new to forum, hi.

[PattyCakes]

Hi,

New here. There are few places my lifestyle is accepted and Im glad to have found this site.

 

Several years ago I started dating a man, who is a local politician. At the time I dated him he was single and we had actually talked of marriage. The thing is Im really not interested in marriage and I told him that at the time.

 

This man has a child by another woman. This woman has been in his life waiting for him to marry her for years. He has said many times that although he loves her he is not in love with her, he has told her this as well. But this woman can not see past this man and would do anything to be his wife. Personally I see that as weak and sad. But that is her problem, and most likely his. As well as dating many other women he has kept her on a tight lead *just in case*. She was out of control while he and I dated. Calling me and causing problems. I decided this was just not worth it and walked from the relationship. Honestly he created a monster in her, she never knew where she stood. I felt sorry for her actually.

 

I get a call last summer. He and i usually talked a couple times a year so I didnt see this as being unusual. He told me that he had finally decided to marry this woman. He felt that she has been the only woman to stand by his side. Also, politically, it was the right move. But he still said he never was or is in love with her. Whatever.....I see this as a very sad union.

 

I am a very independent person that has no intentions of marriage, family or having a man that wants to know my every move in life. I enjoy living alone. But I get lonely. I am very attracted to this man. He has made it clear he wants to see me. Of course he also sees me of no threat because I do not get emotionally attached. So this may be a good thing for both of us. We have talked several times a week for the past six months. I encouraged him in his marriage, as he backed out twice and rescheduled it.

 

Can anyone understand where Im coming from with this? Im hoping im in the right forum and can get some feedback. I do not want someone to come home to everynight, nor do I want a date every Friday/Saturday night. I want a friend with benefits and no real attachment.

Any input?

[RecordProducer]

What kind of input do you expect? Someone to tell you that there's nothing wrong with it? I would be more worried about you not wanting to get emotionally attached to anyone.

He will obviously want to cheat on his wife with you or someone else.

But don't count on your insensitivity so much. You might as well fall in love with him. Why do you need to see a man who will always be in a hurry and leave after the sex? Don't you want romance? What kind of woman are you? Who did such a terrible damage to your soul?

[Tamed Wildflower]

As is often the case, RecordProducer is a little over-the-top. I like you, RP, but I think sometimes people need a little bit more sensitivity and sympathy than you sometimes want to offer.

 

to Pattycakes-

Hmmm... well, I am not sure I can relate to wanting a permanent friends-with-benefits arrangement, but certainly I can relate to being in a sticky romantic situation with someone who has married someone else that he never really wanted to marry. (I just ended that situation about 2 weeks ago. Heartbreaking, but for the better.)

 

I do think it is a problem for you to be carrying on this relationship with this man, and my advice would be to end it. Remember, there were reasons you walked away from this relationship before. Do you want to run into those kinds of problems again? And this poor woman, the guy has now married her! Marriage entails a promise of commitment, as I understand it-- if he keeps carrying on affairs, he is really going to hurt this woman deeply when she finds out, if she doesn't know already. And the man-- he is a local politician. Damn, if word about the affair ever gets out, there goes his political career. This sounds like a dangerous situation all around.

 

Given that you just want a casual sex life now and then with this guy and do not love him or feel an inextricable bond with him, I am having trouble seeing why you would hold on to him. If you just want a FWB relationship, can't you find numerous men to do that with fairly easily? I would think you could have arrangements like this with half a dozen single men if you wanted. I see nothing wrong with wanting this, so I am by no means moralizing at you. I'm just sayin', why this guy?

 

As for the man's relationship with his now-wife. In my opinion, if there is one complaint that mistakes the nature of love in a long-term relationship its, "Well I love him/her, I am just not in love with him/her." Who ever promised that the state of being in love was supposed to last forever!! In love is a fantastic state that alternates between blissful serenity and giddiness; it's that period when you can't stop thinking about your romantic partner ALL the time, and you feel an inextricable attachment to him/her. It's wonderful, but who said it was supposed to last forever?!?? It's meant for the beginning stages of love, and some couples experience it again periodically or to varying degrees over the years of their relationship, but it is not supposed to be constant. In love is fantastic, but love is enough, it is enough indeed. In fact, there is nothing more beautiful.

 

Just my two cents, you can pass it along to your FWB, if you'd like.

[PattyCakes]

Why do you need to see a man who will always be in a hurry and leave after the sex? Don't you want romance? What kind of woman are you? Who did such a terrible damage to your soul?

 

Record Producer, My soul is just fine. Im more worried about someone so quick to judge, such as yourself. You seem pretty intense. Im sorry for you, really. Do I want romance? Not at this time in my life, no. Do I at some point, sure. I suppose.

 

 

But don't count on your insensitivity so much. You might as well fall in love with him.

 

Im far from being insensitive. But at this time in my life it is not an option, for reasons Ive not gone into detail about. So judging my rational as insensitivity is just judgment on your part. Right now my career is far more important then falling inlove and if you see that as being wrong, well that just means we have two different opinions about my life.

 

Tamed,

Thank you for your response. As far as RP goes...no big deal. Her reaction was was amusing. She seems to have a lot of anger and I just pitty her more then anything.

 

But I do appreciate your input. I did have strong feelings for him in the past and we have remained good friends. But the reason I have not jumped into a physical relationship with him is because 1. he is married and that has never been an ideal situation in the past for me. 2. There is a reason he is an ex. I agree.

 

I'm just sayin', why this guy?

 

Because for whatever reason there is a strong connection and attraction that I have not felt with anyone else. And picking men I dont know for sex just is not an option for me, for logical reasons. And like I mentioned, conversation has gone on for six months now, with no physical meeting, not even for coffee. So I do not jump into things quickly. Especially things that can potentionally effect others in adverse ways.

 

 

My understanding is that this forum, as well as many others, is meant to be diverse. Thank God not all of us think the same, feel the same or practice the same standards. Otherwise forums like this would be pretty boring.

[moimeme]

I encouraged him in his marriage, as he backed out twice and rescheduled it.

 

Why on earth would you do that? He won't be happy and he'll make her miserable. This is a disaster in progress and rather than avert it, you encouraged it.

Because for whatever reason there is a strong connection and attraction that I have not felt with anyone else

 

Oh well. In life, you either go with every selfish whim or you aim to be a decent human being. And the latter requires that sometimes you give up something you want because it's not right to want it. I'm sure you don't make a habit of stealing things from stores when you want them. Like the man sang; 'Ya can't always get what you want'.

 

For good or ill, some poor fool loves this man. That poor fool has a heart just like you. She can be shattered and broken because she loves him - and you will be part of the cause of that should you agree to this smarmy little arrangement.

 

And as for falling in love - plenty of women have believed, as you do, that they can enter into a sexual relationship with someone and keep their emotions out of it. Almost without exception, they fail in their intent and fall in love anyway - and then there are two miserable women serving the selfish purposes of one massive jerk of a man.

 

Now really. Is this the sort of life you want? It's not glamourous. It's not bohemian or exotic. It's just kinda tacky. Require more of yourself.

[kalie]

Let me just say one thing. I came to this forum to get solid advice, not get beat up on. Not all of us always do the right thing 100% of the time. Im pretty sure , at least some time in your lives each one of you three posters has made a mistake or considered doing something that was not for the best interest of either yourselves or someone else? No one here has had an affair?

 

Like I said, this has been a consideration of mine because it seemed to fit into my current time frame of living. Ive talked to this man for six months. OF course I could have met him at anytime and never did. One of the reasons I didnt is because I refused to get in the way of his marriage decision. I have not said once that my plans were to go ahead and start an affair with this man. I came here for advice.

It seems Ive been damned to hell before Ive even made a decision. Sad. Im impressed there are so many perfect posters here.

 

 

For good or ill, some poor fool loves this man. That poor fool has a heart just like you. She can be shattered and broken because she loves him - and you will be part of the cause of that should you agree to this smarmy little arrangement.

 

 

 

YOu are right when you say fool. When I encouraged him to marry this woman I felt they desirved each other. If any woman is disparate enough to have put up with this mans crap she should be his wife. Do I feel sorry for her? Only because its sad that any woman would allow a man to treat her like he has for 15 years, and still stick around . Possibly I have a cold heart. But I would never allow this to happen in my life, to myself. I do not feel sorry for her, she has what shes wanted for so long now. Did I encourage a sad union? No. This couple has made a career out of codependency. Both of them have to be pretty stupid to think they have a normal relationship. Both are adults, one overly educated public figure.

 

I used to jest with this man telling him if I could have fifteen mins alone with this woman she would walk away from him, find a nice guy and move on with her life. I believe if she had shown some self respect in herself he may have taken another notice to her in a different light. I see her as sad and weak and so do most. Im not saying this to be mean. But it is true. How many of you women would stay with a man that only wanted you when he had noone else in his life? Its not like family, aka her mother, and friends didnt tell her exactly what Im saying on this forum.

This woman is 45 years old and should have loved herself somewhere down the road enough to leave what I consider abuse.

 

Now. Not that your judgemental attitudes have helped. But posting sure has. Why would I want to be like her and be in a relationship with someone as selfish as he is? I wouldnt. Or I would have months ago. I have a very strong personality and refuse to allow anyone to tread where they shouldnt.

 

 

 

glamourous. It's not bohemian or exotic

 

 

Hardly. I never thought of it as glamourous. I have a real attraction to this man. Now that may not be healthy, or right. But at least I can be honest with myself for saying that, and honest in front of a hundred posters. Attraction isnt always normal, right ,moral or anything else. I have stayed away from him for years now knowing its an unhealthy situation, it had nothing to do with not being attracted to him or liking him, for whatever reason. I stayed away, even for the last six months because deep down I know he isnt worth even meeting for coffee. BUT I am human, unlike you ladies who seem to pillar above being just human. I have thoughts, feelings that may not be morally correct at times. So shoot me. Im honest to a fault. So Im not afraid to admit Im not always clear on what I may want or need. But I sure as heck didnt realize Id be up against the sister hood of perfection when I posted here.

[Bronzepen]

..

[Bronzepen]

Originally posted by kalie

Let me just say one thing. I came to this forum to get solid advice, not get beat up on. Not all of us always do the right thing 100% of the time. Im pretty sure , at least some time in your lives each one of you three posters has made a mistake or considered doing something that was not for the best interest of either yourselves or someone else? No one here has had an affair?

 

Nope, never had an affair. But I am starting to see your train of thought. Read below.

 

Like I said, this has been a consideration of mine because it seemed to fit into my current time frame of living. Ive talked to this man for six months. OF course I could have met him at anytime and never did. One of the reasons I didnt is because I refused to get in the way of his marriage decision. I have not said once that my plans were to go ahead and start an affair with this man. I came here for advice.

It seems Ive been damned to hell before Ive even made a decision. Sad. Im impressed there are so many perfect posters here.

 

 

 

It's not about being perfect or imperfect. Everyone has made mistakes. But that's the difference. People recognize what they did as a mistake and try to fix it and/or learn from it.

 

You on the other hand, don't see your "lifestyle" as a mistake. Your train of thought is, "Well, nobody is perfect so it's ok if I do this." "Everybody is broken, so let's not bother to fix it."

 

You didn't come for advice. What your asking for is validation of your "lifestyle". But your "lifestyle" is based on self interest. That's fine and dandy, we all want to take care of ourselves, AS LONG AS WE DON'T HURT OTHERS on our journey to make ourselves happy, hence your "lifestyle" of self interest "no matter what the cost" attitude. This is what urkes people and that's why your getting negative feed back.

 

 

YOu are right when you say fool. When I encouraged him to marry this woman I felt they desirved each other. If any woman is disparate enough to have put up with this mans crap she should be his wife. Do I feel sorry for her? Only because its sad that any woman would allow a man to treat her like he has for 15 years, and still stick around . Possibly I have a cold heart. But I would never allow this to happen in my life, to myself. I do not feel sorry for her, she has what shes wanted for so long now. Did I encourage a sad union? No. This couple has made a career out of codependency. Both of them have to be pretty stupid to think they have a normal relationship. Both are adults, one overly educated public figure.

 

I used to jest with this man telling him if I could have fifteen mins alone with this woman she would walk away from him, find a nice guy and move on with her life. I believe if she had shown some self respect in herself he may have taken another notice to her in a different light. I see her as sad and weak and so do most. Im not saying this to be mean. But it is true. How many of you women would stay with a man that only wanted you when he had noone else in his life? Its not like family, aka her mother, and friends didnt tell her exactly what Im saying on this forum.

This woman is 45 years old and should have loved herself somewhere down the road enough to leave what I consider abuse.

 

Why do you care who this man marries? You said you want no emotional attachment with him.

 

Why do you even go through the trouble to analyze the woman?

 

For a person that want's no strings attached, you seem to be way too involved.

 

Now. Not that your judgemental attitudes have helped. But posting sure has. Why would I want to be like her and be in a relationship with someone as selfish as he is? I wouldnt. Or I would have months ago. I have a very strong personality and refuse to allow anyone to tread where they shouldnt.

 

 

 

glamourous. It's not bohemian or exotic

 

 

Hardly. I never thought of it as glamourous. I have a real attraction to this man. Now that may not be healthy, or right. But at least I can be honest with myself for saying that, and honest in front of a hundred posters. Attraction isnt always normal, right ,moral or anything else. I have stayed away from him for years now knowing its an unhealthy situation, it had nothing to do with not being attracted to him or liking him, for whatever reason. I stayed away, even for the last six months because deep down I know he isnt worth even meeting for coffee. BUT I am human, unlike you ladies who seem to pillar above being just human. I have thoughts, feelings that may not be morally correct at times. So shoot me. Im honest to a fault. So Im not afraid to admit Im not always clear on what I may want or need. But I sure as heck didnt realize Id be up against the sister hood of perfection when I posted here.

 

 

Again, the ""Well, nobody is perfect so it's ok if I do this." "Everybody is broken, so let's not bother to fix it."

mentality.

 

Nobody is perfect but we all strive to be a better person.

 

We make mistakes and we learn not to make the same mistakes again. If we do keep repeating the same mistake over and over then we have a problem. Counseling is in order.

 

I'm sorry but I can't validate your "lifestyle". Too many people get hurt.

[LucreziaBorgia]

The fact that he's a politician who serves an adultery-unfriendly public will probably be the thing that ultimately ends the affair between you two. For every politician, there are at least ten others out there who are willing, able and more than happy to see him taken down. It doesn't matter how unhappy or farcical this marriage is - the public he serves won't look past a betrayal of the sanctity of marriage. There will be more than a few 'concerned citizens' on the lookout too - particularly if the wife confides her problems to her friends.

 

What to do? Your best bet is to end it before he does.

[Owl]

I find it interesting that you begin your thread with the glowing feeling that you'd be welcomed here for what you're looking to do. Have you read the threads of most of the people who have posted here? You'll find that the vast majority of them are not happy in their current arrangements, and would have strongly preferred for things to have worked out differently for them. Based on that, it's rather interesting that you thought that everyone here would 'validate' what you were planning on doing.

 

Why do you feel that your 'lifestyle' should be acceptable? It goes against the grain of anyone who's ever wanted a committed relationship. As someone noted earlier, it's inherently self-centered, with absolutely no basis other than self-gratification...in this case, at someone else's personal (emotional) expense.

 

You've made it clear what you want. Now...the real question is, do you really feel that doing what you're proposing is justifiable in anyone ELSE's eyes? Do you honestly expect other people to condone what you're suggesting?

 

The REAL advice you'll get from most people here is to walk away before you find yourself in an emotional hell of your own creation. Get out before you end up in a no-win situation...for all three of you.

[Tamed Wildflower]

Patticakes, I am on my way out and don't have the time to read all the new responses in detail, but as for the reactions of posters toward your situation, unfortunately when it comes to affairs, tearing down the OW's character, intentions, morals, self-worth, etc. is par for the course a little too often in this forum. Not to say that having an affair is the grandest dandiest thing one can do in one's life, but I do believe that everyone gets themselves in some sticky situations sometimes in life, some situations that have the potential to hurt multiple people, and it doesn't mean we're stupid, or have no values, or are heartless. I also think that everyone who comes to loveshack with a sensitive problem deserves some sincere and well-thought out advice which is given without added presumptuous assumptions about the person or their situation, advice that is given without condemnation or indignity. I am not herer to judge people, I am hear to offer whatever advice I can. I am truly sorry if I was impatient or hurtful to you in my post.

 

When I came here almost a month ago, I was in a similar position as you, and needed some sympathetic listeners and caring advisors. I got some of that, but I also got some rancor, some spite, some presumption. But I've stuck around here. Most people here, even those who are quick to stomp on the feelings of an OW, are also really great people who are patient, caring and sweet advisors in other realms of life. As you said in your opening post, there ain't many accepting environments for an OW.

 

Anyway... I am taking too many words and too much time here, I'd better get going. I'll come back sometimes later on and see if I can be of any more help.

[WithOrWithoutYou]

I would like to echo the comments of TW. She has said most of what I could say about this. I do think that there are probably reasons why having an affair with this man at this time is ill advised (your heart, his wife's feelings when she eventually finds out, his political career, etc.). I also agree that if it is a FWB realtionship you are looking for, there is really nothing wrong with a FWB relationship in a general sense. Some people are just looking for the sex, without the romance, and if everyone is on the same page and adults, I don't see a problem with it. I do think there are some things, however, that you should think about carefully before getting involved with this particular man. I really don't know how you feel about this man, but I know that personally, before I sleep with someone, I like to at least be able to believe that the person is a decent person at heart. If what this man has done to this other woman is as bad as you say, and if as you have said, it has been abusive for her, but he is marrying her anyway for political reasons, well, perhaps that tells you something about this man you might wish to think about before becoming intimate with him. I also know that you have said you have a strong attraction for this man, and had very strong feelings for him at one point. Just for yourself, I think you should be very concerned that those feelings could come back if you pursue a sexual relationship with him over an extended period.

 

I do think that in this case, for your own sake, for his, and for the sake of his wife, you might want to consider just not pursuing a relationship with him and letting him go. You have already said that you feel sorry for her, which suggests that you are a good person at heart. Compassion, even for the weak and stupid, is a very good quality. Pining after this man, may be all that the wife has to give anymore, even after taking his years of crap. He is an ex for a reason, as you have said, and you don't really want him in a real way, so you might just think about letting her have what she has always wanted, with whatever happiness she can find in that. She may not be as strong a woman as you are, and as you said, what they have together isn't much, but it is all that she has. If you do pursue a sexual relationship, I think it is also likely to be filled with strife and grief in the event it ever becomes public, and if he is a well-known public figure (who stands for election opposed by another candidate), it is very likely to become public knowledge at some point in the future. Also, while it may be an exaggeration to make the comparison, do you want to become known (even locally), as the woman who had the affair with this married publicly well-known man? It could potentially be bad for your own career, depending on what your occupation is (it certainly didn't do any good for Monica Lewinsky - not that I am making a comparison in any way), and often when this sort of thing becomes public, it is the OW who becomes even MORE villified (unfairly, IMO) than even the cheating politician husband.

 

I mean this in the kindest possible way, but I do think that this relationship deserves a rethink, for yourself as much as for him. Being an OW or OM does just happen sometimes (you fall in love with someone who just happens to be married, there is often something horrible about their existing relationship, things happen, a million different reasons can come into play), but in this case, you do have a very clear choice to make, and you are not so in love with him that you are unable to take a step back and think about it objectively. If you want my advice (which again, is offered only in the spirit of trying to help), I think you should consider just letting him go, and finding someone who is not attached to be your FWB (perhaps a single guy who is just as career-minded as you are, and wants all of the same things you do, without the attachment).

 

People become the OW or OM for a variety of reasons (myself included in the past), and I do try never judge anyone for it because until one is in that situation, one can't really know what it is like, and all of the really tough issues that you have to think about. Judging someone for being an OW or OM in my own case, would also make me a hypocrite, because I have been there, done that, and while it is not something I am intensely proud of, I do feel that I had reasons more than sufficient to allow me to sleep at night (long story, if anyone cares they can go back and read my post in OM/OW). Even for those who have not been there, however, I think we need to think about how what we say affects people who might come here and post. We should listen to what they have to say, and give constructive advice, and if we don't have any, just not post. I have seen posts that I just had no desire to reply to of course, and I didn't reply to those threads, but this woman, while very career-focused (nothing wrong with that), is clearly struggling with a problem she is having (a problem of relationships, of filling her sexual needs, of protecting her heart, and possibly even a problem of conscience - issues that we ALL must deal with, under all different kinds of circumstances), and if we can give some good advice, we should try to do so without making her feel like she is wrong for even having the thoughts that she has.

[RecordProducer]

Originally posted by PattyCakes

 

Can anyone understand where Im coming from with this? Im hoping im in the right forum and can get some feedback. I do not want someone to come home to everynight, nor do I want a date every Friday/Saturday night. I want a friend with benefits and no real attachment.

Any input?

 

And again, what kind of input do you want? If you told us what you wanted from us perhaps we could tell you. Are you asking us "Am I normal?" or "Is it okay to be someone's mistress?" or "Do you think I can manage to NOT fall in love with this man?" Or what? I think none of us understood your question. You seem pretty happy with your choice and life overall and you have all the answers about your life. So what exactly is unclear to you?

 

F*ck the guy and enjoy yourself! You can't fall in love with him, because you are concentrated on your career. You did the right thing to encourage him to marry this woman. You don't need someone to come home to every night. You don't need a date either. Having a friend with benefits is a great thing.

 

Were these the answers you wanted to hear? It seems that you gave us the answers and we gave you the questions.

[PattyCakes]

Thank you for your kind response. Like I mentioned before, and Im sure it went unnoticed by most, I have talked to this man for six months now. Starting last Oct. If I truely didnt have concerns I would have jumped right into a relationship with him, and I have not.

 

 

Let me just say, as I did eariler, and again, I think it went unnoticed. Just typing and rehashing what this man is like has given me enough 2nd thoughts to back off. Maybe that was all I needed because there really is no one in RL I can discuss this with.

 

I never really mentioned what our relationship was like prior to ending it and why I ended it. Remember, the heart does not always do what the mind tells it to do.

 

WHen I was dating this man, about six months into the relationship, I found out he was still having sex with the mother of his child. If I had known this in the beginning there would have been no relationship. I knew she was jealous of me, but once I found out that he still strung her on sexually, as well as emotionally, I ended the relationship. So which came first the chicken or the egg? I had no clue she was still in the picture. She knew I was in the picture, but never told me anything, she just left little hints and I knew she was part of the childs life and ignored those hints. He has the child with him all the time. I left that relationship in the first place because i thought it was crappy the way he was treating her and also I was being treated pretty crappy by her. SO if it seems that I do not have much respect for this woman, no I do not. DO I feel sorry for her, yep. Anyone that would allow themselves to be a doormate is pretty sad. SO at one point in this relationship I also see her as being the OW. She knew I dated him, she knew he gave me an engagement ring. I knew nothing about their ongoing , twisted, relationship.

 

SO....no thanks to most of the posters here who seem to be judge mental twits, I do thank you because maybe I just needed to hear from someone that has a friggn heart that this was not the best situation to get into. Like I said there is no one in real life to talk to. I am surrounded by people daily, but this is not stuff I can pull out of my laptop and just discuss with anyone.

 

There will always be an attraction, and maybe feeling of love for this man.He does have some wonderful points to him, but not enough to have married him, as I did not. I have a lot of self respect, or I would have slept with him months ago.

 

Thank you for your words, and I have made a decision. Once I make a decision, because thats all I do in life, damn decisions, I stick with it.

 

One question to all the other posters. Why do you feel justified in having your affairs with men that are in a relationship ? Are there not families and chances of heartbreak in your situations? Just a question because as much as you seemed down about my situation you are all really no better off then I am.

 

 

 

PC.

[newbee]

hi pc,

firstly, you cannot possibly judge his wife, you just dont know what he says to her to keep her in there. also if she had a child by him then she was probably alot more desperate to keep a hold of him than you are. whilst you are standing there calling her stupid and weak for hanging on to him, somebody could also be calling you stupid and weak for believing him that he has no love for her. i am not saying that either of you are stupid but maybe both temporarily weak.

i dont believe you, i'm afraid, that you want just fwb and are not emotionally involved with this man. i think you are trying to convince yourself or manipulate this conversation so that you get what you want from it. this is not a criticism of you, it is however a concern for you and your feelings. i think this man will hurt you, he sounds awful. see if you can find a real man, someone who is mature enough to have a relationship with you without being possessive or limiting your freedom.

learn to enjoy being alone more.

i say all this with compassion as i have been there, i had an affair with someone who wasnt very nice to either me or his wife. he spoke down terribly about his wife, turned out however that he thought more of her than he did me. now he is being a decent husband as far as i can tell, which is good in a way, but not so good for how it made me feel for a long time.

[PatientOne]

Originally posted by PattyCakes This man has a child by another woman. This woman has been in his life waiting for him to marry her for years. He has said many times that although he loves her he is not in love with her, he has told her this as well. But this woman can not see past this man and would do anything to be his wife. Personally I see that as weak and sad. But that is her problem, and most likely his. As well as dating many other women he has kept her on a tight lead *just in case*. She was out of control while he and I dated. Calling me and causing problems. I decided this was just not worth it and walked from the relationship. Honestly he created a monster in her, she never knew where she stood. I felt sorry for her actually.

 

 

Originally posted by PattyCakes

SO....no thanks to most of the posters here who seem to be judge mental twits, I do thank you because maybe I just needed to hear from someone that has a friggn heart that this was not the best situation to get into. Like I said there is no one in real life to talk to. I am surrounded by people daily, but this is not stuff I can pull out of my laptop and just discuss with anyone.

PC.

 

Most people here don't give a rat's ass about your lifestyle. However, you running down the MM's wife/mate shows real poor form.

[PattyCakes]

firstly, you cannot possibly judge his wife, you just don't know what he says to her to keep her in there

 

I try not to judge anyone. All of us have problems and we are all weak at some point in our lives. We don't always make the right choices. Calling this woman stupid may have not been the best choice of words. Weak and needy fit better.

Regardless Of what I think of her it doesn't matter at this point because it does not change the issue at hand.

 

 

 

 

i don't believe you, i'm afraid, that you want just fwb and are not emotionally involved with this man. i think you are trying to convince yourself or manipulate this conversation so that you get what you want from it. this is not a criticism of you, it is however a concern for you and your feelings. i think this man will hurt you, he sounds awful. see if you can find a real man, someone who is mature enough to have a relationship with you without being possessive or limiting your freedom.

learn to enjoy being alone more

 

 

I have not seen him in 2 years. Our conversations have taken place a couple times a week. There are times I don't even pick up the phone when he calls because I don't care to be bothered. I never felt hurt when things ended. I didn't have feelings one way or another. Not like most who sit around, mope and have a good cry. That is probably more the norm. I do not believe, honestly , that I have feelings for this man. I feel a connection. But not one strong enough to have continued a relationship with him back then, nor do I feel a strong enough one now to care much one way or another. If I did I would have met him by now. I'm not sure how he could hurt me, not emotionally. But you did bring up a good point previously. I do not care to be in the middle of a political scandle. I'm very private . I agree he sounds awful. I can honestly say that, but still honestly say I have an attraction to him. I'm trying to be as honest as I can here. Otherwise these posts are a waste of my time. As far as being alone more, that is the lifestyle I enjoy. I do not have a problem being alone. Let me just say I date a lot. But have no desire to settle down right now. I do not sleep around either.

 

 

A little history that may make my lifestyle a bit more understandable. I was married very young, 18. THe man I married was 11 years older then I was. He was abusive physically and mentally. I have no problem admitting that my lack of interest in a deeply emotional and loving relationship probably stems from this . I think, in part, my attraction to this man, the politician, is the fact that he is unavailable emotionally . Never the less, I have decided not to get anymore involved, including taking his calls. It has nothing to do with not wanting to see him but more to do with the possibility of a really messy situation, that I don't care to get into. I appreciate that comment because that didn't enter my thoughts.

 

 

manipulate this conversation so that you get what you want from it. this is not a criticism of you, it is however a concern for you .

 

 

Are you saying that I'm manipulating the conversation to try and justify the situation? Or manipulate the conversation in some other way? I'm really not trying to manipulate at all. I came here looking for someone to talk to about this, not to anger posters or create a scene. I understand your comments are not criticism. THat is why I have responded to your posts. I do appreciate your views very much.

 

May I ask a question, that I asked once before. You as well as the others have entered into relationships with married men. You have been hurt, I'm sorry for that. But do you consider it to have been okay to be involved with a married man? If so then how is that any different then my situation, other then I've taken six months to think about the the right and wrong of it, and didn't just jump into sex with someones husband.

 

Some of the posters found it upsetting that I could get involved with a married man and not get emotionally attached. I think I've even been called cold hearted. Anyway...we all think differently, otherwise these boards would be boring. I personally do not see how an OW has any rights to get emotionally involved with a MM, to the point of tearing apart a marriage. If I slept with a MM it would be strictly for the excitement and attraction. Not to break up a marriage. I don't want something that does not belong to me. I never wanted this man to be my husband, full time boyfriend. His wife can have him. But there has always been a strong physical attraction to him. Which I have avoided. I have never slept or carried on with a MM. I don't feel it is morally right. I never said my thoughts and considerations with this man was right. But I'm just as human as everyone else. The only difference is ....I never intended on wanting him to run off with me, as most here do want. It can be seen as cold and detached. But I see asking a MM to leave his family cold hearted and wrong as well.

[PattyCakes]

I assume your title means you are waiting for your man to leave his wife?

 

My bad mouthing this mans wife was not intended to make her look bad. I actually feel sorry for her. Calling her stupid was not a good choice of words. I feel this woman has been manipulated into a needy person by her husband. If you read my posts carefully you would have read the part where I stated one of the reasons I left him when we were dating was because I found out that he was still with her and did not want to be in that situation. I also told him at the time, very frankly, that the reason she is so needy, so insecure and allows him to treat her the way he does is because he has manipulated her. I never said I hated this woman, or that I was trying to hurt her. I have nothing to lose, other then my self respect, if I should hurt her in some way. I could very well carry on with her husband and go public about it. No one would really give a rats ass about me in that situation. I am very happy that she feels she has gotten her prince. I highly doubt she has though. He still says that he cant leave the house without her needing to know his daily schedule so she knows where he is at every given moment. SEE, I feel sorry for this woman, I pity her. NO one should feel that insecure. Where in my posts have I ever wished her any unhappiness.

 

Problem here is everyone is reading whatever they want into my posts. There is such negative energy in this room. Reread my posts and tell me where I wished this woman any unhappiness. All I have stated is that I do not understand how or why a woman would allow themselves to be treated as he has treated her. I have told this to him many times. I also told him when he was thinking of marrying her that there would probably be no other woman that would wait for him as she has and put up with his messing around.

 

Tell me how my thoughts of a possible affair with this man, other then it is not an emotional issue with me, is any different then the others involved with MM. It is okay as long as there are emotions involved? I don't agree. I think it is wrong when emotions are so involved that people get hurt, especially the wife. I personally think it is wrong to ask a man to leave his wife and children. I don't think its right to sleep with someone elses spouse either. But we are all human, aren't we?

[PattyCakes]

[color=blue][/color][font=arial][/font]

 

Let me just say that I've enjoyed this thread. A couple of the posters actually tried to understand where I was coming from and offered some solid advice. Of which I appreciate and have taken to heart. I came here to discuss something that was bothering me and possibly talk to some people that could share some light on experiences of their own and maybe make a decision. One that I have been thinking about for a long time. Other posters were so self absorbed and obviously opinionated I was amused.

 

 

Whoever wants to think of me as cold hearted, so be it. If cold hearted is taking six months to take in all the considerations of what my decision may entail, aka the possibility of hurting another human being, or taking the chance of getting emotionally attached to a man that isn't mine for the taking , or walk away . I did not , like most, rush into a situation that may cause a lot of heartache for several people involved. I have never carried on with a married man and after reading several , may I add several pathetic , posts about the heartache and low self esteem an affair must cause the OW I have decided to keep myself away from anything that could lower my own standards to those that don't give a rats ass about a wife/husband or family that is being crushed by an affair.

This will be my last post, thank you to those that had some positive things to say. I truly do appreciate it. I can feel good in knowing that I wont be the one to trash this marriage, or any other marriage because I chose to be with a married man.

[PattyCakes]

My apology to PatientOne. I assumed he was female.

[newbee]

the fact is patticakes, that you dont actually have a problem, you dont have feelings for this man particuarly just a bit of sexual attraction, you hardly ever see him or talk to him and from this far back from the situation and being this uninvolved with anything you are pretty much making an objective decision whether to have an affair with him or not. this thread was completely pointless, seems like you are trying to prove something. all you have proved is that you are a hypocrite, you ask not to be judged and yet you have been judgemental in the extreme not only of this guys wife, but of every single person that made the effort to reply to your thread.

[Tamed Wildflower]

Can everybody please stop bashing Pattycakes?!?!??? This is not what Loveshack is for! She didn't come here for permission, or for our approval. Who the heck are any of us to judge?? All she wanted was to be able to discuss her situation and her feelings about the situation with some people, to have some accepting people to work through her thoughts with. It's perfectly fine if you feel that what she was considering doing is not a good thing to do. It's not perfectly fine for anyone to treat her with dismissiveness, hostility, or judgment in LoveShack. You don't have to say that everything anyone does is wonderful-- criticism can be really helpful, provided that it is constructive and said with some respect for the poster. What Pattycakes found here is more like a verbal lynchmob than an environment of supportive critics. I too really should have been more sensitive in my post, but so many of the posts here are so spiteful and self-righteous it's shocking.

 

Please read Midori's post about the OW/OM forum: http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t54546/

 

and her post about posting to engage rather than preach: http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t45340/

[PattyCakes]

Thank you for your post. I have received a couple of really nice PMs from posters who seemed, as you do, to understand why I came here. Not validation of any kind of my situation. Just someone to talk to because this is not something I care to discuss with coworkers and family.

 

I appreciate you and the others that have pmD me recently.

 

Thank you.

[PattyCakes]

First, I have not responded to everyone that responded to my thread. For the most part I have ignored specific posters. Because I do not care to get into verbal/typing bashing.

 

 

 

this thread was completely pointless, seems like you are trying to prove something.

 

Not really. I came here to talk out some of the things that I needed to talk about. Im not sure what it is that I would have to prove. Im new here so what is there to prove?

 

 

that you are a hypocrite

 

Now thats just not nice. I havent called you any names newby. Hypocrite? Thats just down right childish. You havent bothered to really understand my posts. Yet you deem it okay to to call such a name. Good for you. I hope it makes you feel swell.

 

 

judgemental in the extreme not only of this guys wife,

 

 

 

All I have said is I feel sorry for anyone that would allow himself/herself to be treated in such a way. Not that she is a nasty person. I mentioned ONCE that she treated me poorly at one time. But later found out it was because , even though I thought I was in an exclusive relationship, she knew better and was treating me like the OW. Other then that...where have I said one thing that was abusive towards her ? Feeling bad for someone is abusive and judgemental? Not in my book. I personally think the woman could have done better. That being said...I know I can too.

 

I wish you well newby. I truly am sorry you have been offended by my posts. I sure didnt come here to do that. I have more to do with my life then to get into insult wars with people. In my book most of us have a lot of good, more then bad.

Have a great evening.

[SixthSt.Girl]

I totally understand where you are coming from, PattyCakes. I'm also single, not into marriage at all, but sometimes living alone makes me feel like I'm missing out on something (for very brief moments!). Most people I know my age are married or in serious relationships (I'm 23), and watching soaps at night with the cat gets old sometimes. I don't think I could stand marriage, though - my worst nightmare is coming home after a long day just to put up with a man for the whole evening.

 

Anyway, I had (i guess still have) the opportunity to sleep with a married man who I'm very attracted to - the only reason I have not is because I'm planning a career and residence move for the near future. It will be my first time away from my hometown, and I have enough to think about. I know that his marriage is not very stable - he doesn't even act like he LIKES her, let alone loves her - he complains about her, and doesn't even know he's doing it. We have both shown marked sexual interest, but neither has made a move. He's not the type to put himself out there, unlike most men, but I've always been taught that the guy initiates. Anyway, I don't see cheating as a sin, because it's a natural response to the confines of marriage. I've read on different occasions that over 70% of men admit to cheating, therefore, I can't believe monogomy is natural or a good thing, and I won't feel guilty in participating in the destruction of a marriage. I'd feel bad for the BS, but she should know that it's not meant to be if her H is out lusting after other women. I never want to be a hurt BS, so I stay away from commitment. I'll admit I've never had a man cheat on me to my knowledge, but then again, I get too bored in romantic relationships to stick with them for long.

 

Just wanted to add: Sorry, I didn't mean to make this all about me. I agree with what you said about sometimes we think with our heart instead of our mind. Obviously, you feel that this marriage of his is a sham, or else I don't think you'd be seriously considering an affair with him. Just go with your instincts and do what you alone feel is right and I'm sure he will be doing the same.