christian + non-christian r/ships = success or not?

[HoldOn]

Originally posted by bluetuesday

yes, it can work.

 

i'm a staunch catholic. he's a devout atheist.

 

i completely respect his views and he would not have me any other way.

 

although our beliefs are at opposite ends of the spectrum, our depth of belief is similar.

 

my faith is not shaken by his beliefs, his beliefs are not shaken by mine. and neither of us feels the need to convert the other to validate what we feel to be the truth. when we discuss religion we do so fairly. he listens to me and i have learned much from him.

 

i do not live his life for him, his choices are his own. we are each our own person on our own path. and a relationship is nothing without respect, intelligence and tolerance.

 

i'm open minded enough, i believe i am close enough to god, to understand there is more than one way to live.

 

Yes.... And what happens when you have kids. If you are both as devout as you say, then both would have a problem compromising on this, I would think.

[GirlDown]

i am not really sure what's out there, and i don't think i am qualified to say that i think i might know...if that makes sense.

 

i would like to believe there is something.

 

my boyfriend is dead-set against religion. i am not offended, and if i were a diehard christian, he would not be offended, provided i didn't try to change him or convince that what i believed was right.

 

 

we've talked about this before.

 

i know people will say "but you never know, because if you were serious about your religion, you might want someone to share it with" but since that's not the case, it's not up to me or any outsider to decide what might happen when it's not happening.

 

his family is religious, though he is not. he respects them, and they don't try to force him to go to church, or tell him he's a sinner for living with me.

 

i guess it would be like that, pretty much.

 

but yeah, we're fine.

 

two-religion relationships can survive if both are tolerant of the others' beliefs.

[bluetuesday]

Originally posted by HoldOn

Yes.... And what happens when you have kids. If you are both as devout as you say, then both would have a problem compromising on this, I would think.

don't confuse devotion with seeing another viewpoint as 'wrong'.

 

i don't see any path as inherently wrong. there is no wrong and right when you're talking about what god needs you to go through in order to teach you something. who am i to judge that catholicism is right for anyone else, merely because i believe it's the right way for me? i am a catholic because for me it's the best expression of what i have been taught about the world. for me it is truth. that people don't share that point of view isn't in the least threatening to me.

 

i find wonder in god's beautiful creation. he finds wonder in nature and science and love. they're not opposite viewpoints.

 

so to answer your question, i would share with any kids i had the way i think is right for me, as would my partner, and we would both encourage them to find their own paths towards the truth.

[HokeyReligions]

I'm going to add a couple more comments from my own observations.

 

If one person is very devout and practices their religion, at some point it is going to hurt them that their partner, whom they love so much, does not share that belief. It might not seem so now, and the relationship can still be good, but that person is eventually going to be heart-sick at the thought of NOT spending eternity with the person they loved so much on earth. My husband and I have had that conversation. I'm agnostic and not atheist and although those two seem to be almost identical--there is a world, maybe even an eternity, of difference. I'm open to the possibility of a higher power, of life after death, of Heaven or Hell. I don't believe in them, but I could be wrong. As long as that exists in me, my husband and family have hope that someday I will believe as do they and I will not suffer eternal damnation. Without that they would be hurt FOR me and scared of losing me to eternity. Perhaps these feelings and thoughts don't come into play until you are older and your own mortality is not seen as some distant event that will happen to a different person.

 

A person who is active in their church and their God will want to share that with their partner. Sure, you can find things outside of church activities/worship to do together and build a loving relationship -- but a true Christian must put God first and they do it lovingly and willingly and will also want to share that with their partner.

 

Being agnostic I can share in some of the joys that my husband and mother love. I'll go to church, talk about God, share some traditions, etc. because of my love for THEM. It's not a chore or a big sacrifice to me. Some agnostics or atheists may not feel the same way. They want no part of it and if they do share, say a Christmas Eve pageant at the church they could unknowingly be building some resentment between them and their partner.

 

Think of it this way, if a husband loves going to strip clubs and the wife does not, if she is convinced to attend a strip club with her husband - how is that going to make her feel? She may let herself be talked into it because it's important to her husband, but she doesn't like it and gets no enjoyment out of it and over the years that effort to share time together is going to have a negative effect. The same could be said for one partner joining the other in church or worship activities. If the husband gives up going to strip clubs then something that he enjoys is going to be missing from his life and that can build up resentment. If he goes by himself and his wife is okay with it, then its time apart from each other. Same with church. They are not sharing something that is vitally important to one of them. It can work, but it will take work. Be careful and really, really discuss it and all the little details and projections you have for your own futures, right down to the type of funeral you want for yourself and your partner. It does not take great intellect to show and earn respect, but it takes work and understanding, and openness to others.

[bluetuesday]

Originally posted by HokeyReligions

It might not seem so now, and the relationship can still be good, but that person is eventually going to be heart-sick at the thought of NOT spending eternity with the person they loved so much on earth.

you always speak so well, hokey.

 

this point you made about eternity presupposes that christians have an idea what eternity will be like. i am certain we have very little idea - about as much as a child in the womb has of what new york will be like. it also presupposes that after death we will continue to hold to what we held to on earth. i doubt that's the case.

 

but that aside, whether i get to heaven or not is in many ways immaterial, even though i believe i will. i am not a catholic because it offers some hope of a 'reward'. my catholicism is only relevant if it influences my time on earth. i want to create god in the world NOW, though love. that's it. that's my entire life summed up.

 

the sort of christianity which says you are only good enough to get into the presence of god if you do a, b and c, when one of those requirements is being a christian who says you are only good enough to get into the presence of of god by doing a, b and c, is wildly limiting the power and the mercy and the love of god.

 

and the sort of christians who say those who believe d, e and f are consigned to burn in hell for eternity don't know the god i know.

[HoldOn]

i don't see any path as inherently wrong. there is no wrong and right when you're talking about what god needs you to go through in order to teach you something.

 

I don't have time to read everything in these posts, but I had to respond to this...

 

No right and wrong? I beg to differ. What about Satan worship? What about sexually molesting or murdering a 5-year old child, could you maybe say that these things are evil?

 

I'm really not trying to be argumentative, but one of the prime message of Catholicism IS that there is right and wrong. That Jesus is the TRUTH, the way and the life. That there is a wrong way and a right way. That is the basis of the beliefs you claim to have. I'm not trying to be harsh, but I really think you should try to learn more about the faith you are saying is yours.

[bluetuesday]

i'm sure you're not trying to be argumentative, or patronising, but you have failed to grasp my point quite spectacularly.

 

in the context of which i talked about 'paths' i was clearly referring to god and ways he has laid out for us to find the truth. i did not say there was no way to live your life that would be the antithesis of his plan. what i said was that atheism could not be inferred to be wrong unless you knew god's plan for that person's life. and as you don't, you can't judge.

 

catholicism teaches, amongst other things, love and mystery. it should never teach 'we know everything and if you don't like it go to hell'. anyone who thinks that doesn't know much about god or his universal church.

[HoldOn]

I think the point I am making is that: If you think there is no wrong path, then you are not a "devout" Catholic.

 

I was saying earlier that if two people have devout and opposite viewpoints, their relationship will have problems.

 

catholicism teaches, amongst other things, love and mystery. it should never teach 'we know everything

 

Although there are some mysteries in Catholocism, the existence of God is not one of them.

 

 

So, you never answered my question. If you have kids, how will you raise them? Will a "staunch" Catholic care if their children' father is an example of atheism? Will a "devout" atheist, allow his children to be baptized?

[Dino]

Originally posted by HoldOn

So, you never answered my question. If you have kids, how will you raise them? Will a "staunch" Catholic care if their children' father is an example of atheism? Will a "devout" atheist, allow his children to be baptized?

 

Why couldn't you open them to and teach them both, and let them decide?

 

For the record, I an atheist, but I respect others beliefs as long as they don't try to push those beliefs on me. My parents raised me Christian throughout my childhood. As I got a little older and wiser and learned more about religion and the world in general, my personal beliefs quickly headed towards atheism. That was my own choice.

 

My girlfriend is more agnostic. She believes there is "something" out there, but she's just not sure what. Now, even if she was a very religious person (whatever religion that may be), I would feel the best course of action for any children we may have is to teach them the workings of both. The decision should ultimately be theirs. Something as strong and emotional as religious believe is not something that should be forced onto others. It's too bad that after thousands of years, we still haven't figured that out and many people are still being killed in the name of "God" (or whatever name your deity goes by).

[HoldOn]

but I respect others beliefs

 

yes, respect is what we're after here.

 

 

But I am so confused. I don't understand how someone can hold their beliefs and then not care if their children are taught them or not.. How can one believe that a child must be baptized to go to heaven, and not care if they are baptized. Or believe that there is no God and religion is ridiculous and then allow their children to be baptized.

 

I could see a relationship working if one or both of the partners is apathetic and doesn't really care. But if one or both has strong beliefs that differ from the other, then how can it work?

 

killed in the name of "God" (or whatever name your deity goes by).

 

My diety's name is Bob.

[bluetuesday]

Originally posted by HoldOn

I think the point I am making is that: If you think there is no wrong path, then you are not a "devout" Catholic.

i beg to differ. atheism would be wrong for me but i cannot judge what god has planned for other people. the number of diverse religions, for example, is evidence to me that god speaks to people in different ways. ways i do not assume assume to be wrong just because he doesn't speak to me like that.

So, you never answered my question. If you have kids, how will you raise them? Will a "staunch" Catholic care if their children' father is an example of atheism? Will a "devout" atheist, allow his children to be baptized?

what exactly is an example of atheism? he is not evil. if my children's father is a loving, caring man, who am i to say he's not carrying out god's will, just because he doesn't wear the label or carry the belief of a christian?

 

again, i repeat, what is right for me (catholicism) may not be right for my children. i was baptised as a baby and as i grew up, questioned over and over if my beliefs were indoctrinated or genuine.

 

now whether my children are baptised into the catholic church is immaterial to me. but i think this has to do with the way i have learned to view the church.

 

for example, i can see very clearly why the church speaks out against contraception. to me it's obvious what rationale has been used to make this 'law'. but when we are taught that little babies who don't get baptised will not go to heaven, i don't buy it. what sort of god would treat innocent infants that way?

 

so while i hold true to the catholic church for myself, i am not part of a catholic recruitment drive because i don't assume it's the right way for everyone.

 

holdon, i understand where you're coming from. but i trust god to guide my children. and if he guides them in another direction, i hope they thrive in it. it's just not for me to foist my views onto them.

[Dino]

Originally posted by HoldOn

yes, respect is what we're after here.

 

 

But I am so confused. I don't understand how someone can hold their beliefs and then not care if their children are taught them or not.. How can one believe that a child must be baptized to go to heaven, and not care if they are baptized. Or believe that there is no God and religion is ridiculous and then allow their children to be baptized.

 

I could see a relationship working if one or both of the partners is apathetic and doesn't really care. But if one or both has strong beliefs that differ from the other, then how can it work?

 

 

 

My diety's name is Bob.

 

Please don't take this the wrong way as I'm not trying to insult you, but I gather you are the type of person that isn't always open to and respectful of people's religious views if they differ from your own.

 

If a couple with differing religious beliefs raises a child, they can each teach that child about their respective views. My girlfriend/wife could teach the child about Christianity and I could teach him about atheism. The point is not to force a child to practice a particular faith (or no faith), the point is to simply help them learn about various faiths and ultimately let them choose which is right for them.

 

If my significant other wished to take our child to church, I would not have a problem with that, as it would part of the learning experience. I also wouldn’t necessarily object to going myself. I can go to church to be supportive of my wife and the learning experience without having to share in those beliefs myself.

 

As for the baptism, if my wife wanted to get our child baptized (presumably before they’re too young to understand it), I also would not have any objections. The act might hold meaning for her, but to me, it would just be some dude in a robe washing my kid’s hair. I was even baptized when I was very young. Big deal; that didn’t dictate my ultimate decision on whether or not to “believe”. Besides, if my partner was just as supportive of my beliefs as I am of hers (and she is), we may even decide to hold off on the baptism all-together and let the child decide for themselves when they are old enough. You do know that there is no age limit on when to get this ritual performed, right?

[HoldOn]

If my significant other wished to take our child to church, I would not have a problem with that,

 

But some people WOULD have a problem with that. And if they did the problem would be huge.

 

but I gather you are the type of person that isn't always open to and respectful of people's religious views if they differ from your own.

 

I am quite respectful of other people's views. But I wouldn't have children with someone who couldn't share my views. Because I want my children to get one, united message from their parents. Religion is very important to me and I would want my child to share my religion and go to Catholic schools, if possible.

 

I couldn't deal if my husband were denying my religion to my children, that would be a huge problem for me. As a Catholic, I do believe that my way is the best way. That's why I am Catholic.

 

You do know that there is no age limit on when to get this ritual performed, right?

 

Of course I do. but as a Catholic, we do infant baptism. I would be absolutely devasted if my child were to die before being baptized.

 

don't get me wrong, I think that a relationship CAN absolultely work even with people of differing faiths. But it does get more complicated when there are two separate religions. And I wouldn't chose it for myself.

[big_girls_rock]

Man do I LOVE loveshack! I just had this conversation with my Mother and we fought over this before I got kicked out and moved away. We are both on good terms now but it really tore me up inside that because I am a Christian and because someone isn't that I can't date or become friends with them. Im 20 and my generation is much diferent and more open to culture and religious diferences. I thought- it's a prejudice- and it does say that we shouldn't be equally yoked with and unbeliever- and I want soo bad to do what God tells me but I thought why would I want to believe in something that puts limitations on my friendships? I have always been one to embrace diferences- though I don't believe in gay rights and all that jazz because if you put two and two together it just dosn't fit- yet I have an attraction to girls myself- It still kills me that I have a choice- and the one I want is wrong- I have no problem with being friends with a non-Christian and if most Christians date to marry and Im not even thinking about marriage why should I care?

 

But then I realized the concequences of these actions- whats your motive? Are you with them because you see something in them that you want? Because I thought- well Jesus didn't come for the rightous- he came for the un-richous right? and usually non- believers see something in Christians that draws them to them. But if I don't have any unsaved friends whats the point of whitnessing to them? And then where will this all happen? I think its good to hang out and show them what Christ has done in your life- not to push Christianity on them- but to be there- but again will that be in the clubs because they are looking for something else- they are sick of those I heard- and my Mother told me that she learned the hard way with my little brothers dad- she had him out of wedlock and she told me that if I was gonna be friends or date a non Christian then I was gonna set myself up for a fall. I don't want to do that but I think its wrong to push someone away because they arn't like you. Yes you have their future to look at but why do I want to worry about life after death when I feel I am not even living now- I know its probably wrong but when your raised in the church all of your life the outside looks really good.