Guy invites himself over

[Hawaii51]

 

ES, I think you did the right thing rejecting his "suggestion" to come over to your apartment before dinner. As Black Ops Girl pointed out, people that you meet through online dating are complete strangers who friends or family or coworkers can't verify. Always better to be safe than sorry.

 

And the fact that his communication especially on social media has dwindled to nothing after you made it clear he wasn't going to come over before dinner is no coincidence.

 

When guys start off all gangbusters with the charm and wit it's because they have an agenda. If their target doesn't fall for it, i.e. puts up very clear and very strong boundaries, then they pull back the charm and wit and move on to the next woman. But if the woman is naive and falls for it, she gets used.

 

Hopefully this guy isn't like that, ES. Hopefully he's the real deal for you. Only time will tell. You're a smart cookie. I hope it works out for you.

 

Men aren't a bunch of rapers, and women aren't helpless. She declined his suggestion, and then he didn't respond fast enough. maybe it's a sign, maybe he just has a job, maybe he was driving across state,MAYBE he WAS >> recalculating distance to vagina<< after getting detoured. But I sincerely doubt he was trying to get inside her before dinner. Either way ES is over thinking it, and doesn't have the patience to let dynamics play out naturally with out the 2 cents of others.

Edited May 15, 2015 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Edited quote and response thereto

[PegNosePete]

Even the decent and respectful men push the sexual boundaries, even if they preface it with a "please?"

Well, I've never done that. And I am definitely interested in women. Pursuing sex might get you laid but it won't get you a relationship, which is what I am interested in. And I can assure you there are many men out there like me.

[Hawaii51]

Alas, it's true for most men Pete. Show me a man who isn't driven by his nether region around women and I'd point out to you that he's not interested in women. Some men? I'd say that it's most men. Even the decent and respectful men push the sexual boundaries, even if they preface it with a "please?"

 

You act like men decided to act like a man, and put his chemistry on along with his pants this morning. In fact, is human nature to be so primal, it's just exuded differently by women. Human beings living out their lives in the lower realms of survival, sexuality, and power act this way. Not just men, but people who aren't compassionate or nary have a thought deeper than football or coach purses.

 

I just give people the benefit of the doubt and observe.

Edited May 15, 2015 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[BluEyeL]

Several men suggested they pick me up when I was doing OLD, including my current boyfriend. I politely declined every time and they never made an issue of it. I wouldn't say it's a huge deal at all. I know for sure that my current boyfriend was trying to be polite and maybe to see if I was real, not to get sex. We waited 3 months to have sex and he would have waited longer. I didn't let him pick me up until way later than the first few dates, and everything went fine.

 

I would say just date the guy and find out who he is by looking at all the details and the big picture.

[elaine567]

But I sincerely doubt he was trying to get inside her before dinner.

 

He perhaps wanted inside her, INSTEAD of dinner.

I think that was what was concerning the OP.

He was maybe trying to skip the niceties, by getting into her apartment and down to business - who cares then about eating dinner...

- the complete stranger in her apartment was also a concern.

[writergal]

You act like men decided to act like a man, and put his chemistry on along with his pants this morning. In fact, is human nature to be so primal, it's just exuded differently by women. Human beings living out their lives in the lower realms of survival, sexuality, and power act this way. Not just men, but people who aren't compassionate or nary have a thought deeper than football or coach purses.

 

I just give people the benefit of the doubt and observe.

 

So, because ES didn't give him the benefit of the doubt and let him come to her place before dinner, that means she's paranoid? That's a rather misogynist perspective. ES was smart to say no to the guy's "suggestion" that he come over to her place before dinner.

 

And what's your point about people being superficial? That makes no sense.

 

Smart women have good boundaries. Naive women have poor boundaries and that's how they can get into bad situations with men they barely know whom they met online. Read the news. There are many stories of women who were attacked in their own homes by men they met via online dating. So don't accuse women of being paranoid because they have good boundaries, because it seems like that is what you're doing.

 

It's one thing to give someone the benefit of the doubt when they've shown you that you can trust them. But to give a complete stranger the benefit of the doubt? Not smart.

Edited May 15, 2015 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[William]

Folks, I did a little cleanup and will remind members of our policy about 'the past', in that discussing it, meaning member's past postings, is generally discouraged, though our written policy does permit it if the postings are quoted directly and linked to and relevance is established to the current topic. Otherwise, respond to postings in their context here, in this thread.

 

For more information on the guideline involved, see here:

 

LoveShack.org: Community Guidelines

 

Specifically:

 

We expect that all participants will respond to posts in their specific context, not to the person who has posted. While opinions may be formed of various members based on what they have posted in the past, any response to any particular submission should be grounded in what has been posted in that thread. Past disagreements should not be resurrected in new threads. It is important that criticism be directed at what is stated in a post ("I don't like your idea") rather than at the individual making the statement ("I don't like you")

 

Thank you in advance for your cooperation with this moderation directive.

[Eternal Sunshine]

Looks like my instincts were right.

 

After not hearing from him at all today, I texted him to make sure we are still on for tomorrow's date. He never responded (it was over 4 hours ago). He has also extensively used social media during that time.

 

Keep in mind that the only thing I actually told him was "I will meet you <at the restoraunt>" after his apartment suggestion.

 

All my words/actions were consistent and I didn't do a thing to mess it up as I am sure some will suggest. Blah.

[Gaeta]

Looks like my instincts were right.

 

After not hearing from him at all today, I texted him to make sure we are still on for tomorrow's date. He never responded (it was over 4 hours ago). He has also extensively used social media during that time.

 

Keep in mind that the only thing I actually told him was "I will meet you <at the restoraunt>" after his apartment suggestion.

 

All my words/actions were consistent and I didn't do a thing to mess it up as I am sure some will suggest. Blah.

 

No, you didn't do anything to mess it up that's for sure.

 

Now going back to him telling you constantly how gorgeous you are, do you think it was him on the fast lane trying to seduce you?

 

Also, out of curiosity, I know another poster asked but I didn't see your answer: How many dates would you need to invite someone over your place? and not assuming it means sex.

[katiegrl]

Hawaii, you really need to stop being so obtuse. He is a stranger, she barely knows him!

 

Nevermind whether or not he was *testing boundaries* .... a woman allowing a man she barely knows into her apartment is just STUPID! Period.

 

Are you even aware of the rape statistics in this country? Apparently not, so allow me to enlighten you....

 

84% of women who are raped *know their assailant*.

 

57% of rapes *occur on a date*.

 

And the REAL shocker:

 

25% of men surveyed believed rape was ACCEPTABLE if: (1) the woman asks the man out, (2) if the man pays for the date, and (3) the woman goes back to the man's apartment after (or before) the date .... OR **the man goes back to the woman's apartment after (or before) the date.**

 

So would you just stop please? It's just not safe. Again, she doesn't know him, so why chance it? Is it not better to be safe than sorry? And get to know him better? What's the harm in that?

 

With statistics like the above, I cannot believe you are even arguing about this, quite frankly.

 

p.s I am happy to hear you and other men on this board are decent, honorable guys who would never even consider such an atrocity as the above statistics suggest.

 

But NOT all men are quite as honorable....so it is ALWAYS best for a woman to exercise the utmost amount of caution, until such time she gets to know the man better.

 

I mean come on now dude...this is just common sense.

[carhill]

Looks like my instincts were right.

Could you clarify?

 

After not hearing from him at all today, I texted him to make sure we are still on for tomorrow's date. He never responded (it was over 4 hours ago). He has also extensively used social media during that time.

 

I'd have to go back and check the timeline but I recall his last response, the one to your suggestion to meet at the restaurant, was delayed as well.

 

Keep in mind that the only thing I actually told him was "I will meet you <at the restoraunt>" after his apartment suggestion.

 

Yes, you did, kept it simple and he responded affirmatively and you and he had an apparently enjoyable date.

 

All my words/actions were consistent and I didn't do a thing to mess it up as I am sure some will suggest. Blah.

 

I can't see any direct actions which could have 'messed' things up; however, beware of 'instincts' and how they can, even if not acted upon affirmatively, leak into the interaction. IOW, if your 'little voice' is telling you he's a player, as example, but you still move forward, that little voice can leak into your interpretations of his words and actions, your responses to them and so on and so forth, like a 'vibe'.

 

My take is it's a weekend date and early times and both parties are, apparently, socially popular so each enjoys the availability of multiple options. I dealt with this a lot when dating women in my demographic, since nearly all were dating other men concurrently. If a BBD (bigger, better deal) caught their attention for the prime weekend date nights, that guy got the nod and I got the abyss. That's how it can go! Who knows here. I only knew from female friends explaining how it works. Guys can do the same thing. Hope it works out!

[BlackOpsZombieGirl]

I don't necessarily think a single mother has to all the more suspicious about a guy picking her up from work or home for a date. A guy is not going to kidnap or attack his date's children. Sure they have to be careful on introducing their men to their kids if they suspect they are not going to stick around and don't want a procession of guys coming & going in their lives.

 

How do you know what's on the mind of a potential murderer, kidnapper or rapist?! Single moms absolutely posilutely have to be extra EXTRA cautious, suspicious and careful about allowing a STRANGER from OLD or IRL to pick her up after work or at her house! Even if a guy has no intention of kidnapping or attacking her children, he could have his sights set on HER!! And if he's a looney tune, he'll know where she (and her kids) lives, where she works and can go to her house at ANY TIME to do whatever he wants to her!!! It's not about women only having to be careful of introducing a guy to her kids so that there's not a procession of guys coming and going out of their lives, even though that's another reason for a woman to be careful - but the MAIN reason for a mom to assure the SAFETY of her children, her household as well as herself is for her to NEVER EVER give out her address to a complete and utter STRANGER without having known him first for a while.

 

 

As for rapists, really how many online dating serial rapists news stories are out there. For all the hundreds of millions of dates can you link to a handful from the last few yrs. There was a post here recently on the topic and someone posted a stat showing rape was down 60% in like the last 15 yrs and this is during the boom OLD times. I know someone posted a story here about some guy pushing himself onto the woman when he came to her place to pick her up, but she pushed him off yelled at him and he left. ES's guy who she knows where he works and has a career and she has seen his social media profiles and can be tracked by IP or mobile or cctv easy enough is hardly likely going to risk screwing up his life + 10 yrs in jail for an attempted rape at her apt. Women take way bigger risks with their ONS.

 

I get why she was annoyed at the redundancy of him meeting at her place before the date. If he swinging by to pick her up in his car then different story, but I think she was too quick to write him off without just being miffed and deflecting his plans which she ended up doing and it went fine. The coinciding fall back in his communication is not an ideal sign and it could be now that he's a bit miffed that ES is no easy play, but who knows. Seems great single guys are not easy to find so keep going till the red flags pile up.

 

Sorry, but I don't care about 'national statistics', 'national averages' or what some articles say about how rapes against women are 'decreasing' and other such nonsense. I know what I see on the news and hear on the radio almost everyday...I know about what women (who I personally know) have told me about their horrible experiences with seemingly 'nice' and 'respectful' men who have tried to rape them, brutalize them and do horrific things to their children...in short, I KNOW how this world is. It's REALITY.

 

And, I'm intelligent enough to know NOT to trust any and every guy who APPEARS as though they're decent human beings who innocently want to pick me up at my house just because they're being 'polite' or 'chivalrous'. If that makes me 'paranoid' in some peoples' eyes, then SO BE IT. I'd rather people think that I'm being paranoid because I choose to keep my children and myself SAFE in our home than to be trusting of every guy I meet just to satisfy everyone else and then have something HORRIFIC happen to myself and/or to my kids. When I feel that a guy is trustworthy, when I have someone that I know in law enforcement to investigate him to make sure he's not a felon, a sexual predator or has a shaky criminal past and his file comes up clear, THEN he can come to my house to 'pick me up for dinner'.

 

Men don't have to worry about their safety nearly as much as we do; hence why a lot of guys just don't 'get it' and they deem us as 'paranoid' or 'over analyzing' a situation when, in actuality, we're just being cautious, careful and SAFE.

 

And I agree with you, there are great single guys out there. I know there are. But, a woman has to determine for herself how 'great' and SAFE a guy is by following certain protocols FIRST before giving a complete stranger her home address.

 

.

[writergal]

Hawaii, you really need to stop being so obtuse. He is a stranger, she barely knows him!

 

Nevermind whether or not he was *testing boundaries* .... a woman allowing a man she barely knows into her apartment is just STUPID! Period.

 

Are you even aware of the rape statistics in this country? Apparently not, so allow me to enlighten you....

 

84% of women who are raped *know their assailant*.

 

57% of rapes *occur on a date*.

 

And the REAL shocker:

 

25% of men surveyed believed rape was ACCEPTABLE if: (1) the woman asks the man out, (2) if the man pays for the date, and (3) the woman goes back to the man's apartment after (or before) the date .... OR **the man goes back to the woman's apartment after (or before) the date.**

 

So would you just stop please? It's just not safe. Again, she doesn't know him, so why chance it? Is it not better to be safe than sorry? And get to know him better? What's the harm in that?

 

With statistics like the above, I cannot believe you are even arguing about this, quite frankly.

 

p.s I am happy to hear you and other men on this board are decent, honorable guys who would never even consider such an atrocity as the above statistics suggest.

 

But NOT all men are quite as honorable....so it is ALWAYS best for a woman to exercise the utmost amount of caution, until such time she gets to know the man better.

 

I mean come on now dude...this is just common sense.

 

+1 post katiegirl!

 

And ES, always trust your instincts. No, you didn't do or say anything to mess this situation up. If he's using social media but is now ignoring you then it is telling about what his true intentions with you were. At least that's how I see it.

[BlackOpsZombieGirl]

+1 post katiegirl!

 

And ES, always trust your instincts. No, you didn't do or say anything to mess this situation up. If he's using social media but is now ignoring you then it is telling about what his true intentions with you were. At least that's how I see it.

 

Yep. +1 to KatieGrl for her most excellent post and also a +1 to WriterGal for this statement.

 

ES, you're doing just fine. You did EVERYTHING right by keeping yourself safe and sound. But um, my only suggestion to you for any (and ALL) future guys that you date is this: Do NOT (and I repeat,) DO NOT give out your address to him (even if it's just your apartment building number) or let them know where you work. It's bad enough as it is that a bad person can track you down with all of the technology based hacks that they can do, like tracking you from your computer's IP Address or from your GPS feature on your Android or iPhone (I always keep mine switched to OFF and only use my GPS when I actually need to map out my destination or find out where a store is).

 

Yeah...the fact that this guy hasn't said a peep to you after all of this time and yet is online, shows you exactly what his true intentions were - thank the Lord Almighty that you didn't let that creep know your full address or let him pick you up at home!!!

 

 

.

[Thermals]

 

As a rule of thumb, any time a man is trying to get you alone, he is trying to have sex.

 

Why generalize?

 

Speaking for myself, as a rule of thumb, if I'm trying to get a woman alone, be it in public (Park, beach, mountain top), or in private (her place or mine) it's because I enjoy the privacy, it's just the two of us and I feel like I can connect with the other person. It's not always about sex nor is it most of the time either.

[Thermals]

 

25% of men surveyed believed rape was ACCEPTABLE if: (1) the woman asks the man out, (2) if the man pays for the date, and (3) the woman goes back to the man's apartment after (or before) the date .... OR **the man goes back to the woman's apartment after (or before) the date.**

 

Those men need to be locked up in a mental facility for the rest of their lives.

[katiegrl]

Those men need to be locked up in a mental facility for the rest of their lives.

 

You will get no argument from me on that one!!!

 

Unfortunately they must commit the atrocity/crime FIRST before that happens...scary!

Edited May 15, 2015 by katiegrl

[BlackOpsZombieGirl]

Why generalize?

 

Speaking for myself, as a rule of thumb, if I'm trying to get a woman alone, be it in public (Park, beach, mountain top), or in private (her place or mine) it's because I enjoy the privacy, it's just the two of us and I feel like I can connect with the other person. It's not always about sex nor is it most of the time either.

 

Why does she generalize? Because that IS the case 90% of the time with guys.

 

Now, you seem like an upstanding, respectful and safe kind of guy and that's a good thing. But, just because YOU have respectful and innocent intentions on why you'd want to get a woman alone, that doesn't mean that most guys do or that EVERY guy does.

 

For almost every single guy on this planet, their penis is their primary brain that drives them to flirt with women, to date them and to have sex with them. It's only when they have a genuine interest and intentions of having a relationship with a woman because they also want companionship, love and non-sexual affection is when their secondary brain (the one between their ears) drives them to seek that out. Every woman knows this. It's the reality we live with every time we want to date a guy. It's been like this for thousands of years, with no evidence of change in sight.

 

 

.

[carhill]

It appears, in this case, the OP asserted that, once her boundary was communicated, the man didn't push it; they went on date #3, had a good time, he didn't try to go home with her and they made plans for date #4, at this point now unconfirmed due to his lack of timely response.

 

Absent his request to meet her at her apartment, this would be an otherwise innocuous dating experience. He did, she said, repeatedly mention that she was gorgeous and apparently that has borne scrutiny as well. I tend to minimize this because, well, a large cadre of men on this forum have repeatedly stated the same thing and also because, in the beginning, 'gorgeous' in the man's eye is what initially separates one woman from the crowd. This man, absent nefarious intent, is 'out there' with his attraction and admiration of the OP's physical beauty. That's how romances and life-long marriages often start. The rest is up to the parties involved.

[wheream_i]

I would never do that to a woman I just asked out. I always suggest that we can meet elsewhere. That way, she knows what my intentions are and what they are not. And it's much more appreciated. He's setting himself up for the "after dinner party". Turn him down.

[hotpotato]

Why generalize?

 

Speaking for myself, as a rule of thumb, if I'm trying to get a woman alone, be it in public (Park, beach, mountain top), or in private (her place or mine) it's because I enjoy the privacy, it's just the two of us and I feel like I can connect with the other person. It's not always about sex nor is it most of the time either.

 

Because it's true most of the time.

Not noticing the pattern would be downright silly and even dangerous. As someone who has dated a lot in her younger years, I assure you, it is true. Come to my place/go to your place/cuddle/watch movie (at my place/your place) are all code for I want to bang. I have given many men the benefit of a doubt, but they all wanted to have sex. One guy got me alone in a shed and tried to have sex with me there.

 

Most guys aren't going to be like"Hey girl, I wanna grab dem teddies" so they ask in a more polite, roundabout way (see above).

 

Also, many men view being alone with him as the same as agreeing to have sex with him.

 

What do people do in private that they don't normally do in public? To bump uglies...

[hotpotato]

Because it's true most of the time.

Not noticing the pattern would be downright silly and even dangerous. As someone who has dated a lot in her younger years, I assure you, it is true. Come to my place/go to your place/cuddle/watch movie (at my place/your place) are all code for I want to bang. I have given many men the benefit of a doubt, but they all wanted to have sex. One guy got me alone in a shed and tried to have sex with me there.

 

Most guys aren't going to be like"Hey girl, I wanna grab dem teddies" so they ask in a more polite, roundabout way (see above).

 

Also, many men view being alone with him as the same as agreeing to have sex with him.

 

What do people do in private that they don't normally do in public? To bump uglies...

 

Oh yes, and let's not forget what happens if she is raped or sexually assaulted. People are gonna ask,

 

"Well, if you didn't want to have sex why did you go back to his apartment/your apartment/hotel room/etc ??? "

 

That's something women have to think about in these situations.

[katiegrl]

Oh yes, and let's not forget what happens if she is raped or sexually assaulted. People are gonna ask,

 

"Well, if you didn't want to have sex why did you go back to his apartment/your apartment/hotel room/etc ??? "

 

That's something women have to think about in these situations.

 

^^Absolutely ....and there have been many lawsuits/cases where the woman *was* raped, and was ripped to shreds in the courtroom for either going to his place or allowing him into hers, BEFORE knowing him better...

 

Suggesting it was *her* fault for getting raped because she allowed a guy to pick her up!

 

This IS reality! Read the news!

[Ruby Slippers]

After not hearing from him at all today, I texted him to make sure we are still on for tomorrow's date. He never responded (it was over 4 hours ago).

Disappointing. But not that surprising. He was obviously after easy sex and is moving on since he didn't get it from you.

 

I had a feeling from your other thread about him, when you described how he was going through so much effort to make the day perfect, that he was trying to fast-track to sex. Call me jaded, but like I said, it seems increasingly rare to find a genuine guy on OLD anymore.

 

I'd been messaging with this guy the past couple of days who seemed like a really good match. Age appropriate, lots in common, in my league, good flow to the communication, flirtation but nothing sleazy. Like you, I was starting to get a little excited, because everything was going well and he seemed very cool. Then he ruined it all by asking to come over and massage me after my tennis match last night, "as long as I'm naked" I swear I could hear the record SCRATCH when he said that.

 

I think it was pretty stupid of him, because if he had bothered to put in the slightest bit of effort, it probably wouldn't have been that long till I was naked. And then the next prospect, whose profile said he was divorced, admitted he's actually separated. I was about to go out with this guy last week, someone I'd been on two dates with already, but I saw a second profile of his pop up with a different, older age. Liar! He told me he was 39, but he's actually 43. And then he tried to defend himself, saying everybody lies on their profile. Lately, 99% of the guys I've talked to on OLD have been flakes, liars, and creeps. And these guys seem normal on the surface.

 

I'm sorry it didn't work out, but it's good you trusted your instincts and didn't let yourself be manipulated.

[hotpotato]

ES, sorry to hear his responses are tapering off. My gut reaction was that yall had reached magical date #3 and he was trying to cash in his investment. I hope things work out for you!