Justanaverageguy Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 (edited) . But in either case, my question from before still stands, What standard test doesn't test for HSV in advance? The standard STD screen when you go to a doctor does not include HSV or herpes testing. You have to specifically request it. The reason they don't test for HSV (herpes) in standard STD screening is a complicated one to answer. It stems mainly around the stigma associated with genital herpes (HSV2) .... which does not exist for cold sores or oral herpes HSV1. Because so much of the population is unknowingly infected with HSV1 orally - if they did this as a standard blood test more then 50% of the population would come back positive for herpes. Yes you read right - 50% that's how high infection rates are thought to be in adult population in the USA - check stats - U.S. Rates of HSV-1 and HSV-2 Infection Are Falling The blood test for HSV has no way of telling "where" you are infected with HSV. There are two strains - HSV1 (oral) and HSV2 (genital) however both the strains can actually infect either mouth or genital areas. Oral HSV1 infections in the genital area are now massively on the rise due to oral sex. Health agencies basically decided that doing HSV blood tests as standard would cause too many issues because it does not tell you where you are infected and so many people would come back positive for HSV and think they had the genital form - an STD. In reality what most people have is dormant HSV1 virus in the mouth area which they likely got in childhood and which has probably been dormant for decades. To avoid confusion and panic they only do the test if you specifically request it. It is however scary when you realize you have been getting STD screened all these years but herpes was never part of that test process. Its also scary when the people who say they would "never be with someone who has herpes" realise they could very well have it themselves and not know it. I know all this because I had a scare some time back and I did my research into testing. I went to my doc to get STD tested and the doctor didn't include HSV even though I specifically requested it. In the end it turned out to be a yeast infection completely treatable with topical creme thankfully. I was still very very paranoid about herpes though and I did 4 rounds of specific HSV blood tests over the next 7 months to be absolutely certain I was clean before becoming sexually active again. (Can take up to 6 months to show in the blood). Thankfully I am negative for both HSV1 and HSV2. Edited April 10, 2015 by Justanaverageguy 2
elaine567 Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 HSV-2 is the herpes virus most usually associated with genital herpes. Epidemiology of herpes simplex - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia The most recent data for HSV-2 was published in March 2010, based on a National Health and Nutrition Examination Survey study performed between 2005 and 2008 by CDC. About 1 in 6 Americans (16.2%) aged 14 to 49 is infected with HSV-2. HSV-2 prevalence was nearly twice as high among women (20.9%) than men (11.5%), and was more than three times higher among blacks (39.2%) than non-Hispanic whites (12.3%).[8] The most affected group was black women, with a prevalence rate of 48%. Prevalence increased with age and number of partners. Only 18.9% of those infected had previously been aware of their infection.[8]
Toodaloo Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 HSV-2 is the herpes virus most usually associated with genital herpes. Epidemiology of herpes simplex - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Your the Wiki queen... I think women are more susceptible to getting things as well because our "bits" are inside so not as easy to reach where as mens are on full show and have greater access if that makes sense... actually reading back it doesn't but I am sure someone somewhere will understand what I mean.
Buddhist Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 I think he's a keeper, because he actually came out with it. That's a sign of personal responsibility and also some degree of care and concern towards you as well. A rare find indeed. I'll be honest with you. If I found a guy who seemed right for me and he came out and told me he had HIV, I'd probably still go there. Why? Because we are all dying every minute of every day, life sucks and people end up on the end of tragedy. Would I sacrifice the opportunity for real love merely because my intended had suffered a blow in life? No I would not. I know those kinds of thoughts are very far from the minds of 20 yr olds who still feel invincible, but once you cross a line and see your own mortality, you begin to understand what's really important. Love is important because it doesn't happen that often. Young people think it's always around the next corner, but it might not be. Some people never find it actually. If you have a chance for it, take it. 6
Justanaverageguy Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 (edited) HSV-2 is the herpes virus most usually associated with genital herpes. Yep it is - but FYI that is changing rapidly at the moment due to the fact oral HSV1 is so widespread its now becoming almost as common as HSV2 for infections in the genital area. Genital HSV-1 and Young Adults: The Changing Face of Genital Herpes "Most recently, a 2009 study published in the Journal of Clinical Microbiology noted women under the age of 24 tested positive for HSV-1 from genital lesions more often than older women. Overall, the study noted that 31% of the positive swabs taken from participants were HSV-1. For women under 24 with positive swabs, 47% were positive for HSV-1." So 31% of genital herpes found in women overall and 47% of genital herpes infections found in women under the age of 24 are actually from HSV1 not HSV2. Regardless I find it quite comical that people differentiate between the two so widely when they are essentially the exact same virus. If you have it downstairs - you're dirty and disgusting and I want nothing to do with you. If you have it on your lip then that's fine and its just a cold sore. Seems bizarre to me that the poor people who get it downstairs are vilified and avoided for something that is essentially harmless. I was scared about getting it but only for the social stigma associated with it not for any real health reasons. Edited April 10, 2015 by Justanaverageguy 2
Toodaloo Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 I think he's a keeper, because he actually came out with it. That's a sign of personal responsibility and also some degree of care and concern towards you as well. A rare find indeed. I'll be honest with you. If I found a guy who seemed right for me and he came out and told me he had HIV, I'd probably still go there. Why? Because we are all dying every minute of every day, life sucks and people end up on the end of tragedy. Would I sacrifice the opportunity for real love merely because my intended had suffered a blow in life? No I would not. I know those kinds of thoughts are very far from the minds of 20 yr olds who still feel invincible, but once you cross a line and see your own mortality, you begin to understand what's really important. Love is important because it doesn't happen that often. Young people think it's always around the next corner, but it might not be. Some people never find it actually. If you have a chance for it, take it. I have to say I would balk at HIV purely because I don't know as much as I should about it. The only contact I have had is through friends of friends so not what I could call direct... Had I not had frank and honest discussions with my friend about how her herpes affects her then I would probably be the same. In this case knowledge really is power. Power to look after yourself and power to go on to live a full life with a wonderful person.
Gaeta Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 Regardless I find it quite comical that people differentiate between the two so widely when they are essentially the exact same virus. If you have it downstairs - you're dirty and disgusting and I want nothing to do with you. If you have it on your lip then that's fine and its just a cold sore. Seems bizarre to me that the poor people who get it downstairs are vilified and avoided for something that is essentially harmless. I was scared about getting it but only for the social stigma associated with it not for any real health reasons. And what people don't know is that hsv-1 is considered the bad herpes. The type you get on your mouth can be spread to your genitals, mouth, eyes and even brain. When you have a cold sore you have to be extremely careful to not touch your eyes. Type 2 will never be spread anywhere else, it stays below the waist.
Gaeta Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 for most its a deal breaker.. Says who? How can you say something like this when you don't have it, and are so little educated about it? What do you base this statement on? It's a deal breaker FOR YOU. Do not speak for the rest of the population, please. As someone living with it and disclosing it within the first 3 dates I think I am in a better place to tell you if it's a deal breaker or not. And it's not. I had plenty of boyfriends since I've had this. 3
elaine567 Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 And what people don't know is that hsv-1 is considered the bad herpes. The type you get on your mouth can be spread to your genitals, mouth, eyes and even brain. When you have a cold sore you have to be extremely careful to not touch your eyes. Type 2 will never be spread anywhere else, it stays below the waist. NO, that is no longer considered to be true. "Herpes simplex virus (HSV) commonly causes infections of the skin and mucous membranes. Sometimes it can cause more serious infections in other parts of the body. HSV is part of a group of other herpes viruses that include human herpes virus 8 (the cause of Kaposi's sarcoma) and varicella- zoster virus (also known as herpes zoster, the virus responsible for shingles and chicken pox). There are more than 80 types of herpes viruses. They differ in many ways, but the viruses share certain characteristics, notably the word "herpes," which is derived from a Greek word meaning "to creep." This refers to the unique characteristic pattern of all herpes viruses to "creep along" local nerve pathways to the nerve clusters at the end, where they remain in an inactive state for variable periods of time. There are two forms of the herpes simplex virus: Herpes simplex virus 1 (HSV-1)Herpes simplex virus 2 (HSV-2) These viruses are distinguished by different proteins on their surfaces. They can occur separately, or they can both infect the same individual. Until recently, the general rule was to assume that HSV-1 infections occur in the oral cavity (mouth) and are not sexually transmitted, while HSV-2 attacks the genital area and is sexually transmitted. It is now widely accepted, however, that either type can be found in either area and at other sites. In fact, HSV-1 is now responsible for up to half of all new cases of genital herpes in developed countries." Source: Herpes simplex | University of Maryland Medical Center Herpes simplex | University of Maryland Medical Center University of Maryland Medical Center
Gaeta Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 NO, that is no longer considered to be true. There are no medical case of type 2 on the mouth. That was firmly confirmed to me by my doctor and supported by medical studies. In theory it could happen with a person immunodeficient but in practice so far no case has been reported.
Gaeta Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 What if your partner has genital HSV-2 and you perform oral sex on him or her? Will you get HSV- 2 in the mouth? Given the widespread practice of oral sex (some three-quarters of all adults practice it, according to The Social Organization of Sexuality, 1994) and the prevalence of genital HSV-2 infection, you might expect oral HSV-2 to be relatively common. It's not. According to one study, almost 100% of recognizable HSV-2 infection is genital (Nahmias, Scandinavian Journal of Infectious Diseases Supplement, 1990). One reason is that most adults are already infected with HSV-1 orally, which provides some immunity against infection with HSV 2. Another reason is that oral HSV-2 rarely reactivates, so even if an infection does exist, no one knows. Herpes HSV-1 & HSV-2
BlackOpsZombieGirl Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 I can see what some in here are saying with regard to the stigma attached to someone having an STD and why many are scared to disclose that type of info to a person they're dating. It's really scary though how the OP's date waited until before they were going to become intimate to tell her about his STD - but, at least he was HONEST and TOLD her. Many guys wouldn't have told her that and would've put her health at risk just to "get laid". It's truly frightening to me just how many people are walking around out there with STDs because they choose to sleep around with multiple people. See...THIS is one of my main reasons and has been one of my primary motivators to NOT be sexually promiscuous. I can count on one hand how many guys I've slept with in my entire life - sure, some guys might be put off by that because, in their mind, they'll automatically think that equals to me not having much "experience" in bed. But, it doesn't matter to me what anyone thinks about that. And besides, the guys I DID have sex with throughout my life are men that I've had plenty of time to become experienced with...being in the few monogamous relationships I've been in have allowed me to become comfortable with each of them and have given me the confidence and freedom of sexually experimenting with them. I've developed a sensuous, adventurous and tantric way of expressing my sexuality. And every lover I've ever had has complimented me on it. If I ever become intimate with any guy ever again, you can bet I'm going to request to see their STD test results and I'll allow them to see mine. I've been very cautious with my health and my body for my entire life along with operating within my own standards of morals, decency and ideals; and I'll continue doing so. Yes, sex is important in a relationship and sex is an enjoyable and satisfying part of my life and in most peoples' lives - but, sex isn't a necessity for me; it's something that I desire to have with a committed partner. I could happily live without it if I have to or if I don't find a special guy to have it with in a monogamous relationship. OP, it's your call as to whether you decide to intermingle his body fluids with your own - it IS risky though. And just because contracting hsv may not be life threatening or cause you to become wheelchair-bound, it doesn't mean it's completely harmless or something for you to take lightly. .
elaine567 Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 What if your partner has genital HSV-2 and you perform oral sex on him or her? Will you get HSV- 2 in the mouth? Given the widespread practice of oral sex (some three-quarters of all adults practice it, according to The Social Organization of Sexuality, 1994) and the prevalence of genital HSV-2 infection, you might expect oral HSV-2 to be relatively common. It's not. According to one study, almost 100% of recognizable HSV-2 infection is genital (Nahmias, Scandinavian Journal of Infectious Diseases Supplement, 1990). One reason is that most adults are already infected with HSV-1 orally, which provides some immunity against infection with HSV 2. Another reason is that oral HSV-2 rarely reactivates, so even if an infection does exist, no one knows. Herpes HSV-1 & HSV-2 Asymptomatic oral shedding of HSV-2 does occur in some people infected with HSV-2. So whilst it may not often cause obvious lesions in the mouth, it cannot be said that the HSV2 virus stays below the waist.
Gaeta Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 Asymptomatic oral shedding of HSV-2 does occur in some people infected with HSV-2. So whilst it may not often cause obvious lesions in the mouth, it cannot be said that the HSV2 virus stays below the waist. Elaine: A couple of years ago I read that article talking about hsv-2 on mouth and I ran to my doctor. I told him about reading this online and he told me: Gaeta, under very specific circumstances, in theory, it can be found on the mouth but with the same possibility that one day an airplane will fall on your house. In practice there are no records of hsv-2 on mouth. I replied : BUT....and he said NO BUT, your hsv-2 stays below the waist....and stop reading internet. You can also read on internet that hsv can be transmitted on a toilet seat which is a total distortion of information. In theory yes, in practice no. Hsv lives a split second when out of the body. So, like I said. If you have hsv please confirm any information you read online with your doctor.
Gaeta Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 I have to say something about those comments when is a good time to tell about this virus. I believe the person that carries the virus knows best when to tell depending on how well they deal with it. Medical field suggest to wait 1 month. The reason is it's not long enough for someone to get too attached to you but enough to get an idea of the person you are. I don't care how shytty you think this guy is for waiting 2 weeks or a month. You think it's shytty to hear it after 1 month? Try living with it for the rest of your life ! No matter how shytty you think it is it will NEVER be as shytty as he feels! Is that enough shytty word in one paragraph? I tried both. I tried waiting a few weeks and I tried telling right away. My style is to tell right away. Sometimes I tell online before a meeting, sometimes on a 1st date too but never any longer than a 3rd date. Longer than that I cannot live with myself. My best friend who's a woman my age who has hsv-2 is less confident, very insecure and she waits 2-3 months sometimes. She is more comfortable that way. So to those who complains about not being told quickly I tell you *suck it* you don't have to live with it, you're not the one having to spill your guts out each and every time you go on a date. 3
BlackOpsZombieGirl Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 I have to say something about those comments when is a good time to tell about this virus. I believe the person that carries the virus knows best when to tell depending on how well they deal with it. Medical field suggest to wait 1 month. The reason is it's not long enough for someone to get too attached to you but enough to get an idea of the person you are. I don't care how shytty you think this guy is for waiting 2 weeks or a month. You think it's shytty to hear it after 1 month? Try living with it for the rest of your life ! No matter how shytty you think it is it will NEVER be as shytty as he feels! Is that enough shytty word in one paragraph? I tried both. I tried waiting a few weeks and I tried telling right away. My style is to tell right away. Sometimes I tell online before a meeting, sometimes on a 1st date too but never any longer than a 3rd date. Longer than that I cannot live with myself. My best friend who's a woman my age who has hsv-2 is less confident, very insecure and she waits 2-3 months sometimes. She is more comfortable that way. So to those who complains about not being told quickly I tell you *suck it* you don't have to live with it, you're not the one having to spill your guts out each and every time you go on a date. Note the parts of your post that I've highlighted in bold. It is those reasons why some people "complain" about not being told right away when they're dating someone - they DON'T want to contract a sexually transmitted DISEASE! Surely you can understand why most people are afraid of acquiring an incurable disease from someone and why they would panic if that person didn't tell them about it from the get-go. But at the same time, I can understand why the person who has an STD would feel afraid and very hesitant about spilling those beans when they're dating. It would be helpful for all involved to understand the points of view from the perspective of the infected person AND from the person who does NOT want to EVER get infected. It's a slippery slope to navigate through; and I admire and respect people who are HONEST with others about their STD right out of the gate. .
Gaeta Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 Note the parts of your post that I've highlighted in bold. It is those reasons why some people "complain" about not being told right away when they're dating someone - they DON'T want to contract a sexually transmitted DISEASE! I am not sure I follow you! Not being told right away is not going to infect you with a virus. If I decide to tell a man after 1 month I am not going to bed with him or fooling around in any shape or form till I tell him. The same with my friend who takes a couple of months. She keeps it to bowling and horse back riding than she has the talk. In the grand picture who's having a harder time here? You or them? Yes your feelings might be hurt after one month but you get away with just that a bruised feeling. The other person has to pick up themselves, build up their self esteem again, deal with your rejection, and go to next and do it all over again so cut them some break.
elaine567 Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 Elaine: A couple of years ago I read that article talking about hsv-2 on mouth and I ran to my doctor. I told him about reading this online and he told me: Gaeta, under very specific circumstances, in theory, it can be found on the mouth but with the same possibility that one day an airplane will fall on your house. In practice there are no records of hsv-2 on mouth. I replied : BUT....and he said NO BUT, your hsv-2 stays below the waist....and stop reading internet. You can also read on internet that hsv can be transmitted on a toilet seat which is a total distortion of information. In theory yes, in practice no. Hsv lives a split second when out of the body. So, like I said. If you have hsv please confirm any information you read online with your doctor. Yes, but I never said HSV2 can be acquired from a toilet seat, and yes I agree as an HSV2 sufferer, you are not a huge risk to anyone. But HSV2 virus has been found to shed into the mouth on occasion, and so saying that HSV2 "stays" below the waist is patently untrue, whatever your doctor tells you. Symptoms of HSV2 infection stay below the waist is perhaps more accurate. Asymptomatic shedding of virus is worrying, but treatments reduce shedding markedly. Hopefully there will be a vaccine soon. Race tight for genital herpes vaccine
Fhsjkfjrhsdh3646 Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 tl;dr version of this thread: Almost everyone has herpes upstairs or downstairs, get over it.
Justanaverageguy Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 It would be helpful for all involved to understand the points of view from the perspective of the infected person AND from the person who does NOT want to EVER get infected. It's a slippery slope to navigate through; and I admire and respect people who are HONEST with others about their STD right out of the gate. . I agree with this comment. I think I have a pretty unique perspective as I had a scare where I thought I might be infected which ended up being negative so I can see both sides. Being in that position where you think you might have the disease and have to deal with the consequences gave me a much different perspective on what people have to go through. Made me have a lot of sympathy and respect for those that deal with it in the correct way. In saying that I actually disagree that you criticized the guy for waiting until it got to the point of the relationship getting physical to tell her. I personally think this is probably the ideal time to do it. They were only 2 weeks into seeing each other so likely a handful of dates at most - not like this was 6 months or something. It also doesn't sound like he pressured her into sex that night (it doesn't even sound like they have had sex at all). It sounds like when things escalated he sat her down, explained the situation and asked her to go away think about it and decide for herself if she still wanted to proceed with a physical relationship with him. That is is what she is deciding now. That to me is pretty much all I would ever ask of any partner I see. Honest and respectful. It also means the infected partner avoids having to tell people unnecessarily and embarrass themselves if the dates never progress to the point of getting physical. I get your afraid of being infected but this guy has acted like a perfect gentleman by all accounts. I mean what else do you want here ? 4
Gaeta Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 In an asymptomatic person like me my virus sheds 4 to 8 days a year. Meaning I am not contagious 357 days a year. Because it's impossible to pin point when exactly is the shedding I take valtrex each day so when it occurs my partner is covered. OP: How long your guy had it? is he on daily antiviral? does he have outbreaks? Those are all questions you need to ask him. Also, I am blessed to be living in a country with a Universal health care. Valtrex cost me $40 a month. I hear in the US it can run up to $200 a month. 1
BlackOpsZombieGirl Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 I am not sure I follow you! Not being told right away is not going to infect you with a virus. If I decide to tell a man after 1 month I am not going to bed with him or fooling around in any shape or form till I tell him. The same with my friend who takes a couple of months. She keeps it to bowling and horse back riding than she has the talk. In the grand picture who's having a harder time here? You or them? Yes your feelings might be hurt after one month but you get away with just that a bruised feeling. The other person has to pick up themselves, build up their self esteem again, deal with your rejection, and go to next and do it all over again. Well, a non-infected person would want to be told from the get-go so that they haven't had time to develop feelings for the other person- which could make ending things with them more difficult and could affect them making that decision. Who says that after one month of dating that a person wouldn't have possibly developed strong feelings or emotional attachment to the infected person? That timetable may work for you and you yourself may not be the type to develop feelings for another person in that amount of time, but not everyone's feelings are the same. You seem to brush off a person's possible "hurt feelings" as no big deal because you think they'll "get away with just a bruised feeling" and then they'll get over it. That may be so; but a lot of people don't want to have to go through that possibility of feeling hurt and torn just because that will make the infected person's obligation of disclosing this information easier for themselves. However, I totally get what you're saying - and if it were me that had an STD, I'd probably feel the same way you do; although I would disclose that info on a first meet or date to get it out of the way, because, I feel it's just fair to let the other person know what they could be getting themselves into and to allow them to make an informed decision as to whether they'd want to move forward with me or to move on. Even though telling a person from the get-go would, no doubt, be extremely DIFFICULT and would make every and any first meet or date a nerve-wracking and self-esteem deflating experience for the infected person, it's something that I feel they should do. It's something that I would do, because in addition to it being fair to the other person, I'd do it right away for MYSELF as well...so that *I* wouldn't possibly develop strong feelings for the other person during those 30 days, only to have to disclose this important info to them at that time and then have them end things with me. If it were me, I'd want to disclose something this private and important right away BEFORE I started to possibly develop strong feelings and attraction for the other person. However, since I'm not in your shoes, I can only imagine what being in your position would feel like and having to deal with it while dating. You have to deal with this in a way that's beneficial for you and that makes you feel better about it - so long as you're honest with whoever you date, it's no one's decision to make but YOUR own. . 1
kendahke Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 I think the fact he told me was pretty brave...He could have said nothing like most people in their 20s do! Yes, he was brave to tell you this, as it was the right thing to do. He probably wasn't afforded that choice himself. If your fear of catching it is this high, then clearly, sex is off the table when it comes to him. He probably would be a good friend, being that he is honest and doesn't pull wool over eyes. He can go on and take those qualities and find a girl who is in the same predicament as him and make a good boyfriend to her--you can go find a guy who is clear of this.
smackie9 Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 This is why it's so crucial to get tested and be cleared before having sex with anyone, and always ALWAYS insist on him to wear a condom....and no oral.....you can get throat cancer from the HPV virus. Even then make them wear a condom.....lots of people who cheat, cheat unprotected. It may seem extreme to take these measures BUT if you value your health (especially during your child bearing years), and wellbeing it worth all the precautions.
Fhsjkfjrhsdh3646 Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 This is why it's so crucial to get tested and be cleared before having sex with anyone, and always ALWAYS insist on him to wear a condom....and no oral.....you can get throat cancer from the HPV virus. Even then make them wear a condom.....lots of people who cheat, cheat unprotected. It may seem extreme to take these measures BUT if you value your health (especially during your child bearing years), and wellbeing it worth all the precautions. Guys are just carrier for HPV right? Going down on a girl isn't a health risk for us (like cancer)? Just curious.
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