The spouse

May 13, 2015

If I was married and my husband cheated, I think that part would be the worst. Knowing he slept with someone else just for sex? Maybe I could get over it. Maybe. But knowing he was saying I love you to someone else?

I had that experience. And that he was saying he loved her was so sucky. I'd forgiven him the sex before I found out how much more. He was sorry and it was sex and it was over.. Ok. Then was the more and ugh. Yeah. The more was why he left.

And her, I don't doubt for a minute that she felt contempt for me. She whispered **** in his ear to steal him away. She interfered. She pretended to have a miscarriage the night he came home and was telling me. She was in the ER and needed him. Tears. *gag*

May 13, 2015

If I was married and my husband cheated, I think that part would be the worst. Knowing he slept with someone else just for sex?

for me -- it's totally different.

if my partner cheated on me and risked losing me and brought that kind of pain & mess into our lives for 15 minutes of average sex...? that would be a huge blow for me. see, love? i get that, i can understand that. folks fall in love and they start a relationship and they risk it all... for love. and at least i can find some kind of comfort that, you know... it was LOVE in question. fate, kismet, feelings, heart... can't really fight that.

but if you cheat on me just to get some extra p*ssy? like, i meant so little to you that you risked me just to get some on the side? game over.

May 13, 2015

for me -- it's totally different.

if my partner cheated on me and risked losing me and brought that kind of pain & mess into our lives for 15 minutes of average sex...? that would be a huge blow for me. see, love? i get that, i can understand that. folks fall in love and they start a relationship and they risk it all... for love. and at least i can find some kind of comfort that, you know... it was LOVE in question. fate, kismet, feelings, heart... can't really fight that.

but if you cheat on me just to get some extra p*ssy? like, i meant so little to you that you risked me just to get some on the side? game over.

Interesting perspective, Mariah. And I think you make a good point. But if he risked everything for the big LOVE, wouldn't you then expect him to leave you? So he could be with the big LOVE and they could have a life together?

I have a major disconnect over the idea that a person can be in love, and have no desire to make a life together or plan a future. That's always been the breakdown for me with xMM. If he loves me so much--as he claimed--then why not end his marriage so we could be together?

We were talking once and he told me that if our relationship was getting in the way of me finding a real partner, then he would let me go because "that's how much he loves me." To which I responded, "Then you don't love me all that much. Because if you really loved me like that, you'd figure out a way for us to be together."

May 13, 2015

And I think you make a good point. But if he risked everything for the big LOVE, wouldn't you then expect him to leave you? So he could be with the big LOVE and they could have a life together?

true, all good points.

however - i do believe that leaving simply isn't an option for some, no matter how big the love is. maybe i'm being silly & naive -- but just because someone chooses NOT to leave, it doesn't mean that the love wasn't true or real. divorce is not the end of the world, for sure. but some folks can't afford it, some can't bear to see their kids only half of the time. some folks have this... weird sense of loyalty and obligation, this deep need to "do the right thing" so it keeps them from making the final move.

when i was younger, i always thought that being cheated on by some kind of ONS or casual sex would be easier to get over because i could still convince myself that the person loves me, wants me. but with growing older, i find that it's quite the opposite - i don't have a problem in accepting the fact that i won't be someone's The One and One and Only and that i'm being dumped for love. it's like... if it's love and soul-mates and that kind of stuff -- then i wasn't hurt for nothing, you know? it was worth it to that person, i guess. but when i get hurt over some meaningless stuff such as ONS or casual sex...? that hurts me sooo much more.

May 13, 2015

I agree that some people just can't leave for any number of reasons you mentioned or a combination of those including plain old fear. What I don't get, in my experience with a separated MM, why bother with the emotional stuff and "falling in love" when you know you aren't going to leave. I never instigated the "I love you's" he was the one who wanted that from me, or telling me we were meant to be together, etc... How does a person say this to someone one day and then go back to their spouse? There are plenty of people content with casual sex, why get so involved?

May 13, 2015

I agree that some people just can't leave for any number of reasons you mentioned or a combination of those including plain old fear. What I don't get, in my experience with a separated MM, why bother with the emotional stuff and "falling in love" when you know you aren't going to leave. I never instigated the "I love you's" he was the one who wanted that from me, or telling me we were meant to be together, etc... How does a person say this to someone one day and then go back to their spouse? There are plenty of people content with casual sex, why get so involved?

i think -- it's simply hard to resist love.

now, not talking about serial cheaters, cake-eaters & folks with some kind of personality disorder -- i'm talking about people who do fall in love and can't leave. i've seen it happen and i'm not trying to justify anything or to romanticize an A... but it's hard to resist love. especially when you've been unhappy for years, it's so hard to stop yourself from falling... you know? and even if it's not fair to the other person, you want at least those wonderful memories and stolen moments that give you happiness and strength to move on.

it's just hard to resist love, falling in love, being with that person you want & love, with the person that makes you happy. you meet someone and suddenly you just want to dive in because it feels so damn good.

is it reckless and stupid, selfish? sure. As are messy, uneccessary messy. but when folks know that they WON'T leave, i think they go "all in" so they can have something to hold on to and be happy while it actually lasts.

it's like, you know it'll eventually be over - so why hold back? all of this goes for those who are emotionally unhappy on some level, of course.

May 13, 2015

I vacillate between this and understanding that I could never compare to her because she comes with the trappings of the marriage that he wants.

I sometimes think if he could just lift her out of the house and magically replace her with me, re-writing history such that I was there (or really, more accurately, give her the qualities that I have that she's missing...) he would.

When I think about her now, I understand her feelings and I understand how they got to where they are. And I empathize. And I don't want her to feel pain, but she's been feeling pain for years before I ever came into his view.

You make a very good point...the pain our AP 's cause their spouses, begins well before we even come into the picture. This is also true for their marital issues. It's easy to point fingers at the OW/OM blaming them for all their marital problems and their spouse straying. In reality, it's absurd and deep rooted problems probably existed well before the affair started.

May 13, 2015

I can relate to all of this, your description of her sounds exactly the same especially, except my MM never spoke of love for me. I do think it was just about sex for him. I think he caught some feelings though, and it was those feelings that made him run back to his W.

Rose: I've been reading your posts and hope each day is easing the pain that your A has caused. I have to believe it hurts a lot to be treated the way your MM treated you. His behavior just makes him a cad, and puts you in this awful position of having been used as an emotional trampoline to vault him back to being with his wife, after getting close to you caused him to develop feelings for you.

In a way, I wish my xMM would have done the same. The fact that he could go on and on about how much he loves/d me, and then offer no options whatsoever in terms of a future is what confuses me. He dangled this love carrot in front of my nose, but I could only have it on his terms, inside the small space he had created for me. if I didn't like his terms, then he would let me go find a more suitable partner...because he loves me so much. In one of our last conversations, he said, "I would love you so much, if you would just let me." WTF.

May 13, 2015

I agree that some people just can't leave for any number of reasons you mentioned or a combination of those including plain old fear. What I don't get, in my experience with a separated MM, why bother with the emotional stuff and "falling in love" when you know you aren't going to leave. I never instigated the "I love you's" he was the one who wanted that from me, or telling me we were meant to be together, etc... How does a person say this to someone one day and then go back to their spouse? There are plenty of people content with casual sex, why get so involved?

Yes, yes, yes. 100% my experience, too. I came to think that he liked the "I love yous" because that made it a love affair, and not just a plain old affair. And he didn't want to think of himself as a man who would have a plain old affair. He would only do all the stuff he did, for love.

sometimes I wonder what that word even means.

May 13, 2015

i think -- it's simply hard to resist love.

now, not talking about serial cheaters, cake-eaters & folks with some kind of personality disorder -- i'm talking about people who do fall in love and can't leave. i've seen it happen and i'm not trying to justify anything or to romanticize an A... but it's hard to resist love. especially when you've been unhappy for years, it's so hard to stop yourself from falling... you know? and even if it's not fair to the other person, you want at least those wonderful memories and stolen moments that give you happiness and strength to move on.

it's just hard to resist love, falling in love, being with that person you want & love, with the person that makes you happy. you meet someone and suddenly you just want to dive in because it feels so damn good.

is it reckless and stupid, selfish? sure. As are messy, uneccessary messy. but when folks know that they WON'T leave, i think they go "all in" so they can have something to hold on to and be happy while it actually lasts.

it's like, you know it'll eventually be over - so why hold back? all of this goes for those who are emotionally unhappy on some level, of course.

that all resonates with me, in my A, except xMM always said he was happy in his marriage. If he was unhappy, he wouldn't acknowledge it on any level. He would just say, "my cup got bigger..." so maybe he's just a cake-eater...

May 13, 2015

that all resonates with me, in my A, except xMM always said he was happy in his marriage. If he was unhappy, he wouldn't acknowledge it on any level. He would just say, "my cup got bigger..." so maybe he's just a cake-eater...

I don't know if I could handle my AP telling me he was happy in his marriage. Props to you Grapes for being so strong...I couldn't handle that.

And for the record, I highly doubt your xAP was happy. He seems like a "man" who has to keep up appearances. He also sounds like he has a huge sense of entitlement. IMO "happily"' married men do not fall in love with other women. Again, just my opinion.

May 13, 2015

I don't know if I could handle my AP telling me he was happy in his marriage. Props to you Grapes for being so strong...I couldn't handle that.

And for the record, I highly doubt your xAP was happy. He seems like a "man" who has to keep up appearances. He also sounds like he has a huge sense of entitlement. IMO "happily"' married men do not fall in love with other women. Again, just my opinion.

I tend to agree with you. Like most of us, I've done a lot of reading online about this topic, and there is a lot out there that says happily married people have affairs, etc. This may be true, if the affair is really about getting sex or some other specific need met. I have a hard time getting my mind around the idea that someone who is happily married falls in love with someone else, and professes his or her love openly and repeatedly. The mind boggles, and frankly it has really changed my thoughts about marriage and what it means to be in love.

He started out in the very beginning saying that he was not looking for a way out of his marriage and there were "no deficiencies." He also told me that he is "loved" and that his wife is smart, "fun in her own way," and "quite lovely." I interpreted this as meaning he is happy. He never once suggested that he would ever leave his family. So I think that he is, basically, satisfied but likes the excitement and passion of being in love.

May 14, 2015

I'm very new at this and have only seen my MM four times in two months, and it's my first time being an OW.

when we first met we bonded over both being cheated on, me finding out the previous week, and him six yrs ago by his wife. I was curious about his story so he told me and said that as far as he knew she hadn't done it since, but he didn't trust her. He admitted to cheating on her since tho with 'a few women', but if you see how this guy flirts, it's very hard to believe There's only been a few...LOL

anyways, that's pretty much all I know about her and have never had any negative feelings towards her, I actually feel bad seeing as I had just lost my love due to him cheating on me.

He has made comments about her not wanting sex much and that she 'bitches at him about everything', but that's only his opinion and men are very childish about that kind of thing so it's probably not that bad.

He gets pissy when she texts asking when he's coming home, but she's his wife, she's allowed to ask that.

To sum it up, I have mixed emotions, but none overly negative towards her. I believe she truly hurt him six yrs ago and he got back together with her because he loved her, now he says he's not 'in love with her' but stays cuz 'he has too much invested' whatever that means. Lol

I think she does love him though and I feel bad when I stop and think about her and I'm pretty sure she knows that he sleeps around.

I have had the opportunity to see her since I saw them drive by me once but I didn't look at them, that would make what I'm doing feel worse. And I am glad that he never talks about his kids...

I am ending it soon, he helped me through a very hard time and if I'd been in my right mind two months ago I would never be doing what I'm doing. Thankfully he never led me to believe it was anything more than a good time so I don't have 'I love yous' to deal with!

I don't feel that she's won at all

May 14, 2015

I'm very new at this and have only seen my MM four times in two months, and it's my first time being an OW.
when we first met we bonded over both being cheated on, me finding out the previous week, and him six yrs ago by his wife. I was curious about his story so he told me and said that as far as he knew she hadn't done it since, but he didn't trust her. He admitted to cheating on her since tho with 'a few women', but if you see how this guy flirts, it's very hard to believe There's only been a few...LOL

anyways, that's pretty much all I know about her and have never had any negative feelings towards her, I actually feel bad seeing as I had just lost my love due to him cheating on me.
He has made comments about her not wanting sex much and that she 'bitches at him about everything', but that's only his opinion and men are very childish about that kind of thing so it's probably not that bad.
He gets pissy when she texts asking when he's coming home, but she's his wife, she's allowed to ask that.

To sum it up, I have mixed emotions, but none overly negative towards her. I believe she truly hurt him six yrs ago and he got back together with her because he loved her, now he says he's not 'in love with her' but stays cuz 'he has too much invested' whatever that means. Lol
I think she does love him though and I feel bad when I stop and think about her and I'm pretty sure she knows that he sleeps around.
I have had the opportunity to see her since I saw them drive by me once but I didn't look at them, that would make what I'm doing feel worse. And I am glad that he never talks about his kids...

I am ending it soon, he helped me through a very hard time and if I'd been in my right mind two months ago I would never be doing what I'm doing. Thankfully he never led me to believe it was anything more than a good time so I don't have 'I love yous' to deal with!

I don't feel that she's won at all

I don't think I could be doing this without the "I love you" aspect. I really wish I had the ability to detach myself but the truth is, I'm deeply attached. I envy the OW that can accept it for "what it is". I wish I didn't expect so much. My unreasonable expectations will be my ultimate demise. Good luck when you finally decide to call it quits.

May 14, 2015

i think -- it's simply hard to resist love.

now, not talking about serial cheaters, cake-eaters & folks with some kind of personality disorder -- i'm talking about people who do fall in love and can't leave. i've seen it happen and i'm not trying to justify anything or to romanticize an A... but it's hard to resist love. especially when you've been unhappy for years, it's so hard to stop yourself from falling... you know? and even if it's not fair to the other person, you want at least those wonderful memories and stolen moments that give you happiness and strength to move on.

it's just hard to resist love, falling in love, being with that person you want & love, with the person that makes you happy. you meet someone and suddenly you just want to dive in because it feels so damn good.

is it reckless and stupid, selfish? sure. As are messy, uneccessary messy. but when folks know that they WON'T leave, i think they go "all in" so they can have something to hold on to and be happy while it actually lasts.

it's like, you know it'll eventually be over - so why hold back? all of this goes for those who are emotionally unhappy on some level, of course.

I really appreciate your perspective on this, I never thought about it. I often thought I was a "vacation" from the problems in his marriage, a place to hide and pretend he had a different life. When he kept pressing me to "let down my walls" with him emotionally I told him I was the one with everything to lose, and his reply was, "If I stay married, all I get is a life of misery." I thought at that moment "I am sooo happy I'm am not his wife and he's speaking like that about me." Life of misery? Have at it...

May 14, 2015

I really appreciate your perspective on this, I never thought about it. I often thought I was a "vacation" from the problems in his marriage, a place to hide and pretend he had a different life. When he kept pressing me to "let down my walls" with him emotionally I told him I was the one with everything to lose, and his reply was, "If I stay married, all I get is a life of misery." I thought at that moment "I am sooo happy I'm am not his wife and he's speaking like that about me." Life of misery? Have at it...

I think that's a solid point, and I said something similar to xMM (and he didn't like it.) Essentially the point was that at least I have options. I can walk away any time and find a new relationship that satisfies me and is passionate, loving and all the things I desire. He, on the other hand, is stuck wiith the same situation forever until he is brave enough to look at himself honestly. Even if he tells himself he's happy, he's still a cheater and will cheat again.

May 14, 2015

Well, I used to feel that she won and I lost, but actually the opposite is true.

I feel sorry for her. I never hated her. I don't like her as a person (nothing to do with her being his wife) but she didn't deserve any of it. She didn't do herself any favors by refusing to ever have sex with him again, though.

This! She told him to find a c**mdumpster for his needs. I saw multiple texts to that effect. So, I feel no pity for her, and no respect for someone who say such a thing. Beyond what it says about the assumed anonymous OW (me), it is rude to him to reduce his need for sex and intimacy to that word.

May 14, 2015

Exactly, I totally agree. and if you have to tell yourself you're happy, then you are not. The thing that is hard for me to get is that both he and his wife don't "want to be divorced", because socially they would feel less than..does that mean I am less than? Sanctimonious bullsh*t IMO, that if you stay married you somehow succeeded, in this way I do feel sorry for his wife and him, because they both stepped outside of their marriage and would rather sweep it under the rug in order to avoid being a "social outcast".

May 14, 2015

I don't think I could be doing this without the "I love you" aspect. I really wish I had the ability to detach myself but the truth is, I'm deeply attached. I envy the OW that can accept it for "what it is". I wish I didn't expect so much. My unreasonable expectations will be my ultimate demise. Good luck when you finally decide to call it quits.

It couldn't have started off with the "I love you aspect," right? So how did you fall into it?

May 14, 2015

I really appreciate your perspective on this, I never thought about it. I often thought I was a "vacation" from the problems in his marriage, a place to hide and pretend he had a different life.

I still think that. :/

May 14, 2015

Thanks, Grapes.

Rose: I've been reading your posts and hope each day is easing the pain that your A has caused. I have to believe it hurts a lot to be treated the way your MM treated you. His behavior just makes him a cad, and puts you in this awful position of having been used as an emotional trampoline to vault him back to being with his wife, after getting close to you caused him to develop feelings for you.

Our intended goal going into this was to add sex to an otherwise solid friendship, essentially become FWB to satisfy our needs. We each caught feelings, to different degrees. He kept calling it an "intense connection" and "attachment." But it was that that made him run back to his wife, and end it with me. I still can't wrap my brain around THAT - that he was unhappy, he found something that brought him happiness, and he let go of the thing that brings him happiness.

(Intellectually, I get it - it's guilt, fear, not wanting to break up his family... but my heart feels otherwise.)

In one of our last conversations, he said, "I would love you so much, if you would just let me." WTF.

The other creepy guy I started a thread about - the one who had multiple other ladies at the office on his prey list - said the same exact thing to me. We were friends, but I just found him oh so creepy, and this line just pushed me over the edge.

May 14, 2015

I agree that some people just can't leave for any number of reasons you mentioned or a combination of those including plain old fear. What I don't get, in my experience with a separated MM, why bother with the emotional stuff and "falling in love" when you know you aren't going to leave. I never instigated the "I love you's" he was the one who wanted that from me, or telling me we were meant to be together, etc... How does a person say this to someone one day and then go back to their spouse? There are plenty of people content with casual sex, why get so involved?

It's easy to get involved because sex is an act of love. I'd bet most fall in love.

May 14, 2015

I have a hard time getting my mind around the idea that someone who is happily married falls in love with someone else, and professes his or her love openly and repeatedly.

In these situations, you realize "I love you" becomes such an easy thing to say, especially to someone who wants to hear it. Whether the person means it or not is a whole other ballgame. It places importance on actions, and "love" just turns into another word.

May 14, 2015

In these situations, you realize "I love you" becomes such an easy thing to say, especially to someone who wants to hear it. Whether the person means it or not is a whole other ballgame. It places importance on actions, and "love" just turns into another word.

Yeah, I think it becomes habit, and I have no doubt that many WH love their BW in the way you love any family member, but aren't "in love" with her. It's also necessary to not have the BW get tipped off that something is amiss. If the ILY's stop, she'd notice.

May 14, 2015

Yeah, I think it becomes habit, and I have no doubt that many WH love their BW in the way you love any family member, but aren't "in love" with her. It's also necessary to not have the BW get tipped off that something is amiss. If the ILY's stop, she'd notice.

What does "love" even mean to these people anyway?

If someone can look their spouse in the eye, or their "other" in the eye and say 'I love you" knowing all the while that they have another relationship ( affair, marriage) the what meaning do those words actually carry?

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