the_oz_man Posted June 7, 2015 Posted June 7, 2015 (edited) I am not going to get into a long, nitty and gritty detailed description of our relationship as I learned that a tl;dr post doesn't go far. That said, I don't know how else to title this post. My girlfriend is either extremely aggressive sexually...or so regretful of her sexuality that she questions whether we should be sexual at all. Because of her religious background, she does not believe in sexual intercourse before marriage. But...numerous times I have gone down on her (all at her prompting). After 3 months, without me asking (I have never been the initiator sexually up to this point), she gave me oral (she enthusiastically asked if she could). However, the other day, when I asked if she would give me oral after I had went down on her (since I thought this was now an ok thing for us to do together), I could tell something was amiss. After she did, she seemed regretful and distant. After we spoke later in the day, she once again questioned whether she should be sexual and if it was a sin. She also told me she felt uncomfortable and "gross" when I asked if I could watch (she said she thinks it is gross when guys say they want to watch...she was "blocking" the view with her body). She has had a lot of bad relationships with men. For many years she was a self-described "man-hater". I do know she is overcoming issues with past relationships where men were very aggressive with her. She says she was never raped, but the aggression from men has been something she has been working through. I don't know what to do.... While I know her religious beliefs are a driver in her life, I feel like when she becomes distant from her sexuality it really isn't her religion...but her past. Is there any way we can overcome these issues? Edited June 7, 2015 by the_oz_man
central Posted June 7, 2015 Posted June 7, 2015 Well, this is complex. She is going to be highly conflicted and guilty unless she's married or somehow rejects the indoctrination of her faith. IS she marriage material - do you even know yet? Are you passionate about each other, have highly compatible values and life goals, ability to discuss interesting and controversial subjects (your sex life being one of the most important!), and some shared interests? If she is potential marriage material, perhaps hang in there, but discuss whether her religious issues will remain as sexual issues after marriage, and whether she'll expect a religious commitment from you as well (that whole "equally yoked" thing). If she is not, then move on ASAP before you're both damaged and regretful.
Author the_oz_man Posted June 7, 2015 Author Posted June 7, 2015 Thanks for response. Marriage material? So hard to tell because we have only been dating for 3 months. When it "feels right", we really jive very well. I will also say we are older than some people may think. Both in our low 30s, and both working in professional fields. We aren't young and immature. Sometimes she is incredibly open sexually. She loves to touch and talk about sex. And she is very very open to initiating it. When she does, everything goes very well. At these moments we feel very close. Giving (on her end) is where the problems arise. She often questions the act (using her faith as a reason), but I feel like that is only an excuse she uses for something deeper. She is NEVER regretful when I go down on her. With that said, she is in a fragile state. I am her first "significant" relationship since a failed relationship 3 years ago ripped her life apart. After dating for 3 years and thinking marriage was likely, that man slowly left her and moved out of her life. It really damaged her. Self-confidence in herself was destroyed. Days she is feeling good about herself...she is very open sexually and confident. Days where she is struggling with self-confidence, that is when she questions our relationship. In the end, it really largely becomes all about her emotions. Since we are still in the "honeymoon" phase if you will, I deal with it because I know her past is something she is working through...but how long do I keep trying?
Gaeta Posted June 7, 2015 Posted June 7, 2015 No sex before marriage means no sex. I don't understand those people that don't want to have sex before marriage but then engage in all kind of sexual acts and don't consider it sex. Next, if her fears are only related to religious belief then you 2 may get married in a near future and you get to enjoy a fulling sexual life. If her fears are not religion related but bad experiences related than watch out. You may end up marrying this woman and sex just keeps on being something confusing to her and she keeps on putting you through dry spell for weeks or months. I think you need to stop engaging in sexual acts and give her some time to figure out what she wants and what religious guide lines she wants to follow.
Ninjainpajamas Posted June 7, 2015 Posted June 7, 2015 She sounds like she's got a load of baggage...I would be very cautious with her, you're not going to fix her problems, don't be a fool.
Author the_oz_man Posted June 7, 2015 Author Posted June 7, 2015 I agree Gaeta...and personally I don't feel it is the number 1 driving force in her reasoning. When her confidence wanes, she falls back to other things for comfort (her friends, religion, yoga, and anything else that will give her comfort when she is struggling). Sexuality suddenly becomes this awful thing that she should not enjoy. But once again...these questions only arise when she is struggling with her self-confidence (in other words...having a bad day)...and only when it involves me. Going down on her never seems to be a problem. I can't figure out what this really means. My only explanation is it is a problem with her comfort level with men.
Gaeta Posted June 7, 2015 Posted June 7, 2015 I agree Gaeta...and personally I don't feel it is the number 1 driving force in her reasoning. When her confidence wanes, she falls back to other things for comfort (her friends, religion, yoga, and anything else that will give her comfort when she is struggling). This is a good thing. This says she has a good support system in friends and church and she has tools (yoga) to meditate and regain balance. Sexuality suddenly becomes this awful thing that she should not enjoy. But once again...these questions only arise when she is struggling with her self-confidence (in other words...having a bad day)...and only when it involves me. This is normal inner conflict. We are sexual beings, our body is filled with hormones pushing us to want sex to reproduce and ensure the survival of our species. At 30 something she is at her prime, she should be enjoying a fulfilling sex life and satisfy all of her sexual needs. Instead her religion tells her this sexual pull is a sin and should not be acted on. It's the ultimate battle between the body and the mind. Then there is you, you are the one igniting in her those sinful desires so it's normal those inner conflicts arises when it involves you.
Author the_oz_man Posted June 7, 2015 Author Posted June 7, 2015 Thanks for the response again Gaeta. Perhaps I am trying to deny the truth...but it seems...in the end...that there is some degree of selfishness (on her part) involved. And when she tries not to be selfish (because she does, in the end, care deeply for me), she feels regretful for her actions and questions our relationship. In other words, she is deeply conflicted. The challenge here is, many times now (3-4 times already), we have said that we would not engage in sexual behaviour only for her to come on strong on me when we were in an intimate moment or situation. I certainly will never marry someone simply so I can have sex with them. Does abstaining for a while (even when she comes on strong) really change things down the road? The more I write (and process), the more I realize that perhaps this relationship (as good as it possibly could be) is simply happening at the wrong time in our lives. I am ready for a relationship, and she seems to be working through many things in her life. She wants romance and sexuality, but at the same time is possibly not ready for it. And perhaps no amount of abstaining is going to correct it.
Gaeta Posted June 7, 2015 Posted June 7, 2015 Thanks for the response again Gaeta. Perhaps I am trying to deny the truth...but it seems...in the end...that there is some degree of selfishness involved. And when she tries not to be selfish (because she does, in the end, care deeply for me), she feels regretful for her actions and questions our relationship. In other words, she is deeply conflicted. The challenge here is, many times now (3-4 times already), we have said that we would not engage in sexual behaviour only for her to come on strong on me when we were in an intimate moment or situation. I certainly will never marry someone simply so I can have sex with them. Does abstaining for a while (even when she comes on strong) really change things down the road? The more I write (and process), the more I realize that perhaps this relationship (as good as it possibly could be) is simply happening at the wrong time in our lives. As she had sex before?
Emilia Posted June 7, 2015 Posted June 7, 2015 Thanks for response. Marriage material? So hard to tell because we have only been dating for 3 months. When it "feels right", we really jive very well. I will also say we are older than some people may think. Both in our low 30s, and both working in professional fields. We aren't young and immature. Sometimes she is incredibly open sexually. She loves to touch and talk about sex. And she is very very open to initiating it. When she does, everything goes very well. At these moments we feel very close. Giving (on her end) is where the problems arise. She often questions the act (using her faith as a reason), but I feel like that is only an excuse she uses for something deeper. She is NEVER regretful when I go down on her. With that said, she is in a fragile state. I am her first "significant" relationship since a failed relationship 3 years ago ripped her life apart. After dating for 3 years and thinking marriage was likely, that man slowly left her and moved out of her life. It really damaged her. Self-confidence in herself was destroyed. Days she is feeling good about herself...she is very open sexually and confident. Days where she is struggling with self-confidence, that is when she questions our relationship. In the end, it really largely becomes all about her emotions. Since we are still in the "honeymoon" phase if you will, I deal with it because I know her past is something she is working through...but how long do I keep trying? Forgetting sex for the moment, do you ever feel that she pulls away from intimacy completely? That hot and cold thing, does it apply to closeness too? One minute she pulls you in, another she pushes you away? Does she provoke arguments for seemingly no reason?
Author the_oz_man Posted June 7, 2015 Author Posted June 7, 2015 Never had sex, and I do believe her. Religion, to some degree (whether it was indoctrinated or is an actual belief that she holds strongly to) does play some role in her life. But how much is do to comfort seeking or actual belief, I do not know. Days where she struggles with self confidence, I get the feeling she is looking for anything to give her comfort. I should also add we have broken up already once before. A week and a half later we were back together. She DOES not want to hurt me. She is so conflicted sometimes, she wants to end our relationship out of fear she will hurt me.I want to be the man to give her confidence, to support her when she is struggling, but as ninja said above, I can't fix her. The one thing that keeps me trying is she does understand that she needs to work on things in her life. She is beyond the "what is wrong with me" stage, and she is at the "how do I fix myself?" part. I stay because, maybe foolishly, I feel that once she has that life epiphany, I will be the man that was there by her side through it all, and I can see an amazing relationship when the dust settles. But...perhaps...that is only a fools dream.
Author the_oz_man Posted June 7, 2015 Author Posted June 7, 2015 Emilia...the distance only comes during sexuality. She seems to have a problem with intimacy and closeness in general. We are both experienced and intelligent enough to understand the importance of individuality within a relationship. She came off a very long term relationship that she described as needy (her being needy), and sometimes I feel like she tries too hard to be independent (or that she is confusing "needy" with enjoying the company of the other).
Gaeta Posted June 7, 2015 Posted June 7, 2015 She DOES not want to hurt me. This is important. People say these things when they know the other person is involved in them much more than they are themselves. I think you are wise to reconsider this relationship.
Emilia Posted June 7, 2015 Posted June 7, 2015 Emilia...the distance only comes during sexuality. She seems to have a problem with intimacy and closeness in general. We are both experienced and intelligent enough to understand the importance of individuality within a relationship. She came off a very long term relationship that she described as needy (her being needy), and sometimes I feel like she tries too hard to be independent (or that she is confusing "needy" with enjoying the company of the other). Does her mood flip from happy to something negative like angry or distant at the drop of a hat?
Author the_oz_man Posted June 7, 2015 Author Posted June 7, 2015 This is important. People say these things when they know the other person is involved in them much more than they are themselves. I think you are wise to reconsider this relationship. Thanks for your frankness....and this is something that has also bothered me. Problem is.....even after we broke up...she still wanted to hang with me and see me. We were "just friends", and after a week and a half, she was holding my hand and laying her head on my shoulder. She is not using me, and she truly does feel affection for me, and she truly wants intimacy with me, but...she is incredibly conflicted. We are at our best when there is no pressure on her (sexually...commitment wise...etc.). Knowing that, is taking the pressure off her something I should consider trying before breaking it off? I know she hates any type of pressure, but is that simply an unbalanced relationship?
Author the_oz_man Posted June 7, 2015 Author Posted June 7, 2015 Does her mood flip from happy to something negative like angry or distant at the drop of a hat? No drastic mood changes. As said in the previous post, pressure on her is where she draws back and becomes distant. When she feels no pressure from the relationship is when she seems to feel most comfortable. Problem is...that means she dictates all the moves...and I am always reacting to her. She is genuine, but I fear that it is simply an unbalanced relationship...and she isn't ready yet to have a real one even thought she found this man (me) that she truly cherishes. Bad timing is a hard pill to swallow.
Emilia Posted June 7, 2015 Posted June 7, 2015 I'm not sure someone who is this conflicted about intimacy can give you the consistent and steady love and support that you need and want, OP.
Gaeta Posted June 7, 2015 Posted June 7, 2015 Thanks for your frankness....and this is something that has also bothered me. Problem is.....even after we broke up...she still wanted to hang with me and see me. We were "just friends", and after a week and a half, she was holding my hand and laying her head on my shoulder. She is not using me, and she truly does feel affection for me, and she truly wants intimacy with me, but...she is incredibly conflicted. We are at our best when there is no pressure on her (sexually...commitment wise...etc.). Knowing that, is taking the pressure off her something I should consider trying before breaking it off? I know she hates any type of pressure, but is that simply an unbalanced relationship? You being involved at a deeper level than her does not mean she is not involved at all. She does care for you, enjoys your company and comfort but she knows deep down she is walking on shaky ground and her involvement isn't as deep as yours. In my first advice I suggested you take sex off the table. No more fooling around and avoid circumstances where things could get too hot and too difficult to decline. Don't do that without talking to her first and explain to her for the good of both of you keep the intimacy on an emotional level only. But how long will you be willing to do that?
Gaeta Posted June 7, 2015 Posted June 7, 2015 When she feels no pressure from the relationship is when she seems to feel most comfortable. Again, this means she feels best when she does not feel you are more involved than her. At the moment she feels 'pressure' she withdraws because your level of involvement makes her uncomfortable because it's unbalanced with her. This is something everyone has experienced at some point.
Author the_oz_man Posted June 7, 2015 Author Posted June 7, 2015 (edited) You being involved at a deeper level than her does not mean she is not involved at all. She does care for you, enjoys your company and comfort but she knows deep down she is walking on shaky ground and her involvement isn't as deep as yours. In my first advice I suggested you take sex off the table. No more fooling around and avoid circumstances where things could get too hot and too difficult to decline. Don't do that without talking to her first and explain to her for the good of both of you keep the intimacy on an emotional level only. But how long will you be willing to do that? Gaeta...thank you for all your advice. Everything you have said has been either spot on or something I have already thought about at some point. Background real quick...I have been single my entire life...until now. Yes, you read that right. I learned independence on my own...because I had to. I had no friends, and I was always far away from my family. Relying on myself is easy for me. She is the complete opposite. She has always had a ton of friends, and she really relies on those people when life gets challenging. I don't. I am happy within myself, and I don't need others to fill a hole. I still think...to some degree (even thought she is finding herself) that she does. In other words...we are at different stages of life. It isn't that I can't "wait". I have been sexless, relationship less for years. I can live without it! But I don't know how much I can "see if this is really right" only to find that it wasn't right to begin with. My whole life. And I am strong and happy with or without her. But...I feel this draw to her because I feel her ready to break through in life. But perhaps I am fooling myself... Moving is on is tough..but the more I process and write here...the more I realize it may be the best for both of us. But....I cling to hope. And I know hope can be an amazing thing...and at the same time an awful thing. Edited June 7, 2015 by the_oz_man
Recommended Posts