to him) a $150 date. He is spending money to impress and when they are not particularly impressed, he is upset. I guess the expensive date is the carrot too. Him: Do you want to go for coffee sometime? Her: I'll think about it... Him: What about Friday? Her: Sorry, busy all Friday... Him: Monday? Her: I'll let you know... .............................................. Him: I was thinking of going to that new place that opened in the lane Her: Looks pretty expensive. Him: Do you want to go with me? Her: Yes, please.
Taramere Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 To be honnest, I'm not a fan of the whole "I put time and money into my look, be appreciative!" mentality ridiculous too lol I think if a woman's devoting huge amounts of time to looking like a trophy girlfriend, she's looking for the kind of guy who will reward trophy girlfriend looks. Which the ones with a lot of money will...and I don't imagine men who don't have a lot of money are of much interest. It's shallow, of course, but it's no more shallow than men who are primarily interested in a woman's looks. Both are shallow, but neither are evil or immoral - so long as the parties involved are reasonably up front regarding what they're looking for. Gold diggers and rich men who want gold digging trophy girlfriends aside...with regard to normal people, I totally agree with xxoo. If you're going to spend time in somebody's company, what you're primarily looking for them to "bring to the table" is to be enjoyable company for the few hours you're going to spend together. I think anybody who's hung up on "I give X and I expect Y in return...what are you taking to the table?" is probably not going to be a real blast to spend time with. I mean that outlook is fine for business and negotiation, but it's a fairly questionable attitude to take to social situations.
hudson701 Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 Hudson, I cannot speak for all women and I find the idea of one person spending 150$ on the first, even second or third date utterly ridiculous. Personally I wouldn't have expwnsive first dates, but if I was to spend money on a date and he was just meh, I'd let it go. You can't give with expectations of what you'll get in return. If you can't do that, don't give. The simple solution is to either go on cheap/free dates or stop expecting anything in return. No one owes you anything even if you spend money on them. Keep the expensive dates for the third/fourth date. A typical first drink in London costs about £8. A cocktail is around £15. So for an average of two three drinks each you're looking at around £60-70, which is what, approx $90? That's the norm for this place. Thats an average night for a set of drinks and a pretty average date at that. It's not extravagant in the slightest. But you have seemed to missed my point again being unable to emphasise with the difficulties men face. It's another 'this is what you've done wrong' response. Are really unable to emphasise with what I am saying, is it really that baffling? The male commentator above picked up on it immediately.
hudson701 Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 Whooaaaaa hang on ladies, Elaine and the rest of the feminist brigade! You are getting wayyyyy out of line here! I am not trying to impress with money nor target a particular sort of shallow girl. London is very expensive. The vast majority of professional females here are incredibly entitled- there's not an ounce of warmth or humility about them. I live and breathe it everyday. The word 'humble' is foreign to them. And how many times do I have to say I am not trying to equate money/gifts for sex! Re-read what I've said!
Phoe Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 Whooaaaaa hang on ladies, Elaine and the rest of the feminist brigade! You are getting wayyyyy out of line here! I am not trying to impress with money not target a particular sort of shallow girl. London is very expansive. The vast majority of professional females here are incredibly entitled- there's not an ounce of warmth or humility about them. I love and breathe it everyday. The word 'humble' is foreign to them. And how many times do I have to say I am not trying to equate money/gifts for sex! Re-read what I've said! I'm interested in hearing what you'd like for the women you date to bring to the table. I noted that you previously mentioned things like affection, initiating interaction, being flirty, etc. Is there more that you'd like in a partner? 1
hudson701 Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 I'd like to see some opinions on what many of the men would like the women they date to bring to the table. It surely varies from man to man, and while "having a vagina" is obviously a consideration, I imagine the vast majority of men DO have other things they desire from a girlfriend or wife. I'd like to hear a variety of answers on this Affection. The ability to surprise and spoil their man when it's totally unexpected. All the things that I have done to make a girl feel loved and special other than providing the other body part needed for sex. 2
xxoo Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 Whooaaaaa hang on ladies, Elaine and the rest of the feminist brigade! You are getting wayyyyy out of line here! I am not trying to impress with money nor target a particular sort of shallow girl. London is very expensive. The vast majority of professional females here are incredibly entitled- there's not an ounce of warmth or humility about them. I live and breathe it everyday. The word 'humble' is foreign to them. And how many times do I have to say I am not trying to equate money/gifts for sex! Re-read what I've said! What do you like about the women you date, and what do they like about you? How do you choose a woman to ask out? It really seems as if you do not like their personalities, so what is left but looks? And they don't seem to actually like you, either, if they aren't being good company when with you. A transactional approach will attract a transactional approach. Do you not believe that a woman would want to spend time with you just because she enjoys spending time with you?
Taramere Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 Whooaaaaa hang on ladies, Elaine and the rest of the feminist brigade! You are getting wayyyyy out of line here! I am not trying to impress with money nor target a particular sort of shallow girl. London is very expensive. The vast majority of professional females here are incredibly entitled- there's not an ounce of warmth or humility about them. I live and breathe it everyday. The word 'humble' is foreign to them. I've met plenty of guys who are having a good time there, with social circles of perfectly nice, genuine people. I'd say that if the way you're addressing women on here is typical of the way you generally deal with women, that's your problem right there. The only kind of women who will put up with that sorry sort of attitude are the ones who expect expensive treats for putting up with it. 3
hudson701 Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 I've met plenty of guys who are having a good time there, with social circles of perfectly nice, genuine people. I'd say that if the way you're addressing women on here is typical of the way you generally deal with women, that's your problem right there. The only kind of women who will put up with that sorry sort of attitude are the ones who expect expensive treats for putting up with it. Duly noted. So what should I do then, just be myself, and hope it all works out?
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