niceguy55 Posted March 13, 2015 Posted March 13, 2015 Hi all, Rather complicated, but looking for input. I have been with a girl for three years. She has 2 boys, ages 7 and 9. There is no father in the picture and therefore, no support, and living with her folks. She is dying to get out!!!. I fell in love fairly fast because it felt unlike anything else I've had...due to a not too good previous marriage. She also fell for me fairly fast. I explained to her I was recently divorced and would engage in a serious relationship, but not marriage for several years. She mostly agreed and we continued. I was however, living with my ex in my home (after I bought her out) due to economic issues and was receiving rent money which was needed. My new girlfriend understood, esp. because my ex and I never were close physically. That went on for about a year until she moved out, partially because of new girl pushing for it. I regret it, but I needed the funds and new girl had no job. So I was giving ex some respect and made it really hard to have new girl over...very awkward. I am now doing better financially. Since then we have had many ups and downs. My love for her has been very consistent and never punitive if things were not my way. Hers, however, became less and sarcastic and punitive if she was not getting hers. I began to feel that she wanted a provider more than me due to her not having a job for her children. So I was moving slowly and thinking about her moving in with me. She then landed a job 10 months ago which was great! We talked about her and kids moving in as I would do some work on the house to make it better suited. However, she began to lose some feelings and I was dragging my feet. I believe we lacked confidence and felt pushed. I wanted it to be a mutual love before living together but we agreed to give it a shot. After she agreed to come to the house several times, she won't move in with me because my ex lived in the house and she didn't want to move in and then shortly move to another house to start new. She now has given an ultimatum pretty much,To buy a new house in the summertime or she will figure it out on her own more or less without me and call it quits. She has offered a little bit of funds but I would be about 90 percent of it. It just scares me to do that knowing she says she's not in love..and we can move as companions. I would want more and she said she would start giving more to the relationship emotionally if I made her dreams come true in a house and soon marriage. She has been holding out on me due to my not showing her proof of further commitment and moving. I have my hangups too and insecurities that can drive her crazy. Anyway, I compromised and said she means enough to me that I would work towards selling my house later this year and look for something else. I'm generally ok moving, just didn't want to rush. I am grateful for her patience and I have been tolerant of her when she gets mean. Meanwhile, she has said we're done and she can't do this anymore about 7 times over the last year only to work it out a few days later. Now she's saying she's done and want's me out of her life. Its been about a week of no contact except for me saying I hope she's ok and I thought we were close to moving forward as I compromised. She says she has not much to say but want to move on and be happy. These are all things she has said before. I do believe she's more serious now. She has a great heart and I do feel bad as I'm a softie. I love her and her kids as I have grown very close to them. They wish I could be their dad. I show up at all of her kids' ball games. They have another one in a few days. I don't think I should just show up? I could text her and ask if it's ok?? She always said if we break up I can still be active in their life for now but she seems to be changing her mind on that too. The last thing she said was at this point she doesn't want much. We have spent almost every weekend together like a family. She says she mostly enjoys our time together. I'm just hurting because I thought and planned to move forward and now she wants out. I know a lot of it is her anxiousness to move out. I know this is complicated, but any input would be great. Thanks Frank
PegNosePete Posted March 13, 2015 Posted March 13, 2015 she said she would start giving more to the relationship emotionally if I made her dreams come true in a house and soon marriage. Dude WTF! Do guys actually get taken in by this stuff? She is basically shouting from the rooftops that she is a gold digger and you are not even hearing it. She is toally materialistic and using your feelings for financial gain. I would never, ever get involved with someone like this. Combine that with the terrible way she has been treating you, breaking up 7 times! Do you really think she would change if you bought her a house and got married??? No dude, you would end up divorced in a year, and she would take half (or more) of your stuff, probably get to keep the house that you bought, and you'd end up in a crappy bedsit. Dude the writing is on the wall. Wake up and smell it.
sabd Posted March 13, 2015 Posted March 13, 2015 Frank, this woman is using you. Be thankful she's ended it. Hopefully this time it's really over! she said she would start giving more to the relationship emotionally if I made her dreams come true in a house and soon marriage Wow, stay well away from her, she's a manipulative gold digger.
NC-Thomas Posted March 13, 2015 Posted March 13, 2015 wow, this is crazy man. She is basically using you for her personal gain. She doesnt love you at all, she is manipulating you for financial support... Run, forest, run!
Author niceguy55 Posted March 13, 2015 Author Posted March 13, 2015 I understand that is poss. That's why I have hesitated. If I bought another home, it would be in my name only and would have to protect if there was a marriage. She would have to keep her job and contribute, of course. At times it seemed real and strange other times. If I was somewhat protected I would be happy to be together because I really do love them all. But it should be mutual. I have a high tolerance for behavior due to my past. It's just a shame but she has issues too and well as me. We would need therapy to have it work. Just didn't know what to do about my wanting to see kids play. Very attached emotionally. But may be pointless.
PegNosePete Posted March 13, 2015 Posted March 13, 2015 If I bought another home, it would be in my name only and would have to protect if there was a marriage. Depending where you live, that may or may not be true. In England for example, all property including a house which is in your sole name, is considered matrimonial assets and she would have a claim on it in the case of a divorce. Her claim would be reduced if it's a short marriage, but increased if her kids are living there too (which despite not being yours, would be considered "children of the family"). Tread with extreme caution.
Author niceguy55 Posted March 13, 2015 Author Posted March 13, 2015 (edited) I understand there are certain laws in certain states. I am in the US. I have looked into a bit. She used to be fairly giving and can be sweet and thoughtful but it has waned over the last year. Just not consistent. I believe she feels if she kept giving more then I would never want to move or marry. I can get a little change stuck. But she should love me for me not just for what i will do. Or put conditions on love. I do a fair amount already. I help her with kids, do favors, pay for meals and good portions of trips and gifts. etc. At least she is honest in telling me she does not have the strongest feelings. Edited March 13, 2015 by niceguy55
Ruby65 Posted March 13, 2015 Posted March 13, 2015 As for seeing the kids play, I'd just text her and ask if it's okay for you to watch their upcoming games. As to your larger circumstance, I'm guessing there's two sides to the story. You've been together three years, the first year you were still living with your ex-wife. She's been living with her folks and anxious to move in with you and start your life together.... so what's been going on these past two years, since your ex-wife moved out? Why no ring, my friend? You say you love her and that she had fallen in love with you, but that now her feelings have changed and she's withholding emotionally due to your withholding the marriage/commitment..... I have a hard time calling her a heartless gold-digger, I think she's just frustrated and tired of waiting to start a life with you and her boys.
Author niceguy55 Posted March 13, 2015 Author Posted March 13, 2015 Thanks Ruby for bringing up those points. That's why I'm here. I agree with the texting, but she may say no to hurt me because she is? I am slow to commit fully, period. I want to get it right! I don't blame her for being frustrated. She also struggles with things from her past. However, for a while It was financial. I chose not to commit with my struggling and her not working. Since then, we have had a handful of disagreements about certain values, etc. and her loss of feelings for the last year doesn't make me feel safe. She is always comparing me to what I did for my ex 15 years ago. Different situation, but complains why I won't take a chance on her. I just wanted stability. I have been giving 90 percent to her 10 the last year. I know she has the kids etc. Just feel I come last. So maybe we are not the best match then. I just don;t give up easy and looking for balance. She laughed off therapy the last time I tried. I want most of what she does, but in a power struggle and shes demanding its on her terms now after waiting. Don't know if she'll come back or what? I can try her on kids games, but maybe hold off on us and give space?
Ruby65 Posted March 13, 2015 Posted March 13, 2015 Look, she's done waiting and wants you to commit -- so she's given you an ultimatum and it sounds like she means it. IF you want to put this back together, the last thing you should do is disappear and give her *space*. She doesn't want space. She wants commitment. You have a choice: take a risk and move forward with her and her boys..... or play it safe and lose the relationship. Personally, I don't think she's being unreasonable -- given her life circumstances -- to deliver an ultimatum after patiently waiting three years for you to commit to her. Just imo.
Author niceguy55 Posted March 13, 2015 Author Posted March 13, 2015 I'm thinking from all directions. Don't blame her for waiting. I don't want to give the space but that;s what they say she needs? She has said even if i proposed under these hard times she would not accept, so it would have to be the right time. When she's in these moods she rejects what I'm trying to offer. She always says it is forced and won't feel right if she has to push or step out. She would love to be married and taken care of...I know that. She has said it! Just can't do it myself. Confused. darned if i do and if i don't feeling.
Ruby65 Posted March 13, 2015 Posted March 13, 2015 I'm sure it must be insulting for her to feel she has to FORCE YOU to commit to her. I think you're scrambling for a way to justify not committing to her. You say she wants you to take care of her -- but then you say she's been working for the past ten months and has offered to pitch in on the downpayment of a house with you? I'm wondering how much of this is just your trying to avoid committing to this woman.... and I think she's justified at this point to be ready to walk away! And yeah, sadly that has to include her boys, who will also be hurt as a result of the breakup, and whom she's probably trying to protect by telling you to stay away from them unless you're ready to commit to a future as a family.
PegNosePete Posted March 13, 2015 Posted March 13, 2015 Personally, I don't think she's being unreasonable -- given her life circumstances -- to deliver an ultimatum after patiently waiting three years for you to commit to her. But she is not asking for commitment. She is asking for a house. And saying that if he buys her one, she will give him more feelings. AKA: "please buy my love". But she should love me for me not just for what i will do. Or put conditions on love. Amen to that my friend. 1
Ruby65 Posted March 13, 2015 Posted March 13, 2015 But she is not asking for commitment. She is asking for a house. And saying that if he buys her one, she will give him more feelings. AKA: "please buy my love". We'll have to agree to disagree on this.
sabd Posted March 13, 2015 Posted March 13, 2015 I'm sorry, but she gave you an ultimatum that equates to emotional blackmail. Call her bluff.
Author niceguy55 Posted March 13, 2015 Author Posted March 13, 2015 Right. She is all over the place with exactly what she wants. She does really want the commitment and ring too. Trust me. She just wants it to be from me naturally. But that would take time. And she only lasts a few weeks before getting fed up again. hence no stability. I would like to be a family. I admit I'm scared to some extent given her moods which can come into play all the time in the future and then the cycle begins. What if she pushes adoption? Or other big things. will there be ultimatums?
PegNosePete Posted March 13, 2015 Posted March 13, 2015 We'll have to agree to disagree on this. Yeah, well I'm just going on the OP's words: "She now has given an ultimatum pretty much,To buy a new house in the summertime or she will figure it out on her own more or less without me and call it quits"
Ruby65 Posted March 13, 2015 Posted March 13, 2015 Yeah, well I'm just going on the OP's words: "She now has given an ultimatum pretty much,To buy a new house in the summertime or she will figure it out on her own more or less without me and call it quits" She's been working and earning money the past ten months. She WAS in love with him in the beginning. She continued to date him even though he was living with his ex-wife the entire first year. She's now gone on to date him two more years and has been working almost the whole last year. I don't see gold-digger. She's trying to push for a commitment and -- even now! -- he's resisting. He won't propose and he won't even commit to living together. So -- yes, finally -- she's given him an ultimatum and frankly I say more power to her! He's been bonding with her sons and enjoying their relationship for three years now. If he's not willing to move in together and make a life, he doesn't deserve to have her and her great kids in his life. So yeah, we'll agree to disagree.
Author niceguy55 Posted March 13, 2015 Author Posted March 13, 2015 Ruby So you are saying u believe she does love me and should get stronger with commitments? She is hurt and tends to hurt back. hope that would stop. And not be told what she put up with and continue to feel owed. She has said things like it. I committed to her moving in my place but kept changing her mind. Maybe because then she thinks she won't get the ring?? Don't blame her totally for not wanting this house...but not even short term?
PegNosePete Posted March 13, 2015 Posted March 13, 2015 Ruby, I don't disagree with what you are saying. You might be correct on all counts. The history of the relationship seems to not be about her gold-digging but it's a bit of a train wreck really. 7 break-ups! Whatever has gone on in the past, the situation at the moment is this: - She does not have strong feelings for you - She wants a house - She says that if you buy a house for her, her feelings may grow - She says that if you do not buy her a house, the relationship is over Sorry but it would be pure madness to propose or buy a house in these circumstances. Maybe in the past it was about commitment but the situation right now is that she is asking you to buy her love. Making a huge commitment on the basis that her feelings might grow later on is pure madness!
Author niceguy55 Posted March 13, 2015 Author Posted March 13, 2015 Pete, I agree with points of everyone. Sadly, I feel you're right that it has come to this as of late and feel confused and like its a gamble. When she had better feelings, I was nowhere near a full commitment. Still recovering emotionally from divorce and money, job, etc. And didn't grow closer to her kids till later. I know it can all work out, but hard to grasp right now with her anxiousness to get out overshadowing logic. I wish we had another option not so dramatic. But she may be done, or for a while. Could be my loss or hers?? She acts similar to bi-polar tendencies. all or nothing for a while.
mightycpa Posted March 13, 2015 Posted March 13, 2015 I would want more and she said she would start giving more to the relationship emotionally if I made her dreams come true in a house and soon marriage. She has been holding out on me due to my not showing her proof of further commitment and moving. Anyway, I compromised and said she means enough to me that I would work towards selling my house later this year and look for something else.... Meanwhile, she has said we're done and she can't do this anymore about 7 times over the last year only to work it out a few days later. Now she's saying she's done and want's me out of her life.... I know this is complicated, but any input would be great. Thanks FrankIt ain't that complicated, Frank. You are looking at reality and instead of seeing it for what it is, you see it for what it might be in another universe. If I got this right, she's DONE, DONE, DONE, DONE, DONE, DONE, DONE, DONE with you. Go find yourself a nice girl that doesn't require a bellboy. And leave those kids alone. They're going to eventually have to learn to let go of you, and the younger they are when they do it, the better. 1
Stercrazy Posted March 13, 2015 Posted March 13, 2015 To piggyback on that my ex had 3 kids and I have one. They all got along....we all got along. Her kids loved me and I loved her kids. Fact is when I think about the relationship objectively.....without emotions....the relationship was......well......OK. Not the best I ever had.....not the worst. Over a year there was no growth. Whether it was her or myself or both (most likely) there was no growth. She said she tried hard but looking back I don't think she really did. You need to take a step back without emotions and really look at the relationship. Was it really that good? Was it 2 people working together to make each other happy? Did it have understanding, empathy, encouragement, support......or was it more like "how do I benefit?" Take a life lesson and move on. You're better then that. You deserve better then that.
Author niceguy55 Posted March 13, 2015 Author Posted March 13, 2015 Hey, I understand and its interesting. I think we could have worked better together. It seemed one was putting in more while the other was not. If she didn't get what she was looking for at the moment, she would then hold out sometimes and i would get punished in ways. When I didn't get something, I would talk to her but still wanted to be by her side. She was like a magnet and i never played games. Hard to say on the other. I think we both did most of the other things, but again, I feel i was more consistent. She has admitted she was not giving much, but I still hung in and gave 100. She did hang out with me but would be semi cold many times. Things should have been better if we both gave it our fullest together. And when we did do that many times, it was great!! But when someone wants more, quicker, and doesn't realize their actions, It may take longer to achieve the goal.
Downtown Posted March 15, 2015 Posted March 15, 2015 We have had many ups and downs.... she has said we're done and she can't do this anymore about 7 times over the last year only to work it out a few days later. Now she's saying she's done and want's me out of her life.... She acts similar to bipolar tendencies. all or nothing for a while.Perhaps you are right about her having bipolar tendencies, Frank. I note, however, that strong traits of BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder) can be easily mistaken for bipolar symptoms if you're unfamiliar with the warning signs for both disorders. It therefore may be worth your while to take a quick look at my description of the differences I've seen in the behaviors typical of BPDers (e.g., my exW) and bipolar-1 sufferers (e.g., my foster son). It is in my post at 12 BPD/Bipolar Differences. Significantly, learning to spot these warning signs will NOT enable you to diagnose your W's issues. Only a professional can do that. The main reason for learning these red flags, then -- like learning warning signs for stroke and heart attack -- is to help you decide whether there is sufficient reason to spend $150-$200/hour to seek a professional opinion. My advice is that, if you are ever tempted to take her back, you should check with a psychologist -- for a visit or two all by yourself -- to obtain a candid professional opinion on what it is you're dealing with. If I were you, my greatest concern would be the 7-8 breakups experienced in only a year's time -- a serious red flag for emotional stability. A recent survey of about 550 BPDfamily.com members, for example, found that 38% of BPDer relationships go through at least 6 complete cycles of breakup/makeup before eventually ending for good. Indeed, 21% of them experienced 10 or more B/M cycles before finally ending.
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