Author empresario Posted May 11, 2015 Author Posted May 11, 2015 "Bring it on????" What threat did I make? Want to quote it? Get a fn life.. Obviously you have none whatsoever playing these games with everyone. You committed unlawful actions collecting data and admitted it on a public forum. That would probably be my first concern if I were you. You said you would take actions into your own hands with your 'skills'. That was a very immature comment. You have no skills. Also, I did nothing illegal. She gave me access to everything to do my own research. Please go antagonize someone else. Run along. Or try to back up your words. I don't care. You have no real power.
d0nnivain Posted May 11, 2015 Posted May 11, 2015 It will never benefit her to know what you did. You never should have done it in the first place. It will be less destructive but only slightly less destructive to hear it from you. She's going to find out eventually. You can't keep a secret like this. It will be beyond detrimental when she finds out from somebody other than you. 1
Ronni_W Posted May 11, 2015 Posted May 11, 2015 The thing that bothers me, is why would she have searched her rapist's address if she had no idea where or who. You are right, of course: she would not, could not have done that. So either (a), she already knew who/where...and therefore did not need and did not ask you to do anything about it, or (b), all your tech-savvy/secret-spy activity has NOT delivered the guy who may or may not have raped her. However, I think. To achieve your goals around this particular, possibly-true, may-not-true incident, you will of course have to tell her of your exploits and "success", yes? Otherwise, how will she ever know? From the human/humanitarian side, though. Maybe a rape or even only potential rape is not the best scenario to use, to further own goals or prove one's skills, importance, helpfulness, power, etc. There will be other opportunities for you, with far less potentially hurtful/harmful impact on the next person. But. If you know you're going to end up telling her anyway, then just do it...sooner than later will be kinder on her, in the long run.
todreaminblue Posted May 11, 2015 Posted May 11, 2015 No. I have not told her. To be clear, because I may have ambiguously stated it before...she does not know herself who raped her or where it happened. At least that's what she told me. So really, I want to know if I should even give her the opportunity to face her rapist...or if some things are better left buried. I couldnt in my whole entire life dread anything more than seeing my rapist face to face......i dont want to face him.....it would eb trauma on top of trauma on top of trauma.....maybe that is part of the reason why i have never gone to the police when i have been assaulted and why my parents decided to keep my sexual abuse as a child a secret...... as donnivain said so eloquently in her post to you ...you have violated her privacy, insinuated yourself in something she didnt want you to be involved in...thats what she got from trusting you enough to tell you......how often do you think women would make up sexual abuse ....a horrible experience...men seem to think it happens all the time women make it up...that is a huge problem........ i know what its like to be thought a liar......to not be believed ....to be ridiculed for having a sexual abuse history claiming i sought attention fo all things.........and people wonder why women dont come forward......and keep sexual abuse that is not their fault in the slightest a dirty shameful secret...because thats how they are made to feel...dirty ....perverted....shameful.......some how they made it happen because they are promiscuous and cant be trusted...or they want attention ...or to cover up another misdeed..disgusting behavior to treat a person who has suffered a traumatic crime huh...... i was disappointed by your opening post showed so much lack of foresight my head spun......leave her alone move on...let her find someone more trusting in whom she can trust with sensitive and the trauma she has been through treat her with compassion and understanding.... it is possible to black out during a rape actually...its also quite possible to develop ptsd...its also possible like me to develop alternate personalities to deal with abuse......and all this happens without control.....the woman has no control ...do you understand that concept.....being helpless and abused...so...no control....the body does things to protect itself from severe trauma...black out is one........ you again have taken her no as a yes and violated her privacy you need to tell her the truth.....and let her decide whether she wants to see you again...no actually means no....even when it comes down to privacy issues...no....is no....never meant to be a yes go ahead.......deb 4
beach Posted May 11, 2015 Posted May 11, 2015 No. I have not told her. To be clear, because I may have ambiguously stated it before...she does not know herself who raped her or where it happened. At least that's what she told me. So really, I want to know if I should even give her the opportunity to face her rapist...or if some things are better left buried. More, this is not yours to reveal. And the physical evidence of the rape is now long gone. It's been her choice all along to ignore it - by pretending it never happened. You may have hard evidence where it took place - but that wouldn't mean that guy is the one who did it! Anyone can be gone from their own house - someone else could be walking by - and boom, she's being raped... Whatever the back story is - this gal is messed up and isn't ready to face her truth or demons. You forcing it into the open could be VERY detrimental to her since she isn't "ready" emotionally to process it. Stay out of it! In fact, don't date her - she's messed up and has a lot to work through. You can't do it for her
Author empresario Posted May 11, 2015 Author Posted May 11, 2015 I couldnt in my whole entire life dread anything more than seeing my rapist face to face......i dont want to face him.....it would eb trauma on top of trauma on top of trauma.....maybe that is part of the reason why i have never gone to the police when i have been assaulted and why my parents decided to keep my sexual abuse as a child a secret...... as donnivain said so eloquently in her post to you ...you have violated her privacy, insinuated yourself in something she didnt want you to be involved in...thats what she got from trusting you enough to tell you......how often do you think women would make up sexual abuse ....a horrible experience...men seem to think it happens all the time women make it up...that is a huge problem........ i know what its like to be thought a liar......to not be believed ....to be ridiculed for having a sexual abuse history claiming i sought attention fo all things.........and people wonder why women dont come forward......and keep sexual abuse that is not their fault in the slightest a dirty shameful secret...because thats how they are made to feel...dirty ....perverted....shameful.......some how they made it happen because they are promiscuous and cant be trusted...or they want attention ...or to cover up another misdeed..disgusting behavior to treat a person who has suffered a traumatic crime huh...... i was disappointed by your opening post showed so much lack of foresight my head spun......leave her alone move on...let her find someone more trusting in whom she can trust with sensitive and the trauma she has been through treat her with compassion and understanding.... it is possible to black out during a rape actually...its also quite possible to develop ptsd...its also possible like me to develop alternate personalities to deal with abuse......and all this happens without control.....the woman has no control ...do you understand that concept.....being helpless and abused...so...no control....the body does things to protect itself from severe trauma...black out is one........ you again have taken her no as a yes and violated her privacy you need to tell her the truth.....and let her decide whether she wants to see you again...no actually means no....even when it comes down to privacy issues...no....is no....never meant to be a yes go ahead.......deb This whole thing happened because she gave me the right to go through her things. But yes, I understand. This gives me more insight than most posts into what would be best for her. Thank you. I will bury it. That's all I wanted to know. I never claimed to needing to tell her. I never claimed to NEEDING to know the truth. I just wanted to know, given the opportunity, if it was 'just', right, or fair to allow the person to be brought to justice. I would never think of doing that on my own. It's not my gavel to swing. Being a male, and never being raped, I just needed some clarity from some people that may know what it's like. For that, I thank you. 1
Author empresario Posted May 11, 2015 Author Posted May 11, 2015 It will never benefit her to know what you did. You never should have done it in the first place. It will be less destructive but only slightly less destructive to hear it from you. She's going to find out eventually. You can't keep a secret like this. It will be beyond detrimental when she finds out from somebody other than you. Rest easy knowing she won't find out from someone else. It's either I tell her or no one. And I think it's painfully obvious the opinion is to just bury it. And that is something I can do. At the end of the day if I can't trust her on it, we will break up. Done and done. Thanks for the advice, even if it was misguided at times! There were parts that definitely helped.
todreaminblue Posted May 11, 2015 Posted May 11, 2015 This whole thing happened because she gave me the right to go through her things. But yes, I understand. This gives me more insight than most posts into what would be best for her. Thank you. I will bury it. That's all I wanted to know. I never claimed to needing to tell her. I never claimed to NEEDING to know the truth. I just wanted to know, given the opportunity, if it was 'just', right, or fair to allow the person to be brought to justice. I would never think of doing that on my own. It's not my gavel to swing. Being a male, and never being raped, I just needed some clarity from some people that may know what it's like. For that, I thank you. one thingi know about justice....is that the laws of man are perverted and tainted....that often the victim is made to feel like they are the one who has committed the crime and this happens often in a courtroom..... i was judged by my peers as a child for telling my history.......the only justice i got was isolation and ridicule......called devils spawn by a childs mother saying i was an attention seeker.....the mother then refused to let me play with her daughter or even for her daughter to sit next to me in the classroom.......the mother was a fine christian lady with pull in th ecommunity......so i never got invited anywhere....i became an outcast i was about ten i think.the only justice i have....is my parents faced him and the kids he was minding on weekends from an orphanage he worked at....no longer had to suffer as i did..........because he packed up the night he was confronted and ran...... these sort of people who know nothing of rape or abuse exist..... i am glad you read my post and that i provided insight..i feel a bit relieved actually that you read and understood.....i dont believe in you not telling her the truth.....i believe in honesty......and if you could come clean with her and be honest in your distrust for her.....certainly in that you truly do have her best interest at heart and not your own interests in appearing to be who you are not.....maybe you can convince her to get help.......because she may actually have reason to trust you...honesty can change peoples lives.....help her if you care.....and that doesnt mean you have to stay with her...try and get her help...while it is still at the forefront of her psyche and not festering hidden at the back somewhere.......its harder to deal with ....when it is left for years...........deb
BlueIris Posted May 11, 2015 Posted May 11, 2015 Oh, it isn’t MY opinion to bury it. Some maybe, but not me. I think it is a matter of integrity to tell her what you did. I believe that she has a right to know that you are going to act against her express wishes when you choose to, and that you feel perfectly justified in doing so. You did this research for yourself and ignored and overrode what your GF asked. You did what you wanted despite what she wanted. Personally, I think that that is the only reason you did not tell her immediately. Now, I don’t know how she will react WHEN you tell her the truth about defying her request (about her rape, you know, not about something that happened to you). Maybe she will see you as her knight in shining armor. That other woman did and you feel good about that, very proud. But you didn’t tell your GF what you did and now are sidestepping your intrusion and violation of her wishes by burying it. Not good at all. On a related note, doesn’t “Anonymous” get the consent or blessing of the victims they vindicate or assist? Or do they limit themselves to public cases, perhaps, cases that have already been reported and become active police matters so the question of anonymity is not an issue and the wishes of the victims are known? 1
Author empresario Posted May 11, 2015 Author Posted May 11, 2015 Oh, it isn’t MY opinion to bury it. Some maybe, but not me. I think it is a matter of integrity to tell her what you did. I believe that she has a right to know that you are going to act against her express wishes when you choose to, and that you feel perfectly justified in doing so. You did this research for yourself and ignored and overrode what your GF asked. You did what you wanted despite what she wanted. Personally, I think that that is the only reason you did not tell her immediately. Now, I don’t know how she will react WHEN you tell her the truth about defying her request (about her rape, you know, not about something that happened to you). Maybe she will see you as her knight in shining armor. That other woman did and you feel good about that, very proud. But you didn’t tell your GF what you did and now are sidestepping your intrusion and violation of her wishes by burying it. Not good at all. On a related note, doesn’t “Anonymous” get the consent or blessing of the victims they vindicate or assist? Or do they limit themselves to public cases, perhaps, cases that have already been reported and become active police matters so the question of anonymity is not an issue and the wishes of the victims are known? I will be brief because I'm mobile. Feel free to track . Again. She gave me permission. She never told me not to look because she didn't want me to...she initially requested I not look because she said she had tried and that it was futile. Look at it this way. Just as she has the right to bury something, I do too. If it doesn't help then it's not worth mentioning. There is no integrity in causing pain. Comparing a hacker group to someone that was given authority to all used materials is obscene. I am not a hacker, not because of ability. I have spent my life protecting peoe from hackers. Big difference. Have I done anything illegal? No. Have I acted out with my knowledge? No. The most I can be accused of is asking g for sincere advice from a community that claims to give it. I appreciate the advice I've gotten. From you and others. Ones that apply to my original questions. 1
d0nnivain Posted May 11, 2015 Posted May 11, 2015 Rest easy knowing she won't find out from someone else. It's either I tell her or no one. And I think it's painfully obvious the opinion is to just bury it. And that is something I can do. At the end of the day if I can't trust her on it, we will break up. Done and done. Thanks for the advice, even if it was misguided at times! There were parts that definitely helped. I have never advised you to bury it. I always told you to tell her. When you do she most likely will break up with you. You can't keep this from her. Even if everything else in your relationship went great how could you marry her knowing what you know & that you affirmatively kept such an important secret from her? It's toxic. 2
spiderowl Posted May 11, 2015 Posted May 11, 2015 It all sounds very strange to me. You don't cheat on your partner because you are trying to cope with being raped recently. I really don't see the connection between the two there. Can you show anything other than that she was with a particular person when she was raped? Obviously, you can't prove it was a rape but have you reason to suspect it was not? It seems strange your girlfriend blacked out. She was leaving her ex's so, if the logical thing happened - that someone spiked her drink - would it have been her ex? Was there anyone else there at her ex's? How was she getting home anyway? By car, on the subway, by bus? There is missing information here. It's possible that if the rape did happen she doesn't want you to investigate and do anything. Rape victims can feel very afraid of the possible consequences and personal embarrassment. How do you prove it was rape, for example, if it's your word against theirs? It would be difficult for you to take this further without her consent. I'm sure the police would investigate, if you could provide them (maybe anonymously) with evidence and pointers, but if your girlfriend is going to deny she was attacked then it's not going to go anywhere from a judicial point of view. Why were you investigating all this in the first place? Was it an attempt to find out who had abused your girlfriend, or to check that she really was? I can imagine you would have a great need to make sense of what seems to be some very strange behaviour. Did you notice different behaviour before and after the rape? I would have thought there would have been very distinct differences. I am wondering if you believe your girlfriend over all this or not? You say you know who did it. Do you?
BlueIris Posted May 11, 2015 Posted May 11, 2015 ... Again. She gave me permission. She never told me not to look because she didn't want me to...she initially requested I not look because she said she had tried and that it was futile. Look at it this way. Just as she has the right to bury something, I do too. If it doesn't help then it's not worth mentioning. There is no integrity in causing pain. Ah... quite different scenario. I wonder how I read that so very wrong. Then tell her that you looked into it, it wasn't futile at all, you found out lots of things. If that is really true, this is easy. Of course tell her. If she is A-OK with your having researched this and the only impediment or hesitation is that she thought it was futile, there will be zero fallout when you tell her what you did.
spiderowl Posted May 11, 2015 Posted May 11, 2015 I appreciate the sentiment. I am a wildly confident guy. I have no problems dumping her if it came to it. If everything is on the up-and-up then I am willing to stay in it to see what happens (knowing I can end it any time). If not, I am more than happy to act on that as well. Remember the married ex-BF? Yeah, he's divorced now. I also ruined his career in the medical field. And he can't ever see his son. Point is, I know how to dig up any information and act on it. I'm well connected, and I have resources. That's why I don't want to focus on me. I'll be fine. More so, if it is a rape, I want to know if I should tell her and how I should go about it. I'm trying to be sensitive about her situation and experience...which is odd for me. Empathy is not my strong characteristic. It's extremely worrying that you ruined someone's career out of what seems to be sexual jealousy! 2
d0nnivain Posted May 11, 2015 Posted May 11, 2015 She has slight details about where it was and what the guy looked like. When she originally told me, she told me not to look into it, because "I would never find out who or where". Well, as I explained, I am better than a P.I. at finding out stuff. I know who. I know where. She doesn't know these things. She doesn't know that I discovered who and where. Ah... quite different scenario. I wonder how I read that so very wrong. Then tell her that you looked into it, it wasn't futile at all, you found out lots of things. If that is really true, this is easy. Of course tell her. If she is A-OK with your having researched this and the only impediment or hesitation is that she thought it was futile, there will be zero fallout when you tell her what you did. Blue Iris The GF gave the OP access so she could prove that she wasn't cheating with the married ex-bf, not the rapist. Against her instructions not to look into the rape, the OP investigated that using the access he had been given for another purpose. You may be right. She may be thrilled he looked into this for her. But she may not be. Either way, he has to tell her what he did. 1
Author empresario Posted May 11, 2015 Author Posted May 11, 2015 It's extremely worrying that you ruined someone's career out of what seems to be sexual jealousy! I just need to post the full story when I get home. I tried to paraphrase the whole thing and it came off incredibly wrong and out of context. He is a doctor. He admitted to masturbaiting at work between clients and to using his bedside manor to pick up coworkers and patients. I simply brought those details to light. I wouldn't want my female relatives to be treated by him. Would you?
todreaminblue Posted May 11, 2015 Posted May 11, 2015 I just need to post the full story when I get home. I tried to paraphrase the whole thing and it came off incredibly wrong and out of context. He is a doctor. He admitted to masturbaiting at work between clients and to using his bedside manor to pick up coworkers and patients. I simply brought those details to light. I wouldn't want my female relatives to be treated by him. Would you? you need to post the whole story...you are right......because it isnt making sense now at all..........deb
Author empresario Posted May 11, 2015 Author Posted May 11, 2015 you need to post the whole story...you are right......because it isnt making sense now at all..........deb I will do that. Hang tight. It will be a book and I can't do it until later tonight. But I appreciate you deb. You are a good person and give good advice.
beach Posted May 11, 2015 Posted May 11, 2015 I just need to post the full story when I get home. I tried to paraphrase the whole thing and it came off incredibly wrong and out of context. He is a doctor. He admitted to masturbaiting at work between clients and to using his bedside manor to pick up coworkers and patients. I simply brought those details to light. I wouldn't want my female relatives to be treated by him. Would you? That's info that goes to the medical board... Only the evidence. Let them handle it. 1
Timshel Posted May 11, 2015 Posted May 11, 2015 Taking your thread at face value empresario, I have one question. Are you in love with her?
Author empresario Posted May 11, 2015 Author Posted May 11, 2015 That's info that goes to the medical board... Only the evidence. Let them handle it. Which is what happened. So, we are on the same page. We are speakity the same lingiddy
BlueIris Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 Blue Iris The GF gave the OP access so she could prove that she wasn't cheating with the married ex-bf, not the rapist. Against her instructions not to look into the rape, the OP investigated that using the access he had been given for another purpose. You may be right. She may be thrilled he looked into this for her. But she may not be. Either way, he has to tell her what he did. I completely agree with you.
velvette Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 Yes I think you should tell your gf that you THINK you know who her rapist is, see what her reaction is and go from there. But, you don't really know imo. Im sure any professional detective or private investigator could tell you how easy it is to take a piece of information and follow it to the wrong conclusion. You are an amateur detective, so probably even moreso. For example, how do you know the person you think is guilty of rape wasn't just another man she went to to cry on his shoulder, crash if she was under the influence, get a ride home with, whatever? My gut is that her story is not true. Experts disagree about how prevalent false rapes claims are. Usually, though, they involve women out for revenge which doesn't fit here or women who think they are going to face negative consequences for consensual sex which may fit here as the mostly likely reason for that to happen is young girls facing parental disapproval or wives/gf's who are cheating. Still if you want to assume her story is true, by telling you about it, she has given you the opening to talk further with her about it. Meaning, she is not likely going to fall apart by you talking about it. Further, if she is using it as her excuse for cheating, then you definitely have the right to delve deeper and require her to do the same with a professional if she is going to continue in a relationship with you. Even if her story is true, doesn't sound prosecutable with no evidence unless she is able/willing to be a super star witness in a he said/she said case. Of course, only your local police/DA can answer that, but it doesn't sound like she is willing/able. Finally, much of this depends imo on what you intend to be your relationship. If you are planning to marry her, then yes you have a right to know she was raped and further to require that she seek professional help imo. It has already affected your relationship. It will likely continue to do so. She of course has the right to refuse, in which case I would not continue the R. You don't have the right to insist she pursue prosecution, nor to pursue it on her behalf. A compromise would be to get her buy in to give the info to the police, let them assess it and in the event this guy has previous allegations pursue it if they think they can. Most rapists have more than one victim unless its their first offense. She wont be under any obligation to testify, although the police may talk to her and ask her to.
No Limit Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 Not believing the story either. Anyway, dump her and get the information to the police and run from this situation. Drama all around. Good job on her ex-MM though.
velvette Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 BTW her saying she didn't know the Doctor ex-MM boyfriend was married doesn't pass the smell test for me. Sure it happens that women get fooled. But, how hard is it to say to the receptionist in his office, "He's cute, is he married?" Seems like it would be incredibly easy to find out if a doctor was married.
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